Werewolf Lite CXCIX- The Family Meeting, Part II

[AOK. 11]

There is only one question I would still like an answer to (but I doubt whether I will ever get it). What would AOK himself have done if he were in your or mine position, confronting his evil self?

Basically what you did. Except threaten to burn people's houses down if they did not vote with me. I would have also gotten very aggressive with possible packmates in the hope of earning a sellout vote or two. Had you pressured drxav and Sedracus, I think you could have flipped one or both.

AOK is the worst liar in the game.

I just saw this. Lying effectively is something I take pride in. Saying something like this is not something I take litely. The fact that I can pass anything off at this point after over five years of treachery is pretty strong evidence that I am not the "worst liar" in the game.

I am the best liar. In the worst possible way of course.

 

[reis91]

Yes. I'm afraid that might be the case.
And ofcourse I feel bad for trying to prevent a village-loss despite that it turned out to be an unwinnable situation. Game is no fun if you are still in the game yet nothing can be done what will even help in preventing loosing.

Oh, but it can be fun! Walrus's Big, completely unbalanced towards a certain baddie pack, where the village was utterly abused, but it was still fun.

It's not fun if only play only for the win.

Anyway, I still have the PM where I asked for a scan on you, plus all the PM's we've exchanged. I wonder why randakar didn't use those, since I sent them to him.

 

[AOK. 11]

If he would have posted PMs I had forgeries ready in retaliation. I thought they would be somewhat more believable if posted immediately following any PMs from the enemy. I could claim I did not have time to forge anything since I only posted as an immediate response to forgeries from Randy.

I have deleted them but they were pretty good and I think I could have neutralized any affect Randy's PMs may have had.

 

[reis91]

No, I meant the PM where you clearly incited me to go after randy.

 

[AOK. 11]

No, I meant the PM where you clearly incited me to go after randy.

But I was only a villager, and I was suspicious of Randy! And my suspicions turned out to be right! You see, I was always suspicious of him. My story has not changed a bit. I just made the misake of backing off.

Reis, I can do this all day. No matter what you tried, I could deal with it. I got the drop on you.

 

[reis91]

I want to see a good performance in my Big game, AOK. Anything which is deemed sub-par for your extremely awesome skills will lead to the GM's assumption that you are zombie'ing, followed by autolynch Also, please join the Big game, here:

Werewolf CIV : When the saints go marching in

The setting

You are in a religious gathering, with the most holy missions of canonization and beatification. However, before the gathering began, a Voice spoke to each of you, about the evil in your midst, seeking to subvert the holy purpose of the Assembly. The barriers between Good and Evil shall be utterly shattered, and your goal is to win, by whatever means necessary.​

 

[AOK. 11]

Pastor Ted "AOK" Haggard will do his best to spread the Good Word to the furthest reaches of the globe.

 

[Adamus]

Youve done the group pm's yes?

 

[randakar]

I am the best liar. In the worst possible way of course.

That's basically what I meant

 

[reis91]

Youve done the group pm's yes?

Would like to know if I can go to jail for it, first.

 

[drxav]

To put an end to the ongoing argument about who won or lost the game and who is the best player, I'll tell you this:

AOK's metagaming hunts put us in trouble. AOK's fake outing was purely suicide. Randy's mess up with Dirkje saved the day for us. It gave us the name of hte seer and the entire JL. Reis91 auto-kill is yet another lucky development for the wolves. And finally we managed in the end to confuse everyone deeply as to win this game.

So to AOK: chill out, you really, really, really got lucky there. You put yourself in a complicated situation (and us along you) and you pulled it off thanks to Randy's mess up.

To Randy: don't hate yourself, you just let too much information go. Be careful next time.

Rysz: we got the information upper hand. From there it was very hard for you guys to win the game. We killed the JL in one single turn.

Finally: it wasn't a genius move, it wasn't a retarted move, it's just a chain of events that lead to the wolves winning. Had Randy not told us who the seer was AOK would've been lynched, period. Had Reis91 voted the villagers would've had more time to think. We really really got lucky and no one actually lead the debate. It was all chance.

