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Nov 4, 2006
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This is a question for those veterans who've done the TRP and WIF mods. Could you please tell me what strategies you were forced to use(or not to use) which were different from the usual ones practised in standard HOI2:DDA or DAIM?

So far, all I know is that one must attack several provinces at once to avoid the AI massively overstacking 1 hex in defence, and that one has to attack fast to avoid prolonged battles which sap your reinforcements. I've also learnt the value of ground-attack. And I've been told that I shouldn't bother building the huge amounts of engineering-brigades that I usually find useful for my HOI2-DDA DAIM games.

Any other suggestions you can think of?
 
CromCruachan said:
This is a question for those veterans who've done the TRP and WIF mods. Could you please tell me what strategies you were forced to use(or not to use) which were different from the usual ones practised in standard HOI2:DDA or DAIM?

So far, all I know is that one must attack several provinces at once to avoid the AI massively overstacking 1 hex in defence, and that one has to attack fast to avoid prolonged battles which sap your reinforcements. I've also learnt the value of ground-attack. And I've been told that I shouldn't bother building the huge amounts of engineering-brigades that I usually find useful for my HOI2-DDA DAIM games.

Any other suggestions you can think of?
Click to expand...
With WIF platinum, playing USA. If you take the "I want to get my ass kicked" option, you have to rush japan as soon as possible. Japan gets 100,000 convoys, more manpower than you can kill, and a ton of ic. Japan abandons the war in china, leaving it to manchuko. This is the only mod where I actually use nukes and strategic rockets. I also use navs.
 
And one of the few mods in which you can get your ass kicked in 5 months of gameplay, even with the US.
 
Ive only played WiF. I played TR for a few minutes but didnt like the clutter appearence.

Lessons i learnt.
Be prepared to find long losing battles on one siode of front so can win on other.

Dont overstack your advancing columns cause the computer will strategically counterattack. Need to atleast make a fight of it.

Altho you can get bogged down in a fight for a month you can also blitzkrieg so sometimes its worth going if your a bit unprepared aslong as enemy is also. (enemy retereated after losing a battle and has vbeen harassed by aircraft).

WiF gives the computer time to manuvuer in defense but even on very hard it still gives you time. Dont panic with bad looking bars like 80-90% vs you, Still have time for manuvuers.

Amphius assaults are very useful. They have brought me quickest strategical victorys. (Landing in athens and crete - Landing in suez on septemper the 2nd :D) Dont actually assault tho unless have marines :).

Improve infrastructure in places that prolonged battles will occur. Or the staging points for major offenses. Had armoured fist in oppeln for attack on poland with improved infrastructure. Stuttgart to manuvuer left and right. Infrastrucure is pretty fairly priced in my opinion.

Airbases are probably good to build after get all technologys. But they are a little to expensive for my liking. But if intend a major long term offensive in area with few airfields then .......

Wif has mass air formation effectively in sky of 8 with a airmarshall. Make sure to use this effectively and dont suffer overstacking its very annoying. I find spreading 8 formations to seperate battle areas with a airmarshall in the mix is a decent way. Can if bothered stagger arrival of planes throughout day. But im usually not that bothered. Spreading them out and possibly bombing through night keeps rid of that naughty overstacking.

Dont let the computer retreat to citys! If avoidable cut off retreat to citys. I once let 38 infantry divisions retreat to warsaw. Even surronded with 50 quality divisions on it. i felt like crying :mad:. When attacking just dont let them congregate like this. Breaks heart to try and win these battles. :)

WiF can seem like slow battles. But the speed of the units is quite fast. So if you get a flanking force like a ball on chain and really go for it can achieve amazing things still, Thats what i love. It still heavily rewards the well planned offensive :D

On very hard WiF eats your manpower so much :( You get less to start with and units cost more :eek: So get the argrichemistry stuff check each year for manpower ministers. GET ALL THE MANPOWER CAN! In the very end manpower is real constraint on army power. If dont have alot of manpower replace these men with technology. Offcoures with the TC load this can only go so far.

