• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

CK2 Dev Diary #34: Facts about Artifacts, Real talk about Relics

Hello all, it’s been a while, but it’s my turn to write a Dev Diary again! Today I’m going to tell you about the Treasury system we’re adding in 2.7. This system itself is part of the free patch. However, a lot of the content for it is part of Monks and Mystics.

The Treasury is where characters store their items, such as weapons, artifacts, or holy relics. In many ways items are much like Character Modifiers which you are likely already familiar with, but Character Modifiers are a fairly limited and not entirely clear system. With the new Treasury system we have greater control over how they work and when they are active as well as more UI space to display and explain them. Not only that, this system allows items to be inheritable and stealable.

We hope that seeing your character’s items as physical object rather than just a number on their character sheet will offer greater immersion, especially for player who like to focus on role-playing. Sure, in the past you could find a nice axe to increase your personal combat skill, but it was just another number - now you’ll see a gleaming axe, ready to hew the limbs from your foes!
artifacts_example_isolated.png

this is not quite final artwork, but it should be similar to what we end up with

As an example, say your Character has found the Holy Grail - you will now see the Grail in your Treasury with a picture and a description as well as the effects of owning it. Further, if some Norseman comes along and raids your castle, there’s a chance that he’ll make off with your precious Grail - however, since he’s not a Christian your most holy relic is nothing more than a fancy cup to him.

As mentioned, items are also inheritable, they all go to a character’s primary heir. In the event someone dies without an heir, the items will pass to their liege if they have one, but they have a chance of being lost in the process. If an independant character dies without heirs, their items are lost - although if time permits we have talked about them having a chance to be snapped up by powerful vassals.

For 2.7 we’re converting several character modifiers into items, such as the +1 axe you might find while raiding, the saint’s bones you might find on a pilgrimage, or the trophy you made from the skull of your rival. With Monks and Mystics we’re adding a lot more, such as:
  • Commissioning swords from skilled smiths.
  • Buying fabulous Crown Jewels.
  • Hunting for Holy Artifacts.
As well as the items you can find or make while playing, we have also added a system to place some Artifacts into character’s Treasuries when a new game is started. These are mostly placed at random to keep things interesting, but there are also a few historical artifacts given to famous characters.
Paradox_CK2_TreasureChamber_big_v02.jpg
 
  • 322
  • 25
  • 2
Reactions:
This is fantastic. Really excited for this expansion now!

Just a small question: you mention raiders (and possibly besiegers I assume) will be able to steal relics, but you did not mention intrigue characters. Will they be able to steal relics aswell, either by using plots or focus-driven events?
 
  • 7
Reactions:
Oh and add links to wikipedia on any artifact which are named for real (or mythical items).
 
  • 8
Reactions:
Nice! Some questions:

- Can you see the items of other characters? If so, can specific items be hidden (e.g. "Secret Cultist Knife of +2 Intrigue")?

- Can we see the stats given by specific items by mousing over them or a summary of item-given stats?

- Can we attempt to steal items with the Intrigue focus?

- What happens if you somehow get more than one copy of an item (e.g. if your heir already has one)? Can you decide what to do with the extra item (e.g. give it to your spare), or is it deleted automatically? Can you hold duplicates of some items (e.g. the crown jewels of the HRE and France)?

Some sillier questions:

- Are you sure you have the right Grail if it is a fancy cup? Shouldn't it be the cup of a simple carpenter...?

- With the Grail being discussed, can we get Excalibur from some strange woman lying around in a pond, or perhaps the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch?

No, just a summary of the effects.

Both - there's a summary on your character sheet and you can see per item stats in your Treasury.

No (would be nice to add though).

You can hold multiple items, but not all effects stack. E.g. if you hold multiple bones of saints, those stack, but if you have multiple Holy grails (not something which should be possible, but for example) they would not since only one can be "real".

Personally I think all the grails were real, it was Donvan's impure motives that made him melt :p

So wait is a +2 axe a magic weapon or just masterwork?

It's an epic, of course!

Will there be only event chains, or will hunting be connected with other gameplay mechanics? I kinda hope for hunting artifacts Lelouch style ('If you need to find small secret society hideout somewhere in China, you should start with coup d'etat and pushing your marionette as new head of government of China').

