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Jul 21, 2009
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Hi guys

Right, I'm about to play my housemate at HOI2 MP. He will play as Germany, I will play as USSR. He's been playing HOI a long time, I've played for a few weeks and won on very hard against Germany AI, I also feel I'm a better tactician than him.

I'd like advice/opinions on strategy to beat him, here is what I am thinking:

Research:
Machine tools/production techs
-Computing techs
-Infantry techs
-Agriculture
-Land doctrine

Build:
-Pure infantry, on parallel builds - should I mix in Militia (wiki says this is good tactic)

Don't do:
Any naval stuff, any air stuff, any armour, any brigades, any forts etc... just infantry

Tactics:
-Try and surround his armies in Poland in '41, if not then fall back slightly and encircle near Smolensk
-Try and keep 30/40 divisions in each province opposing him, with more in reserve to counter any breakthroughs
-Take as much land as possible
-Advance through Finland/Norway (maybe 20 divisions)

I have to win this, any help appreciated.

I was also thinking drafted army and free market
 
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First of all remove all dissent, build atleast 3 runs of ic maybe even 4.
Purge. dont build any inf until u got the 41 inf tech (rusch)

Some player disband all 1918 inf, i dont, startuppgrade when u gotthe 41 inf tech

Also u will need atleast 6 HQs.

20-30 lvl 2 fighters isnt bad either.

Ive shouldnt try to crusch the gerries in poland, casue of gde modifers, just slowy retreat to the river, here is where youre first line of defense shall be.

also use defense in depth to aviod being encricled.

Good Luck!

free market can u forget imo it will take ages for SU to get it.

do 1 or 2 hawlobby then move towards standing army.
 
Well here I have to assume that you're playing the -36 scen, and Barbarossa won't be before April -40...


Your sliders: Hawk lobby full, then standing army. Invertionism can be gained by events and some GoI's, like GoI Albania, Poland, Denmark and so on, until you're full. Free market is totally useless, I have no idea why you even suggest it, because central planning gives you a +25% IC boost, you would lose without it.

Straight from Jan 1st -36, disband all your forces, EXCEPT your motorized, armored, HQ and mountaineer divs. Also save your ints and bombers. As for the Red Navy, you should only keep your capital ships, newest subs and the TP in Vladivostock. Also remember to put all your land divs under the command of log. wizards, and remember to keep the divs within the command limit of them, or the whole thing is useless.

Then put factory serials that will last around late -39. Try to build your factories in the best infra provs you have in Siberia, they will be constructed faster. Leave some IC for killing dissent, but DON'T use all of your IC on killing dissent, with the starting dissent, the purge dissent and minister changes ofc. Assuming you're going for historical MR pact, you get -5 dissent, when you get Eastern Poland, so you might save some dissent killing with that. The point is that slowly kill your dissent, but take your time with it, you will need factories too.

As for the ministers, the +25% MP and -5% infantry bonus guy as your Chief of Staff is the best option for the entire game. -15% supply guy as the Chief of Army is just as useful, even if you're invading bloody Berlin (if you ask me). The +5% IC, +10% industrial research guy is the best Armaments Minister, until around 41-42, when you're massive army consumes so much supplies, that it would be more beneficial to switch to the +20% supplies Minister. A +10% MP growth and +10% foreign MP guy is gained in -41. You gain +5% IC Minister of Security in -42, so remember to take him too. As for the Chief of Airforce, you should probably take the fighter guy, depending on the situation.


I don't know how your rules are, but during the peacetime years you can make Germany's life a bit harder. Cancel your trades with him, take all the rares you can of Germany's best trading partners. Also some BP stealing, minister assasination and smearing does damage, but beware of any retaliation by German espionage.

As for your techs, your 3 goals are to get infantry ass. line, -41 infantry and large formation doctrine soon as possible. -41 inf should be available in late -39, but the ass. line might take even till mid -40 and large formation doctrine mid-late -41. Other useful techs are machine tools, ass. lines, agriculture, computing/crypting, supply dumps, mot. inf, tanks, AC & SP-ART, ints, tac bombers, air doctrines and hospital techs. (Sorry, but fighters are simply a waste compared to ints, unless you're fighting in the Pacific.)


