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* CKII: Charlemagne Developer Diaries will be released weekly on Wednesdays from now on up to release! *

Welcome to the Charlemagne dev diaries - and above all, welcome to the 8th century!

I'm Tobias Bodlund, scripter on the Crusader Kings II team, and in this first installment of the dev diaries for CKII: Charlemagne I will be talking about the new 769 start date and how we've chosen to represent that historical period in the game.

We've added a bunch of new cultures to the game. A few of these could arguably have been present in The Old Gods already, but going back to 769 we felt we really needed to shake up the map to properly represent the changing cultural landscape of the Early Middle Ages.

sw_eur_cult.png

In Spain we have the Visigoths, and they are in the Iberian rather than the Germanic group, since the Gothic migrations are long since over and they have been living in the peninsula since the early 6th century. With time, Visigothic provinces are likely to eventually become Castilian, Catalan or Andalusian depending on location and which other religious and cultural influences they are subjected to. In northwestern Iberia we also still have the Suebi, an old Germanic people. They have their own culture shift events which may see the rise of Portuguese culture.

Looking north, we have the Franks. They are still Germanic but becoming more and more latinized. You will see them slowly turning into something we call "French"...

Other new cultures you will find are Saxons, Lombards, Picts and Somali. Also, there are no Russians yet, but instead various East Slavic peoples such as the Ilmenians, Severians and Volhynians.

We've revisited cultural dynamics in some other places as well. For example, the emergence of Norman culture is now somewhat more likely than before.

Regarding religion, the old Norse religion in the game is now referred to as Germanic. We decided to do this because with the earlier start date this religion exists well beyond Norse lands (specifically, the Saxons), and the old name also sometimes caused players to confuse it with Norse culture.

Moving further south, the Ibadi faith is now its own religion and no longer a Sunni heresy.

We've also added a new pagan religion, available only in the Charlemagne start. They are the followers of the sun-god Zun, which was historically the Zunbil dynasty in Afghanistan. They start out surrounded by Muslims and Buddhists, and this should provide an interesting and possibly quite difficult start, comparable to the Jewish starts.

And where are the Jews in 769, you ask now - you will find them in Semien in Ethiopia (sometimes referred to as Beta Israel).

religion_map_persia.png

Oh, speaking of the Norse, yes... with the new start date the Viking Age hasn't begun yet. This means that the Norse will initially not be able to launch Viking expeditions overseas. This will change the early game for them as they'll need to focus more on local affairs initially. Don't worry, though, a few decades in things will start happening for them and the continent will properly learn to fear the wrath of the Northmen.

Finally, let's look at some of the large empires in the 8th century:

In 769, the Byzantine Empire is embroiled in what historians call the "First Iconoclasm". This basically means that the emperor and patriarch (and most of the elite) follow the Iconoclast faith, where religious icons are condemned as idolatry much like in Islam. There is a choice for the emperor to either stick with Iconoclasm or renounce it (via a special decision).

Meanwhile, the Abbasids are the great blob of the 8th century. During this time, they historically ruled an area from the Indus in the east to the Maghreb in the west. Though "rule" is perhaps a misleading word in some cases. To reflect the fact that in reality they had limited control over many of their nominal vassals, we have made some of these areas independent in the game. But the Caliph still has plenty of de jure CBs and claims on those areas, so beware...

In Spain, Umayyad rule is fairly recently established, so you have an Arab Muslim dynasty ruling over mainly Visigothic Christian subjects.

europe_map.png

Then there is the Frankish Empire. After Pepin died, his sons Charlemagne and Carloman inherited a kind of joint kingship over the Franks, with each of them ruling directly over a portion of the kingdom. In the game, this means the two brothers each have a king title but also a claim on the other's title. With powerful neighbors such as the Lombards, the Umayyads and the pagan Saxons, things may get very interesting here.

