Dev Diary #112 - Year in Review

[Tschobo]

To talk about this year, it can be seen good or bad. The current year was more of a middling thing to CK as a whole. I am not saying, that they did a marvellous job, marvellous was the launch and the first few months up to Northern Lords, afterwards it was a drought, partially thanks to Covid and this year had ups and downs, and thanks to some miscommunication that could have been handled better, there were some harsh situations.

My takes for CK3 this year are:

1. Royal Court was a mess, and a completely middling DLC. Mind not, the culture system is great and the artifcats, while sometimes annoying, had a great return. But the Royal Court itself was underwhelming and chaotic. It is also the reason why the developers don't overhype anything here. Or release trailers of CK3 additions until they have enough to show. But I don't want to start with everything that lead us here was the Royal Court faults rant again.
2. Fate of Iberia was the best DLC so far for CK3. Yes, there were some DLCs in CK2 that were better, but it was a long needed success after two mediocre additions.
3. The Pricing Discussion was not thought out. While the signs were there, they could have handled the price increase of the flavour packs better. Just throwing out that they increase them and then fall into Radio Silence for a few days was not the most clever decision as it caused an uproar pretty much everywhere.
4. Friends and Foes is a great patch but an optional DLC. The patch was great and fixed a lot of things, but the DLC is optional at best.
5. The communication of Develpers in the forum increased. While not by a large margin the Developers take note of some threads, comment on it, maybe clarify some issues and even look at some concepts. I really like that and that deserves some recognition. Espescially those who even explain and defend some of the more unpopular decisions.
6. The last Patch was OK. It was mostly nothing groundbreaking but fixed a few things, added some smaller things for RP and some dazzle to the Faith mechanics and bugfixes but that's that and that is for a free patch ok and decent and overall better than waiting an eternity for the next DLC.

So I really hope for some fun additions next year. Like a flavour pack not set in Europe for once. Or that the next Major Pack can tackle the topics it wants to add smoother than the last one. But until then, everybody should enjoy their holidays if they have them.

I'm with you. We just want quality. Nicknames is something extra.

Well I guess the Nicknames are a part of the next patch. It won't be the Nicknames Major Pack now coming in March. I guess we will hear more about the next DLC at January and until then it is just smaller tidbits.

 

[TravlingCanuck]

To talk about this year can be seen good or bad. The current year was more of a middling thing to CK as a whole. I am not saying, that they did a marvellous job, marvellous was the launch and the first few months up to Northern Lords, afterwards it was a drought, partially thanks to Covid and this year had ups and downs, and thanks to some miscommunication that could have been handled better, there were some harsh situations.

My takes for CK3 this year are:

1. Royal Court was a Mess, and a completely middling DLC. Mind not, the culture system is great and the artifcats, while sometimes annoying, had a great return. But the Royal Court itself was underwhelming and chaotic. It is also the reason why the developers don't overhype anything here. Or release trailers of CK3 additions until they have enough to show. But I don't want to start with everything that lead us here was the Royal Court faults rant again.
2. Fate of Iberia was the best DLC so far for CK3. Yes, there were some DLCs in CK2 that were better, but it was a long needed success after two mediocre additions.
3. The Pricing Discussion was not thought out. While the signs were there, they could have handled the price increase of the flavour packs better. Just throwing out that they increase them and then fall into Radio Silence for a few days was not the most clever decision as it caused an uproar pretty much everywhere.
4. Friends and Foes is a great patch but an optional DLC. The patch was great and fixed a lot of things, but the DLC is optional at best.
5. The communication of Develpers in the forum increased. While not by a large margin the Developers take not of some threads, comment on it, maybe clarify some issues and even look at some concepts. I really like that and that deserves some recognition. Espescially those who even explain and defend some of the more unpopular decisions.
6. The last Patch was OK. It was mostly nothing groundbreaking but fixed a few things, added some smaller things for RP and some dazzle to the Faith but that's that and that is for a free patch ok and decent and overall better than waiting an eternity for the next DLC.

So I really hope for some fun additions next year. Like a flavour pack not set in Europe for once. Or that the next Major Pack can tackle the topics it wants to add smoother than the last one. But until then, everybody should enjoy their holidays if they have them.



Well I guess the Nicknames are a part of the next patch. It won't be the Nicknames Major Pack now coming in March. I guess we will hear more about the next DLC at January and until then it is just smaller tidbits.

Excellent summary. Royal Court really de-railed CK3. Fate of Iberia helped get it back on track. Friends and Foes I personally liked, but is obviously controversial - likely wouldn't have been so controversial if it didn't follow hard on the pricing announcement fiasco and general unrest about the state of the game. The only two things I'd add:

• too many bugs have been lingering for too long; 1.8 demonstrated an effort to tackle this, hopefully more effort is forthcoming
• hopefully 2023 will build on the strengths of 2022 (Fate of Iberia) and we can all look forward to a better year ahead!