Anyway, after your IC production ends, start building masses of -41 inf, in serials ofc. If you have to wait for them, produce supplies into your storage and get 2 HQ's in any case to raise it to 3! If you are sure, that Germany won't invade you too early, stick to the -41 inf. But if you have spare MP and the situation looks threatening, you could build about 100 militia divs to fill your armies. However if it comes to this, divide the militia evenly, like 2:1 inf-mil corps. Alone it is useless, combined it helps by taking the hits.

Thanks to your techteams, your airforce can't really do anything before -42. Don't under any circumstances even bother to build planes, until your MP is low enough, or you actually have useful doctrines. If you focus on building an airforce that will get butchered in any case, your land forces will suffer too much and then I say, your defeat is 99% certain, if Germany knows what to do. Also avoid expanding all airfields, besides the places you will (or have to) hold, like Leningrad, Moscow and Stalingrad. You would just be helping Germany there...


As for the events, accept the purge ofc. Invade Finland, you don't need extra any troops besides the ones you didn't disband in -36. Get them upgraded and reinforced. Divide them into small corps, 1-3 div. Get your best commanders there to gain all the xp they can. The easiest way to win with a small force like that, is to attack Kajaani, then Oulu with your bombers supporting. After that go south, like the Soviet plan was IRL, expect this one will work haha. :D ...Anyway, bringing socialism is the best option. But now comes the important part. Don't kill any of the Finnish divs. You might have to take most of the country, including Helsinki, so advance steadily and don't do pockets. Because once you have some 75-90% warscore, offer puppettation, and they will accept. There you have a nice army to guard the north. However the Finnish divs can't take care of much more, than guarding the Finnish beaches, Swedish/Norwegian border if required and maybe Murmask and Archangelinsk (you'll never know). But at least now you have a formitable force in the north. ;)

After Finland, you might consider invading the Baltics during winter. If you wait to claim/invade them in May, Germany might invade you around then, and you might never get their benefits, or even worse... You might be at war with them AND Germany at the same time!

Before Barbarossa, keep a close eye on Germany and anticipate her plans. If Germany does smt like invade Sweden, or Turkey, then get troops to those borders immediately! Besides that, just be on the lookout when Germany might invade you, which is likely to be May-June.


Prepare your troops well. Have 2-3 mechanized armies, 1:2 tank-mot combo. Use your best panzer generals there, like Zhukov, Konev and later Rossovsky. Always combine HQ's with infantry, making 9-div formations, to avoid your HQ's getting killed. 9 div infantry armies are the base of your army and Generals are your servants. Lt. Generals should command 3 div corps, gain xp and then rise to Generals to command larger formations. Don't waste the skill of your best Generals by promoting them to FM. Take some useless promoted old guard and put him on 1 div, if you need a high command limit for an offensive. 3 HQ's is enough at first (North, Middle, South). From -42 onwards, start a serial expanding them to around 5-7.

Now for the most important thing, your strategy. Use literally defence in depth. Your troops on the border will be owned, so no use in leaving extra divs there to get encircled. However focus on some chokepoints and important defensive positions behind your lines. By using defence in depth, you will have a strong line with organized troops, little fear of encirclements and breakthroughs, dug in troops taking cover from planes, and most importantly: Massive casualties on the Germans! :cool:

The basic idea is to have 9-12 divs on the border and at least 3 divs in every inner prov, from South of the Dvina and West of the Dnieper. Then at least 1 div in the provs on the Eastern shore of the Dnieper. Here are the many expections to this general rule:

The Northern Front:

ALWAYS 3 divs in Moscow, be it because of paras, landings, aliens, magical dragons, AT ALL TIMES! (Learned it the hard way...)

Novgrod, Staraya Russa, Veliye Luki, Rzhev, Toropets, Vyazma, at least 3 divs there, can wait till July-August, but really good swamp provs to keep the North.

1-3 divs in Murmansk and Archangelinsk to guard the beaches.

(6-15 divs on every prov on the Swedish-Norwegian border IF NEEDED.)

1-3 divs on the Finnish beaches, focus mostly on Turku-Helsinki-Viipuri. Keep 1-3 divs in reserve in inner-Finland, like Tampere.

3 divs in Leningrad, and 3 on every beach in Estonia and Latvia.

6 divs behind the Dvina river in Latvia, in Riga, Dagaupulis and Polotsk.

6 divs in Kaunas, good IC, swamp and an important encirclement prov.

18-30 divs in Grodno including your Northern HQ, often used by the Germans for encirclements in the north.