Also
Sorry for offtopic, but I wanted to ask for some time.
Is there any chance for the series of dev diaries like 'Mechanics X: what we wanted to do, whaw we did, what we think about result, how would we do it in CK 3'? I often feel that some core mechanics is strange, either I don't understand the concept behind mechanics, or it doesn't work. It would be cool to confront my observations and guesses with official position of the team.

Mostly event chains, but it's also possible to steal them while sieging or raiding holdings.

DD idea is neat, but I think it would make more sense to do that when/if we make CK3. We do discuss what we intended/what we did a bit in post mortum DDs after expansions come out.

A completely new system, well done Paradox!

By the way, Does it mean every religion will get its own holy relics(such as unreformed pagans)?
Will they influence religious authority?

Every religion group got some, but Christians got most.

Is there any chance these items can stack? so we can have more than one, and if yes can we get them with a working hidden = yes flag? Further, can we give them command_modifier blocks?

As mentioned, some stack (it's a setting when you define them). Command modifiers are something I have already requested be made, but it's not currently in - hopefully we'll add it. Hidden I think already works, but I'm not certain. Speaking of hidden, we'll do a mod support diary with details at some point, but we've expanded hidden on traits/modifiers etc to have an is_visible trigger so you can control who sees what if desired :)

Will there be any prestige benefit for stealing and holding another religion's holy relics, or possibly a chance to convert by spending time in your treasury and having a revelation while viewing one?

There's prestige for stealing them, yes.

So you're saying I should indiscriminately butcher my vassals so I steal their ****?

Exactly!

Waow, waow, waow, waow. This is definitely a must have dlc.

MODDERS, ASSEMBLE.

Not to "unsell" you on it, but remember the system is in the patch, so if modding is your only concern you don't actually need the DLC.

Would it be possible to add hidden effects to Items? For example, you have a nice jewel that gives you some prestige bonus and all is well. Except that anyone that owns it keep dying, due to a hidden malus to health. The hidden effect could then be revealed in an event after a couple of short generations.

It's a fun idea, but not currently possible. Might be able to add it though.
 
  • 33
  • 6
Reactions:
Not something I expected, but given the character focus of the game and that it adds flavour to an already existing aspect, I'm all for it.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
This looks really cool. I like all moves that make CK more RPG-ish.
Maybe the caravans that bring eunuchs now can also bring an exotic artifact!


Would be nice to be able to do things with some items. For example:

Giving them away
- holy relics to the church for piety and relation bonus.
- other items to other characters (maybe your son that's left for a Holy Order) for relation bonuses and role play reasons.

Hiding them. Some items you might want to keep extra out of sight, reducing the risks of losing them to envious rivals.
- a very special sword you want to save up for your son, and you don't need to be displaying.
- unholy items that no one should know you have.

Displaying them. I mean REALLY SHOWING THEM OFF!
- you have a wicked set of artifacts and there's a festival or a feast coming up? why not show them off for a prestige bump!
- of course this may cause envy in the hearts of others, or may even cost you the artifact itself, as thievery or other accidents can occur.
- you are the patrician head of a wealthy Venetian family? why not keep a permanent display in your mansion of the gifts you received from the merchants of the orient.

Developing their story. Why not have them break or become better?
- Did you lead a victory on the field and it was all thanks to your trusted sword? Let us name it and give it a little extra passive prestige income.
- Were you cornered in a duel against an adversary beyond your skill? Maybe you barely escaped, but now your famed sword is shattered, and may take some time until you find a smith with the skill to restore it (if you have the gold for the service)
- Are you a mystic delving into the unknown? Why not try and temper with that cloak of yours to cast a spell on it, or get your witch doctor friend to do it.
- Are you an alchemist? Why not put some of that basic chemistry to use and carry with you some home made poison ointment for your blade or bow.
 
  • 4
  • 1
Reactions:
There should be a event chain that includes the "Ulfberht" *steel* sword and con men selling knock off "Ulfberht" bog iron swords that break on the first blow for a couple of your cows. I mean that's probably the first historically recorded instance of cheap knockoffs.
 
  • 3
Reactions:
No, just a summary of the effects.

Both - there's a summary on your character sheet and you can see per item stats in your Treasury.

No (would be nice to add though).

You can hold multiple items, but not all effects stack. E.g. if you hold multiple bones of saints, those stack, but if you have multiple Holy grails (not something which should be possible, but for example) they would not since only one can be "real".

Personally I think all the grails were real, it was Donvan's impure motives that made him melt :p



It's an epic, of course!