As for engineer brigades they are still lovely but they do eat manpower. 2.5 manpower a brigade. I love them especially the +4 speed increase is massive but give them only to a specialised army for river crossing or your armoured spearhead. But not to many cause of eternal manpower problems :(

In summary fight hard and use force multipliers like aircraft, manuveurablity, concentrated force amphious assaults and always the unexpected :)

many regards pollock
 
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Thanks for all the advice. Very detailed. I don't think air-bases are that necessary, IMO, as WIF seems to spread them out more than in normal HOI2.

I've just heard of an "East is Red" mod which gives massive penalties for overstacking. If I can find it on this board then that might be a way out of such long, drawn-out WIF battles. I've also had similiar fights against 38-50 land-units in Warsaw, and while I managed, eventually, to defeat that army, it exhausted me re reinforcements etc, and I don't want another repeat of that. I've also decided to delete the constant partisan events which WIF introduces as they are just too frequent to be realistic.
 
son of liberty said:
You can find Cueball's East is Red mod here http://forums.ederon.net/default.aspx?g=posts&t=1306
Click to expand...

Well, I've decided not tgive the east is red multiplayer mod a try, as some of the listed changes are definitely not to my taste and I would find it too difficult to select only those which suited me.

At the moment, I've gotten bogged down in Belgium as usual in a trench-warfare situation. It seems that, in WIF/TRP, it's impossible for a 12-unit(even tank-army) force to defeat a modern army in another hex(even 2 units!) unless assisted by attacks from other hexes. The only exception is units from less technologically-advanced nations such as Poland, Turkey etc. which can be rolled over easily.
 
CromCruachan said:
Well, I've decided not tgive the east is red multiplayer mod a try, as some of the listed changes are definitely not to my taste and I would find it too difficult to select only those which suited me.

At the moment, I've gotten bogged down in Belgium as usual in a trench-warfare situation. It seems that, in WIF/TRP, it's impossible for a 12-unit(even tank-army) force to defeat a modern army in another hex(even 2 units!) unless assisted by attacks from other hexes. The only exception is units from less technologically-advanced nations such as Poland, Turkey etc. which can be rolled over easily.
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True, battles are much harder. Even 6 MAR lvl 4 with spart against 3 unbrigaded garrisons in sendai took so long that japan was able to reinforce with 18 more divisions.
 
CromCruachen,
I don't know about the Wif mod but in TRP air power is an absolute must. As Germany TAC and CAS are vert importtant. You need to plan your attacks in advance. Since you can not specifically target provinces you have to saturate a region. Air attacks will rapidly drop an enemy's org allowing you to advance quickly into enemy territory. You need plenty of air. Also, as Germany you need a repectible Int force because the UK will use Strat. bombers on you. Unlike vanilla if you ignore your airforce in either size or technology you will have a very difficult time.
 
In WiF the highest air general can command 8 units :(. So its very hard to down 1 province at a time. Have to spread attacks.

Been playing a WiF challenge difficulty game now. Things ive learnt are to be strategicallyaggressive while keep an eye on the dissent to declare war of allies. Took denmark and netherlands :).

When attacking need to pin the sector reserves your main attack is in. So after spearhead beats first province they can manuvuer on back of surronded units or strike out into undefended terriotrys.

Most important lesson learned was a bit gamey. Launch an attack somewhere to draw in reinforcements. Specially from urban capitals like warsaw :). You dont have to or intend to win this battle. Infact its best if dont. Marshall it so dont take too high casualities. Will take some . After this diversionary attack launch your main attack at the depleted garrison and main attack point e.g. warsaw :) Managed to conquer poland in 5 weeks on WIF challenge difficulty. Quite proud of it :)

Think main thing is have to not worry so much about slightly losing bars and only slightly winning. If have a strategic plan for victory and its progressing then all is well. You just gotta grind sometimes for blitzkrieg to happen elsewhere :)

regards
 
Well, short of starting the whole game all over again and investing in a 100-strong TAC-force, I'm not sure what to do(I already have c.16-20 TACs attacking Flanders with no luck(ground strike, ground support and logistical strike) - and some aircraft are being wiped out, no dopubt because they're in stakcs of 2 or 4, at the moment, with Allied aircraft no doubt at 8 units per stack. Even attacking other land-areas that I'm not interested in so as to draw off reinforcements hasn't worked with belgian forces holding out(2 units to c.22 of mine!) for long enough until French forces from 6 provinces away can reach them in time. By contrast, the Turkish(Axis) AI has done wonders conquering half of Iraq and all of Syria by October 1939, despite its inferior tech, and the US(Axis) AI has wiped out Canada by october 1939, 4-6 months less than in a DAIM game.