The Middle Front:

9-12 divs per prov on the line Orsha-Minsk-Bobrainsk-Mozyr-Vinnitsa. A good line for Soviet counterattacks/defence and Vinnitsa is one of the most important provs in the South for German encirclement.

At least 3 divs in Smolensk, one of the best defensive positions before Moscow and on the river line.

9 divs in Pinsk, a good chokepoint, easy to escape from encirclements by using support defence.

1-3 divs in Brest Litovsk and Bliesk, no more! The provs that can be most easily encircled.

The Southern Front:

18-24 divs in Lvov, the most important prov on the 1st day of Barbarossa. Zhukov here, best tanks here, Middle HQ here. The Germans shouldn't be able to take it on the first few days.

12-18 divs in Kowel, put some of your tanks here.

Leave Stryj empty, Stukas will only kill your divs there.

9-12 divs in Stanistalow, important prov & river, should be held for long.

15-18 divs in Beltsy, put all your mountaineers and your Southern HQ here.

At least 9-12 divs in Ismail to keep the Romanians out.

As for the reserves, 9-12 divs in Rowne.

12-15 divs in Tarnopol, important prov.

6 divs Mogilevi Podolski, Chekassy & Balta, often used in the Southernmost encirclement.

9 divs in Kiev, the capital of Ukraine and a strong defensive position before the river.

3 divs in Priluki & Zaporozhye, important provs for crossing the river.

Prepare a beach defence in Batum, Sevastopol, Meliotopol, Perekop and all the other beaches on the West side of the Dnieper.

Also be prepared if paras take ports around Crimea, so 1 div/beachless port prov.

1-3 divs of reserves in Kharkov, Staliano & Novossosbrisk, important strategical and defensive positions.

Also 1 div in Stalingrad, just to be cool. :cool:

(Mongolian and Tannu divs are the best reverve divs.)

Basically the idea is to slowly fight where you can and fall back where you can't (and mostly you can't at first). Do massive counterattacks where you can, but don't exhaust your army. Your first hope of reversing Barbarossa comes when you get the GDE increase to 0,7 a few days after the German dow. Then your masses can disorganize the few German divs that arrive seperately and make recovery impossible for the German player. However it will surely be a bloodbath in Poland then...

However as falling back, ALWAYS keep a reserve behind your lines. And I don't mean the kind of reserve that comes to support the defence. There is always some kind of a division/corps/army behind the line to prevent breakthroughs. Behind your reserve should be another reserve and maybe then yet another layer would be nice! :D

The Dnieper and Dvina are good barriers for your defence, but usually the Soviet player has the honour to fight (like a man) and fall back (like a little girl). Only those cowards use the so called Dnieper turtle tactic by being pussies behind the river right from the start! That is not the Red Army spirit, I tell you! :mad: ...;)


Adjust your inf production that you get some every week to fill your holes. NOT some 50 divs every 2 months, coz after 2 months you will be dead without reinforcements. Put the new divs where you need them the most ofc. Strat deploy divs from quiet fronts to the desperate ones, if you're really sure of it. And nobody is stupid enough to keep troops on the Japanese border ofc. :D

Anyway, know when to reduce your div production to keep your MP pool above 0 for reinforcements. If high on IC and low on MP, focus on upgrades, tanks, planes and later mechs. If you get to 0 MP, disband your militia for MP, if you have any.

If you need to stop German transports at sea, subs might be the option. Being cheap and safe from Stukas, they are modest, but better than nothing.


Try to get mech -42 model by -42! Then once you're low on MP and with more advanced doctrines, switch to building them as your main land forces, brigaded with AC / SP ART. That combined arms bonus is invaluable on the defensive and they pack a punch even on the offense. So combine the new mechs with your old & experienced infantry armies, but add them mostly in the south, thanks to the easy terrain.

In -43, research air doctrines actively and see if you can achieve air superiority. Don't be suprised if you can't. Expanding airfields and the prov infra can help to achieve it. Also remember to get -43 inf and tanks as soon as you can. Then you have lots of upgrading, but that -43 inf is worth it.

From -44 onwards, steadily modernize your army and airforce. If Germany is now in the Urals, you have lost. Hopefully if the front is further west, continue towards Berlin. Unless Germany controls half of the world, they will gain less MP than you, so that kinda means you should eventually win... ;)
 
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Straight from Jan 1st -36, disband all your forces, EXCEPT your motorized, armored, HQ and mountaineer divs. Also save your ints and bombers. As for the Red Navy, you should only keep your capital ships, newest subs and the TP in Vladivostock. Also remember to put all your land divs under the command of log. wizards, and remember to keep the divs within the command limit of the log wizards, or it's useless.

