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what is the % probability for vassalization/annex?

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aino

aino

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I'm becoming very frustrated with the diplomacy in this game. No matter how hard I try I cannot seem to get any vassals.

Currently, I'm playing as Austria. I'm trying to vassalize Lorraine, Saxony and Hungary. I have +200 relation with all 3... it's before 1517 so everyone is Catholic... I have royal marriages with all 3 and we're all in a military alliance.

I tried (through loading) to vassalize Lorraine 6 times, and each time I was declined. Then I read somewhere that not having a common border is a problem, so I turned to Saxony. We have a common border now (we carved up Bohemia early on) and I fit all the requirements, so I try to vassalize Saxony. Declined.

So I reload the game 7 more times just to see the percentages. Each time I'm declined. There is NOTHING that I'm missing. 200 relation. Royal Marriage. Same Religion. Military Alliance, and yet I cannot get vassals for the life of me.

In the time I've been playing, I've made maybe 40+ vassalization offers, and I've only succeeded ONCE. I was playing as England and after about 7 tries and 20 years I vassalized Hannover... only to have them change religion the next year, making it all for naught.

Does anyone know what the probability for forming a vassalization are? Are there hidden factors like time? (I thought it was time so I waited 15 years before submitting the vassalization request to Saxony) Or is this a bug? Because it's seriously starting to annoy me.

Other than that and some other tiny details, this game is disturbingly fun. =)
 
My answer here is solely based on my limited experience, but I've found that, in addition to the strict requirements you mentioned, relative military and economic strength seem to have a great deal to do with the percentage chance to vassalize. Not sure about this, but that's how it's been for me so far. I would love to have a better answer on this though.
 
First of all a common border is needed for diplo annexation, not vassalisation.

Becoming a vassal of someone is effectively giving up half ur monthly income to someone, let their troops parade thru ur lands and let them decide most of ur foreign policy. So in case they would accept that, they would have to be in some trouble first, aka need protection. A country that is doing fine on its own is not gonna give up its independence just to please u. The things u mentioned are the requirements, those are the easy parts. Getting them to agree is the real trick :D

Look out for low stability, recent bankrupcies, big losses in war, ...

It of xure helps if u actually look like being able to protect them like be big and have a big army.

And have a monarch with a very nice diplo skill :D
 
For the record, I have a very nice vassalisation record myself if I may so so. There's no rush, pick plausible targets, work on relations and be more patient. Evidently there's a random factor but it can be quite minimized.
 
What I don't like, is that while you're waiting around for the your vassal to weaken, you are tied up in that alliance, which is by its nature usually a weak one. Then you're not free to ally yourself with a stronger nation, like Spain or France. So I find myself stuck in a weak alliance for 20 years, and then I and my vassal get defeated, without a strong ally to come to our aid, when being attacked by a stronger alliance.
 
Once they are ur vassals u don't need to be in the same alliance anymore to diplo annex them, u know. Just ally with whoever u want. IF someone pounds then on ur stand alone vassal, tyen ur chance of diplo annexing only becomes bigger.

OR u could build ur own alliance, for example invite Spain and then add ur vassals.
 
Originally posted by BiB
Once they are ur vassals u don't need to be in the same alliance anymore to diplo annex them, u know.
Click to expand...

Actually, no, I didn't know. After reading this, I looked around at some old posts and found that one of the beta testers stated that having a military alliance 'helps' with dipo annex, but as you pointed out, is not required. Now, I wonder how much it 'helps'

So, can you dipo annex when you or your vassal is in a war?
 
Part of the problem with the confusion about vassalization is that in the original build of the game it was relatively easy. Austria, with +200 relations, would vassalize vassalize Hungary 3 out of 4 times (and annexation was only a little more difficult). Several of us commented that this didn't help the game much, so I think the rules have been changed to make things much more difficult. I would imagine that it would be very difficult now for Austria to vassalize and then annex Hungary, given the relative sizes of the two.

I still remember my first game as Venice when I politically annexed Hungary... bet I couldn't do that again!
 
Thanks for all of your help guys. I understand that it makes more sense and is more realistic this way, but I'm trying to make my Austrian empire grow without having to become the badboy of Europe, and it was starting to frustrate me. :)

But I figured that relative military strength plays a role in the vassalization/annexation. Alsace-Lorraine had been at war, so when I was trying she had around 80k troops mobilized. After a few years of peace she demobilized and went back down to 2k worth of troops, and I vassalized her on the first try.

Similarly, I vassalized Saxony on the second attempt. I tried to annex her twice and failed. So the third time I built up my army, added about 30k more soldiers and then tried to annex and was succesful.

Seems pretty intuitive... if you can defend the country against agressors, they'd be more willing to join you for the protection of their people :)
 
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