This game Needs: Enemy invasions

[Tiago87]

One of the biggest streamed game today is "They Are Billions".
Why's that? It got worse graphics. worse tech, worse map-style/settings than many other games.
IMHO the constant challenge of enemies, randomization and that its not super dumb down makes every map different and fun.

To build a SimCity/city-skylines town on mars is nice but whats the end goal? Something that keeps every nerd like me playing. Events like a meteorite strike etc? (I guess there will be more constant events occurring.)
But without more depth and for example "Starship troopers" like enemy invasions, this game as it looks now on stream ain't more than SimCity in space. Certainly nice/cute for a moment but nothing more than a footnote in strategy gaming.

And for players who just want to build, make a toggle checkbox for enemy encounters.

(To all internet trollers and/or haters: PLZ I'm also a Paradox fanboy, who buy every dlc, who grind the toughest achievements, and got more than 1k hours in CK2/EU4/VIC2/Stellaris (Hoi4 needs a better trade and diplomatic system...
And as Cato the Elder would say: "Ceterum/Praeterea censeo Carthaginem esse delendam" = China needs a accurate historical Nerf in EU4. And less propaganda adjusted history.))

 

[greatolaf3]

As far as I can tell, you, my friend, are the troll here. There is explicitly no end goal to most Paradox games, you either set the goal yourself, or the goal is fun. If you can't understand that, you either haven't been playing Paradox games very long, or you are on the completely wrong forum.

 

[Tiago87]

As far as I can tell, you, my friend, are the troll here. There is explicitly no end goal to most Paradox games, you either set the goal yourself, or the goal is fun. If you can't understand that, you either haven't been playing Paradox games very long, or you are on the completely wrong forum.

Got the feeling that I'm answering a troll but here we go:
I'm not trying to belittle your feelings. It's cool, as I stated earlier, to do your own thing. Like painting a painting. Expressing yourself. Like what's the end game for skylines or Sims4 etc? That's nice 2. ☺

What I want to put forward is that many players enjoy goal's that brings the challenge of opponents. Like other nations in EU4. Hostile species in stellaris. More complex achievements like Aladdin in ck2 or a Gothic HRE in EU4.
Game titles like: "Command and conquer", "Age of Empires", "Caesar 3" and every other "gathering resources, building base, defend" game there is.
Still some, like yourself, ain't wrong if you just want 2 build a Mega city in skylines with no traffic issues or slide the ai nation bar to minimum in stellaris.

If this game aims to casual city builders and sims players that's cool, but if this game would allow the option of ai nations or base defending that would add more depth and draw a bigger player base to paradox.

 

[greatolaf3]

Let me put it in a more practical manner, and I apologize for starting my last post guns blazing. Amusingly, I am technically a troll, I live in southern Michigan. But, back on track, their stated goal in the creation of Surviving Mars is to create an extremely realistic Mars colonization focused game. While I may disagree slightly with their numbers on solar and wind power, and, greatly eith their numbers on battery storage, I believe that so far, from what we have seen, they have accomplished this goal. In this vein, they have either completely opted out of terraforming as outside of the scope of the game, or left it to potentially add in a DLC later. As a result of which, everyone is living in domes. Assuming that humans don't go completely insane in the future, this means that the only people engaging in militant actions will be either suicidal, or as insane as anyone willing to actually use nuclear weapons today. Those domes are fragile, and can take only a very limited form of punishment, they're designed to maintain pressure and keep out dust storms, they'll have failsafes certainly, but ultimately, if you're determined, they'll be quite easy to break, killing all the inhabitants in minutes. Unlike in gsmes like They Are Billions, (an excellent game I hope to purchase, at some point), Command and Conquer, or other RTS games, Surviving Mars is in a remarkably hostile environment, the planet itself is trying to kill you, do you really see other humans trying to as well? This is not a horror movie, with it's paper thin excuse for a plot, and the complete idiocy of participants, this is a highly planned expedition, with presumably rigorous vetting procedures and having an eye for the best and brightest of mankind.

