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I don't figure that I will fall 20 techs behind anyone for a good long while. But, I'll have my sliders ready to go - next few moves will be toward either Centralization or Innovative.
If you take out the majors soon enough you won't even need Westernization and considering the progress you might be well even in Ottoman tech group since they have better units for a longer time.
I'm interested as I never really understood the full stuff about better units (event after reading lots about it) At first sight it looks like cavalery are much better until quite late but are Janissaries (land 13) or Sebkan (land 18) really better than Landsknechten or Maurician?
OK. I saw it's only 1444 in his game. I usually westernize with Ottomans around 1500-1510 (I tend to have less than optimal leader always) and military modernization occurs around 50 years later. That's actually the hardest I think as there's always something wrong happening with stability (at that point it's usually taking more than 3 year per each stab point!).
Good luck though. I would have taken down Spain and Portugal first, then France and HRE. But I'm eager to see what will happen.
Chapter 7
At the outset of war, I do several things:
1) I split up one of my 16K stacks in Burgundy and send forces to begin besieging northern France.
2) I begin besieging Holstein (who declares on me in alliance with England) and split up the rest of that stack to battle English troops in Jylland, Fyn, and Skane.
3) I get all troops that I can spare headed toward Italy, where the bulk of the French forces are.
4) I move my navy to Coast of Holland and wait for the AI to do something stupid.
I leave one 16K stack in Burgundy so I can monitor the war - they will either besiege England or help in France, depending on how things progress.
England immediately splits up its fleet (I hate how foolish the AI is with their navies. I really hope this gets addressed in EU4) and I win a series of naval battles over the course of the first three months of the war. By December 1444, the entire English navy is sunk. All of it.
Meanwhile, I successfully lift the fog of war in France so I can monitor troop movements. I engage the main French force in Liguria. France is also besieging Ancona with 7K troops. They will stay there for over a year.
By December, I've won in Liguria and am on the verge of wiping out all French troops in Italy, save those poor saps in Ancona.
Early in 1445, I see the one remaining large 15K French stack heading up north, so I move my Burgundian reserves into motion to meet them. The French forces are again defeated. France decides that now would be a great time to declare war on Scotland, which is fine by me.
By May, the war in France is going quite well. I've spread out and besieged much of the country. England is contained - with no navy to transport their forces. The English also have about 20K troops in Gascogne and Labourd at this stage, but they have no military access to France and cannot engage my forces.
Here's a look at the English war screen in May:
Aragon managed to land some troops on Rhodes, but I hunt down their navy and sink it. By late 1445, neither England nor Portugal nor Aragon has any ships remaining.
I annex Serbia in May as well, fulfilling my mission. My new one:
Sieges continue in France throughout 1445 and I send some troops up to England, which is fairly poorly defended. Compared to the French, English battles are almost effortless - they don't have the advantage of military drill or Defender of the Faith that the French enjoy.
In January 1446, the Ottomans get a new ruler:
With an 8 diplomacy ruler, infamy is now falling at -1.45/year.
1446 is a year of sieges. I'm trying to take as much as possible in this war, so I'd like to push the war score up to 99% if I can. I've had so many battles with France as they futilely try to recruit troops that I'm getting close by late in the year. In December, Scotland makes peace with France, ceding Highlands.
As you can see, England is besieged by now as well.
In January 1447, Burgundy revokes our military access. Just a few days later, Austria declares war. I don't really have troops to spare to fight them (especially since I'm fighting the Timurids again), so I need to wrap up war with France soon.
In September, Morocco declares on me. For the sixth time.
I hit 99% war score with France. Time to make peace:
I take 8 provinces, including Toulouse and its university. I avoid taking a land border with Burgundy. Would rather not have to deal with them just yet.
Overextension happens as a result of French peace:
In October of 1447, I notice that England has reached Government 9. Luckily, they opt for Superior Seamanship and not QFTNW.
I send troops from southern France home to Italy to fight the Austrians. Those in northern France head to England to help besiege. I also finally eliminate the English forces in Gascogne and Labourd.