Well you in a really bad situation if Germany attack -37 -38

Total unrealistic to disband 80-90% of your whole army, would never ever have happend in Soviet union.

lvl 1 ships can be very usefulls as tripwires.
 
Storm... you really love this game dont ya? ;)
If you ask me for a guide on a nation I have wasted 5 years of my life on... Then yes, I do have a lot of stuff to share. :D ...And the game is great too, three hurrays for HoI3!!! hip hip hurray... x x hurray!

And btw, this must have helped you a lot on our game. The Axis will surely lose now! :rofl:


Well you in a really bad situation if Germany attack -37 -38
Storm said:
Well here I have to assume that you're playing the -36 scen, and Barbarossa won't be before April -40...
*Sigh* The first line in my text and you missed it. I would need to write for 10 years of my life if I would go through a -36, -37, -38, -39, -41, -42, -43, -44, -45... -63 tactic on defending against German invasions.


Total unrealistic to disband 80-90% of your whole army, would never ever have happend in Soviet union.
Totally unrealistic? Did he say they were playing some historybook game or what? I'm just telling him how to win, because that's what he asked... Disbanding less expensive units of your army to save supplies for 4-5 years + the upgrading and reinforcing IC is simply worth it.

Never heard of a realistic USSR playing tactic, wtf is that? Do you do all the stuff historically, like keep 50 divs on the Japanese border, get 5 million men encircled, let Germany take Stalingrad in -42 and you don't attack Berlin before 23 April 1945?:rofl:


lvl 1 ships can be very usefulls as tripwires.
And very useful at wasting your supplies for 4-5 years and then get destroyed in a single sea combat. To put simply, it's not worth to keep the little supply eaters for 4-5 years, because of the likely risk of them getting owned.
 
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Thankyou very much for the reply storm! :D

Very good tips with using Log Wiz generals to save on supplies etc... :D

As Stalin once said "quantity is a quality of it's own" :D I think my housemate will build lots of CAS, but like you say if infantry are dug in they will not be hurt.

Would it be possible for me to invade Norway in 1939/40... then use paratroopers from south Norway to take Berlin to steal supplies? Good idea?
 
good tips by storm, but the most important factor in IC building is the existing IC in the target province. Factories build always at the same speed, but even the time for the production to become available is more dependent on existing IC levels. E.g. in USA a new factory built in a 80%infra + 7 existing IC province (cleveland for example)will come available faster than a new factory built in a 100% infra + no factories province.(concord for example)
 
Thankyou very much for the reply storm! :D

Very good tips with using Log Wiz generals to save on supplies etc... :D
Haha, yea. Always happy to help a fellow USSR player. ;)


As Stalin once said "quantity is a quality of it's own" :D I think my housemate will build lots of CAS, but like you say if infantry are dug in they will not be hurt.
Yes, many German players build CAS. I have often fought a Germany who only builds CAS. He has more CAS than land divs. :rofl:

Anyway, you might lose even up to 50 divs to CAS during the first year of the Barbarossa. And you might lose a lot of MP, but you just got to take it and keep cool. His CAS is at it's best when your troops are retreating in small stacks. But if you have a big, dug in mass, he will just kill his CAS there.

So the way how to combat CAS without an airforce... Keep your units in large formations 3-9 divs, 1 div would die in 5 seconds. Avoid excess retreating and useless attacks. If you go and take a prov and you know he will kick out of there and kill your 3 tank divs, it is simply not worth it. Also allow your troops to dig in, but ofc attack and move if you have to. Then don't expand the airfields in the Western USSR.

You should however have a few ints, even the 8 from the start are enough. The point is that your airforce can't win, but you can have some fun with it. Do the so called hit & run tactics. If Stukas are close to your airfield, attack them and then retreat & stay at your airfield. Germany can't guard every prov in the USSR for your planes. So focus your small airforce and hit them where they ain't. If you make your small airforce look big, Germany might spend a lot of IC on improving his ints and that is out of the German tanks and Stukas. Even better, he might be a lot careful with Stuka attacks. So basically use your airforce as a tool of fear. ;)

And finally, use subs on the sea, rather than surface ships. CAS can't really scratch a sub, but surface ships go down fast.


