Two small suggestion: one cosmetic for immersion and one new decision

[TheFeudalBavarian]

I have two little suggestions for CK3:

1. Purely cosmetic: in early and high middle ages, throughout Europe, pretty much 100% of all coins and money was silver based (in very few exceptions gold coins were used for international trade). Only in the late middle ages some regions minted gold ducats, mostly for international trade. Therefore I would suggest that we call the money in the game "silver" instead of "gold" and change all little money symbols throughout the game to silver coins, instead of gold coins. This is mostly for a more historic correct immersion aspect of the game.

2. Suggestion for additional decision available to rulers: in medieval Europe rulers used something called "Renovatio Monetae" (re-coinage) to collect hidden taxes. this was especially used by HRE rulers (mostly dukes and archbishops) between 1200 and 1500. Basically, people were forced to exchange a certain amount of old coins for fewer new ones, therefore making the ruler who was minting coins additional money. People would get upset about this over time and eventually that even caused revolts. This would make for a nice new decision play mechanic. A ruler could decide to do an event called '"Renovatio Monetae", a re-coinage, which would give him instant extra tax money. The downside would be that every time this is used, the revolt risk for this region goes up (when used multiple times it should even go up drastically( and vassal opinions down. This would be a historic correct new decision mechanic to the game....also would add to the historic immersion.

Looking forward to this game!!!

 

[Arona]

I agree, but silver or gold it self had value and if coins were in precious metal then orginally this scheme woulnt work. Only would work for coins what are not precious metal and what value is defined by state.

 

[TheFeudalBavarian]

I agree, but silver or gold it self had value and if coins were in precious metal then orginally this scheme woulnt work. Only would work for coins what are not precious metal and what value is defined by state.

First of all, there was no state....it was the feudal system with kingdoms, duchies etc. Also, there was not one kingdom wide currency. Well, most of the time through the middle ages there was only one kind of coin: the penny (Pfennig in Germany, Denier in France, Denaro in Italy). They could all differ in weight but basically 240 of them made up a pound of silver (the weight of a pound differed a lot based on region). Alone in the HRE you had dozens of different mints.

Second, this scheme worked very well. It is very well documented and was used all over the place. If you were in medieval Germany (HRE) somewhere 11th to 14th century, you would have to get local coins in any city or town in order to buy something. You couldn't just use pennies from lets say Trier to buy something in Regensburg. You had to go to the local coin exchange and exchange non-local coins to local coins. When over regional trade deals were negotiated, the negotiations also included in what coinage it had to paid. It was not enough to say the "4 pounds have to be paid". It was more like "4 poinds of Regensburger pennies" or any other regional coinage.

Very often rulers used this re-coinage to make extra money. the old money was "verrufen" (recalled) and people had exchange old coins for fewer new coins. The old coins were not allowed to be accepted in the duchy, city or for whatever region this coin was minted. Yes, technically you could have put the coins aside and melted them for the silver....but that was not feasible for most people. This actually lead to quite some upset folks...people revolted and burned down local mints, as it happened in Munich in 1295.

So, in the game we could have the decision to re-coinage (Renovatio Monetae) the money in a specific county or duchy that we control. This would give us some instant extra taxes for the price of unhappy peasants and vassals with the increased risk of revolts. This could be a nice option to have when money is tight, but we think we can deal with a possible revolt.

And it would add to the depths of the game by adding another thing to do, with implications down the road if we abuse it. It certainly would add to the immersion factor.

 

[guinea prince]

Second, this scheme worked very well. It is very well documented and was used all over the place. If you were in medieval Germany (HRE) somewhere 11th to 14th century, you would have to get local coins in any city or town in order to buy something. You couldn't just use pennies from lets say Trier to buy something in Regensburg. You had to go to the local coin exchange and exchange non-local coins to local coins. When over regional trade deals were negotiated, the negotiations also included in what coinage it had to paid. It was not enough to say the "4 pounds have to be paid". It was more like "4 poinds of Regensburger pennies" or any other regional coinage.

 

[Arona]

Scheme worked becouse locals hasent much change, but rich merchants and nobles didnt fall for it. Silver was real value and most important trade were regional and global trade. and it were calcualted mostly in silver and gold, foreign merchant didnt care what stamp coin had on it only its weight. But ovrally you are right small folk didnt have much coice and were pissed off, but nobles and rich merchant werent never that stupid.

Our home place we find few years ago some noble silver stash. and it included 14 different silver coins and 2 different gold coins. So that meant directly nobles didnt exchange they silver coins but stashed them up and when there were need and oprtunity they exchanged silver to coins with cheap exchange fee not paying 20-25% of every exchange cycle

 

[TheFeudalBavarian]

Scheme worked becouse locals hasent much change, but rich merchants and nobles didnt fall for it. Silver was real value and most important trade were regional and global trade. and it were calcualted mostly in silver and gold, foreign merchant didnt care what stamp coin had on it only its weight. But ovrally you are right small folk didnt have much coice and were pissed off, but nobles and rich merchant werent never that stupid.

Our home place we find few years ago some noble silver stash. and it included 14 different silver coins and 2 different gold coins. So that meant directly nobles didnt exchange they silver coins but stashed them up and when there were need and oprtunity they exchanged silver to coins with cheap exchange fee not paying 20-25% of every exchange cycle

Where is your home place?

Well, sure...some rich merchant probably melted away silver in some cases and sold it. But those people were a real minority. Also, merchants who visited another town for trade had to pay duties in the local currency, and trade and the market square had to be done in local currency. But this kind of hidden re-coinage fee mostly hit the local towns people and common folks. but those made the majority of the population. Peasants could't afford to stash away money in order to avoid re-coinage. they needed to money daily to survive. And again...re-coinage worked, otherwise they dukes and bishops wouldn't have done in hundreds of time through out the middle ages....

 

[TheFeudalBavarian]

I like that...LOL

 

[RagingJaws]

Anything that replaces the "New Coinage" event in CK2 is welcome.

I'd like to take that event out back and shoot it.

 

[TheFeudalBavarian]

What is the "New Coinage" event? I never had it....

 

[Arona]

What is the "New Coinage" event? I never had it....

well its business focus event where you can mint new coins and get 100 free gold if you dillute money and also 100 free prestige, but you have change to get caught and lose double prestige.