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Economy 2.0 Dev Diary #2

Welcome back to the second dev diary detailing the changes coming in the next patch. If you missed it, check out the first part here. Today we are covering a few important changes not directly related to the economy and we’ll go over what you can expect when loading up your existing cities.

Let’s start with Rent. Most likely you have run into complaints of “High Rent” in the game, so let’s talk about it. To complement the Land Value changes in patch 1.1.0f1 in March, we have tweaked how Rent works. First of all, we removed the virtual landlord so a building’s upkeep is now paid equally by all renters. Second, we changed the way rent is calculated. For those interested, the calculation looks like this:

Rent = (LandValue + (ZoneType * Building Level)) * LotSize * SpaceMultiplier

This of course affects the “High Rent” notifications you may have encountered, but we’ve tweaked those directly as well, so they are now based on the household’s income. That means that even if they currently don’t have enough money in their balance to pay rent, they won’t complain and will instead spend less money on resource consumption. Only when their income is too low to be able to pay rent will they complain about “High Rent” and look for cheaper housing or move out of the city.

Besides rent, households and companies need to pay for the building’s upkeep, which in turn affects the level of the building. When they pay the full upkeep fee, the building condition increases by a constant amount until the building levels up and the tenants start paying towards the next level. Similarly, if they cannot pay it, the building condition decreases by the same amount until it’s in such poor condition it collapses.

BUILDING UPGRADES UNLEASHED
From zoned buildings automatically leveling up to the City Service building upgrades you choose and place manually. While this update doesn’t directly relate to the Economy 2.0, it shares the same patch and deserves a little spotlight. Gone are the days when you had to bulldoze the entire building to remove, or just move, an upgrade. Now, all upgrades can be removed by selecting the building, finding the upgrade in the Selected Info Panel, and clicking the bin icon.

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Deactivate or delete Extensions or relocate Sub-buildings through the Selected Info Panel

For sub-buildings, there’s even more control. They can also be removed using the bulldozer, you can pick them up and move them, or turn them on and off as needed. Moving them is particularly handy now as they don’t have to be placed in connection to the main building. As long as they are within the predefined radius and have pedestrian and/or road access, they will work like before. Sub-buildings like the Elementary School Playground just need a pedestrian path connecting them to the rest of the city, while sub-buildings like the Bus Depot Extra Garage will need road access to function. We’re excited to see how you take advantage of this new freedom in your cities, so don’t hesitate to tag us on social media if you’re showing off screenshots.


EXISTING CITIES
Now you might wonder how all of this affects your existing cities, so let’s get the most obvious question out of the way first. Saves from before the economy rework still work, though we expect they will have a transition period as the simulation adapts to the changes. When it comes to modded saves, we can’t make any guarantees, but keep an eye out for updates or instructions from the modders. Mods that affect the simulation are likely to be affected by the update.

When you load up your city (and unpause) there are a few things you should keep in mind. With Government Subsidies removed and City Service upkeep increased, the cost of running your city just increased. If your city relies on ambulances, hearses, fire engines, police cars, and garbage trucks coming from Outside Connection, make sure to enable the Import City Services policy in the City Information panel, but don’t forget that your neighbors charge a fee to help you out. All this is expected to create a negative money trend, but depending on your city’s finances, your tax income might be enough to offset the new costs once the calculations catch up. If you’re struggling for money, don’t forget that you can increase taxes, reduce service budgets, or temporarily turn buildings off to save on their upkeep cost.

Demand adjusts quite quickly, so don’t be alarmed if some of your demand bars empty or fill up when you start playing. With the increase in industrial manufacturing space, your industry will be on a hiring spree that’s likely to drive up your residential demand - unless your city has workers already looking for a job. We recommend giving it some time though as companies (commercial, industrial, and office) readjust their production and employee numbers to be profitable, which we expect will overall lead to an increase in unemployment in your city.

With the new calculations for residential density demand, your citizens may also start looking for different types of housing or move around the city. Thankfully, the new calculations for rent and resource consumption should help them afford the type of housing they prefer, and we expect most (if not all) of your “High Rent” notifications will disappear after letting the simulation run for a while. If you keep seeing these or they start to come back, then make sure to check your unemployment and provide citizens with jobs so that they can pay their rent.

With time and some tweaks, your existing cities should adjust to the changes, so you can get back to realizing their full potential. And as always, don’t hesitate to ask for help if you encounter any situations you’re unsure of how to handle and report any bugs you might run into here.


WHAT’S NEXT?
Before we finish for today, we’d like to share our plans going forward. We will of course follow discussions and read feedback you share as you play with these changes. We’ve done extensive testing to get the changes as balanced as possible, but we know that some tweaking will likely still be necessary once you all start sharing your experiences.