Mostly event chains, but it's also possible to steal them while sieging or raiding holdings.

DD idea is neat, but I think it would make more sense to do that when/if we make CK3. We do discuss what we intended/what we did a bit in post mortum DDs after expansions come out.



Every religion group got some, but Christians got most.



As mentioned, some stack (it's a setting when you define them). Command modifiers are something I have already requested be made, but it's not currently in - hopefully we'll add it. Hidden I think already works, but I'm not certain. Speaking of hidden, we'll do a mod support diary with details at some point, but we've expanded hidden on traits/modifiers etc to have an is_visible trigger so you can control who sees what if desired :)



There's prestige for stealing them, yes.



Exactly!



Not to "unsell" you on it, but remember the system is in the patch, so if modding is your only concern you don't actually need the DLC.



It's a fun idea, but not currently possible. Might be able to add it though.


Is there a way to scope to the original owner, or if an item was created to its creator? I ask so we can do dynamic naming like, "Legendary Sword of X" where X was the first owner, or the crafter and have the name remain the same? I am thinking for warhammer and our crafting system, being able to give a name to an item would be quite helpful, especially with relation to a way for a sword to kinda gain a legend based on where it was created.

would you be able to double check on the hidden btw? If command modifiers get in this could be a really useful way to make stacking temporary effects, that previously required me to do a half dozen different traits.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
Depends on if we can see them on dead character otherwise you won't be able to trace back the inheritance of VS swords etc which is something I like to do. We could probably work around it but it would be a nice thing to have

Also we have no artists to make the images lol
That would be nice to have on real life mythical swords to. Not much point in having Curtana, Durendal, or Joyeuse without being able to see that they are in fact (supposedly obviously) the blades of Ogier, Roland and Charlamagne.
 
Last edited:
  • 2
Reactions:
Very good idea - I am certain it will greatly improve the RP feeling...
It could be VERY cool, if it was made possible to "transfer" items to someone specific. Say you have a vassal you wanna be good friends with, you can grant him a beautiful item. Or if you have a favorite son, a warrior, it would make sense you could grant him your heirloom sword, rather than it goes to your inbred no-good, imbecile, dwarf son, who is your heir... sadly...

Send gift - give money or give item - please select the item you wish to give from your inventory menu.

Seems to me that it wouldn't be that hard to do.
 
Last edited:
  • 2
Reactions:
I foresee people whining that X sword design is wholly inaccurate for the time period/religion/culture of their character and thus the game is ruined forever, and a mod for crafting new items from existing ones.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
I know I'll just get a bunch of disagrees from the RP community here but that's because that's all that's left here. The grand strategy players have moved on. Sucks too, since CK2 was once my favorite game.
Well, I for one declare myself as grand strategy(-ish) player and I'm stlll here. But I'm not sure if CK can really work as 'classical' grand strategy.
 
  • 1
Reactions:
Will there be any prestige benefit for stealing and holding another religion's holy relics, or possibly a chance to convert by spending time in your treasury and having a revelation while viewing one?

Will there be events with the carousing focus to go show off your artifacts during a party, with chances of them being stolen or damaged, or maybe play a game with someone else who has artifacts, winner takes one?

Will the Necronomicon be an artifact? Somewhat related, will there be artifacts with downsides?

We are going through content of previous DLCs to change items/artifacts/relics from character modifiers (which they used to be) to actual physical items that are used by the new inventory system.

And yes, you may find certain rare items that, other than having purely beneficial effects, will also be detrimental... :)
 
  • 16
  • 1
Reactions:
And yes, you may find certain rare items that, other than having purely beneficial effects, will also be detrimental...

It seems you can't give or sell them, only lose them, in the present state of the game. So if you have an object with detrimental effect, you are stuck with it for a long time. It can be frustrating.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
Can't read whole pages sorry about that :p. Just want to add or ask are/can people name their weapon artifact by themselves. At that times heredity or noble or etc. named their own weapons by themselves. Are you planning to do that or it is already in the package ? :)
 
My hope for this system is that there will be TONS of flavor. I want to be able to go to my father's tomb and find out more about the sword, and follow clues i left behind in my previous life to figure out where the lost weapon of my dynasty is. I want to find jewels only to be cursed, I want to find my Empire's crown jewels missing and spend my entire lifetime searching. I want the crown of a minor kingdom to be lost to one of the vassals dynasty, until they use that crown to show their right to be the ruling family.
 
  • 6
Reactions: