• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

CK2 Dev Diary #63: In the Emperor's Good Graces

Greetings!

Today I would like to talk to you about some of the ways you can gain the Grace of the Emperor, and ways in which you can use it to your advantage! To interact with China you must be within their diplomatic range - which extends throughout the entire Silk Road, and through the influence of the Western Protectorate and any Tributaries China might have. When you are within diplomatic range you have the options to Pay Tribute and Ask for Boons.

Paying Tribute to the Emperor will get you in their good Graces, giving you the option of asking for Boons. While the first thing that comes to mind would be to become an actual Tributary State to China, there are more ways to earn Grace. Of course, being a Tributary State is one of the most effective ways to earn the Emperors good Grace - having the Emperor like you more for each month you stay a Tributary State - though you have to give up a significant portion of your Wealth and Levy Regain rate. As China prefers their Tributaries to keep paying Tribute to them, they are willing to defend their Tributaries from outside threats - Tributary States will have the option of summoning a regiment of Chinese forces when they are under attack. When playing as a small realm in the Tarim Basin, for example, it is very prudent to become a Chinese Tributary as they will help you fend off ravenous Nomads and expansionist Tibetans alike.
Tributary.png



Not everyone will have the opportunity (or want to give up their sovereignty) to become a Tributary State though, in that case there are other things you can do to earn the Emperor’s good Grace. The two most common things the Emperor requires are more Concubines for the harem and more Eunuchs for the administration. If you are able to find characters that suit either role, you will be able to send them off as Tribute. These characters will most often have to be your close relatives, making the choice whether to send them away or not more tactical (perhaps you’d rather keep your daughter for forming a local alliance, or keep your third son as a backup in case your first two sons bite the dust). Note that you won’t be able to send off characters that stand to inherit titles. The selection of a suitable character is made by executing a new type of ‘third party character’ decision, as can be seen in this screenshot:
Selection.png



There are also other things you can do to gain the Grace of the Emperor, I won’t go into too much detail, but they include things such as: Offering a Court Physician when China is suffering a Plague, sending Relief while China is suffering a Famine, sending Artifacts or Gold, and more.

Any Grace you’ve earned will persist as long as the same Dynasty sits on the throne in China - Civil Wars and Invasions might result in a new Dynasty taking the Dragon Throne, making you lose any grace you’ve accumulated. Fortunately the Dynasty changes seldomly, and you get ample warning before it happens (so that you get a chance to leverage the Grace you’ve accumulated with the current Dynasty).

Emperors, like most characters in CK2, have their own personalities. This is characterized through the Emperor’s likes and dislikes - if the Emperor favors Buddhists you will find it more rewarding to both be a Buddhist yourself, and to send the Emperor Buddhists as tribute. The opposite is true for being disliked by the Emperor - with the additional threat that they might, just might, treat you as a priority target should they become expansionist!

Now on to using Grace - if you’ve sent enough Tribute to the Emperor you will be able to request Boons. Boons are generally very powerful, and come in many flavors - I won’t go through all of them in this DD, but here are a select few:

Request Peace Deal - The most basic of all Boons, having an active Peace Deal will prevent China from ever targeting you with wars. It is very cheap to get one and, unless you’re taking a risk by saving up for something costly, you should usually be able to afford one. A Peace Deal lasts for a long time, and also persists through multiple characters should the one who requested it die. In addition to preventing the wrath of China, it also gives quite a bit of passive prestige. Do note that if China is in an Expansionist phase they might not want to hand out any Peace Deals, so get them while you can…

Request Strategist - This Boon has a character trained in Chinese Strategy join your court. This character is both a competent commander by himself, but will given time also train your existing commanders in the art of Chinese warfare. This is represented by special Commander Traits with very powerful bonuses.

Request Master Engineer - This Boon has a masterful Chinese Engineer join your court. For as long as this character stays employed, he will improve your demesne with powerful province modifiers - Blast Furnaces, Paper Mills, Fireworks Guilds and other wondrous things. These modifiers tend to help you advance in Military and Economic technology.