 

[foreman_domai]

Perhaps nicknames named after Greek philosophical schools, " the Stoic", "the Epicure", "the Cynic", "the Skeptic", "the Peripatetic" ect. Maybe their analogies in middle eastern and Indian philosophy ( "the Charvaka").

 

[MastL]

Is anything new for this game this year?
Royal Court,mostly made in last year.
FoI,some Iberian flavor,yes.
F＆F,several events only.
And...memory mechanics?AI improvements?

Could have done way more.

 

[Sappho of Lesbos]

Hoping you can balance it in such a way we don't see the same few nicknames super often.

EDIT: Can we get one for eating the pope? It's a giant meme and I imagine realistically if someone actually cannibalized the pope they'd be forever infamous. "The Priest Eater" or something?

I think it would just be "The Pope Eater".

 

[BadKidOh]

Suggestion for a new nickname. some of them need work I guess.
* the Despised
* the Unholy
* the Torturer
* the Scourge of "location"
* the Sorrow of "location"
* the Undying (really old age or not dying in battle or reincarnation)
* the Lover
* the King/Emperor of the World
* the Witch
* the Giant
* the Small
* the Twin Souls (marrying your twin & being their soulmate)
* the Builder
* the Paradox

Also thinking of holidays, wouldn't mind some x-mass in game & other holidays like new years.

 

[KarlReich]

As others state, it is quite disappointing to sit around waiting for core issues to the game to be addressed and a "Holiday Break Teaser" meant to entice us to stay tuned for the next exciting feature is... Nicknames.
Still no sign of a rework of, in my opinion, a dreadfully lackluster levy system that does not integrate with vassal relationships at all. Your holdings affect only your men-at-arms composition, your levies remain the same throughout the game. But Nicknames is the pressing issue you want us to be excited for?
I simply don't understand. I still have no tangible reason to play Crusader Kings 3 over its predecessor, Crusader Kings 2.
Two years have passed and the only feature that drew me in and made me go "That's a REALLY good addition" was the cultural rework, which says enough, doesn't it?

I really want to like this game. I'm starting to think I never will.

 

[TheRevanchist25]

As others state, it is quite disappointing to sit around waiting for core issues to the game to be addressed and a "Holiday Break Teaser" meant to entice us to stay tuned for the next exciting feature is... Nicknames.
Still no sign of a rework of, in my opinion, a dreadfully lackluster levy system that does not integrate with vassal relationships at all. Your holdings affect only your men-at-arms composition, your levies remain the same throughout the game. But Nicknames is the pressing issue you want us to be excited for?
I simply don't understand. I still have no tangible reason to play Crusader Kings 3 over its predecessor, Crusader Kings 2.
Two years have passed and the only feature that drew me in and made me go "That's a REALLY good addition" was the cultural rework, which says enough, doesn't it?

I really want to like this game. I'm starting to think I never will.

The Hooks was also a good idea that CK2 didn't have, but alas, much like basically every other system in the game, I feel like they don't do much with Hooks.

 

[G.Barega]

Having high dread could lead to being called "The Terrible", not sure if you already have that one on the list.

 

[Testeria]

So another meme stuff and still no sign of strategic gameplay improvement...

 

[kawamuratc]

As others state, it is quite disappointing to sit around waiting for core issues to the game to be addressed and a "Holiday Break Teaser" meant to entice us to stay tuned for the next exciting feature is... Nicknames.
Still no sign of a rework of, in my opinion, a dreadfully lackluster levy system that does not integrate with vassal relationships at all. Your holdings affect only your men-at-arms composition, your levies remain the same throughout the game. But Nicknames is the pressing issue you want us to be excited for?
I simply don't understand. I still have no tangible reason to play Crusader Kings 3 over its predecessor, Crusader Kings 2.
Two years have passed and the only feature that drew me in and made me go "That's a REALLY good addition" was the cultural rework, which says enough, doesn't it?

I really want to like this game. I'm starting to think I never will.

Who said a preview had to be a “pressing” issue? It’s a little tasty appetizer. Notice the number of posts of people excitedly offering up nicknames and suggestions. This is a fun little thing for us.

Theyve told us previously how they were going to release info. You may think it’s better that they drop an important, serious bit of info as a preview then disappear until next year, but boy, I’d hate to see the way 10 or so forumites work themselves up in a five week frenzy over how this Big Important Feature Preview is the sign that PDX is doomed and their devs are dumb dumbs and how CK3 is a giant flop.

Also, you know what? It’s fine if you don’t like CK3, if it doesn’t develop in the way you want it to. I vastly prefer CK3 over CK2. CK3 really leaned into the aspects of CK2 that I liked, the ones that seem to have surprised devs with their popularity.

