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Developer Diary | Historical Raj

Namaste, As-Salamu-Alaykum, Subh bakhair and Sat Sri Akal. Today we will look at the historical and shared military branches for the British Raj. I will use India and the Raj interchangeably to denote the subcontinent, and as always everything is under development and might change. Also a special thanks to @AveeBee who has provided invaluable help during the development of the Raj

Historical Context
In 1936 the Indian subcontinent was still under British rule and had been, in some form or other, for almost 2 centuries, either during the times of the East India Company, or directly by the crown.

In World War I the Raj fought as part of the British army against the Central Powers and afterwards the independence movement was rapidly picking up steam, no longer content to be ruled from London.

Demands by leaders such as Nehru, Gandhi and Jinnah were met in part by aloofness and part in indignation, while the population at large remained impoverished. At the outbreak of World War II India was once again called to fight in a country far away from home, amassing the biggest volunteer army in history of 2.5 million soldiers.

However this was not without controversy, as local leaders weren't consulted and even imprisoned. Some went as far as siding with the Axis, notably Subhas Chandra Bose to achieve independence, down the line helping the Japanese invade Burma and India itself, before being stopped at Imphal.

As World War II came to an end the British could no longer keep control over the Raj due to mounting pressure from abroad, as well as from within. In 1947 India and Pakistan gained independence by partitioning the subcontinent, with Bangladesh gaining independence in 1971.

Princely States
Princely States were historically local leaders of India that were a quasi-independent entity separated from direct British rule, but still under British control as a form of subsidiary alliance. As long as they supported the crown they could rule over their states.

In Hearts of Iron IV this is represented as high-compliance, non-core territory at the start of the game. Meaning that the Raj will now start with uncored territories, with ways to core it later.

We toyed with having the princes as puppets right from the start, but it leads to some funky interactions with subjects having subjects, and I don't think that everyone would like to be forced into having puppets as part of the main branch. However the princes can appear on the map at a later date.

The princes represented are: Mysore, Madras States, Kolhapur and Deccan States, Hyderabad, Central States, Rajputana, Western Indian States, Sindh, Balochistan, North-Western Frontier Provinces, Kashmir, Sikkim and Manipur. With Khalistan being releasable as well.
PIC2.png

The Raj also controls a bit of Aden, as they did historically before handing it over to the British.
PIC3.png

In the historical path you will have special ways to deal with the princes via the two special garrison laws
PIC4.png

PIC5.png


Burma
Burma was officially transferred from the Raj to British control in 1937, but effectively it began with the 1935 Burma Act. In game this results in Burma being a colony of the UK instead of being occupied by the Raj.

That 1935 act notwithstanding, Burma is ethnically and culturally a bit different from the rest of India, so we believe that it makes sense to have them as a separate country. It also has mechanical implications which results in a Raj player not being able to, as easily, fortify the Siamese/Japanese front, thus having both countries having to rely more on their natural defenses instead.

Independence Branch
The independence branch is also the historical branch, where you try to build an independence movement to eventually break away from the British.

While there are positive elements of British rule they serve as an antagonistic force, as being attached to their yoke depresses your growth somewhat. A key tenet of the independence branch from the start was that the player unlocks India's latent industrial capabilities as they gain more independence. So as you grow the movement you also gain more industrial capabilities.

This takes another approach compared to the old focus tree where you would use the Increase autonomy focus to break free. I went under the assumption that most players do not like being a subject in general since it reduces player agency, and that you would most of the time default to breaking free, come Hell or high water. In this new tree it becomes more about in which order you build your independence movement and what industrial capabilities you gain with less need for using continuous focuses.
PIC6.png

As you build up your independence movement you will also get the side effect of spillover resistance. It is not easy controlling such a large group of people with different views and interests, and violence can spill over.

