wilderness needs a research buff

[cerberus189]

I understand that wilderness effectively gets free pops, but that's kind of useless when the jobs they get are, well, trash. a size 9 district with 2 harmony zones should produce more than 162 research, especially when wilderness in my games does not get anywhere near the amount of job efficiency bonus every other origin gets. now something that could be used to help this would be allowing wilderness access to the research support zones increasing the cost of the researchers for more jobs and output. that would atleast help to balance out the current problems i see.

 

[Abdulijubjub]

You don't have 9 research districts here. You have 4.5, since you're using the specializations that are half research and half unity.

If you don't make enough research... make more research. You could also try expanding your planets, or converting some districts from basic resources to hive districts.

Also: try Natural Neural Network. It's quite powerful for Wilderness (especially in the early game) because it lets you produce research while focusing purely on basic resources (and not needing biomass for buildings).

 

[Thiend]

I'm gonna try Wildernes before I say this for certain, but I suspect a lot of people are playing it, failing to hit 3.14 research numbers, and believing it to be undertuned.

Research numbers across the board are down, debatable whether that's good or bad, but they are. Wilderness can't be assessed for research without also playing a normal empire (and, again, I also could be wrong, but I'm going to play Wilderness to find out - you need to play both to assess it).

Separately, it may be a little low. Or not. It's also worth comparing sprawl, because if it's sufficiently lower having lower research output just makes it balanced.

 

[cerberus189]

You don't have 9 research districts here. You have 4.5, since you're using the specializations that are half research and half unity.

If you don't make enough research... make more research. You could also try expanding your planets, or converting some districts from basic resources to hive districts.

Also: try Natural Neural Network. It's quite powerful for Wilderness (especially in the early game) because it lets you produce research while focusing purely on basic resources (and not needing biomass for buildings).

This is not caused by me using the mixed system I compared it to normal empires and it's weaker then they are at the same point. In addition I am already using that civic

 

[cerberus189]

I'm gonna try Wildernes before I say this for certain, but I suspect a lot of people are playing it, failing to hit 3.14 research numbers, and believing it to be undertuned.

Research numbers across the board are down, debatable whether that's good or bad, but they are. Wilderness can't be assessed for research without also playing a normal empire (and, again, I also could be wrong, but I'm going to play Wilderness to find out - you need to play both to assess it).

Separately, it may be a little low. Or not. It's also worth comparing sprawl, because if it's sufficiently lower having lower research output just makes it balanced.

I have played normal empires this patch and "normal" hives to compare it to and it's numbers are lower

 

[Abdulijubjub]

Is that comparison by game year, or per pop?

A normal hive can use boosting buildings which bump them up from 6 output to 11, at the cost of quadrupling their upkeep (1.5 CG to 3 CG and 0.5 e.g. crystals). That, combined with a -20% upkeep building and the +15% efficiency building, is (very) roughly equivalent to +100% efficiency, all told. That's true.

But wilderness can expand without limit. You can just have 2x as many jobs.

 

[Psykhes]

bump, still an issue

Honestly, not sure really if there is an issue.

I cannot compare it to many other races & origins in 4.0 (partly because I did not play many others, partly because there are also some very very broken ones, which should not be assumed as the status quo).

However, compared to the "usual" progression in 3.xx I am doing well really with wilderness. In 2305 I just got Mega Engineering, and produce 3k unity and 7k research.
That seems totally fine to me?
Grand Admiral, although with Scaling Difficulty to Mid Game. Started the game with 4.07.

The only other race/origin I played so far in 4.x is an evolutionary predators devouring swarm. That one had at the same time (latest save I got there is 2287) a slightly higher research in absolute numbers (6k vs 5k of wilderness in 2287), but a much bigger multiplier due to empire size (+ costs of 96% vs 31% of wilderness) , so was doing much worse in unity and research.

 

[Dayknight]

I think Wilderness in general have weaker ascension bonus compare to others is reason for this feeling. It can't build Genetic lab which has huge for genetic ascension empires, Purity give you advanced trait while barely matters in Wilderness playthrough. Oh by the way, they don't have advanced government type too, which is huge downfall for using Purity.