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EU4 - Development Diary - 16th of January 2018

Hello everyone!


I am Trin Tragula and this is the first development diary for Update 1.25 - REDACTED. Some of you may know me from previous diaries that have dealt with research, the historical setup and most of all map changes to various regions. This time is no different, I am here to tell you about a region that has received more work in the, as of yet unnamed, update that we are currently working on.


The region around the English channel has been revised before, both in Update 1.12 (Low countries) and 1.16 (France and the British Isles). Still there were some issues with it and detail is lacking a bit when compared to some more recently revised regions like Scandinavia or Hungary (also originally revised in the same update but later updated). For 1.25 it was therefore time to once again focus on overhauling this part of Europe.

As we plan to do in all future regional updates we have also added new texts to the startup screen for interesting countries that lack them in the overhauled region.


Ireland

Ireland.png



While Ireland has long been an English subject on paper the actual authority of the crown was in many ways a legal fiction in 1444. In practice direct English rule has collapsed and does not extend beyond the small piece of land known as the “The Pale” around Dublin.

While the particulars vary the Anglo-Norman earls, peers under the English kings, are in practice independent by most definitions of the word and have become as Irish as the population the govern.

Receding English influence has also allowed many of the older Gaelic clans to thrive and the island is home to several strong Irish kingdoms.

With the English Kings preoccupied with the Hundred Years war in France and internal squabbles over even their own succession the Irish independence seems destined to last. Should England manage to stabilize and be able to focus on the Emerald Isle once again however they risk losing this freedom quickly. Even so Ireland would likely be an unruly region to control.


In the 1.25 update we hope to better show how the various minor states in Ireland thrived as English rule grew weaker and weaker. We hope the new setup will better show how diverse the Island was and offer the player to lead one of the many clans or earldoms of Ireland to perhaps put up a stronger resistance to the English threat or fail and at best hope to rule as an English vassal.

All Irish tags (new and old) will be given individual national ideas, and the old group set will be repurposed (and partly rewritten) to be a reward for uniting the Island.


Playable Tags in Ireland:

  • Munster (New) - Independent Irish Kingdom
    • This tag represents the MacCarthy Mor, leader of the MacCarthys and the hereditary Gaelic Kings of Desmond. Named Munster to avoid confusion with the Earls of Desmond.
  • Ormond (New) - Independent Irish Earldom
    • In 1444 this tag represents the Butler family, the earls of Ormond.
  • Offaly (New) - Independent Irish Kingdom
    • Central Ireland was divided between many minor clans in 1444, most of them Gaelic. When it later fell to English conquest this is one of the primary regions subject to English settlement. In 1444 in EU4 this province is ruled by the Faly O’Connors, but they were really just one of many minor clans in this region.
  • Tyrconnell (New) - Independent Kingdom
    • The O’Donnel kings of Tyrconnell are another native dynasty to Ireland with roots going hundreds of years back.
  • Leinster (Old) - Independent Kingdom
    • In 1444 the Kingdom of Leinster is ruled by the Kavanagh dynasty since the 12th century (the kingdom itself dating many hundred years further back). While close to the Pale Leinster has a history of strong opposition to the English crown and has often been a force beyond its size in Ireland.
  • Clanricarde (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • Another Anglo-Norman dynasty the Burke family rules their part of Ireland in the name of the English king. In practice however they are just as independent as their neighbors and are.
  • Kildare (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • Much like other parts of Ireland the FitzGerald Earls of Kildare are for practical purposes rulers of their own lands but their close proximity to the Pale means they have a closer relationship with the crown and they have often worked more closely with the king.
  • Thomond (Old) - Independent Kingdom
    • The Kingdom of Thomond remains one of the most independent Gaelic kingdoms on Ireland in 1444. Far from the direct reach of the English crown their problems are more related to their immediate neighbors than a distant king.
  • Sligo (Old) - Independent Kingdom
    • In 1444 Sligo is ruled by the Sligo O’Connors. Much like the Faly O’Connors their hold over the region was not as absolute as we show it in the game.
  • Desmond (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • The Earldom of Desmond (not to be confused with the Kingdom of Desmond, a tag we call Munster) rules the richer parts of south-eastern Ireland. Their ties with the crown are not as close as those of their kinsmen in Kildare.
  • Tyrone (Old) - Independent Kingdom
  • The dominant Gaelic kingdom in the north Tyrone is ruled by the ancient O' Niell dynasty. Tyrone was for a long time the most dominant state in the north.
  • Ulster (Old) - Independent State
  • In 1444 this province was home to a larger number of clans, many with close ties to their Scottish counterpart. In EU4 it is ruled by the Maggenis dynasty.

