The War of Castilian Succession - A Beta Mini-AAR

[unmerged(9576)]

Mr T, it looks to me that you will need to keep looking for quarrels from now and then just to be sure that will have a decent "traditional" army when you need it. I mean, you got your ass kicked
is it possible to have good troops by paying for it rather than fighting?

Also in this particular case with Castile, how could they have decent conquistares with just a tiny war against Granada if, as I understand, their skills will depend on tradition?

does naval tradition depends on naval warfare only?

does hiring leaders improves your tradition?

 

[unmerged(6777)]

Nice, but did you know that there was a possibility for succesion crisis befor it happened? Did you know that you had no direct heir?

I knew that it could happen; but not that it would happen. EU3 is not CK.

And will the type of regiment be the same as in EUII, meaning you have infantry, cavalry and cannons? Or will there be new units with new technologies? And how are navies handled: Will they be automatically be upgraded, like in EUII?

Personally, I hope it will stay as simple as in EUII, because I wouldn't like to disband all my old units and replace them with up-to-date ones every fifty years or so.

I've lost count of how many different unit types there are...at least several hundred anyway. There's 3 classes of unit: infantry, cavalry, artillery. Each class has a large number of unit types, each of which is defined by the culture group it belongs to and the land tech level you have to reach before it becomes unlocked.

I started out with very basic western European infantry and cavalry and had no access to artillery at all (yes...artillery existed at the time, but not for field combat...like EU2, artillery regiments aren't available until you've reached a certain land tech level). If I'd played further into the game, I would have had new and improved infantry and cavalry regiments become available to me, and I would then have had to pick a time to upgrade my army. However, the upgrade of my entire national army would have taken only a couple of mouse clicks. No more clickfest/micromanagement hell for that anymore.

One thing that interested me was the battle summaries from the game files. Is this a feature that automatically adds the battle details to the history file? Could be of great use for AARs... as we've just seen

The battle details in the AAR are lifted directly from the save game file I made when I ended the war. I think I clipped the date in the first few battles I posted; but that last one (the set of three that I posted in a single code bracket) is exactly as it appears in the save except that it's in reverse order (for technical reasons, in the save file the most recent battle is at the top of the list, not the bottom). I just cut and pasted them into forward chronological order instead of reverse order to make it easier for you folks to read. There are other details about the war that are also in the save (date it started, who started it, who joined in on which side, date it ended, etc.).

 

[DukeWilleo1630]

The only reason that the AI lost this war was that another AI nation (my ally) bailed me out. If Portugal hadn't come in and crushed the main Aragon army, I was toast. I would have accepted almost any peace Aragon demanded before that happened. I even made a couple tentitive offers that were rebuffed as being too little.

So Portugal sent their army to help your provinces on their border. Do you think the AI could have sent the armies over castille to siege aragon directly?

 

[ComradeOm]

The battle details in the AAR are lifted directly from the save game file I made when I ended the war.

Very nice

The only worry I'd have about this is that surely saving the details of every battle fought would lead to a huge save file? I know in CK the massive files of dead characters can lead to technical issues after a while.

 

[unmerged(6777)]

Mr T, it looks to me that you will need to keep looking for quarrels from now and then just to be sure that will have a decent "traditional" army when you need it. I mean, you got your ass kicked
is it possible to have good troops by paying for it rather than fighting?

Frequent skirmishing will help your tradition, yes. The idea is to give nations that are generally warlike a combat advantage over nations that are generally passive...although once war is declared and some battles are fought (and lost) the passive nation will gain tradition and be able to field better generals. If you've got lousy tradition, the only way to get a good general is to convert your ruler -- provided that your ruler has at least a semi-decent military stat. If he doesn't, you could be in for a world of hurt unless you've got a very large army that can do enough damage in spite of the leadership differential. I should point out that Alfonso is an extraordinarily high military stat ruler, and I suspect that when Aragon converted him to a leader they got lucky and he had *extremely* high combat stats...that's the way it goes, sometimes. I wouldn't normally expect to run into that nasty a leader who can rout my armies quite so badly.