Would it be possible for me to invade Norway in 1939/40... then use paratroopers from south Norway to take Berlin to steal supplies? Good idea?
Well first of all, it is really easy for Germany to defend and your limited TC might suffer a bit. Never thought of doing paras on Berlin, that might be interesting to try out, althrough the investment is expensive. So sure, you should try it out.

Also another common tactic to harass Germany is to land in Denmark or Romania. So build some TPs and land with cheap infantry, the beaches will surely be unguarded. However CAS might destroy your troops once you're ashore, but they will be out of action on the Eastern Front for quite some time. And if Germany starts to garrison the beaches after that, it's many divs out of the Eastern Front.

Usually I haven't done landings in the rear, coz in the way is my Soviet player honour again. :D ...But I've had some TP's in storage in the Baltic and Black Sea, just in case. In case Germany starts to play dirty, or I'm in a really bad situation. But never needed them so far. :)


good tips by storm, but the most important factor in IC building is the existing IC in the target province. Factories build always at the same speed, but even the time for the production to become available is more dependent on existing IC levels. E.g. in USA a new factory built in a 80%infra + 7 existing IC province (cleveland for example)will come available faster than a new factory built in a 100% infra + no factories province.(concord for example)
Untitled-2-59.gif

Well how in my game the situation isn't like that? (Vanilla Arma 1.3b 2) The IC builds at the same rate, no matter how many factories there are. But if you build in 60% infra, rather than 40%, that means your factory will be ready a bit over a month before. If you then do some 5 serials, that saves you hell of a lot.
 
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Honestly if you just build 500 -41 infantry and you know game mechanics there is only slightly possibility that you would lose.
Not really. When I was playing our glorious 13 hrs-in a row Barbarossa with Nazi, he pretty much conquered the entire Europe before the Barbarossa. UK, Spain, Italy, Sweden, Romania you name it. Only some Croatia and Switzerland were left independent. Now why did he do that and suffer the parties? Well then he has HUGE amounts of IC and MP at his disposal and the AI is so stupid that it can't actually invade anything. If he put the foreign IC minister, BAM 150 MORE IC! If he put the foreign MP guy, BAM HE GETS MORE MP THAN THE USSR!!! Then I was invaded historically on June 22, 1941. With a less historical army though...

Now I fought him with some 400-500 div army and I must admit that even I was suprised a bit. When he annexed Romania, he built TPs there. Then along with paras, he encircled some 50 divs from me in Bessarabia, mostly thanks to the powerful landings. Stukas killed maybe another 50 divs. I faced the hugest invasion ever. He only left defensive forces in the north and invaded with HUGE panzer armies in the south. I had to deploy my troops from the north there. Then when I was able to stop him in the south, then he invades the north. This cat and mouse game lasted for the whole year. My troops couldn't simply cover the entire front without weakening the other part.

Then I was able to hold him for the winter around the Dnieper. Usually one would expect that if he lasts till the Winter -41, he has won. Well in December I was expecting a nice event, the Great Patriotic War. Well it just raised my GDE to 0,8. No MP, no IC, nothing. Also the US lend lease didn't come to my aid.

So in the spring of -42, I realized that it's only a matter of time I would lose. I was getting bombed by V1's, and -43 tanks and infantry were now on the German side against my obsolete troops. Stukas also started their work again.

He has more IC, more MP, more org, more tech, more troops, better troops, more & better everything. So how could one win in such of a case? His TC might slow him down, especially with the occupied Europe, but in time the partis will lower and the techs will increase TC...

You can imagine playing that as the USSR for 13 hours till 3 am is literally a nightmare. And it is my worst nightmare in HoI. :D ...Hordes of Stukas, V-bombs, supertroopers, paras, marines... I was suprised how I even held the line in -41. You simply can't fortify on the defensive in the USSR if Germany becomes too strong. Even your 5-year IC buiding isn't enough compared to that. I was like the huge isolated Qing Empire! :rofl:

My biggest mistake was that I didn't have any offensive planning. But I don't know could I have pulled of anything successful. If I land in Germany, I would face 30 Stukas. Romania or Denmark aren't much better, althrough entrenching in Copenhagen might be worth a try.
 
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I belive you had some houserules and thats why you let nazi run around. Anyway thats truely worst case-scenario :D
Yea, maybe it was smt like that. I don't totally remember, but maybe the only major rule was that Barbarossa will be on June 22nd 1941. :D ...So it was a bitter lesson that sometimes the best defence is a good offense. :cool:
 
Hi guys

Right, I'm about to play my housemate at HOI2 MP. He will play as Germany, I will play as USSR. He's been playing HOI a long time, I've played for a few weeks and won on very hard against Germany AI, I also feel I'm a better tactician than him.