Scotland

Scotland.png


In 1444 Scotland remains a strong regional kingdom, supported by the King’s of France in the south. While the Clans remain influential in Scottish politics, and would likely assert their independence if they felt it threatened, the Kingdom is unified in a way the Irish lords could only dream of. During their time on the throne the Stuarts have strengthened their rule and their defences against the English to the south, while hungrily biding their time to reclaim the last remains of Norse rule in the form of the Norwegian Jarldom of Orkney in the north.

Scotland has not received any new playable country tags in the 1.25 update but the region has been broken up into more provinces to give the Scottish kingdom a bit more depth and staying power. In the South two provinces have been carved out to show that the Anglo-Scottish border is in fact not flat and hard to defend. The addition of the West and East March provinces instead allows Scotland to fight an invader before they reach the farmlands around the capital
The Highlands have also been broken up, ensuring that a resurgent Highlander kingdom will be stronger and stand a better chance of surviving.


England & Wales

England.png


While England was updated once before after release we felt that it was simply not up to date with regions like Denmark or Germany, and that it was too easy to overrun the island of Great Britain for a naval invader. England is arguably one of the historical winners of this period and while England never saw much in the way of foreign invasion it was the scene of two great civil wars.

In update 1.25 England and Wales have been given a thorough rework with many provinces carved out of the existing ones or redrawn to better reflect both the political and economic realities of the time. The Isle of Man has also been made its own province, a naval base in the Irish sea for whoever manages to get control of it.


Added Tags:
  • Mann - Revolter in the Isle of Man province.
    • In 1444 the Isle of Man is an English possession but it was once a kingdom of its own with roots in the now defunct Kingdom of the Isles.


France & Burgundy

France.png


Another “winner” in our timeline was France. The great kingdom that dominated European politics for centuries before imploding to internal unrest and rising reborn as the Revolutionary Empire of Napoleon, ready to reshape the politics of the continent completely.

In 1444 France is the scene of the Hundred Years war, a long conflict over who would rule the populous lands of the Kingdom. The recently concluded treaty of Tours has seemingly restored peace to the region but its stipulations have yet to be carried out in their entirety as England seem reluctant to surrender Maine to the French king.

The 1.25 update have not brought any new countries into being in France but we have revised the French map, especially in the north.

Normandy and the region around Paris are now more detailed, allowing for a less one-sided early campaign between England and France once conflict flares up again. We have also taken the opportunity to shift some of the French development towards the more populated north to better represent the historical economy of the region.

The huge province of Bourgogne has also been broken up to represent the Burgundian border castles such as Semur, with their capital in Dijon receiving an Inland Centre of Trade.


The Low Countries

Low Countries.png


In 1444 the Low Countries are already one of the greatest economic centers of the European continent. Politically many of the states are dominated by the Dukes of Burgundy but under their rule they enjoy considerable autonomy and in time the northern parts would historically form the United Provinces of the Netherlands, an iconic power in the Europa Universalis timeline and a great mercantile and colonial power.

We have felt that when this region was last revisited it was perhaps done so a bit conservatively and this time we have been less concerned with keeping the status quo.

The province of Holland has been broken in two, as has Gelre and Friesland. The Province of Limburg (forever plagued by trying to accomodate the fact that the majority of the county of Limburg would become separated from the city itself in this timeline) has been removed entirely in favor of a separate province for Upper Guelders. The borders have also been redrawn to hopefully better reflect the many border changes in this region during this period in history.