As you can see, the world in 769 is quite different from later starts, with many period-defining events still to unfold. Things such as the Holy Roman Empire (yes, you can found it), Vikings, Normans and Russians are still unheard of. There aren't even that many Karlings yet (!).

The 8th century is a strange and wonderful place. We hope that you'll enjoy it.
 
Please make North Africa more Christian at AD 769. Its only been under Muslim rule for a short while at this point (less than a century), and the region had been *very* Christian, and there are plenty of historical, first-hand accounts of the Christian nature of the population throughout this time period.

Western North Africa will probably have more Christian provinces at release.
 
For how it was written (little new information, several mistake pointed out by poster still exist), I wouldn't surprised if this DD is composed at last minutes (well, maybe more than minutes but still) because this week MP stream failed to launch...
There is even no mention whether the DD will be weekly, bi-weekly, or monthly...

Hope next DDs going to be the 'real' DD...

+1
 
Question for Devs regarding current "tribal titles" like Great Moravia. Will these stay Tribal as they are without de-jure drift being possible or turn into "formable" titles with Charlemagne. So could you start a game as Great Moravia and attempt to retain it's title and nice CoA and if you manage to stick around for 100 years, get your de-jure "Great Moravia" into existence?

"Tribal titles" of the old kind won't exist anymore. This means all those titles will now be connected to the de jure mechanics. Of course, not all titles will exist at all start dates - so for example, the de jure Empire of Germania is only available in 769 (replaced by the HRE in later starts).
 
Like the religious map.
I think it shows one part of Tunisia as Catholic. The argument is that at least one part was, but it was likely a little more Christian than one. But definietly agree with at least one section, there were still nativ e Christians as a majority in some areas when Sicily took over during the Crusades. But the Christian areas should be south of Tunis.
Jerusalem and Bethlahem are definitly Miaphysite that is very certain, especially if you look at the capacity of Churches vs Mosques in Jerusalem in this time period.
As far as the Balkans, the religious map looks correct, even if the slavic overlords may not have been Christianized. Vojnomir with the help of Charlemange took over Croatia and converted to Christianity as thanks. The specific Serbian area was a mix of cultures at the time, so the base stock may have been orthdox in the coastal areas which were still reasonably populated with Romano-Illyric cultured peoples. But the overlords and rulers would be Slavic. Of course ruling over a region with Christian populace would probabyl hasten Christianity.
The Vlach culture (Romano/Latin/Romanian/Dacian/Thracian mix) would be prevelent in the area of Transylvania specifically at this time (700AD onward).
Also in the area, Anna Comnena refers to Dacians (Future Romanians).
The whole area was definietly not Tengri (at all) If anything the conversion of Bulgaria was expidited due to the LARGE number of Christians under their rule, There were also a LARGE number of Slavs under Bulgarian rule (one of the reasons that Boris switched to Christianity, to stop the religious unrest between Tengri and Slav). So if anything I would say Capital as Tengri, South of the Danube as Orthodox, North of the Danube Slav mixed with Orthodox along the Coast and in Vlach Territory.
Avar Territory West Side Catholic, East Side Orthodox (Vlach) Center Slavic Capital Tengri. Possibly Székely Culture Tengri in the Northern Border.
There were "Hunnic" Mercenaries hired by the Byzantines in the 700 AD era.
 
"Tribal titles" of the old kind won't exist anymore. This means all those titles will now be connected to the de jure mechanics. Of course, not all titles will exist at all start dates - so for example, the de jure Empire of Germania is only available in 769 (replaced by the HRE in later starts).
Great and glorious news :D
 
For the Devs: Will you be adding a Frisian culture? As currently as far as I know its all Saxon in Frisia where it should be Frisian.
 
Are there any changes to the later start dates (e.g. some of the new cultures being present in 867)?
 
Will tribes be added through out the arabic and african world where they make sense, even though many are muslims?

I really hope you guys don't tie this mechanic too much with religion.