PIC7.png

Here are some more concrete examples of how focuses can add to the players road to independence

Two Nation theory or India United
Before becoming independent you will have to choose between keeping India united, which means that you will not have to partition India into Pakistan or Bangladesh. While initially strong, keeping a united India means you will have to appease the religious minorities, leading to a moderate long term suppression of compliance, meaning it will be a bit harder to core states later on.
PIC8.png

The two nation theory, which is the historical outcome, leads to the partition of the Raj into India and Pakistan. Some princely states will also rise up and become independent.
PIC9.jpg

Here you can either pressure them to join you, or attack them directly if you so desire. You can pressure individual states, which means you now can get something like the Kashmir split. If there's no decisive victor between Pakistan and India in regards to pressure versus a princely state they will remain independent.

Should you decide to start hostilities with Pakistan make sure to finish quickly, or your old overlords can step in.

While you lose land in this path, you can become a Hegemon of the subcontinent, gaining you a big bonus if you gain a large advantage over your Pakistani rival, either via tech or industrial output.
PIC10.png


After Independence
Historically, the AI will not go for independence until after '47, but the player certainly can. Doing so will unlock the last bit of industrial focus. Here you can either decide to continue as a free nation with the allies, or remain neutral, trying to act in your own self interest by sending volunteers across the world.
PIC11.png

Here you will finally be able to core all territories that previously were controlled by the princes via the India Indivisible focus. This part of the focus also is meant to supercharge India's industry, moving from a suppressed nation economically to being able to play catch up with other industrialized nations.
PIC12.png


Army Shared Branches
Let’s look at some of the shared army branches now. These are generally available for all paths.
Beginning here you get to choose how to model your doctrine, either leaning into the UK and their doctrine, or modelling after one of the other big majors, gaining unique themed bonuses.
PIC13.png

The Raj's extensive railway network also has its own sub-branch, where the more focuses you complete the faster you can build things like supply hubs, railways and infrastructure.
PIC14.png

More to the right features the different Ordinance factories for the Raj, which not only adds extra factories, but each Ordinance factory unlocks extra traits for the MIO as well. When you get to the end of the path you'll get an upgraded MIO policy as a reward.
PIC15.png

Additionally there is an assortment of military focuses that deal with improving the general technology of the Raj. Particularly the Raj will have focuses that make their forces more adept in mountainous terrain, both for tanks, artillery and infantry.
PIC16.png

Agrarian society is still here, same as before with some additional maluses. There are a few ways to deal with it now
PIC17.png

When you first complete Local recruitment offices the malus will start to gradually ebb away. This can be shortened eventually by completing additional focuses.
Pic18.png

If you are in a hurry though you can complete additional focuses to instantly reduce the negative effects
PIC19.png

In the end you can unlock a decision to fully remove the Agrarian Society against a large cost of political power.
PIC20.png


The Bengal Famine
PIC21.png


The Bengal Famine was a devastating event where food became unavailable for a large majority of people due to several external shocks to a fragile food system. This now happens under certain conditions. When Burma loses a state and is in a faction with the Raj, when the Raj loses a state that it controls at game start, or after a certain date in history.

It will start in a certain state, after a series of escalating events. They are now both a state modifier and a country modifier. The country modifier scales how bad it is depending on how many state modifiers there are. For example in this scenario the famine started in Bengal and has spread out of control to three adjacent states.
PIC22.png

In addition to causing havoc in the state it also causes chaos on a country level
PIC23.png

As a result I have deployed several emergency measures to try and prevent the spread, such as asking for international aid, shutting down black markets and deploying emergency healthcare.

I should have also prepared better. Some focuses in the trees will also reduce the risk of the famine spreading.
PIc24.png

The preventative measures act as a "shield", both preventing the spread of famine and also reducing the time it takes for the famine to abate.
PIC25.png

I will leave it here, but if you have any questions about a specific focus or feature, feel free to ask!

 
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have the raj's resources been updated? since when playing in the area this dlc encompasses you easily run out of certain resources as you build up your industry.
something which is especially bothersome when playing against the allies.
 