Be realistic about it.

 

[AOK. 11]

Be realistic about it.

I don't mean to be harsh, but you are clueless. This was not luck.

You said what I did was the worst move ever in a PM. You were totally and utterly wrong. Had I not done what I did I would have been outed and we would have gotten nothing in return. I would have died anyway. Even if Randy had not made the slip, I would have destroyed them anyway as I had already gone after Tres. You can criticize my hunts if you want, but at least I did not suggest hunting Adamus, one of the easiest fall guys left, on the day I "outed" tres instead of Tres/Randy. That was perhaps the most ridiculous hunt suggestion ever.

I will say it again. Had you been in charge the wolves would have probably lost. You would have been killed for certain along with Sedracus. Only dirkje would have had a chance had the JL not been destroyed on that day.

And one final thing, dirkje, you played really well. You are a very skilled player despite having only a few games under your belt. Your ability at this point after only a few games is quite remarkable.

 

[randakar]

And one final thing, dirkje, you played really well. You are a very skilled player despite having only a few games under your belt. Your ability at this point after only a few games is quite remarkable.

I knew that going into this game, AOK. It just needs to sink into you people

 

[drxav]

I don't mean to be harsh, but you are clueless. This was not luck.

You said what I did was the worst move ever in a PM. You were totally and utterly wrong. Had I not done what I did I would have been outed and we would have gotten nothing in return.

You WERE extremely lucky. You outed Trespoe who happened to be the seer, but you were clueless when you did.

Let's sum up how things went: you made meta-game hunts which rang the bell of randy. He had you scanned you knew about it. You went berserk on some random player. This is what you did. The rest is about external factors that turned your decision into a valid move.

You put us in danger by selecting your hunts.

Let's assume Trespoe had not been the seer (you had no possibility, neither did you know when you made your move). So we manage to get him lynched. So what. We're down to 10 vs 3. Let's assume Reis91 isn't auto-lynched. The game would've gone far more days. And since you rose the suspicion towards us, it'd had been pretty pretty tight for us. I reckon before dying Randy transmitted a suspect list and was somewhat accurate.

We DEFINITELY were lucky and you can't claim you made such a genius move. You were lucky, we were lucky and we pulled that off by pure luck. You outed the seer by chance, the JL lost a player by auto-lynch. Period.

You can state I'm just a newbie and all, I don't care, I'm realistic about it. I was lucky to win that one. And I'm persuaded your move isn't a valid strategy, at least not a winning strategy.

 

[AOK. 11]

You WERE extremely lucky. You outed Trespoe who happened to be the seer, but you were clueless when you did.

Trespoe's obvious support for Randy the previous day is what we like to call a clue. Obviously you did not see it....as you are clueless. A process of elimination, as well as looking at those who supported Randy, led me to deduce that Tres was a good JL suspect. I was correct. Obviously deductive reasoning is difficult for you, so I understand why you might think it was just a random choice.

Let's sum up how things went: you made meta-game hunts which rang the bell of randy. He had you scanned you knew about it. You went berserk on some random player. This is what you did. The rest is about external factors that turned your decision into a valid move.

Nothing I do is random. Nothing. When people accuse me of randomness I do not take it lightly. Trespoe was the best JL suspect available. You did not see that because you are clueless.

You put us in danger by selecting your hunts.

Incorrect. Perhaps I got myself scanned a day earlier, but thats it. I did not endanger anyone.

Let's assume Trespoe had not been the seer (you had no possibility, neither did you know when you made your move). So we manage to get him lynched. So what. We're down to 10 vs 3. Let's assume Reis91 isn't auto-lynched. The game would've gone far more days. And since you rose the suspicion towards us, it'd had been pretty pretty tight for us. I reckon before dying Randy transmitted a suspect list and was somewhat accurate.

You seem to have difficulty understanding this, so I will go slow. I....WAS.....ALREADY.....DEAD! The only question was when or how. Whether Tres was the Seer or not, guaranteeing that another two villagers were killed before I was lynched was the correct move. I could either die and get nothing in return, or I could die and take a good JL suspect and Randy with me.