Also, as I mentioned, I had chosen extremely bad army composition at the time...cavalry dominate most battlefields early in the game and I had a very infantry-heavy army up against Aragon's armies which had a large cavalry components (applauds the AI for doing a much better job at structuring its army compared to my cost-cutting stupidity).

I could certainly have fielded a better army if I'd been willing to pay for it. At that point in the game, you really want an army that's about a 4:6 ratio of infantry to cavalry (roughly what the AI did) but I was a cheapskate and had something more like a 4:1 ratio. There's no way to get around this issue without paying for it one way or another -- either by buying the cavalry in the first place, or hiring a lot of cavalry mercs (which I did when panic set in and I took a couple loans). Money won't buy you better leaders, and I was in the unique situation of being the lesser partner in a PU so I wasn't allowed to convert my ruler into a general (which is the usual way to get a good general on the field when you don't have tradition).

Also in this particular case with Castile, how could they have decent conquistares with just a tiny war against Granada if, as I understand, their skills will depend on tradition?

does naval tradition depends on naval warfare only?

They didn't. When I hired my first explorer I had 0 naval tradition so be basically sucked...but he was able to explore. See my post above for more details.

does hiring leaders improves your tradition?

Quite the reverse. Every time you hire a new leader (general/conquistador/admiral/explorer) your tradition is reduced. Think of tradition as being a pool of up-and-coming junior officers who have some combat experience (or exploration experience). Each time you draw from the pool, you try to take the cream of the crop which means that you now have fewer remaining officers to draw from until you build up the pool again.

 

[unmerged(21489)]

The map looks horrible. The whole pseudo-3D concept is totally wrong, it strucks itself in the middle between the beauty of the 2D maps from EU2 and the awesome 3D maps of RTW being as a result a stupid 3D map that will be always looked from the top (you need prespective to play, it's not arcade!) turning all the 3D elements in strange and poor figures that don't even fulfill it's role to inform of the kind of element they represent.
From a far/top view of the map, there is no doubt that a 2D map with maybe a smooth 3D for the mountains with 2D signs and elements is far better than all those 3D cities that cannot be seen properly from a ceiling prespective.

Bad job Paradox!

PD: Please, don't post supid replies to my post defending Paradox just because you're brainless fanatics. Paradox CAN MAKE MISTAKES and Paradox has to accept and expect bad reviews if they want to improve and progress.
I'm sure the game mechanics have improved and that EU3 will be very fun, but we will have to wait to EU4 to have a decent game, those maps remind me Popolous and other visually horrible 3D games.
The graphic level of nowadays games: Medieval Total War 2, Civilization 4, Railroad Tycoon 3, etc. makes EU3 graphics a shame.

I love Europa Universalis, I pass 80% of my gaming time with EU2, but I also have my own humble opinion.

 

[Victor1234]

The map looks horrible. The whole pseudo-3D concept is totally wrong, it strucks itself in the middle between the beauty of the 2D maps from EU2 and the awesome 3D maps of RTW being as a result a stupid 3D map that will be always looked from the top (you need prespective to play, it's not arcade!) turning all the 3D elements in strange and poor figures that don't even fulfill it's role to inform of the kind of element they represent.
From a far/top view of the map, there is no doubt that a 2D map with maybe a smooth 3D for the mountains with 2D signs and elements is far better than all those 3D cities that cannot be seing properly from a ceiling prespective.

Bad job Paradox!

Ummm, if you read MrT's previous posts, you'll find that he cut out alot of graphics options to improve performance, and zoomed out to take the screenshots....

 

[Vacceo]

Ehhhm forum mates; I think you´re accepting a huge historical mistake regarding the capital of Castille during XV-XVI centuries: it wasn´t in Toledo since Castille didn´t have official capital till Philip II.
The capital was were the king was but as "de facto" capital, the city was Valladolid (province of Castilla la Vieja in EU3) since there was stablished "chancillería" (general court of justice of the kingdom) and the crown archives.