Even ireland will be tribal. So I think we will see some of then in Africa as well. (I think they also said east Perisa, but i'm not sure),
 
This schism discussion is very interesting.

The way we've chosen to handle it in Crusader Kings II is based on what you describe, that by the time the game starts the churches were already divided and competing since a long time (you could even argue that it all started in 476 - or before that if you want to take into account the cultural impact of Greek vs Latin traditions in the Roman Empire). There are many things, such as the existence of differing church customs and rituals, the growing political power of Rome etc that clearly show that it was not one unified church at this time. Events such as the coronation of Charlemagne also illustrate the existence of a political separation, that the West did not accept Eastern authority.

The mutual excommunication of 1054 is by many historians taken to be the "official and final" date of the schism - but the division of Eastern and Western Christianity was already a fact since several centuries.

I think by 769 it's fair to guess that to the majority of Christians it appeared that they were of one faith, but church leaders and other politically aware actors of the time knew this not to be true.

That is right and correct, but please give us a decision to mend it as Catholic Ruler... and made Orthodox heresy...
 
"Tribal titles" of the old kind won't exist anymore. This means all those titles will now be connected to the de jure mechanics. Of course, not all titles will exist at all start dates - so for example, the de jure Empire of Germania is only available in 769 (replaced by the HRE in later starts).

Related Follow Up Question: Will titular titles (ie Khazaria in the current 867 start) still exist?
 
"Tribal titles" of the old kind won't exist anymore. This means all those titles will now be connected to the de jure mechanics. Of course, not all titles will exist at all start dates - so for example, the de jure Empire of Germania is only available in 769 (replaced by the HRE in later starts).
What exactly do you mean? That there wont be anymore any titles that are automatically destroyed when their holder gets same or higher tier nontribal title? Does it mean, that dejure titles will use different name and CoA if their holders are of certain culture and have tribal capitals? Because old "titular tribal titles" were great way to represent things like nomad Magyars, or Timurids, or Mongols, and many historical realms which had no set territory, and couldn't be reasonably tied to existing dejure title. Stuff like Great Moravia for example, you couldn't just use renamed Bohemia, since it would screw regnal numbers in later start dates.
Any clarifications on it, please?
 
What exactly do you mean? That there wont be anymore any titles that are automatically destroyed when their holder gets same or higher tier nontribal title? Does it mean, that dejure titles will use different name and CoA if their holders are of certain culture and have tribal capitals? Because old "titular tribal titles" were great way to represent things like nomad Magyars, or Timurids, or Mongols, and many historical realms which had no set territory, and couldn't be reasonably tied to existing dejure title. Stuff like Great Moravia for example, you couldn't just use renamed Bohemia, since it would screw regnal numbers in later start dates.
Any clarifications on it, please?

Yes, no more auto-destroying tribal titles.

There will still be titular titles. And some previously tribal titles will get de jure land, while some will be merged with other local de jure-titles. Also, the de jure map may not always be the same for different start dates.

Great Moravia - as an example - will not be Bohemia, but it will also not exist de jure in every start date.
 
Yes, no more auto-destroying tribal titles.

There will still be titular titles. And some previously tribal titles will get de jure land, while some will be merged with other local de jure-titles. Also, the de jure map may not always be the same for different start dates.

Great Moravia - as an example - will not be Bohemia, but it will also not exist de jure in every start date.

Interesting.... This would mean that Great Moravia would replace dejure Bohemia in earlier startdates, just like Asturias replaces Leon in ToG. Speaking of Spain, I hope their dejure would be tweaked, since its odd to see Castille but no Leon in ToG, both should be dejure Asturias.
Also, dejure Finland in later dates could be divided between Sweden and Rus, since Finland was considered integral part of Swedish Crown. After 1110s, Pomerania would be divided between Poland and Germany, since Stetting and Danzig were considered dejure Poland, just as Mecklenburg was Germany
 
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