For me, CK2 was fun, but it was also a game that I had to swallow a lot of uninteresting and often tedious busywork to get to the actual interesting parts: the story. I’d only have memorable characters once every three or four generations, then the characters would fade back into statistics.

With CK3, that changed. Something about the pacing of the game was drastically altered in a way I don’t fully understand and suddenly I was having memorable characters every generation. Part of it is likely due to the move to the 3D portraits so I could see the slow change of time/generation in faces.

if CK3 had leaned into the parts of CK2 I didn’t like and became more like, i don’t know, EU, that would have sucked for me. I wouldn’t have liked it. And that too would have been fine, because games are allowed to exist even if I don’t like them. I’d check it out from time to time and wistfully sigh about the game it could have neen

CK2 is not going anywhere. It’s okay for you to like it better and not like CK3. Keep playing CK2 and enjoy yourself.

So another meme stuff and still no sign of strategic gameplay improvement...

Ah, yes. Nicknames. Very meme-y.

I regularly send pictures of nicknames to group chat. Just like, look at this fire meme I found:

Maybe not every bit of the game you’re not interested in is a meme

 

[BrotherJonathan]

Also I'd like to point out that character nicknames being repetitive or too random has actually been a fairly consistent player complaint, so this is actually addressing something that a lot of people find annoying/immersion-breaking.

 

[Prairie_Doggin]

Anyone who is hoping the devs really shake things up in 2023 and maybe take the game in a different direction should go take a look at the steam reviews. They're overwhelmingly positive, with most saying some variation of "I had sex with the Pope! 10/10!"

I'm fading fast, bros...

 

[kawamuratc]

Anyone who is hoping the devs really shake things up in 2023 and maybe take the game in a different direction should go take a look at the steam reviews. They're overwhelmingly positive, with most saying some variation of "I had sex with the Pope! 10/10!"

I'm fading fast, bros...

Far more serious strategy games would at least have me sleeping with my cat spymaster, right?

 

[Wokeg]

To everyone posting nicknames: thanks so much and we've definitely taken down quite a few of these! This is a neat little system that just gets better the more variables it has to work with, so the extra input is very much appreciated.

Also I'd like to point out that character nicknames being repetitive or too random has actually been a fairly consistent player complaint, so this is actually addressing something that a lot of people find annoying/immersion-breaking.

Thank you! ^^' That's part of the reason we're doing it.

Who said a preview had to be a “pressing” issue? It’s a little tasty appetizer. Notice the number of posts of people excitedly offering up nicknames and suggestions. This is a fun little thing for us.

Theyve told us previously how they were going to release info. You may think it’s better that they drop an important, serious bit of info as a preview then disappear until next year, but boy, I’d hate to see the way 10 or so forumites work themselves up in a five week frenzy over how this Big Important Feature Preview is the sign that PDX is doomed and their devs are dumb dumbs and how CK3 is a giant flop.

This exactly. It's a tiny preview of a small thing that one or two people have worked on when they've found themselves with a gap in their schedule over the last few months. It's a teaser we're showing because we're not quite ready to talk about larger stuff, and this is a fun lil side-thing we can show off in a WIP state.

I'm going to be very candid here, and say that the December-January dev diaries tend, IME, to be the absolute worst, with January more so because every year so far us not working over the holidays of late December or having much to show whilst work is restarting in early January has been treated by a (loud) few as a content drought/communication shut-down. It's more or less exactly how Kawamuratc says, which is actually quite demoralising and just... not fun. Frankly, it's not what people want to be doing in the run-up to/mid-holidays for something that isn't actually part of their job description and especially during what's supposed to be time off, which means devs tend to just tune out over these months, and then fail to tune back in again because of the resulting atmosphere in the forums.

In my opinion it was a major & direct contributor in the slow drying up of dev activity here over the last year and a half or so. It's also a large part of the reason we're more hesitant to show off smaller things we're working on, or WIP things we're working on, or just... things that are mostly complete but which we won't be releasing for a while, all of which I see people pining for us to do. Because when we do, we start taking (often fairly harsh) flak for not focusing on particular mechanics instead, or for something being unfinished according to a particular set of standards, or not addressing specific bugs or issues that bother someone personally. :/ If the response to open communication & teasers is hostility and conspiritorialising, even by a comparatively small group of people, then it doesn't actually take that much to make said-openness just not worth the risk or effort.