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Namaste, As-Salamu-Alaykum, Subh bakhair and Sat Sri Akal. Today we will look at the historical and shared military branches for the British Raj. I will use India and the Raj interchangeably to denote the subcontinent, and as always everything is under development and might change. Also a special thanks to avebee and pdx_lily which has provided invaluable help during the development of the Raj

Historical Context
In 1936 the Indian subcontinent was still under British rule and had been, in some form or other, for almost 2 centuries, either during the times of the East India Company, or directly by the crown.

In World War I the Raj fought as part of the British army against the Central Powers and afterwards the independence movement was rapidly picking up steam, no longer content to be ruled from London.

Demands by leaders such as Nehru, Gandhi and Jinnah were met in part by aloofness and part in indignation, while the population at large remained impoverished. At the outbreak of World War II India was once again called to fight in a country far away from home, amassing the biggest volunteer army in history of 2.5 million soldiers.

However this was not without controversy, as local leaders weren't consulted and even imprisoned. Some went as far as siding with the Axis, notably Subhas Chandra Bose to achieve independence, down the line helping the Japanese invade Burma and India itself, before being stopped at Imphal.

As World War II came to an end the British could no longer keep control over the Raj due to mounting pressure from abroad, as well as from within. In 1947 India and Pakistan gained independence by partitioning the subcontinent, with Bangladesh gaining independence in 1971.

Princely States
Princely States were historically local leaders of India that were a quasi-independent entity separated from direct British rule, but still under British control as a form of subsidiary alliance. As long as they supported the crown they could rule over their states.

In Hearts of Iron IV this is represented as high-compliance, non-core territory at the start of the game. Meaning that the Raj will now start with uncored territories, with ways to core it later.

We toyed with having the princes as puppets right from the start, but it leads to some funky interactions with subjects having subjects, and I don't think that everyone would like to be forced into having puppets as part of the main branch. However the princes can appear on the map at a later date.

The princes represented are: Mysore, Madras States, Kolhapur and Deccan States, Hyderabad, Central States, Rajputana, Western Indian States, Sindh, Balochistan, North-Western Frontier Provinces, Kashmir, Sikkim and Manipur. With Khalistan being releasable as well.

The Raj also controls a bit of Aden, as they did historically before handing it over to the British.

In the historical path you will have special ways to deal with the princes via the two special garrison laws
Burma was officially transferred from the Raj to British control in 1937, but effectively it began with the 1935 Burma Act. In game this results in Burma being a colony of the UK instead of being occupied by the Raj.

That 1935 act notwithstanding, Burma is ethnically and culturally a bit different from the rest of India, so we believe that it makes sense to have them as a separate country. It also has mechanical implications which results in a Raj player not being able to, as easily, fortify the Siamese/Japanese front, thus having both countries having to rely more on their natural defenses instead.

Independence Branch
The independence branch is also the historical branch, where you try to build an independence movement to eventually break away from the British.

While there are positive elements of British rule they serve as an antagonistic force, as being attached to their yoke depresses your growth somewhat. A key tenet of the independence branch from the start was that the player unlocks India's latent industrial capabilities as they gain more independence. So as you grow the movement you also gain more industrial capabilities.

This takes another approach compared to the old focus tree where you would use the Increase autonomy focus to break free. I went under the assumption that most players do not like being a subject in general since it reduces player agency, and that you would most of the time default to breaking free, come Hell or high water. In this new tree it becomes more about in which order you build your independence movement and what industrial capabilities you gain with less need for using continuous focuses.

As you build up your independence movement you will also get the side effect of spillover resistance. It is not easy controlling such a large group of people with different views and interests, and violence can spill over.


Here are some more concrete examples of how focuses can add to the players road to independence

Two Nation theory or India United
Before becoming independent you will have to choose between keeping India united, which means that you will not have to partition India into Pakistan or Bangladesh. While initially strong, keeping a united India means you will have to appease the religious minorities, leading to a moderate long term suppression of compliance, meaning it will be a bit harder to core states later on.

The two nation theory, which is the historical outcome, leads to the partition of the Raj into India and Pakistan. Some princely states will also rise up and become independent.