I'd like advice/opinions on strategy to beat him, here is what I am thinking:

Research:
Machine tools/production techs
-Computing techs
-Infantry techs
-Agriculture
-Land doctrine

(TECH AIRFORCE) You dont need to build it untily ou have turbojet models but you WILL need airforece for the big offensives. (44 onwards)


Build:
-Pure infantry, on parallel builds - should I mix in Militia (wiki says this is good tactic)

(BAD IDEA) Tech Motorized, and Mechanized as well. Mobility troops are your mainstay the 300+ Infantry units are just for filling gaps and covering your arse from para's.

Don't do:
Any naval stuff, any air stuff, any armour, any brigades, any forts etc... just infantry

(Brigades are a must in the later years), I always build a few well placed forts smolensk rogachev and tula.

Tactics:
-Try and surround his armies in Poland in '41, if not then fall back slightly and encircle near Smolensk
-Try and keep 30/40 divisions in each province opposing him, with more in reserve to counter any breakthroughs
-Take as much land as possible
-Advance through Finland/Norway (maybe 20 divisions)

I have to win this, any help appreciated.

I was also thinking drafted army and free market

Alot of people like the blob russian tactic but to be honest its a waste of time without western europ coming to bail you out.

Motorized Infantry, Turbojet fighters, Tubojet CAS ftw.

heres a save of a 1v1 im currently playing. I have lost over 60 Divisions at this point in the save and am just about to commence MASS airforce assembly.


http://www.MegaShare.com/1284077
 
Im my opionion people who disband the start infantry and only mass spam regular raw infantry are noobs.

Mobility, mobility, mobility is the key.

Also letting germany mop up all of europe whilst you do nothing is silly. always threaten the germans with annexing china japan if they do sealion. Pretext to war is as good as a natural defence.
 
Honestly if you just build 500 -41 infantry and you know game mechanics there is only slightly possibility that you would lose.

NOOB


its obvious youve never played against a seasone german opponant.

Infantry dont win battles, mobility and cunning do.
 
Right, you actually needed 3 posts to call us noobs and to tell us about your glorious mobility strategy? One would be enough, coz usually the noobs post little posts every 2 mins haha! :rofl:

But would you actually bother explaining a bit more of your strategy than just saying mobility is the key & you are all noobs?

When will you begin your mot production, is it model 1 or 2? How many divs are you able to get for a -40 or -41 Barbarossa? It is a lot less certainly...

Also it's quite hard for you to get those cool turbojets of yours before Barbarossa, or does Germany invade you in -45 or smt?
 
Right, you actually needed 3 posts to call us noobs and to tell us about your glorious mobility strategy? One would be enough, coz usually the noobs post little posts every 2 mins haha! :rofl:

But would you actually bother explaining a bit more of your strategy than just saying mobility is the key & you are all noobs?

When will you begin your mot production, is it model 1 or 2? How many divs are you able to get for a -40 or -41 Barbarossa? It is a lot less certainly...

Also it's quite hard for you to get those cool turbojets of yours before Barbarossa, or does Germany invade you in -45 or smt?


Well i didnt bother to make a lengthy apraisal as it was all covered fairly well in your prior posts.

My only real added suggestion of his buildup was to make room for future expansion of the airforce. No point in having planes pre war, the Tech can be done by december 1942 for Turbojet Fighters leaving heaps of roomt o assemble a behemoth air force 43-44.

The other point was dont just spam infantry, build 100+ motorized units there not that much more expensive and still build in 60? days like infantry. Relying more on the mobile units to defend against the German Armour and mobile units and using infantry to fill the gaps.

The noob post was for calad, Spamming infantry as russia is not a war winning solution. To mch soft mp cost and against a good German player 1v1 your MP will be ground down. Not to mention if your also fighting in the far east.

I posted the save not because i thought my buildup was super, infact it was less then stellar.... but it was meerly to point out how id used a few key moble units to defend whilst i held off the big attacks until an airforce could be raised. And also how i had placed a few key forts for my inevitable defence.

Your post pretty much covered the rest, but the motorized are far superior to the regular infantry and you can have sufficient numbers for war+ oil.