While the development of the Low Countries region was always high (indeed even in 1.24 it is higher than all of England) it has been increased slightly again to better reflect the economic power of these cities. Utrecht, Friesland, Gelre and Holland have all grown by one province each while Brabant, though it remains a powerful force in the region, has lost both a province and a sizable amount of development.



That was all for today! From Ireland to Burgundy we hope that this overhaul will make for a better experience and that it will also make for a more accurate representation of this central region to the developments of the 1444-1820 period.

Next week’s developer diary will be written by @DDRJake and should shed some more light on what kind of update we are making as well as the upcoming Immersion Pack that will go along with it.
 
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Hello everyone!


I am Trin Tragula and this is the first development diary for Update 1.25 - REDACTED. Some of you may know me from previous diaries that have dealt with research, the historical setup and most of all map changes to various regions. This time is no different, I am here to tell you about a region that has received more work in the, as of yet unnamed, update that we are currently working on.


The region around the English channel has been revised before, both in Update 1.12 (Low countries) and 1.16 (France and the British Isles). Still there were some issues with it and detail is lacking a bit when compared to some more recently revised regions like Scandinavia or Hungary (also originally revised in the same update but later updated). For 1.25 it was therefore time to once again focus on overhauling this part of Europe.

As we plan to do in all future regional updates we have also added new texts to the startup screen for interesting countries that lack them in the overhauled region.


Ireland

View attachment 327663


While Ireland has long been an English subject on paper the actual authority of the crown was in many ways a legal fiction in 1444. In practice direct English rule has collapsed and does not extend beyond the small piece of land known as the “The Pale” around Dublin.

While the particulars vary the Anglo-Norman earls, peers under the English kings, are in practice independent by most definitions of the word and have become as Irish as the population the govern.

Receding English influence has also allowed many of the older Gaelic clans to thrive and the island is home to several strong Irish kingdoms.

With the English Kings preoccupied with the Hundred Years war in France and internal squabbles over even their own succession the Irish independence seems destined to last. Should England manage to stabilize and be able to focus on the Emerald Isle once again however they risk losing this freedom quickly. Even so Ireland would likely be an unruly region to control.


In the 1.25 update we hope to better show how the various minor states in Ireland thrived as English rule grew weaker and weaker. We hope the new setup will better show how diverse the Island was and offer the player to lead one of the many clans or earldoms of Ireland to perhaps put up a stronger resistance to the English threat or fail and at best hope to rule as an English vassal.

All Irish tags (new and old) will be given individual national ideas, and the old group set will be repurposed (and partly rewritten) to be a reward for uniting the Island.


Playable Tags in Ireland:

  • Munster (New) - Independent Irish Kingdom
    • This tag represents the MacCarthy Mor, leader of the MacCarthys and the hereditary Gaelic Kings of Desmond. Named Munster to avoid confusion with the Earls of Desmond.
  • Ormond (New) - Independent Irish Earldom
    • In 1444 this tag represents the Butler family, the earls of Ormond.
  • Offaly (New) - Independent Irish Kingdom
    • Central Ireland was divided between many minor clans in 1444, most of them Gaelic. When it later fell to English conquest this is one of the primary regions subject to English settlement. In 1444 in EU4 this province is ruled by the Faly O’Connors, but they were really just one of many minor clans in this region.
  • Tyrconnell (New) - Independent Kingdom
    • The O’Donnel kings of Tyrconnell are another native dynasty to Ireland with roots going hundreds of years back.
  • Leinster (Old) - Independent Kingdom
    • In 1444 the Kingdom of Leinster is ruled by the Kavanagh dynasty since the 12th century (the kingdom itself dating many hundred years further back). While close to the Pale Leinster has a history of strong opposition to the English crown and has often been a force beyond its size in Ireland.
  • Clanricarde (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • Another Anglo-Norman dynasty the Burke family rules their part of Ireland in the name of the English king. In practice however they are just as independent as their neighbors and are.
  • Kildare (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • Much like other parts of Ireland the FitzGerald Earls of Kildare are for practical purposes rulers of their own lands but their close proximity to the Pale means they have a closer relationship with the crown and they have often worked more closely with the king.
  • Thomond (Old) - Independent Kingdom
    • The Kingdom of Thomond remains one of the most independent Gaelic kingdoms on Ireland in 1444. Far from the direct reach of the English crown their problems are more related to their immediate neighbors than a distant king.
  • Sligo (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • In 1444 Sligo is ruled by the Sligo O’Connors. Much like the Faly O’Connors their hold over the region was not as absolute as we show it in the game.
  • Desmond (Old) - Independent Earldom
    • The Earldom of Desmond (not to be confused with the Kingdom of Desmond, a tag we call Munster) rules the richer parts of south-eastern Ireland. Their ties with the crown are not as close as those of their kinsmen in Kildare.
  • Tyrone (Old) - Independent Kingdom
  • The dominant Gaelic kingdom in the north Tyrone is ruled by the ancient O' Niell dynasty. Tyrone was for a long time the most dominant state in the north.
  • Ulster (Old) - Independent State
  • In 1444 this province was home to a larger number of clans, many with close ties to their Scottish counterpart. In EU4 it is ruled by the Maggenis dynasty.