We’ve already started work on the next major patch which we hope to have ready for you in Q3, and we want to give you a little sneak peek at what you can expect. As previously mentioned, we want to expand the service import to bring you more control. We’re also looking at what we can improve in the UI and how the game relays information to you, so you have everything you need to solve issues in the game. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this topic. Are there any issues you’ve struggled to solve in your city? Any information you have been looking for but weren’t able to find?

Last, but definitely not least, the art team has been cooking up some new free buildings for you all. We appreciate each and every one of you for sticking with us and giving us a chance to make Cities: Skylines II what it can and should be. Your patience and support mean the world to us and we hope the new service buildings and vehicles can serve as a token of our appreciation. Thank you for being a part of our community!

NewStuff.png

A sneak peek at some of the new service buildings and vehicles you can look forward to
 
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100% this. At this point it's just heavily disappointing and playful with the community's trustworthiness on how reliable their words are for the player base. Best advice at this point is to just not announce any deadlines, because obviously this studio finds making deadlines very optimistic and hardly at all realistic.
Some people can't read apparently. They only gave an indication, it was never a deadline.
 
Good. If they're not too stupid they will understand that unexpected things can happen and they will understand you did your best to meet that date.
The indication is not a deadline. A deadline is. But they never called it a deadline. That's what someones interpretation was.

So what would I do if I communicated a date and knew people were taking that as a hard deadline? Communicate of course. Managing expectations. Not close to midnight and not (only) on a platform like X, but first and foremost on my own forums and discord.
 
Good. If they're not too stupid they will understand that unexpected things can happen and they will understand you did your best to meet that date.
The indication is not a deadline. A deadline is. But they never called it a deadline.
If I tell my customers or my boss "I aim to deliver between June 3rd and June 19th", then on May 23rd I say "It's almost ready- just doing some polishing" and then on June 18th I say "tomorrow will be the day", I'm pretty sure they will call June 19th the deadline, no matter how you call it.
Let's agree to disagree.
 
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There is nothing to disagree, you seem to miss the point that what they communicated wasn’t a deadline. It was a target date they worked towards and they almost made it but something unexpected happened. I’m sure it’s almost here but something outside their control messed their plans up. Let’s see what they will say about it, presumably later today.
 
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There is nothing to disagree, you seem to miss the point that what they communicated wasn’t a deadline. It was a target date they worked towards and they almost made it but something unexpected happened. I’m sure it’s almost here but something outside their control messed their plans up. Let’s see what they will say about it, presumably later today.
Firstly, if you are announcing a certain timeframe for something to be delivered, any normal person will understand the last day of said timeline as the deadline.

Secondly, the first date of said timeline is important in our case as well. This is the date at which they hoped to be able to deliver the patch in the best case. Which in turn means development of that patch had to be finished some days prior as there is supposed to be a QA sequence.

Thirdly, by the pure fact that the patch was NOT delivered on June 3rd, we already know that issues have come up BEFORE June 3rd. But they didn't say anything about it but let the original timeframe stand as it was.

In total: once again they have unforcedly raised and fueled expectations and when learning that they couldn't fulfill those expectations, they decided to go silent about that fact.
 
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Really getting my optimistic ass worried. The summer vacations most likely start today in CO since tomorrow is a very common holiday in Finland. They are either going to publish right before leaving for holidays or they dropped the ball and we're going to have to wait for the patch who knows how long. Both are worrying scenarios.
 
Firstly, if you are announcing a certain timeframe for something to be delivered, any normal person will understand the last day of said timeline as the deadline.

Secondly, the first date of said timeline is important in our case as well. This is the date at which they hoped to be able to deliver the patch in the best case. Which in turn means development of that patch had to be finished some days prior as there is supposed to be a QA sequence.

Thirdly, by the pure fact that the patch was NOT delivered on June 3rd, we already know that issues have come up BEFORE June 3rd. But they didn't say anything about it but let the original timeframe stand as it was.

In total: once again they have unforcedly raised and fueled expectations and when learning that they couldn't fulfill those expectations, they decided to go silent about that fact.
They gave a timeframe, right? And that expired last night. They should’ve communicated better yesterday. Not sure why you think June 3rd is such an important date.

If you have any experience with software development you would understand that you can’t give a hard prediction how long something will take. It will be a timeframe. If everything goes to plan Feature A might take 2 days, worst case 5 days.
So their plan to deliver yesterday was within that timeframe.

What did you want them to do? Did you want them to post here every day what they did and why didn’t release that day?
Which means developers had to give up their valuable time for stupid meetings everyday explaining their status.
 
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Also one more thing to add. What I think happened last night is they were ready to go but something outside their control turned out to be a blocker.

I think the update is ready, and without that issue it would’ve been in our hands.
 
They gave a timeframe, right? And that expired last night. They should’ve communicated better yesterday. Not sure why you think June 3rd is such an important date.

If you have any experience with software development you would understand that you can’t give a hard prediction how long something will take. It will be a timeframe. If everything goes to plan Feature A might take 2 days, worst case 5 days.
So their plan to deliver yesterday was within that timeframe.