Besides that, I´d suggest to change the province of Toledo to Castilla la Nueva to make sense with the other provinces.

 

[Brownbeard]

Seems we wont be spamming royal marriages around the globe to serve as non-aggression pacts and diplo enhancers anymore, these things are dangerous!

Got a few questions:

1. If you had not formed a RM with Portugal would there have been a PU with Aragon instead of a succession war?

2. Is there any clue when a monarch might kick the bucket or anything involved or is it all completely random? IE, if you had reloaded autosave prior to that event, would death of monarch still happen?

 

[unmerged(6777)]

So Portugal sent their army to help your provinces on their border. Do you think the AI could have sent the armies over castille to siege aragon directly?

They could have...but they were actually somewhat preoccupied at the time themselves. Portugal protected its borders by attacking anything that came in range; but it was also involved in a naval invasion at several locations. I didn't pay super-close attention to it, but at one point I noticed that Portugal had taken almost all of Aragon's islands and on at least two occasions it transported armies by sea and landed them in Barcelona to lay siege to the Aragonese capital. Each time, though, Aragon was able to muster enough to repulse the attack, and later in the war Aragon had built enough ships and won enough naval battles to defeat Portugal's fleets.

I think Portugal could have helped me a little bit more, but not much. In an MP game, a human Portugal might have chosen a different approach; but I was actually quite impressed with the overall behaviour of the war AI (both Portugal and Aragon) in this test. It's certainly more than I have ever seen in EU2. And, as you saw, it very nearly crushed me, in spite of the fact that Aragon also had to contend with a brief bit of French opportunism.

The only worry I'd have about this is that surely saving the details of every battle fought would lead to a huge save file? I know in CK the massive files of dead characters can lead to technical issues after a while.

Not too bad, actually; but the full battle details are only saved for battles that involve the player and only for "significant" battles. As you say, saving each and every single battle for every single country would make for gigantic save game files. IMO Johan has chosen a pretty decent compromise.

 

[Dominik]

Were there any of those generic random events during your game except for the succession one? It would be nice if you could reveal some of them

 

[ComradeOm]

Excellent stuff MrT. Thanks for taking the time for this. I think everyone's picked up a lot of new info today

 

[Ayeshteni]

The map looks horrible. The whole pseudo-3D concept is totally wrong, it strucks itself in the middle between the beauty of the 2D maps from EU2 and the awesome 3D maps of RTW being as a result a stupid 3D map that will be always looked from the top (you need prespective to play, it's not arcade!) turning all the 3D elements in strange and poor figures that don't even fulfill it's role to inform of the kind of element they represent.
From a far/top view of the map, there is no doubt that a 2D map with maybe a smooth 3D for the mountains with 2D signs and elements is far better than all those 3D cities that cannot be seen properly from a ceiling prespective.

Bad job Paradox!

PD: Please, don't post supid replies to my post defending Paradox just because you're brainless fanatics. Paradox CAN MAKE MISTAKES and Paradox has to accept and expect bad reviews if they want to improve and progress.
I'm sure the game mechanics have improved and that EU3 will be very fun, but we will have to wait to EU4 to have a decent game, those maps remind me Popolous and other visually horrible 3D games.
The graphic level of nowadays games: Medieval Total War 2, Civilization 4, Railroad Tycoon 3, etc. makes EU3 graphics a shame.

I love Europa Universalis, I pass 80% of my gaming time with EU2, but I also have my own humble opinion.

As MrT has already stated the map is in a zoomed-OUT position. The perspective does change, you need only look at other screenshots to see this.

Ayeshteni

 

[unmerged(21489)]

I repeat, this is how we all play, zoom out, and it is awful.

No one plays watching with a province filling the screen, you try to have at least all Spain/France inside the screen, just like the screenshot shows.