OTOH, I can see where you're coming from, and, while this game is explicitly not a strategy game of any stripe, I can see where people, (crazy people IMHO), might want additional challenge. With them having refused to show or detail any of the mysteries beyond their names so far, I honestly can't say much with certainty, but some of the names might indicate the presence of aliens, who absolutely would not care about the people they're killing in those fragile domes, they just want them gone. Also, remember, this is being made in cooperation with the people who brought us Tropico, I'm expecting a lot of cues from those games as well, alongside Cities: Skylines vibes, with maybe the tiniest hint of Stellaris influence.

On a... slightly unrelated note, you might notice that Paradox, when they have a vision, can and do tell the fans to go screw themselves. If they want to include Martian warfare of any kind, they will, eventually, if they don't, they won't. No amount of bickering on our part has gotten them to change their minds about goddamned AI naval attrition or any of a dozen or more other complaints in their other games, especially on big, mechanical or engine based issues before. Why do you think it will now?

 

[gigau]

Surviving Mars is in a remarkably hostile environment, the planet itself is trying to kill you, do you really see other humans trying to as well? This is not a horror movie, with it's paper thin excuse for a plot, and the complete idiocy of participants, this is a highly planned expedition, with presumably rigorous vetting procedures and having an eye for the best and brightest of mankind.

I can see a mod idea there… the drones go nuts and implement the Cohaagen Initiative, shutting down the ventilation to a dome…

 

[Tiago87]

On a... slightly unrelated note, you might notice that Paradox, when they have a vision, can and do tell the fans to go screw themselves. If they want to include Martian warfare of any kind, they will, eventually, if they don't, they won't. No amount of bickering on our part has gotten them to change their minds about goddamned AI naval attrition or any of a dozen or more other complaints in their other games, especially on big, mechanical or engine based issues before. Why do you think it will now?

+1
It takes courage and humility to do that!
Like how Epic's game Fortnite changed from the "Orcs must die" style to also catering to the PUBG players.
I do appreciate Wiz and the Stellaris crew who are rebuilding the FTL system. A move that show both love for the game and strength.
Of course they have to balance how much time they are willing to spend on their product vs bringing in the bucks asap EA style.
But man I would love to see a RTS Starcraft/ Age of Emp/ They are Billions game from paradox.

 

[Tiago87]

I can see a mod idea there… the drones go nuts and implement the Cohaagen Initiative, shutting down the ventilation to a dome…

Well they mentioned different cooperations you could choose from. How about some good old cooperation espionage/sabotage? ☺

 

[henzington]

Tropico had rebels but the nature of the habitats doesn’t really lend itself to this

 

[IceWeasel]

What I love about this game is that it precisely DOESNT have ennemis. Except nature. I don't understand why companies nowadays think that every game has to have zombies in order to be a survival game... as soon as I see Zombies in any game I immediately loose interest. Let me strategize, let me plan my colony etc... This is not about science fiction, its about something that will actually happen in the near future... and there wont be zombies or aliens. Just us.

 

[Tiago87]

What I love about this game is that it precisely DOESNT have ennemis. Except nature. I don't understand why companies nowadays think that every game has to have zombies in order to be a survival game... as soon as I see Zombies in any game I immediately loose interest. Let me strategize, let me plan my colony etc... This is not about science fiction, its about something that will actually happen in the near future... and there wont be zombies or aliens. Just us.

I hear ya . And that's awesome for u!
When I mentioned "they are billions" it was as a example in game design.
I would Not like zombies on Mars as well.

When I watch the streams I feel this game is "flat".
After 20hours of gaming, if this is it, what's next?
The reason why I'm even here on this forum ain't to trash talk, it's a probably naive attempt to reach out to you guys and maybe Paradox, but it's to improve this game/simulator. More depth, challenges, something that adds replayability (like a true paradox title should have)!
Island building like Tropico got their special charm and political/rebel/Swiss Bank account adding to their building game. (plus our favorite Penultiumo voice actor.)