Scotland

View attachment 327664

In 1444 Scotland remains a strong regional kingdom, supported by the King’s of France in the south. While the Clans remain influential in Scottish politics, and would likely assert their independence if they felt it threatened, the Kingdom is unified in a way the Irish lords could only dream of. During their time on the throne the Stuarts have strengthened their rule and their defences against the English to the south, while hungrily biding their time to reclaim the last remains of Norse rule in the form of the Norwegian Jarldom of Orkney in the north.

Scotland has not received any new playable country tags in the 1.25 update but the region has been broken up into more provinces to give the Scottish kingdom a bit more depth and staying power. In the South two provinces have been carved out to show that the Anglo-Scottish border is in fact not flat and hard to defend. The addition of the West and East March provinces instead allows Scotland to fight an invader before they reach the farmlands around the capital
The Highlands have also been broken up, ensuring that a resurgent Highlander kingdom will be stronger and stand a better chance of surviving.


England & Wales

View attachment 327662

While England was updated once before after release we felt that it was simply not up to date with regions like Denmark or Germany, and that it was too easy to overrun the island of Great Britain for a naval invader. England is arguably one of the historical winners of this period and while England never saw much in the way of foreign invasion it was the scene of two great civil wars.

In update 1.25 England and Wales have been given a thorough rework with many provinces carved out of the existing ones or redrawn to better reflect both the political and economic realities of the time. The Isle of Man has also been made its own province, a naval base in the Irish sea for whoever manages to get control of it.


Added Tags:
  • Mann - Revolter in the Isle of Man province.
    • In 1444 the Isle of Man is an English possession but it was once a kingdom of its own with roots in the now defunct Kingdom of the Isles.


France & Burgundy

View attachment 327661

Another “winner” in our timeline was France. The great kingdom that dominated European politics for centuries before imploding to internal unrest and rising reborn as the Revolutionary Empire of Napoleon, ready to reshape the politics of the continent completely.

In 1444 France is the scene of the Hundred Years war, a long conflict over who would rule the populous lands of the Kingdom. The recently concluded treaty of Tours has seemingly restored peace to the region but its stipulations have yet to be carried out in their entirety as England seem reluctant to surrender Maine to the French king.

The 1.25 update have not brought any new countries into being in France but we have revised the French map, especially in the north.

Normandy and the region around Paris are now more detailed, allowing for a less one-sided early campaign between England and France once conflict flares up again. We have also taken the opportunity to shift some of the French development towards the more populated north to better represent the historical economy of the region.

The huge province of Bourgogne has also been broken up to represent the Burgundian border castles such as Semur, with their capital in Dijon receiving an Inland Centre of Trade.


The Low Countries

View attachment 327660

In 1444 the Low Countries are already one of the greatest economic centers of the European continent. Politically many of the states are dominated by the Dukes of Burgundy but under their rule they enjoy considerable autonomy and in time the northern parts would historically form the United Provinces of the Netherlands, an iconic power in the Europa Universalis timeline and a great mercantile and colonial power.

We have felt that when this region was last revisited it was perhaps done so a bit conservatively and this time we have been less concerned with keeping the status quo.