 

[unmerged(6777)]

Seems we wont be spamming royal marriages around the globe to serve as non-aggression pacts and diplo enhancers anymore, these things are dangerous!

Risk-reward. You can't get the good things happening (like being senior partner of a PU, inheritting, diplo-annexation, etc.) without them, but there's the corresponding risk of having something nasty happen to you instead. It certainly makes you think about things...

Got a few questions:

1. If you had not formed a RM with Portugal would there have been a PU with Aragon instead of a succession war?

Possibly. There's a certain chance of each happening, and I'm not positive whether the "succession war" result reverts to PU if the conditions for the war aren't met or if it might just re-roll until is gets a valid result.

2. Is there any clue when a monarch might kick the bucket or anything involved or is it all completely random? IE, if you had reloaded autosave prior to that event, would death of monarch still happen?

No. If I reload an earlier save there's no guarantee that the same thing would happen. It's not completely random. It's a random chance that is weighted by situational factors. In this instance, I know that Juan II (my previous ruler) is fairly old so he's likely to die pretty soon; but the exact date of his death and his possible succession issues are not predetermined (else you could "cheat" and read them from a save game file).

Were there any of those generic random events during your game except for the succession one? It would be nice if you could reveal some of them

I had a few random events during that time. IIRC I had one from some disgruntled nobles that didn't like my DP settings and forced me to choose between moving slightly more towards decentralization or suffer a stab hit (I took the former) and I had a province whose population was less than impressed with my war taxes and decided to whine about it. To placate them I think I decided to allow them a tax exemption of some % of their province tax for some extended period of time (was better than have them rise up in revolt...I needed the manpower and didn't need yet another hostile army kicking around).

<stuff>

To each his own.

Also keep in mind that Arenas hasn't actually played EU3 so he's just speculating on how he will play. He's entitled to his opinion, just as anyone else is, as long as he remains polite about it.

 

[unmerged(5165)]

I've lost count of how many different unit types there are...at least several hundred anyway. There's 3 classes of unit: infantry, cavalry, artillery. Each class has a large number of unit types, each of which is defined by the culture group it belongs to and the land tech level you have to reach before it becomes unlocked.

I started out with very basic western European infantry and cavalry and had no access to artillery at all (yes...artillery existed at the time, but not for field combat...like EU2, artillery regiments aren't available until you've reached a certain land tech level). If I'd played further into the game, I would have had new and improved infantry and cavalry regiments become available to me, and I would then have had to pick a time to upgrade my army. However, the upgrade of my entire national army would have taken only a couple of mouse clicks. No more clickfest/micromanagement hell for that anymore.

That sounds very cool! Thank you for your quick and helpful answer!

 

[Reveilled]

No. If I reload an earlier save there's no guarantee that the same thing would happen. It's not completely random. It's a random chance that is weighted by situational factors. In this instance, I know that Juan II (my previous ruler) is fairly old so he's likely to die pretty soon; but the exact date of his death and his possible succession issues are not predetermined (else you could "cheat" and read them from a save game file).

This is something that seems a bit strange to me. Surely, if the monarch's death is liable to result in a sucession crisis or a personal union, that would be plain to see for everyone well in advance of the monarch's death.


Oh, and about Exploration. Will EU3 finally allow historical level exploration, like circumnavigations in the 1500s, or trips to India without african colonies, before then?

 

[EvilSanta]

Excellent read! This raises my already high hopes to whole new levels. I cant wait for the first long AAR.

 

[Petrarca]

and I had a province whose population was less than impressed with my war taxes and decided to whine about it. To placate them I think I decided to allow them a tax exemption of some % of their province tax for some extended period of time (was better than have them rise up in revolt...I needed the manpower and didn't need yet another hostile army kicking around).

That makes me feel so... Renaissance monarch.

 

[frpe02]

Wow, I can't wait to play this game!

The system with constant reinforcement of the armies seems great and will hopefully make it easier to wage war .

Now it's just to wait to the next AAR...