To add to the thought about "no aliens, nothing except us".
Humans are enough!
Economical interests and proud leaders will always cause trouble.
(Just as when the European powers discovered the American continent. They killed the natives and other europeans while racing to expand their colonies for wealth and glory.
Fighting for centuries until colonists all over America wanted independence. And after they got independence, the new nations continued fighting, both in civil wars and externally. All for wealth and pride.)
This is just one idea, but I'm sure you all and especially Paradox have many more on how to add more depth and replayability.

 

[IceWeasel]

Yeah I get your point. I'm sure this would appeal to a large part of the player base too. However in that case I think bringing it as DLC would be appropriate or like you've mentioned as an option to be turned on or off at will.

Maybe have another company also start their mission to mars, using another sponsor with the goal of us later on establishing some sort of commerce or trading possibilities? Or like you said , political aspects and rivalry. Although Im not sure about that idea, since in real life (hopefully) this wont happen and the first colonists on mars will be international and peaceful, although the occasional scramble is normal I guess.

 

[Submaster]

This game will be my first foray into something brought about be either Haemimont or Paradox. While I know no one likes having their babies subjected to demands from others, I'm hoping the occasional softly delivered advice will be heeded by the devs. While it would be awesome to be able to interact with other colonies (other players, not AI but I'll take what I can get), I think the Mysteries will add enough spice to liven up the gameplay to make it worth continued play.

 

[ᛒᛖᚱᛋᛖᚱᚲ]

I'm sure a more enhanced combat mechanic is on their long list of DLC ideas. Give them time to get the game out before we start stamping our feet on the ground.

 

[mrinku]

I think the OP pretty much misses the point. This isn't a "strategy game", but primarily a sim.

The Sims doesn't need enemy invasions, nor does Truck Simulator or City Skylines.

I'm seriously puzzled by their drawing a parallel between European invasion/colonisation of the already inhabited Americas and setting up an outpost on an unihabited and unihabitable planet. Do we see the various Antarctic bases demanding independence from their host nations? I think not.

Now, having said that, I'm sure we'll see mods or EPs that deal with war as a disaster, even if it's not in the release game. Doesn't need to be troops on the ground... a world war back on Earth would clearly have a major effect on supply and funding.

 

[XanTraX]

As i noticed in the official gameplay videos, the game is completly modable and the devs would like to see everything one can imagine on mars.
So feel free to mod us Martians, Zombies, Bugs (the citine armourd ones) and everything you can imagine

 

[Nero616]

As a former Fanfiction author married to someone trying to get her Fantasy Novel published, I know a bit about Storytelling.
Surviving Mars is man vs nature-themed strategy, narratively speaking.

Think about it. You build the very first colony on Mars. Your Enemy is the scarcity of resources and the hostile environment. Cold weather, dust storms, meteorites and more that return occasionally and each and every one of them capable of destroying your colony if you don't prepare.
In the mid to late game, when you automated the production and distribution of more resources than you immediately need and the natural disasters that return every now and then are not a treat anymore, the game throws the Mysteries at you to mix up the gameplay. Depending on what it is and how you deal with it, your Colony can benefit from it or be destroyed by it. And as there can be only one Mystery per Map, you can play the game at least as long as there are still Mysteries you don't know or want to try again.
Those Mysteries, as far as I know, count as forces of nature, from a storytelling standpoint, even if the lore reveals them to be relicts of an extinct alien species or something like that.

I would not want the early game to be different than what I've seen on YouTube Videos so far, but there are some things I would like to see added to the mid to late game in DLCs or Mods. I am not opposed to colony vs. colony wars or invasions from earth, but it is not on my top 5 list.

 

[EntilZha]

Planetbase called, they say they have the terrible mechanic you want.