Here you can either pressure them to join you, or attack them directly if you so desire. You can pressure individual states, which means you now can get something like the Kashmir split. If there's no decisive victor between Pakistan and India in regards to pressure versus a princely state they will remain independent.

Should you decide to start hostilities with Pakistan make sure to finish quickly, or your old overlords can step in.

While you lose land in this path, you can become a Hegemon of the subcontinent, gaining you a big bonus if you gain a large advantage over your Pakistani rival, either via tech or industrial output.
View attachment 1251748

After Independence
Historically, the AI will not go for independence until after '47, but the player certainly can. Doing so will unlock the last bit of industrial focus. Here you can either decide to continue as a free nation with the allies, or remain neutral, trying to act in your own self interest by sending volunteers across the world.

Here you will finally be able to core all territories that previously were controlled by the princes via the India Indivisible focus. This part of the focus also is meant to supercharge India's industry, moving from a suppressed nation economically to being able to play catch up with other industrialized nations.
View attachment 1251750

Army Shared Branches
Let’s look at some of the shared army branches now. These are generally available for all paths.
Beginning here you get to choose how to model your doctrine, either leaning into the UK and their doctrine, or modelling after one of the other big majors, gaining unique themed bonuses.

The Raj's extensive railway network also has its own sub-branch, where the more focuses you complete the faster you can build things like supply hubs, railways and infrastructure.

More to the right features the different Ordinance factories for the Raj, which not only adds extra factories, but each Ordinance factory unlocks extra traits for the MIO as well. When you get to the end of the path you'll get an upgraded MIO policy as a reward.

Additionally there is an assortment of military focuses that deal with improving the general technology of the Raj. Particularly the Raj will have focuses that make their forces more adept in mountainous terrain, both for tanks, artillery and infantry.

Agrarian society is still here, same as before with some additional maluses. There are a few ways to deal with it now

When you first complete Local recruitment offices the malus will start to gradually ebb away. This can be shortened eventually by completing additional focuses.

If you are in a hurry though you can complete additional focuses to instantly reduce the negative effects

In the end you can unlock a decision to fully remove the Agrarian Society against a large cost of political power.


The Bengal Famine was a devastating event where food became unavailable for a large majority of people due to several external shocks to a fragile food system. This now happens under certain conditions. When Burma loses a state and is in a faction with the Raj, when the Raj loses a state that it controls at game start, or after a certain date in history.

It will start in a certain state, after a series of escalating events. They are now both a state modifier and a country modifier. The country modifier scales how bad it is depending on how many state modifiers there are. For example in this scenario the famine started in Bengal and has spread out of control to three adjacent states.

In addition to causing havoc in the state it also causes chaos on a country level

As a result I have deployed several emergency measures to try and prevent the spread, such as asking for international aid, shutting down black markets and deploying emergency healthcare.

I should have also prepared better. Some focuses in the trees will also reduce the risk of the famine spreading.

The preventative measures act as a "shield", both preventing the spread of famine and also reducing the time it takes for the famine to abate.

I will leave it here, but if you have any questions about a specific focus or feature, feel free to ask!

My only question about the dlc is about whether there is a set time for civil war that the Indian national army rises up against the British raj? Similar to the Spanish civil war or other civil wars that time out and erupt into war
 
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Is there any reason for the princely states chosen? "Mysore, Madras States, Kolhapur and Deccan States, Hyderabad, Central States, Rajputana, Western Indian States, Sindh, Balochistan, North-Western Frontier Provinces, Kashmir, Sikkim and Manipur"

1. Madras States: What are these states supposed to be? Madras itself is the state consisting of the modern states of Tamil Nadu and Andhra Pradesh. It was just called Madras if this is why "States" is there in the name.

2. Kolhapur and Manipur seem a little irrelevant to add unless there's something special planned for them. Would rather have Ahom, Bengal and Oudh instead. Especially Bengal.