As a disclaimer, I will say that overall, this thread has been generally fairly positive and I'm grateful for the content suggestions, the hopes expressed for the future, the support from many of you for the team, and the critique that's been phrased politely and helpfully. I'm definitely not going to say all the critique, but a good deal of it, and critical feedback is useful and necessary. I've written this reply mostly because I feel like the forums have been much more pleasant to interact with lately (I've had some great conversations and suggestions in here the last couple of months) and, tbh, I'd like that to continue and progress. I'd like to see to see more dev activity, more forumite activity, more teasers and WIP work being released earlier, more discussions, more community pain points getting brought up, more of everything. I don't really want to see it torn down again by vitriol and hyperbole, and though there's not a huge amount of that in this thread as yet, like I say, January is usually the worst month for that and we're 25% of the way there.

 

[kawamuratc]

I'm going to be very candid here, and say that the December-January dev diaries tend, IME, to be the absolute worst, with January more so because every year so far us not working over the holidays of late December or having much to show whilst work is restarting in early January has been treated by a (loud) few as a content drought/communication shut-down. It's more or less exactly how Kawamuratc says, which is actually quite demoralising and just... not fun. Frankly, it's not what people want to be doing in the run-up to/mid-holidays for something that isn't actually part of their job description and especially during what's supposed to be time off, which means devs tend to just tune out over these months, and then fail to tune back in again because of the resulting atmosphere in the forums.

[…] I don't really want to see it torn down again by vitriol and hyperbole, and though there's not a huge amount of that in this thread as yet, like I say, January is usually the worst month for that and we're 25% of the way there.

It’s actually really distressing because I’m almost certain a lot of the anger and vitriol are part of major (like, on the level of country wide culture) failings that also harm the people who are lashing out.

I’m aware this is a forum for CK3, so I won’t go too off topic, but I can’t help but notice the way the anger regularly arises in response to vacations. Time off from work.

Yeah, because a larger portion of the (speaking from what I know, so excuse the specificity) Americans on here are worked to death and that’s just how they expect the world to be or else it’s lazy. Because that’s how they’re treated, and to them it’s not that they’re treated like machines to break on the altar of capital accumulation for others, but that the ones who get less breaking are morally bad and messing up their hobby.

I have to live in a flawed world where I regularly, just by living, engage in systems that harm and exploit others. Let the devs who make a game I like have reasonable hours, work conditions and, yes, vacations. We should be angry not that they’re off living more fulfilling lives where they aren’t constantly producing new content we consume ravenously, but that a large number of us don’t get treated right.

 

[Mortrag]

I have mixed feelings about this post, but I would like to pick one part of it:

... Because when we do, we start taking (often fairly harsh) flak for not focusing on particular mechanics instead, or for something being unfinished according to a particular set of standards, or not addressing specific bugs or issues that bother someone personally. :/ ...

As a disclaimer, I will say that overall, this thread has been generally fairly positive and I'm grateful for the content suggestions, the hopes expressed for the future, the support from many of you for the team, and the critique that's been phrased politely and helpfully. I'm definitely not going to say all the critique, but a good deal of it, and critical feedback is useful and necessary....

Could you be a bit more specific with the part about critque?
And I'm not talking about the obvious parts, like insulting or offending developers, which is just BS-behaviour.

But where ends for you the "useful and necessary" critical feedback, and where starts the "nagging because of personal preferences"?
I mean, if certain mechanics of Ck 2 are not included year/s after release or if some bugs are not fixed after months (and one also gets no feedback in the Bug Report-section); I guess the people just leave the forum or bring their topic forth again and again, in the hope of someone adressing their issue.
So can you please communicate the line between "Thanks for reminding us about the old issue, we're working on it." and "Stop posting about that old issue, we won't/can't work on it because..." ?

 

[kawamuratc]

Yeah, it’s probably NDAs that make devs not want to come by.

Not the whole “being a jerk” thing and calling CK3 a gutted out CK2 and explaining why devs have “earned” disgust and how when customers act bad they’re the real victims.

Its the NDAs and the 500 strong legal team PDS Black has.

 

[TheRevanchist25]

Yeah, it’s probably NDAs that make devs not want to come by.

Not the whole “being a jerk” thing and calling CK3 a gutted out CK2 and explaining why devs have “earned” disgust and how when customers act bad they’re the real victims.

Its the NDAs and the 500 strong legal team PDS Black has.

If that's how you decided to interpret a nuanced point about equitable accountability, then good for you sir.

 

[kawamuratc]

Accountability is a two way street sir. One day I hope you understand that.

Accountability isn’t responding to a heartfelt, somewhat vulnerable post from a dev who is off the clock expressing their feelings with a rant about your disgust and how you feel disrespected by their attempts to request you treat them decently.

By the way? When someone says they feel “disrespected” by a person asking to be treated with a base line of respect, that’s one of my personal biggest red flags for “this person is acting abusively”.

If you don’t feel you’re getting the “respect” you supposedly deserve, just leave and take you money with you. No one is forcing you to stay.