In January 1448, Castille declares on me. Hungary declares in alliance with Castille. Then in February, Burgundy declares on me. Very glad I didn't take a land border with them in the French peace.
I've about had it with war at this point:
In March, I make peace with Austria. They make a lovely donation of 225 ducats to the Turkish Treasury. Then, I make peace with the Timurids. They can go fight the Mamluks now. In April, I make peace with England:
Only five provinces, but both English universities.
May brings white peace with Morocco. July, a war declaration on Bosnia and white peace with Castille. In October, it's time for white peace with Burgundy, who immediately declare war on France.
Now I'm just at war with Bosnia and GH. I hope to be at peace soon to reduce my war exhaustion. Lithuania has other ideas:
I do make peace with the Horde in August 1449. In November, I learn about lots of places:
In March 1450, I make peace with Lithuania for 100 ducats and core revocation. In June, I annex Bosnia and get a new mission:
This is a great mission. -5 infamy and all I need to do is convert Rhodes to Islam. I dispatch a missionary post haste.
In November of 1450, I get another boundary dispute - this time with France for Provence. Always nice to get disputes on high % peace value provinces.
The next year or so is peaceful and pretty uneventful. Here are some maps and ledger shots from November 1451:
At the outset of war, I do several things:
1) I split up one of my 16K stacks in Burgundy and send forces to begin besieging northern France.
2) I begin besieging Holstein (who declares on me in alliance with England) and split up the rest of that stack to battle English troops in Jylland, Fyn, and Skane.
3) I get all troops that I can spare headed toward Italy, where the bulk of the French forces are.
4) I move my navy to Coast of Holland and wait for the AI to do something stupid.
I leave one 16K stack in Burgundy so I can monitor the war - they will either besiege England or help in France, depending on how things progress.
England immediately splits up its fleet (I hate how foolish the AI is with their navies. I really hope this gets addressed in EU4) and I win a series of naval battles over the course of the first three months of the war. By December 1444, the entire English navy is sunk. All of it.
Meanwhile, I successfully lift the fog of war in France so I can monitor troop movements. I engage the main French force in Liguria. France is also besieging Ancona with 7K troops. They will stay there for over a year.
By December, I've won in Liguria and am on the verge of wiping out all French troops in Italy, save those poor saps in Ancona.
Early in 1445, I see the one remaining large 15K French stack heading up north, so I move my Burgundian reserves into motion to meet them. The French forces are again defeated. France decides that now would be a great time to declare war on Scotland, which is fine by me.
By May, the war in France is going quite well. I've spread out and besieged much of the country. England is contained - with no navy to transport their forces. The English also have about 20K troops in Gascogne and Labourd at this stage, but they have no military access to France and cannot engage my forces.
Here's a look at the English war screen in May:
Aragon managed to land some troops on Rhodes, but I hunt down their navy and sink it. By late 1445, neither England nor Portugal nor Aragon has any ships remaining.
I annex Serbia in May as well, fulfilling my mission. My new one:
Sieges continue in France throughout 1445 and I send some troops up to England, which is fairly poorly defended. Compared to the French, English battles are almost effortless - they don't have the advantage of military drill or Defender of the Faith that the French enjoy.
In January 1446, the Ottomans get a new ruler:
With an 8 diplomacy ruler, infamy is now falling at -1.45/year.
1446 is a year of sieges. I'm trying to take as much as possible in this war, so I'd like to push the war score up to 99% if I can. I've had so many battles with France as they futilely try to recruit troops that I'm getting close by late in the year. In December, Scotland makes peace with France, ceding Highlands.
As you can see, England is besieged by now as well.
In January 1447, Burgundy revokes our military access. Just a few days later, Austria declares war. I don't really have troops to spare to fight them (especially since I'm fighting the Timurids again), so I need to wrap up war with France soon.
In September, Morocco declares on me. For the sixth time.
I hit 99% war score with France. Time to make peace:
I take 8 provinces, including Toulouse and its university. I avoid taking a land border with Burgundy. Would rather not have to deal with them just yet.
