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CK2 Dev Diary #105 - Clergy Interactions Revamp

Hello, everyone.

Today we will be talking of a nice quality of life update to the interface, AI behavior and some new additional flavor regarding the Papacy (as well as any similar religious head that has access to these interactions, such as a Reformed Pagan High Priest with Hierocratic Leadership).

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The patch coming with Holy Fury will place all Papal Actions in a more easily accessible list of icons, right under the portrait of your religious head in the Religion screen.

Furthermore, the behavior for all these actions has been un-hardcoded and fully scripted, so the Pope is now much more sensible when deciding who he wants to Excommunicate, and less restrictive when considering the possibility of granting an Invasion casus belli to an ambitious ruler. More importantly, players are now able to see exactly why their religious head is denying them a request.

The AI logic itself has been considerably expanded and tailored to the various actions.

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Having a vassal Pope no longer ensures that all your demands will be automatically accepted, and having an independent Pope will not make it near-impossible to get a favor from him. The Pope will take into consideration Opinion, Piety, traits, the specific circumstances (such as divorcing an infertile wife), and the amount of controlled Cardinal seats when deciding whether to accept a ruler’s request or not. Piety costs for these interactions have also been rebalanced and tied to the ruler’s tier, making them more accessible to low ranking rulers and costlier to Kings and Emperors.

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The Request Claim interaction has been given a special new interface as well to make it more intuitive and accessible to players. Rather than having to search directly for the title that you wish to gain a claim on, you can use the new button in the religious view to get a list of potential Catholic rulers owning titles for which the Pope is willing to grant you a claim on. By clicking on any of them, you will be shown a second window showing the list of all titles owned by the target ruler and from there you can select the one that you are interested in.

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Finally, if you are Excommunicated, the Issue Declaration of Repentance decision has been revamped so that it is no longer simply a cash payment.

Much like when requesting a coronation, the Pope will now pick one out of several possible demands for the player to fulfill in exchange for the lifting of his excommunication. Requests can range from a show of contrition causing Prestige loss, to changing your realm laws, to give one of your sons to the Church.


Also, bonus Cardinal clothes, pre and post 1245:

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I might be mistaken, but doesn't dalai lama just mean something like "great master" in tibetan? If so, I don't see the problem with bön faithfuls using the title considering that they'd most likely do so before the time the first dalai lama historically appeared.

As somebody has posted in thread, "Dalai" is a Mongolic word (means ocean) instead of Tibetan. It is too weird for non-Mongolic people to use a Mongolic word to call their leader before the Great Mongol Conquest.

In my opinion even "Panchen Lama" would be better than Dalai.

"Panchen" is an abbreviation of "Pandita" and "Chenpo"(the former is Sanskrit, the latter is Tibetan) meaning "Great scholar".
 
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Yeah, chernoban sounds more like a titke for head of Slavic satanist equivalent.
Yes. It sounds kind of weird that Slavic religious head is "chernoban", Chernobog is the black god. There is binary opposition for slavic like zoroastrianism, white (Belobog) against black (chernobog). There is one supreme god above the black and the white. There is no resourse shown that slavic people majorly worship this supreme god, and it sounds like Orlog in Norse religion.
And if you like to play a role which believes in slavic in CK2, you will find a religious artifact named "axe of perun" and have a chance to vassalize a holy order named "Warriors of Perun". It sounds like in_game slavics prefer Perun than other gods of slavic.
In the wikipedia, it shows that "The West Slavs, especially those of the Baltic, worshipped prominently Svetovid ("Lord of Power"), while the East Slavs worshipped prominently Perun himself, especially after Vladimir's 970s–980s reforms."
It sounds like that people in different places have different favourite god.
It looks like no historical title for high priest of slavic, but I suggest Paradox to use name about Perun or Svetovid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_paganism
 
I might be mistaken, but doesn't dalai lama just mean something like "great master" in tibetan? If so, I don't see the problem with bön faithfuls using the title considering that they'd most likely do so before the time the first dalai lama historically appeared.
Firstly Lama is a title Buddist exclusive. Whats more, Dalai is not Tibetan but Mongolian. My father once worked in Tibet and he knows this.
 
The information is correct, but to quote a relative because they've been there is such a weak argument. Written source or go home.
When neither side has written source, I tend to trust the relative over conjecture.
 
>Chernoban
"The Late Proto-Slavic word *banъ is not of native Slavic lexical stock and is generally considered to be a borrowing from a Turkic language."
-https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ban_(title)

Either way "Black Ruler" doesn't exactly sound like a very honorable title for the highest priest. I have to agree with @DmUa as Vozhd would be a more appropriate title unless of course Paradox would care to explain their reasoning behind this name and maybe shed some light on why they chose it.
- Vozhd is more of a modern russian ( well ok east slavic ), it should be something like Vozh/Vod/Vodz if we go for the true old slavic sounding word.
 
- Vozhd is more of a modern russian ( well ok east slavic ), it should be something like Vozh/Vod/Vodz if we go for the true old slavic sounding word.
This is only problem of transliteration into latin alphabet.

Fact is this, that we haven't any real name on "higher shaman" for slavic paganism. So maybe this can be based on others, slavic words on authorities? Eg. Batiushka (батюшка) was used sometimes on russian tsar or on orthodox priests.
 
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I cannot speak for other Slavs, but for an Eastern one "Chernoban" does not seem a good choice. The "-ban" ending is totally unfamiliar to us, and as people has already stated - "Cherno.." means "black", the game already uses Chernobog as Lucifer equivalent, who would choose this name for a high priest?

IMHO much better choices would be:
  • Vedun/Vedunja(Ведун/Ведунья, prophet/seer/sorcerer etc.),
  • Mudrets/Mudraya(Мудрец/Мудрая, (wo)man of wisdom),
  • their equivalents from other slavic languages,
  • or simply High Volhv.
 
So I tried googling chernoban and the only result was a Russian forum where they make a fan translation for the game and have no idea what chernoban is and how they are going to translate it. So do I.

By any chance did you mean chernobay (чернобай)? At least that's a word. Doesn't seem to be the right one though, as the only article I've found on it says it means a foul mouthed person (which makes sense given how it literally means black-talker). The same article also mentions word krasnobay (краснобай), literally beauty-talker, so an eloquent person. Which sounds much more like what a religious head should be.
 
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So I tried googling chernoban and the only result was a Russian forum where they make a fan translation for the game and have no idea what chernoban is and how they are going to translate it. So do I.

By any chance did you mean chernobay (чернобай)? At least that's a word. Doesn't seem to be the right one though, as the only article I've found on it says it means a foul mouthed person (which makes sense given how it literally means black-talker). The same article also mentions word krasnobay (краснобай), literally beauty-talker, so an eloquent person. Which sounds much more like what a religious head should be.

Most off us are translating the roots cherno- == black, ban == ruler or lord (though this is a later loan word)
 
Firstly Lama is a title Buddist exclusive. Whats more, Dalai is not Tibetan but Mongolian. My father once worked in Tibet and he knows this.
you know the word Lama comes from Bla-ma the Tibetan word for master or guru so it is less exclusive to Buddhist than you are making it out to be, while you are right about Dalai is being Mongolian in origin