The province of Holland has been broken in two, as has Gelre and Friesland. The Province of Limburg (forever plagued by trying to accomodate the fact that the majority of the county of Limburg would become separated from the city itself in this timeline) has been removed entirely in favor of a separate province for Upper Guelders. The borders have also been redrawn to hopefully better reflect the many border changes in this region during this period in history.

While the development of the Low Countries region was always high (indeed even in 1.24 it is higher than all of England) it has been increased slightly again to better reflect the economic power of these cities. Utrecht, Friesland, Gelre and Holland have all grown by one province each while Brabant, though it remains a powerful force in the region, has lost both a province and a sizable amount of development.



That was all for today! From Ireland to Burgundy we hope that this overhaul will make for a better experience and that it will also make for a more accurate representation of this central region to the developments of the 1444-1820 period.

Next week’s developer diary will be written by @DDRJake and should shed some more light on what kind of update we are making as well as the upcoming Immersion Pack that will go along with it.

Thaks for the Update, I hope you will also take a look at the ITalian map and improve it with the adding of the historical other regional powers , I did a humble mod for it but I would like to see more region splitting to represent better the Italian political situation and also the economical power both of North and South states.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=612459817
filedetails


http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=612459817
 
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@Trin Tragula
Rename ‘Den Haag’ back to ‘Holland, that’s more in line with Brabant, Gelre, Friesland & Vlaanderen.

Make sure that the name ‘Oversticht’ is for UTR only, as the rest should call it ‘Overijssel’.
And add ‘Sticht’ as a name for ‘Utrecht’ while owned by UTR.

Upper Geulders hould also have a Dutch/Flemish name ‘Opper Gelre’ and as capital Roermond. (Currently the capital is Maastricht, which is outside Gelre)

Last suggestion, please rename ‘Groningen’ into ‘Stad en Lande’ as that contains the city and the surrounding area or ‘Ommelanden’ when owned by Friesland. The name 'Groningen’ is a Napoleonic invention.

When Friesland is owning ‘Amsterdam’ it should be known as ‘Westfriesland’.
 
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Eh no. Spain needs a dedicated immerison pack, Austria the HRE needs a decidacted immerison pack and there are several regions in Germany who also need immersion packs of their own, Bavaria, Lower Saxony+Pommerania and so on.

The way I understood it they ain't going to do only immersion packs now, there will still be expansions done. And a Habsburg expansion like the Cradle of Civ one would be a good starting stone for Spain/HRE. (The changes needed are also so big that they shouldn't be distributed piecemeal in immersion packs)
 
Upper Geulders hould also have a Dutch/Flemish name ‘Opper Gelre’ and as capital Roermond. (Currently the capital is Maastricht, which is outside Gelre)

Why would the capital be Maastricht for Upper Guelders? It was the capital of Limburg but we removed that province :)

Last suggestion, please rename ‘Groningen’ into ‘Stad en Lande’ as that contains the city and the surrounding area or ‘Ommelanden’ when owned by Friesland. The name 'Groningen’ is a Napoleonic invention.

Those names don't conform to our naming conventions. It's Groningen because the most important city was Groningen, just as in many other places.
When we can we prefer to name provinces after regional names but that is not always possible. :) The same goes for those asking for the Ridings of Yorkshire to be named after their location rather than cities within them (we try to avoid using directions in land province names as far as possible).
 
Oh no, that means I have to wait to play this game again!

I just play games far away from the regions affected - so right now deepest Africa or the Americas :D
 
Why would the capital be Maastricht for Upper Guelders? It was the capital of Limburg but we removed that province :)



Those names don't conform to our naming conventions. It's Groningen because the most important city was Groningen, just as in many other places.
When we can we prefer to name provinces after regional names but that is not always possible. :) The same goes for those asking for the Ridings of Yorkshire to be named after their location rather than cities within them (we try to avoid using directions in land province names as far as possible).