Overextension happens as a result of French peace:
In October of 1447, I notice that England has reached Government 9. Luckily, they opt for Superior Seamanship and not QFTNW.
I send troops from southern France home to Italy to fight the Austrians. Those in northern France head to England to help besiege. I also finally eliminate the English forces in Gascogne and Labourd.
In January 1448, Castille declares on me. Hungary declares in alliance with Castille. Then in February, Burgundy declares on me. Very glad I didn't take a land border with them in the French peace.
I've about had it with war at this point:
In March, I make peace with Austria. They make a lovely donation of 225 ducats to the Turkish Treasury. Then, I make peace with the Timurids. They can go fight the Mamluks now. In April, I make peace with England:
Only five provinces, but both English universities.
May brings white peace with Morocco. July, a war declaration on Bosnia and white peace with Castille. In October, it's time for white peace with Burgundy, who immediately declare war on France.
Now I'm just at war with Bosnia and GH. I hope to be at peace soon to reduce my war exhaustion. Lithuania has other ideas:
I do make peace with the Horde in August 1449. In November, I learn about lots of places:
In March 1450, I make peace with Lithuania for 100 ducats and core revocation. In June, I annex Bosnia and get a new mission:
This is a great mission. -5 infamy and all I need to do is convert Rhodes to Islam. I dispatch a missionary post haste.
In November of 1450, I get another boundary dispute - this time with France for Provence. Always nice to get disputes on high % peace value provinces.
The next year or so is peaceful and pretty uneventful. Here are some maps and ledger shots from November 1451:
Its going well, good work and a useful mission. Have you considered neutering the Castillian navy to reduce their colonisation? It could set them back a year or two.
With England reaching Gov 9, but not taking QFTNW, I'll be turning my attention to Portugal and Castille once my infamy drops a bit. Keeping the colonial powers with weakened navies is certainly a priority. Although, as you can see from the ledger, it did not take long for Portugal to get back up to 19 ocean-going vessels after I sunk their whole fleet.
This is fun stuff; now I want to go and start up an Ottoman game. I'm curious about how you're planning to go about religious conversion. It looks like you're not sending out many missionaries at the moment; are you holding off until gotten more of a foothold in Europe? Or is it just a budgetary consideration at the moment?
It's largely budgetary. I was so focused on building ships to defeat England up until this point that I neglected both buildings and missionaries. I'm working to remedy that now. (You can also see in the screen from the Convert the Infidels mission that I've got 10 missionaries out trying to convert - so it's not as if I'm sending none, just fewer than I'd like)
75 big ships ? the AI won't bother you anymore!
that's pretty impressive to take on France and england on very hard like that ...
that's pretty impressive to take on France and england on very hard like that ...
Of the 75 ships, I think I only built about 30 or so. They rest were 'donated' by Morocco, Castille, Portugal, Denmark, France, Holland, and of course, England.
I find that timing is everything in this game. The French were weakened just enough from their war with Savoy/Milan that I was able to defeat their armies and besiege the whole country. If I had tried the same thing while the French were at peace and at full strength and readiness, it may well have ended in disaster.
Keeping the impressive progress... Your truce times are more or less synchronized for France and England now. Hopefully, it won't pose a problem in the next round of wars. Also, Dalmatian shores may be a good summer resort for war exhausted soldiers. You should talk to Hungary about it.
France is in serious trouble, with Burgundy declaring on them while France was in such a weakened state. More about that in the next update.
I had planned to be at peace for a while, but in September of 1452, an opportunity presents itself. Ferrara gets annexed by Sicily. I declare on Sicily shortly thereafter. Hungary comes to Sicily's defense. I assault Ferrara and occupy it quickly. I take one more province from Sicily to push up the war score and then sue for peace:
Not bad for a 5 month war. Brings my university total up to ten. Of course, I am still at war with Hungary, but they'll make white peace in a couple of months.