3. Hyderabad is the big Deccan State, what are the Deccan States supposed to be? The Marathas?

4. Why is it called Rajputana vs Rajasthan?

5. Western Indian States is currently only the modern state of Gujarat but there was a state called "Saurashtra" that included the modern state of Gujarat and large parts of another state called Maharashtra

6. North-Western Frontier Provinces isn't really a thing as far as I know, could be wrong but there are several other options to chose from for a name. This area for instance had the Sikh Empire, and was in modern times referred to as the region of Punjab. The people living here (Punjabis) are also spread around India and Pakistan in modern times.

7. There's a tiny state with "Kochin" as the capital. If this is supposed to be Travancore, it should cover more of the modern state of Kerala and the capital should be "Cochin" not "Kochin"

8. Little side complaint but the state of Kashmir looks terrible, not that big of a deal but please fix it if possible.

Also concerned about the famines after losing a state, hopefully there's a min amount of time this land needs to be held by a foreign power. Like a month or so. Otherwise it just becomes an exploit.
 
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If 0.12% of human resources are replenished per month, the lifespan of a citizen in Hoi4 is 69.4 years. This is not affected by troop losses.
In other words, the soldiers lost in Hoi4 return home, have children, and receive pensions (consumer goods) until age 69.4.
Based on this mechanism, although human resources may decrease during famine, the population should not decrease.
 
I have a problem with the occupation methods in the game in general, doesn't it always make sense to have it set to civilian oversight so you get the compliance gain over time? Even if it doesn't, it seems very binary because you have positive with that and negative compliance gain with literally everything else. Removes a lot of flavor from the game. Like with communists, it would make sense to have the liberated workers one have even positive gain if the country had a lot of support for communism, or was a colonial subject.
 
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Could "Agrarian Society" please give bonuses to mountaineers/special forces? Indian troops historically were drawn from the warrior castes, and tended to be of higher quality. They also tended to be excellent hill fighters.

I can understand not getting Marine/airborne bonuses, but Britain's Indian troops should definitely be formidable in rough terrain.
 
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I also had a lot of similar feedback here. But just to add to some of the discussion here:

Is there any reason for the princely states chosen? "Mysore, Madras States, Kolhapur and Deccan States, Hyderabad, Central States, Rajputana, Western Indian States, Sindh, Balochistan, North-Western Frontier Provinces, Kashmir, Sikkim and Manipur"

I think the devs had mentioned (either here or on reddit) that there was a choice made to go with a mix of the big princely states and some smaller ones, which IMO is a subjective design choice and something I am totally ok with. There is no need for an objective criteria here I feel.

1. Madras States: What are these states supposed to be? Madras itself is the state consisting of the modern states of Tamil Nadu and Andhra Pradesh. It was just called Madras if this is why "States" is there in the name.

2. Kolhapur and Manipur seem a little irrelevant to add unless there's something special planned for them. Would rather have Ahom, Bengal and Oudh instead. Especially Bengal.

3. Hyderabad is the big Deccan State, what are the Deccan States supposed to be? The Marathas?

4. Why is it called Rajputana vs Rajasthan?

Re. questions 1, 3 and 4, these are probably references to the "Agencies" of the British Raj which managed princely states:


As re. question 2, Kolhapur was a prominent state (19 gun salute) but geographically nowhere as big since as it shown on the map. Manipur seems to be a subjective choice for a small state - if they had to pick one from the north east, I'd have gone with Tripura - but that's the devs choice I guess. Only gripe about Manipur is that it is not at the correct location on the map.

Ahom, Bengal, and Oudh were all provinces by 1936. Bengal had no major princely state left except Koch Behar.


6. North-Western Frontier Provinces isn't really a thing as far as I know, could be wrong but there are several other options to chose from for a name. This area for instance had the Sikh Empire, and was in modern times referred to as the region of Punjab. The people living here (Punjabis) are also spread around India and Pakistan in modern times.