We DEFINITELY were lucky and you can't claim you made such a genius move. You were lucky, we were lucky and we pulled that off by pure luck. You outed the seer by chance, the JL lost a player by auto-lynch. Period.

Again, nothing I do is random, and it was not pure luck. New players often make this mistake since they do not know any better. It was not a genius move. It was simply a competent move that was the correct course of action to be taken at that point. You claiming otherwise is ignorance of how this game works.

You can state I'm just a newbie and all,

Fine. You are a newbie and it shows.

I don't care, I'm realistic about it. I was lucky to win that one. And I'm persuaded your move isn't a valid strategy, at least not a winning strategy.

There are two objectives in this game. Destroying the enemy, and surviving. If one is impossible, then I concentrate entirely on the second. In this case, I was not going to surivive this game no matter what if I did not get the Seer before Day 3 or so. Once that became clear, I concentrated on killing as many villagers as possible. Whether Tres was the Seer or not was completely irrelevant in deciding whether or not I made the right move. Taking two goodies with me was the correct decision, whether he was JL or not

 

[EUROO7]

By the way, Drxav, if you feel the urge to torture and murder AOK in future games, let me tell you it's only natural. All of us have been through that process.

 

[AOK. 11]

By the way, Drxav, if you feel the urge to torture and murder AOK in future games, let me tell you it's only natural. All of us have been through that process.

First you kind of dislike me. Then you hate me. Finally, you really hate me.

Those are the three stages of AOK. And indeed, they are natural.

 

[EUROO7]

First you kind of dislike me. Then you hate me. Finally, you really hate me.

Those are the three stages of AOK. And indeed, they are natural.

There is... one final stage. One which only few of us achieve.

 

[AOK. 11]

There is... one final stage. One which only few of us achieve.

And it shall not be mentioned as it does not exist except to those few.

 

[drxav]

Trespoe's obvious support for Randy the previous day is what we like to call a clue.

Why didn't you tell us then? He wasn't on OUR suspect list, which you agreed on. Don't be making up stuff please. I do not disrespect you, you shouldn't disrespect me. You never told us he was a good suspect, you just tagged his name randomly. If he was such a good suspect, why did you agree on hunting Walrus and not him the day before?

You did not see that because you are clueless.

I'm laughing quietly to myself.

Incorrect. Perhaps I got myself scanned a day earlier, but thats it. I did not endanger anyone.

No you didn't, and we perfectly knew about it. Randy told you HE was scanned the day before. You got scanned that very day because of your behaviour. I even Pmed you that, Randy Pmed you that. IIRC I said something along the line : you should've told us you were hunting according to a pattern, now Randy's all over you, consider yourself scanned. I have the other wolves to attest.

You seem to have difficulty understanding this, so I will go slow. I....WAS.....ALREADY.....DEAD! The only question was when or how. Whether Tres was the Seer or not, guaranteeing that another two villagers were killed before I was lynched was the correct move. I could either die and get nothing in return, or I could die and take a good JL suspect and Randy with me.

I'll have to go slow: YOU WERE LUCKY. You picked the seer out of the blue and were lucky Reis91 got auto-lynched.

Fine. You are a newbie and it shows.

There are two objectives in this game. Destroying the enemy, and surviving. If one is impossible, then I concentrate entirely on the second. In this case, I was not going to surivive this game no matter what if I did not get the Seer before Day 3 or so. Once that became clear, I concentrated on killing as many villagers as possible. Whether Tres was the Seer or not was completely irrelevant in deciding whether or not I made the right move. Taking two goodies with me was the correct decision, whether he was JL or not

Feels like I'm playing CSS now.

I hear your argument and agree to some degree. You were just lucky it turned out the way it turned out. You cannot claim, like you did, that it was the best move ever and ruined the chances of the village from that point, and won the game. Luck won this one, and I reckon a great many deal of players will agree with me on that.