The first half of 1453 is busy. I convert Rhodes to Islam, fulfilling my current mission:
Austria declares war on me in March. In April, Burgundy makes peace with France:
I'll need to keep my eye on Burgundy, especially with Austria and Bohemia both so weak. They're all set up to become Emperor and fight me for France, and more.
As soon as that peace is made, France declares war on me. England had warned France and is now allied with me in that war:
In May and June, Holland and Norway declare on me. Denmark declares as well, but Norway is now the Scandinavian war leader. In January of 1454, Norway and Holland both make white peace, after their fleets are sunk.
I get an event which grants me a free slider move:
In July of 1454, the accomplished diplomat event fires. The good news is that I get a -6 to my infamy. The bad news is that my current infamy is only 2.8. But I have occupied a few French provinces by this time, so I make peace:
Three provinces, 100 ducats, and my infamy drops to zero.
The Mamluks declare on me in August. I consider just taking Alexandria for 2 infamy, but my war exhaustion is creeping back up, so I make white peace after a few months.
In December, Burgundy declares on me. We still don't share a border, but I'm starting to get worried. They are now ahead of me in land tech and if they expand more against France, I'll need to fight them on land.
March of 1455 sees peace with Austria:
In June, I get another boundary dispute with Hungary, this time for Oltenia. August brings a declaration from Poland, along with their allies in Lithuania and Switzerland. I make peace with the Golden Horde to focus on defeating them.
My infamy is less than 2 at this point. I am just thinking that I need to refocus my attention on the colonial powers, when:
But I need more than that. Fighting Castille alone is not enough - I need to stop all the potential colonials:
This should be fun.
Not bad for a 5 month war. Brings my university total up to ten. Of course, I am still at war with Hungary, but they'll make white peace in a couple of months.
The first half of 1453 is busy. I convert Rhodes to Islam, fulfilling my current mission:
Austria declares war on me in March. In April, Burgundy makes peace with France:
I'll need to keep my eye on Burgundy, especially with Austria and Bohemia both so weak. They're all set up to become Emperor and fight me for France, and more.
As soon as that peace is made, France declares war on me. England had warned France and is now allied with me in that war:
In May and June, Holland and Norway declare on me. Denmark declares as well, but Norway is now the Scandinavian war leader. In January of 1454, Norway and Holland both make white peace, after their fleets are sunk.
I get an event which grants me a free slider move:
In July of 1454, the accomplished diplomat event fires. The good news is that I get a -6 to my infamy. The bad news is that my current infamy is only 2.8. But I have occupied a few French provinces by this time, so I make peace:
Three provinces, 100 ducats, and my infamy drops to zero.
The Mamluks declare on me in August. I consider just taking Alexandria for 2 infamy, but my war exhaustion is creeping back up, so I make white peace after a few months.
In December, Burgundy declares on me. We still don't share a border, but I'm starting to get worried. They are now ahead of me in land tech and if they expand more against France, I'll need to fight them on land.
March of 1455 sees peace with Austria:
In June, I get another boundary dispute with Hungary, this time for Oltenia. August brings a declaration from Poland, along with their allies in Lithuania and Switzerland. I make peace with the Golden Horde to focus on defeating them.
My infamy is less than 2 at this point. I am just thinking that I need to refocus my attention on the colonial powers, when:
But I need more than that. Fighting Castille alone is not enough - I need to stop all the potential colonials:
This should be fun.
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Wow. Goin in for the Kill. Thats alot of big names you fighting. Best of luck to you!!
Doubt he'll need much luck as the war plan should be rather simple. Neglect Burgundy at first, carpet siege Iberia, if enough troops in Britain wipe their army and carpet siege if not then just stack siege while waiting for Iberian troops. After Britain is under carpet siege only then take on Burgundy. In my exprerience rebels are more annoying than the attackers in situation like this as rebels can really mess with your country where as attackers just run up your WE and take some of your income.
For me the interesting thing is if buddha has a better plan in which case I will blatantly copy him in my future games
For me the interesting thing is if buddha has a better plan in which case I will blatantly copy him in my future games