What did you want them to do? Did you want them to post here every day what they did and why didn’t release that day?
Which means developers had to give up their valuable time for stupid meetings everyday explaining their status.
June 3rd was such an important date as by then the patch should have been ready according to their own hopes. Actually, it should have been ready some days before that to give time for QA.
Again, as they DID NOT release the patch on June 3rd, something has gone wrong by then already. That has been more than a fortnight ago. So even at June 3rd, the patch was in a dire state already.
And we shouldn't forget that said timeframe was already a postponement of what they announced earlier.

And yes, YESTERDAY was still within their timeframe. What did happen though? Nothing.
Regarding my experiences with software development - are 25 years enough?
I can tell you that a track record like CO's one would have let to firing most of their staff meanwhile.
Just to list some points from the top of my head:
a) they have been late by three years at release day
b) they weren't able to deliver anything even remotely satisfying
c) starting with this year, they drastically reduced the sequence of patches coming out
d) however, the quality of delivery so far has been underwhelming, to put it politely. Patches breaking functionality, DLC which had to be retracted.
e) they have managed to miss almost any date they once announced in this year.
Patch? Late, although already postponed.
Asset imports? Late.
Consoles? Late.
f) and to have some icing on the cake, as soon as problems arise they are going radio silent only to show up some weeks later again promising to improve.

And the one whose experience in software development is questionable is you, if you expect the developers (aka the programmers) to have to communicate with the public. That's the job of the socalled community manager. Where is she?

Crickets...

Edit: I misread your last sentence. For that I apologize, but it doesn't make things any better.
If your company is in a state like CO is at the moment, if your software product is of such a poor quality, and if your patch is not in a state to be released then status updates (internally) are vital, are of the utmost importance. And then you have to notify your customer(s) and play with open cards.
Or you might go out of business sooner or later.
It is as simple as that.
 
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Also one more thing to add. What I think happened last night is they were ready to go but something outside their control turned out to be a blocker.

I think the update is ready, and without that issue it would’ve been in our hands.

I think that too - Steam DB shows basically no movement when it comes down to the branches besides the usual automatic daily deployment on the Development and Staging branch (10h ago. so middle of the night for CO). --> no movement = still some code freeze.

It would not be the first time that MS Store is the culprit. As the 19th was public holidays in the US the patch may be delayed by not being yet approved by MS which would mean everything is ready and waiting for approval. On Steam they can just deploy with the press of a button.

This ofc is just a guess - it could also be that they have some trouble with the deployment process. Maybe some automated test fails and they first have to look into this, who knows, but as the 19th was a public holiday overseas it somewhat fits.
 
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Also one more thing to add. What I think happened last night is they were ready to go but something outside their control turned out to be a blocker.

I think the update is ready, and without that issue it would’ve been in our hands.
I think that too - Steam DB shows basically no movement when it comes down to the branches besides the usual automatic daily deployment on the Development and Staging branch (10h ago. so middle of the night for CO). --> no movement = still some code freeze.

It would not be the first time that MS Store is the culprit. As the 19th was public holidays in the US the patch may be delayed by not being yet approved by MS which would mean everything is ready and waiting for approval. On Steam they can just deploy with the press of a button.

This ofc is just a guess - it could also be that they have some trouble with the deployment process. Maybe some automated test fails and they first have to look into this, who knows, but as the 19th was a public holiday overseas it somewhat fits.

That's why communication is important. I would assume a "Community Manager" could spend 5 to 10 minutes to draft a simple message to end speculation.
 
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I can tell you that a track record like CO's one would have let to firing most of their staff meanwhile.
Just to list some points from the top of my head:
a) they have been late by three years at release day
b) they weren't able to deliver anything even remotely satisfying
c) starting with this year, they drastically reduced the sequence of patches coming out
d) however, the quality of delivery so far has been underwhelming, to put it politely. Patches breaking functionality, DLC which had to be retracted.
e) they have managed to miss almost any date they once announced in this year.
Patch? Late, although already postponed.
Asset imports? Late.
Consoles? Late.
f) and to have some icing on the cake, as soon as problems arise they are going radio silent only to show up some weeks later again promising to improve.

Couldn't agree more.
 
it was a range. it’s really not that hard to understand.

So they estimated it could take let’s say 3 weeks or 5 weeks to develop the patch and they said, well, we might deliver 3 June at the earliest and 19 June at the latest, if things go well.

It didn’t take them 3 weeks. I couldn’t care less why. Not my business because they said we will deliver in that two week timeframe. It took them the full 5 weeks. Well, grand, the package is ready and now it’s waiting to be pushed.

No idea what the reason for the delay is but just to assume that things were already going wrong the 3rd is a bit of a stretch. But if that’s what you like to believe, do it.

The only thing they really need to fix is their communications. They fail that time and time again.

Just posting a short message on their discord and twitter late at the night of the aimed release date is quite missing the opportunity imho.
 
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