NWFP was definitely a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North-West_Frontier_Province

7. There's a tiny state with "Kochin" as the capital. If this is supposed to be Travancore, it should cover more of the modern state of Kerala and the capital should be "Cochin" not "Kochin"

So the the northern part of Kerala (Malabar) was part of the Madras and directly administered by the British. There were no princely states left there in 1936 - Kolathunad and Calicut had been defeated and annexed long back (1790s/early 1800s). Travancore limits were only till Alapuzha in the north and Kanyakumari in the South. in My issues with this were the unnatural projection towards Madurai. It would make more sense for Trivandrum to be the capital - since Travancore was the bigger state and Trivandrum would go on to be the capital of both the Travancore-Cochin state that was formed after independence, and currently the Kerala state as well.

8. Little side complaint but the state of Kashmir looks terrible, not that big of a deal but please fix it if possible.

Also concerned about the famines after losing a state, hopefully there's a min amount of time this land needs to be held by a foreign power. Like a month or so. Otherwise it just becomes an exploit.

Agree with these.
 
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Can the trigger for India's famine be changed to no longer having a civilian economy? Because the collapse of fragile agriculture during the economic mobilization of the British Indian government sounds more reasonable, at least much more so than the Japanese or anyone else invading Myanmar causing famine in India.
 
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Can the trigger for India's famine be changed to no longer having a civilian economy? Because the collapse of fragile agriculture during the economic mobilization of the British Indian government sounds more reasonable, at least much more so than the Japanese or anyone else invading Myanmar causing famine in India.
 
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Could "Agrarian Society" please give bonuses to mountaineers/special forces? Indian troops historically were drawn from the warrior castes, and tended to be of higher quality. They also tended to be excellent hill fighters.

I can understand not getting Marine/airborne bonuses, but Britain's Indian troops should definitely be formidable in rough terrain.
The tree we have now gives bonuses to mountaineers and artillery on mountains. I imagine we will still get these in the new tree.
 
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I have a problem with the occupation methods in the game in general, doesn't it always make sense to have it set to civilian oversight so you get the compliance gain over time? Even if it doesn't, it seems very binary because you have positive with that and negative compliance gain with literally everything else. Removes a lot of flavor from the game. Like with communists, it would make sense to have the liberated workers one have even positive gain if the country had a lot of support for communism, or was a colonial subject.

Not always. I have sometimes adjusted them regionally to get more resources and factories. From my Israel run I know that the AI also tries to change the occupation laws if you use spies to ignite resistance. But as long as the Overlord is at peace, it's not worth it. Maybe not even if he's at war.
 
Even the famine triggers having ties to the current trade policy is more logical than tying the famine to the fall of Burma. Before the famine the government continued to export rice from Bengal to Ceylon, and actually increased exports. Having limited exports should prevent, delay or somewhat mitigate the effects of the famine.

The chief reasons for the famine were cyclone (the only factor not caused by the British), scorched earth policy of destroying foodstock and boats, increase of rice exports before and during the famine, prevention of distribution of food from other parts of India, meagre resource allocation to mitigate the famine.

The fall of Burma had little impact in food availability in Bengal. As I said before there is no evidence of food imports from Burma/Myanmar after independence, secondly if the population of Bengal and by extension India couldn't be met domestically, the population of Bengal and India naturally wouldn't grow to rival nations which had more intensive, mechanical farming.

Presenting the most tragic event of India during this time period and misrepresenting the causes of it, as if to absolve the colonial government of any blame is low. Especially since every other similar occurrence is treated as untouchable.
 
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Maybe I'm missing something here, but how does any of this interract with WW2?

How does one end up not having India partition and go independent in the middle of the war, and keep it historical instead?

EDIT:

Historically, the AI will not go for independence until after '47, but the player certainly can. Doing so will unlock the last bit of industrial focus. Here you can either decide to continue as a free nation with the allies, or remain neutral, trying to act in your own self interest by sending volunteers across the world.

Should have kept reading. Features like this really make me wish we eventually have something to continue the world and game into the 50s.
 
Will the Princely States, Bangladesh, Pakistan and Burma have some minimal content? Or at the least some unique portraits?
Jinnah, Cochrane, and Ne Win are there, and so is a few Princely States monarchs. Just set this thread to "Show only dev responses"

Haven't seen the Bangladeshi ones.
 
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