Motorized are cheap to upgrade for USSR, if you thing the germans will attack early build 60 lvl I's. If they aren't goign to attack and wait till historical date, then just wait for mot II ans spam out a good 120-180. In the save i posted above i shot myself in the foot by historical dow date and supplied the gemrnas with materials i now desperately need. And dont forget ive lost 60+ divs in the save posted above. If id spammed all infantry that would be 600 divs lost ^^

Ive lost my fair share of battles with Infantry only armys. Motorized ftw.
 
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My only real added suggestion of his buildup was to make room for future expansion of the airforce. No point in having planes pre war, the Tech can be done by december 1942 for Turbojet Fighters leaving heaps of roomt o assemble a behemoth air force 43-44.
Well I said that don't bother to build an airforce before you run out of MP for the other units, so basically the same thing. And are you also able to get full int/fig doctrines by 43-44? The problem with the airforce is not so much the numbers, but the crappy doctrines (coz of crappy TT's) and the lack of airfields.

The other point was dont just spam infantry, build 100+ motorized units there not that much more expensive and still build in 60? days like infantry. Relying more on the mobile units to defend against the German Armour and mobile units and using infantry to fill the gaps.
Around 1939, with the -37 human wave docs, Shaposhnikov as the best chief of staff:

An infantry div costs 5.1 x 77 = 392.7 IC days

A mot div costs 11.9 x 85 = 1011.5 IC days

And once you've developed the assembly line (vehicle & infantry) and defence in depth, an infantry div costs 273.6 ICD, while motorized div costs 773.5 ICD

Early before Barbarossa the ratio with infantry and motorized is 2.6:1 and during the height of Barbarossa it's 2.8:1.

If you build 100 mot divs, you will be missing 260-280 infantry divs, which is almost your entire force before Barbarossa. With 100 mot divs, you can't really build any infantry.

The only point when I can understand wasting IC on motorized, is once you get large formation doctrine and the following -43 doctrines. They make infantry more costly and mot cheaper. But you can't usually get large formation until late -41 (three -41 docs in the same year). But infantry is still cheaper and pretty much as powerful. Instead you can devote your extra IC on upgrades and your airforce.


The noob post was for calad, Spamming infantry as russia is not a war winning solution. To mch soft mp cost and against a good German player 1v1 your MP will be ground down. Not to mention if your also fighting in the far east.
Far East?! Motorized exactly sucks more in swamps, forests and mountains. And sure you will lose if both Japan and Germany decide to kick your ass, but here it's just 1v1 Germany vs USSR.


And also how i had placed a few key forts for my inevitable defence.
Forts?! I can understand building some in Moscow, Leningrad & Stalingrad, coz you can't afford to lose them, but forts... Germany can get them down really fast with interdection.


Your post pretty much covered the rest, but the motorized are far superior to the regular infantry and you can have sufficient numbers for war+ oil.
Then explain to me how the hell are they superior. They suck in the north, in the forests and swamps. You take extra casualties during winter and they suck in any winter combat. In urban, they suck at defending, but more importantly it's the huge IC cost. In the south they suck on the hills and mountains. Oh and the increased supply and fuel consumption cost more for your IC and TC.

And all this for some 30% faster speed and 80% softness? The softness gives only the 20% chance for Germans to use their hard attack on you. But their tanks have plenty of it. Also since you will have almost 3 times less divs and mots have less defensiveness and toughness. Against outnumbering Germans, your def & tgh will run out real fast and you will be fighting with 0,6 GDE (instead of 0.8) without defences and that means your troops suck, big time.

And with less divs, Stukas will kill your mots hell of a lot easier.

So try to explain to me what exactly superior you see in motorized divs? The only superior thing I see is that Germany will be superior and defeat your army in 1 month. :rofl:


Motorized are cheap to upgrade for USSR, if you thing the germans will attack early build 60 lvl I's. If they aren't goign to attack and wait till historical date, then just wait for mot II ans spam out a good 120-180.
Cheap to upgrade for USSR?! What the hell does that mean? Thanks to your full drafted army, upgrading is +50% more expensive and especially mot upgrading is one hell of upgrading, compared to infantry.


Ive lost my fair share of battles with Infantry only armys. Motorized ftw.
Lol, I don't know how you were able to lose, maybe you lost on purpose or smt. :rofl:
 
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Ive think the main point is that if u got the mobility advantage over the Gerries then its really gonna be hard for him to conducting any blitzkrieg against you.