Another WIF anomaly is that oil-loss/oil-use seems astronomically high, even with my 27 tanks(3 light armoured) -only having an Axis-USA has saved me by giving me oil for free in trades. Perhaps TRP and WIF deliberately discriminate against tank-usage?
 
I use all aircraft in stacks of 6. Obviously this means that only air generals/marshalls are any use, but single airwings get wiped out fast. I also put 2 ftr with 4 cas. The cas seem to get wiped out too fast without protection. This just goes to show that you must achieve air superiority first, then bomb.
 
Yes i hear that need air supremacy first :). I started invasion of belgiumwith 20 cas flying and they got quite hurt before the interceptors could start brawling. I generally not trusting airforce as much as in original. It needs a lot more specific situations to be effective. Like moving enemys or low numbers of enemys.

I invaded france on WIF challenge diffiiculty. Won in a month :). THe long battles can actually work for you. If your expecting it. The computer isnt as mobile or responsive when engaged in battles. They commit all forces and dont leave much of a reserve. Can exploit this by sneaking down flanks.

I engaged a very strong force in a battle in amiens for the entire campaign. Never won tho was getting upper hand in last days. They had 7 Medium tanks III with SP art :wacko: and about 10 infantry. I engaed with second panzer corps of 2 med tanks and 1 light tanks and another armoured corps of lights and motorised with about 10 infantry The long battles allowed me to hold them up here that essentially removed the defensive reserve from paris. So managed to outflank paris with only 5 infantry and the 1st panzer corps under von manstein. Got into back field and split into single divisions and land grapped. With all this the centre of line at belgium was a little weak. But the long battles again came to rescue. I was steadily losing here for the entire campaign. But never lost :)

They attacked ghent antwerp and liege ruthlessly. Just held them with shuffling troops in and out of battle offensive supply and reserves from luxenberg colgne. These battles again drew in troops from maginot line. Launched a direct attack of 30 divisions vs 5 in strasburg. Won very slowly after betting line and then moved on and through. Probably not strictly neccesary with the surrender event . But i wasnt sure it existed in mod and this way could have elminated all french forces with this second slow "pincer".

Think getting hang of WiF. Have to plan to elminate all org of opponents if want to win. It does take a long time to beat opponent directly with blunt straight forward attacks but also takes them a long time to beat you. So if remain moreflexible and dont commit all forces to a mindless meat grinder in centre can outmanuveur.It helps that on the right terrain the units are very fast. Sometimes tanks go from province to province in like 6-10 hours :O Its the strategic objectives that win you the day. Encirclements, land graps victory point steals, supply depot siezure and envelopement. Not beating armys straight up. :cool:

regards
 
Both mods are similar in that you need TACs to achieve your goals, and, by extension, the INTs and FTRs to protect them. In a way not much has changed from vanilla except in the sense TACs and CAS would be game changers rather than requirements.

I also use diversionary attacks to draw troops away from my planned offensive. Then I smash them with as much air force as I can muster (without overstacking) as well as from as many provinces / directions (usually 3 or more) as I can. It worked in the vanilla Götterdämmerung scenario and I've been using it ever since.

Don't be afraid to halt a major offensive (or two) if you have to. It's kind of like a game of poker: Never follow the bad money with the good. TRP and WIF will make you pay in manpower and time if you refuse to back down. No worries though, a failed offensive often opens door in sectors you may not have been expecting.
 
I use alot more "strong probes" in one area before commiting to battle in the next provinces. The ai will send reinforcements allowing easier breakthroughs in the areas where it sees no threat.
 
Its kind of couynter intuitive but have found continuing battles that are slightly losing can be ok, Obvisiously if getting slaughtered change up. If losing somewhere have to hope that have local superioty somewhere else. Socan struggle on for a while and win in that other sector. Im constantly surprised by how long it takes computer to beat you on WiF :)
 
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