So why not name Gelre, Nijmegen? As that was one of the most important cities not only in that province but also in the low countries at that time
 
you dont know what you are talking about, with so many irish tags you willl always be able to invade and stablish a beachhead/no cb and pull englan into it without any big ally/ally one of them and block england from growing

then tell me which nation can match englands fleet in the very beginning and tell me which nation is interested in wasting time on no-cb wars to kill irish minors. you obviously never player multiplayer, doing stuff like this in mp is literal suicide.
 
then tell me which nation can match englands fleet in the very beginning and tell me which nation is interested in wasting time on no-cb wars to kill irish minors. you obviously never player multiplayer, doing stuff like this in mp is literal suicide.
cant you land troops in scotland beforehand as always though? if you cant diplo thats not my fault, that many irish minors only opens diplo possibilities
 
In the listing of Irish states, they have bunch of "titles". Some are Irish Kingdoms, some are kingdoms, some are gealdoms... Are these actual things in coming patch?
I think he just got lazy towards the end. Though the distinction between kingdom and earldom is important. The former were based in Irish law and were free and owed subjection to no one. The latter were former vassals of the crown and in theory (though not in practice) owed their loyalty to the administration in Dublin.
 
So why not name Gelre, Nijmegen? As that was one of the most important cities not only in that province but also in the low countries at that time

As I said, when they fit we prefer regional names. These are provinces, not just one city. :)
 
@Trin Tragula I think the 2 new Scottish provinces could have better names.

East March should be "borders"

West march could be extended west, becoming the province with the strait to ireland and be called "Dumfries and Galloway". If it's not extended, it could at least have a better name. I am not too sure where exactly Galloway is, but Dumfries is definately in the "West March" province, so in the event of Galloway being a part of the Ayrshire province then it should just be called "Dumfries". (Fun fact: It's pronounced dumfreece, not dumb fries :) )

political-scotland.gif


How will the development look now? I'd imaging Lothian will increase in development as it now owns Fife, and Aberdeen to increase as it owns the city of Dundee.

Edit: Also, what's with the south west of Scotland? In game there is an island where the peninsula thing is supposed to be.
 
As I said, when they fit we prefer regional names. These are provinces, not just one city. :)
I don’t understand, why then Den Haag is used instead of Holland. Also Leiden, Dordrecht, Rotterdam were important cities in that province. I forgot also Delft.
 
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cant you land troops in scotland beforehand as always though? if you cant diplo thats not my fault, that many irish minors only opens diplo possibilities
what is a blackflag? and again, why would you do such a thing? as france you cant, as burgundy you cant, as denmark you cant, as castille you cant. they all got several neighbours which are only waiting for the moment your troops are dying in england. there is literally no reason or way to do what you just suggested. if you play with 40+ players, stuff like this is suicide and you refuse to admit it. this whole patch will just make strong countries even better and already medicore/weak countries worse.
 
However, whilst splitting Holland in the way they have done isn't necessarily accurate for most of the game's time period, both Den Haag and Amsterdam are far more important cities to represent than the entirety of Drenthe is.
Not in any of the game's time period, the current borders were established in 1840 ;). But yeah, representing Amsterdam could be worth sacrificing a bit of historical accuracy, I don't deny that.
 
The same goes for those asking for the Ridings of Yorkshire to be named after their location rather than cities within them (we try to avoid using directions in land province names as far as possible).
Why not York for North Yorkshire and Leeds or Sheffield for East Yorkshire (preferably Leeds)?

Also, could Norfolk be renamed to East Anglia since it also covers Suffolk? I hope it's been given a dev boost considering the importance of the region.

Is there a reason Hampshire has the shire ending when none of the other English counties do?

Not in any of the game's time period, the current borders were established in 1840 ;). But yeah, representing Amsterdam could be worth sacrificing a bit of historical accuracy, I don't deny that.
With those names, yes, but there was a split along pretty much the same lines within the Kingdom of Holland in 1807.
 
Not in any of the game's time period, the current borders were established in 1840 ;). But yeah, representing Amsterdam could be worth sacrificing a bit of historical accuracy, I don't deny that.
I just think that they took the Hollandic Bailiffs Kennermerland, Waterland & West-Frisia and named it Amsterdam. The city alone would be big enough (During the Dutch Republic) to be a province of it's own..