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Today is thursday, the day of the God of Thunder, so what is a more appropriate way to celebrate than with a development diary for Europa Univeralis IV. We’ve talked about development and politics the last few weeks, so now its time to talk a bit more about warfare again, before going back to more peacetime-related activities.

All of this mentioned in this development diary will be in the free update accompanying the next expansion.

Fortress Rework
Connecting a bit to the previous reveal of our change to how building works, we have overhauled the fortress system.

There are now four different forts, one available each century, providing 1, 3, 5 and 7 fort-levels each. A newer fort makes the previous obsolete, so you only have 1 fort in each province. Each fortress also provides 5000 garrison per fort level, so besieging a fortress now requires a large investment.

Forts now also require maintenance to be paid each month, which currently costs about 1.5 ducats for a level 1 fort per month in 1444. Luckily, you can mothball a fortress which makes it drop to just 10 men defending it, and won’t cost you anything in upkeep.

Garrison growth for a fort is also a fair amount slower than before, so after you have taken a fort, you may want to stick around to protect it for a bit.

What is most important to know though, is that forts now have a Zone of Control. First of all, they will automatically take control of any adjacent province that does not have any forts that is adjacent and hostile to them. If two fortress compete over the same province, then the one with highest fort-level wins and in case of a tie, control goes to the owner of the province. Secondly, you can not walk past a fortress and its zone of control, as you have to siege down the blocking fort first.

Each capital have a free fort-level, but that fort will not have any ZoC, as most minor nations can not afford a major fortress.

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Looting
As we promised, we have now completely revised how looting works. Now there is a “pile” of possible loot in a province, which is directly tied to have developed the province is.

At the end of each month, all hostile units in a province attempt to loot, and the amount they loot depend on how many regiments you have there, and what types they are, where cavalry is by far the best. Some ideas and governments increase the amount you loot each month, where for example Steppe Hordes gains a nice boost.

A province starts recovering from being looted when 6 months have passed since last loot, and it takes up to a year until it has fully recovered.

Of course, the penalty on a province from being looted is still there until it has fully recovered, but it is scaled on how much have been looted.

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Committed Armies
One of the major complaints we have had on the combat in Eu4, has been the fact that you can fully abort your movement whenever you liked. This have been changed, and now you can’t abort your movement if you have already moved 50% of the way. After all, its just common sense that a unit that have already moved halfway between the centers of two provinces is already in the second one.

Force Limits
We felt that the calculations of forcelimits where far too hidden from the player, Players saw stuff like “+25.87 from Provinces”, which based based on projections of base-tax amongst other things, and sometimes those dropped for no obvious reasons.

Now you will be able to see in each province how much it provides to your forcelimits, and we have cleaned up the logic.

Each level of development gives 0.1 land and naval forcelimit.
Overseas will provide -2 land and -2 naval forcelimit
Inland provinces will not provide any naval forcelimit.
However, a province will never be able to provide negative forcelimits.

A nation also have a base value of +3 land and +2 naval force limit, and there are some other ways to get direct forcelimit increased, that are not just percentage increases.

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Next week, we'll be back and talk more about The Devout.
 
What do you mean by that?

"To avoid exploits : Zone of control rule should be calculated on Garrison size not fort level."

Bit late but what I meant by that is that if it is only by level then you can use low upkeep forts to take territory from provinces form a lower level fort that has high upkeep. Despite the lower level high upkeep fort having more men.
 
Maybe loot could be tied into supply? For non-Horde nations, looting was more about feeding your army than about getting rich. Maybe Supply Limits should be much lower, but Loot acts a sort of extension on your Supply Limit that can eventually run out. Or, armies would carry an amount of "supply" which has to be topped off at friendly Forts or sucked up via Looting, with "Supply Lines" of occupation running from friendly territory (or coastal provinces) to the nearest fort.
 
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Supply lines would also be great... would remove militarty access being handed out so easily. Who wants a foreign army marching through their lands?
Seiging Russia would be stupid then.
 
Will Blockading still have the same effect on coastal Provices, even if they don't have forts? And what about te ones that do have forts? Is it the same +2 bonus or is it different?
 
Will your own armies also loot the province? Historically it took till modern times for the army system to develop to such level that soldiers no longer had to rely on scavenging (e.g. looting). It took centralized states lots of time, funds and effort to develop and keep up systems of regular salaries to conscripts, so that they could actually *buy* their provision instead of *taking* it. It take even more time for armies to develop a steady supply lifelines so that armies no longer would rely just on the local resources. Sure, own armies shouldn't put the looting level on the same level as it is for invading army that wishes to pillage and destroy. But still, no province till ~18th century was glad to see a marching army go through it - be it own or foreign.
 
no wait, stop... hold your horses!

this is too much micro for defense... the fortress bit... you'll be busy the entire war flipping funding sliders around for various provinces as the enemy force-marches their troops to the other side right past all the ones you just funded ;o

honestly, not quite realistic, as IRL, the enemy could march their troops out of said fort and attack your flank/rear during a major engagement...
 