Request Imperial Marriage - The Emperor has many daughters (and in the case of female rulers, cousins and kinsmen) and if you stand in their good Graces you might be allowed to have you or one of your children marry one of them! Such a marriage is not only very prestigious, because a princess doesn’t leave China alone - along with her she will bring a regiment of Honor Guards that you can call upon at will. Unlike the troops you can call upon from being a Chinese Tributary State these Honor Guards can also be used in offensive wars - giving you an edge in warfare. An Imperial Marriage also sets a Peace Deal in place.
Princess.png



Request Invasion - This is the most costly Boon of them all, and will be a challenge just to gain enough Grace for - if there is a realm that has grown too large and powerful for their own good, you can suggest that China invades them with the sole purpose of dismantling their realm. Of course, it might not be very likely that China would succeed in taking down a distant Empire (i.e. Byzantium) and there is no absolute guarantee that they will win regardless. If you are independent you can choose to join in the war yourself, which is especially useful if you really want the war to succeed. Having Peace Deals with China will protect characters from Requested Invasions and normal invasions alike.

There are plenty of other things you can request; Scholar-Bureaucrats, Siege Engineers, Chinese Artifacts, Silk Road Trade Contracts and more - but I won’t go into more detail in this DD!

Finally I’d like to say that many of these features will be controllable by Game Rules. If you want to disable the Diplomatic Range of China and gain Grace as a count in Ireland you will be able to do so - the same if you do not wish to have China launch any invasions, along with many other things. And as always, if you have any ideas/questions/concerns for Game Rules relating to the features presented in the DD, feel free to suggest them here!
 
Why not? Indonesia would be fun as hell.

That would make China and Japan a large terra incognita. It would also slow down performance a lot. Most players play within the European continent anyways so it would bother people who bought the game to sacrifice speed for places they don't care about.
 
Yo where are all the War updates for the new xpac? Did that one get pushed back for this China stuff? Or are these two part of the same package? Just wondering, cause I'm looking forward to all the new War focused stuff.
 
Korea is like thirty county's and all of them are held by the top tier liege in pretty much every start date, and even those who do have vassals how do you know they are historical? Paradox cant just take it on faith that is correct, they would need to verify that's the case. Its not just a copy and paste job and its in many ways less work to start from scratch..
Last time I checked a year or so ago they were anything, but historical.
 
Yo where are all the War updates for the new xpac? Did that one get pushed back for this China stuff? Or are these two part of the same package? Just wondering, cause I'm looking forward to all the new War focused stuff.

They'll improve war the day they make theocracies playable. I hear that's after the China expansion right alongside improved crusades and unique mechanics for every European county.
 
That would make China and Japan a large terra incognita. It would also slow down performance a lot. Most players play within the European continent anyways so it would bother people who bought the game to sacrifice speed for places they don't care about.
Check what he was replying to before replying yourself. He was replying to a claim that Asia should never, ever be added. When we're talking CK4 performance is much less of an issue.
 
I responded to this in the last DD, only the Silk Road will be affected. I.e. the route with the name 'silk_road' in the files.
Ah, sorry I must have missed that :oops:
Thanks for answering anyway.
 
Check what he was replying to before replying yourself. He was replying to a claim that Asia should never, ever be added. When we're talking CK4 performance is much less of an issue.

I replied correctly. Including Indonesia would need to either have China and Japan north of it or have it as terra incognita or else the map would not be a proper rectangle.
 
Foreign Alien revived my Ignore list.
 
Plus nobody plays outside of Europe anyways.
You know... unlike what I presume are a lot of people, I always wanted to think that you always at least added something new to the conversation, even if I disagreed. That time is past us now.
 
Okay, I wasn't too thrilled about this conception of Chinese DLC, but it's getting a little more interesting. What would convince me to absolutely buy it (still not there, yet, though) is actual, conquerable, Chinese geography, with also ofc Southeast Asia, Japan, and Korea. I would pay good money for that, on day 1 of release.

My question is thus... I know I've heard 'people' around these forums, and iirc I think devs as well, say it wouldn't or 'couldn't' be done due to the processing power required to expand the map and manage all of the new characters, etc... but there is a major Chinese DLC that does this very thing, and it doesn't slow down my machine, nor most others it seems. Why do I keep hearing this claim when it's clear modders expand the map and add so many characters, etc, without much issue? Is it a different reason, or has there been something else keeping Paradox from doing a full-on Chinese-focused DLC?

Just because YOUR PC can handle the mod don't mean everyone's PC could handle this. They can't rise the lowest specs for this because that would piss people off who play on the lowest specs.
 
It would be a nice little touch with this addition to add just a tiny fun flavour event, have it so that if you ever restore the roman empire and hold a certain percentage of the provinces required for the "Old Borders Restored" event a envoy from China finds its way to Constantinople/Rome seeking to establish relations, which might start a event chain but I'm completely fine with it just being that one event.

This holds some historical credence, as Chinese Emperors have been trying to establish diplomatic channels with Rome in the past, but many were rebuffed by the Persians controlling the route between.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Roman_relations
And since reforming the Roman Empire is alt history anyway it could be a fun flavour addition.
 
Did the Samurai or Ronin roam around Asia at the time? Maybe they could be kept as part of the courts.

Samurai are Japan not China

If you load up Tianxia you can see a ton of start dates have empty land with no characters or just a single character controlling every county in the realm, Korea is like thirty county's and all of them are held by the top tier liege in pretty much every start date, and even those who do have vassals how do you know they are historical? Paradox cant just take it on faith that is correct, they would need to verify that's the case. Its not just a copy and paste job and its in many ways less work to start from scratch.

Paradox isn't going to deal with the culsterfuck that would entail, how many people have contributed to the map? how much money should they each get? its not worth it.

Tianxia is a work in progress. And let's be honest here, Paradox is pretty loose on being historical. The Charlemagne bookmark is a good example of that with most characters being made up and is why HIP will never bother trying to add that boommark (they already had to fix all of Paradoxes errors with the main supported bookmarks).

We'll see that in this new DLC too if they make the Song Dynasty (the Dynasty of most of CK2s time period) the 'main' China when it was paying tribute to the Liao Dynasty along with Western Xia and in no position to make central Asian peoples pay tribute to it.
 
Last edited:
Is the princess always beautiful and amazing? Can I be sent a princess with shitty traits?

I don't want to see a million attractive genius princesses like what happens when you find women through the seduction event. They just end up being clones.

Also can china stop existing at all @rageair ? It'd be really really useful for my mods if we could disable and enable the interface during the game.
 
Getting little closer of getting the Far East into the game, By having Tang dynasty characters play minor role in next DLC.
 
Last edited:
It would be a nice little touch with this addition to add just a tiny fun flavour event, have it so that if you ever restore the roman empire and hold a certain percentage of the provinces required for the "Old Borders Restored" event a envoy from China finds its way to Constantinople/Rome seeking to establish relations, which might start a event chain but I'm completely fine with it just being that one event.

This holds some historical credence, as Chinese Emperors have been trying to establish diplomatic channels with Rome in the past, but many were rebuffed by the Persians controlling the route between.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Roman_relations
And since reforming the Roman Empire is alt history anyway it could be a fun flavour addition.

The Sassanids had a great relationship with the Tang Dynasty so much so many Iranian nobles and the royal court fled Iran during the Caliphate conquests and were treated as honored guests in The Tang capital of Chang'An. Peroz III became a Tang General and led forces to reclaim Iran but failed and so did his son after. The Eastern Romans (Byzantines) sent envoys to the Tang 7 times.
 
Obviously.

It's a side a topic related to adding new Asian off map features.
Samurai proper appear circa 12th/13th century only. Though even then they didn't really roam anywhere outside Japan.

Getting little closer of getting the Far East into game, By having Qing dynasty characters play minor role in next DLC.
Qing?