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no wait, stop... hold your horses!

this is too much micro for defense... the fortress bit... you'll be busy the entire war flipping funding sliders around for various provinces as the enemy force-marches their troops to the other side right past all the ones you just funded ;o
I guess that if you try this, it will be too late!!!!:eek:

Why?
Probably, will take time to reinforce, and you wil be steamrolled.

Better to use your savings (or borrow, or something like that) at the start of the war.
 
no wait, stop... hold your horses!

this is too much micro for defense... the fortress bit... you'll be busy the entire war flipping funding sliders around for various provinces as the enemy force-marches their troops to the other side right past all the ones you just funded ;o

honestly, not quite realistic, as IRL, the enemy could march their troops out of said fort and attack your flank/rear during a major engagement...
Takes twenty months to go from 10(aka assault with no losses) to full so nope.
 
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Maybe you are so powerful, that is easier to just steamroll your adversaries.

what's the point of building forts in the first place then? if you're building them, you're gonna lose, is what you're saying, because you are by definition 'weaker' ;p lol

essentially, it will boil down to a pointless micro game, where you fund all their claimed provinces just to piss them off... but you will lose anyways, just remember that ;p
 
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what's the point of building forts in the first place then? if you're building them, you're gonna lose, is what you're saying, because you are by definition 'weaker' ;p lol

essentially, it will boil down to a pointless micro game, where you fund all their claimed provinces just to piss them off...
If your business is not WAR, sprinkle the frontiers with forts, and live in peace. Because anytime soon, someone will declare war. Then you can build the forces, or concentrate them in the right place.
 
If your business is not WAR, sprinkle the frontiers with forts, and live in peace.

the only peace i can agree with is if you become my vassal ;p then we can agree. lol diplo+influence ideas, 8-10 vassals. funny stuff ;)

i was trying to figure out how to turn them all into marches, and then realized you need AOW for that. only 20$ and you can have marches/mothball fleets too ;p ok, maybe that's not completely fair, it does have a lot of other features, like vassal war objectives (although not sure how that system works).

in the commonwealth game, the vassals provide some 120-150k forcelimit? it'd be pretty funny if they were all marches and i expanded them... ;\
 
the only peace i can agree with is if you become my vassal ;p then we can agree. lol diplo+influence ideas, 8-10 vassals. funny stuff ;)

i was trying to figure out how to turn them all into marches, and then realized you need AOW for that. only 20$ and you can have marches/mothball fleets too ;p ok, maybe that's not completely fair, it does have a lot of other features, like vassal war objectives (although not sure how that system works).

in the commonwealth game, the vassals provide some 120-150k forcelimit? it'd be pretty funny if they were all marches and i expanded them... ;\
Not so funny if they revolt against you.:oops:
 
Please, please, please make coastal forts (at least high level ones) unsiegeable without a naval blockade. Or at least extremely difficult to take.
Can you imagine an epic siege of the Gibraltar? Or Sveaborg? Oh, that would be sweet.
 
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You've said that the capital gets a free fort level but no ZOC. So let us say that I am playing a OPM and managed to snag a second adjacent province. If I am understanding things correctly, my capital 'fort' will provide no protection for my new province and in the event of another war it would get instantly occupied my any army that walks through it.

Have I got this right?
 
You've said that the capital gets a free fort level but no ZOC. So let us say that I am playing a OPM and managed to snag a second adjacent province. If I am understanding things correctly, my capital 'fort' will provide no protection for my new province and in the event of another war it would get instantly occupied my any army that walks through it.

Have I got this right?

It might depend on whether capital forts are lost on being conquered. I can't recall if it has been mentioned what happens in that case. Imagine expanding within the HRE, you'd have a sea of expensive forts.
 
It just occurred to me now with fort change, that whenever I play Britain and captures the Gibraltar and build up the fort to the max level, it will literally take very, very long time for Spanish to siege it and chance are, it might not fall at all most of the times before the war ended. Historically, Spanish were never able to successfully recapture Gibraltar. I do have a modded event to increase defensiveness by 200 percent for Gibraltar if owned by Britain but I suspect it's more than just defensiveness. 5000 men per a fort level might firm it up a lot, especially when having 4 fort levels at max will give effectively 20k garrison.
 
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