• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Europa Universalis IV - Development Diary 28th of February 2023 - Great Britain

Greetings! A new week, a new Dev Diary, and this time it is about our final big country of the DLC, England, and its follow-up nation of Great Britain. Similar to Russia, England and Great Britain received their content update with 1.25 which is now almost 5 years old. While the British mission tree was one of the most extensive in its time, it has become quite outdated and was in dire need of receiving an update in order to keep England on the same level as the other great powers which are seeing a liftover with 1.35.

So, let’s get started!
british_missions.png

These are all the missions you have available as England and as Great Britain. These missions are available to everyone who forms GB.

The mission tree is split into several themes:
- The internal affairs and issues of England, which were the War of the Roses, the English Reformation, and of course the English Civil War
- The classic conquest of the British Isles
- Trade Dominance in Europe
- Colonizing the New World
- The conquest of India
- Internal development

Starting with the classic missions, the British Isles conquest missions are what their name suggests: unifying the British Isles under your banner. The highlight of these missions is the ability to unlock the “Act of Union” which is a unique parliament issue to form Great Britain - more on it later. Also a ,QoL addition has been added to these conquest missions: if you conquer Scotland you can get the following event if Norway did not sell Orkney to Scotland yet.
flavor_gbr.2.png

The AI is very likely to accept as long as they don’t have any negative opinion of you.

The missions regarding colonizing the New World are also quite self-explanatory. However, these missions do have some unique rewards which make colonization a little bit more interesting. The mission “Found the Royal Navy” grants you +33% Colonial Range and the ability to recruit explorers and conquistadors for 25 years. It also unlocks a parliament issue that gives you the same modifiers once the mission reward runs out.

“Discover the Americas” unlocks another Parliament issue with a rather experimental and unique effect:
colonial_venture.png


As long this modifier is active and you fully colonize a colony you get the following event:
colonial_venture_event.png

You get a selection of trade goods to choose from. The province will then start producing the selected trade goods. The first option keeps the current trade good if you don’t want to select any new production.

Keep in mind that the trade goods you can choose from have the same requirements as they would normally have when you colonize a province. In other words: you cannot select every province in North America to be a gold province out of nowhere.

Speaking of gold: selecting a certain trade good to be produced has a price that is calculated by the following formula: (1 + <the times you selected the trade good>) * 5 * <base cost of trade good without any modifications from events>.

In this example, we decide to create our own Fish & Chips monopoly, so we choose fish for every colonized province:
colonial_venture_event_2.png


Some trade goods are inherently more valuable than others. If a trade good has a higher base cost than 2.5 then it will also have an Administrative cost in order to be produced:
colonial_venture_gems.png

Note: The admin cost will be rounded down to 7.

Again, the formula for this is also rather simple: (<base trade good price> - 2.5) * 25 * <the times you selected the trade good>.

Now of course I have to address the elephant in the room: Gold. In order to avoid a world where a Great Britain player would put a gold province in every single eligible province of the New World, I decided to give Gold an “estimated value” of 10 Ducats base cost. This is reflected in the price you have to pay for a Gold province in the new world:
colonial_venture_event_gold.png

The only limit for how many gold provinces you want in the end is not any hard block but your tolerance for pain in paying for the establishment of another gold province.

Of course there is a decision which toggles this off if you are not interested in micromanaging every single colony you create:
colonial_venture_toggle.png

The missions “Settle in America” and “Colonize the Caribbean” modify your colonial capabilities even further with more unlocked parliament actions:
taxation_vs_representation.png

gold_act.png

Note: You have access to a sugar and spice version of this Parliament Action in the mission tree.

Finally, the mission “Dominate the New World” gives a permanent modifier which also benefits your colonial subjects too.
new_world_domination.png

Note: The Trade Efficiency might look weird considering that you siphon the trade from the New World, but Tariffs in their current iteration are calculated from the production income + trade income. As such, this bonus is an indirect bonus to how much tariff you receive from your colonies.

Of course a British mission tree would not be complete without a trip to India. The mission “East India Company” gives you an early choice of how you want to manage your territory in India.
east_india_company_event.png
The first option will release a unique subject in the form of the East India Company and it gives all permanent claims you get in India to your subject. The second option lets you keep the claims, but you won’t have access to your new subject, while the third option is for the purpose of role-playing where you can play as the company yourself, which might be an interesting campaign for some people.

The East India Company starts with a unique version of the Merchant Republic:
trade_company_reform.png

And of course it has its own set of ideas:
Code:
EIC_ideas = {
    start = {
        global_prov_trade_power_modifier = 0.2
        tolerance_heathen = 3
    }

    bonus = {
        global_trade_power = 0.15
    }
   
    trigger = {
        tag = EIC
    }
    free = yes        #will be added at load.

    eic_governors_general = {
        global_unrest = -1
        governing_capacity_modifier = 0.1
    }
    eic_indian_trade = {
        global_trade_goods_size_modifier = 0.15
    }
    eic_chartered_merchants = {
        merchants = 1
        placed_merchant_power = 10
    }
    eic_presidency_armies = {
        global_manpower_modifier = 0.1
        global_sailors_modifier = 0.2
    }
    eic_intercontinental_trade = {
        trade_steering = 0.25
        trade_range_modifier = 0.1
    }
    eic_colonial_monopoly = {
        trade_efficiency = 0.1
    }
    eic_colonial_exploitation = {
        trade_company_investment_cost = -0.1
        build_cost = -0.1
    }
}

This trade company subject has some special properties which aim to make it competitive to the trade companies we already know and love. A trade company behaves in many ways like a colony, which means it is able to declare its own wars, it will pay tariffs to its overlord and you can use the “Modify Subject Relationship” on them (modifications for Self-Governing Colonies are applied here). However, when an external nation attacks your Trade Company you are called into war. There are also some additional subject interactions which are not available to normal colonies such as “Siphon Income” and “Fortify Subject” (in the past it was March, but it has been renamed now).

“Masters of India”, which requires you to own or have a subject own 200 provinces in India, gives an additional bonus to your trade company subject:
masters_of_india.png

These were the colonial missions. Now we move on to the internal missions.

The missions of the “War of the Roses” path are all about your religious internal affairs. Depending on what is your stance towards the clergy, you unlock one of the two government reforms for the 4th tier:
religious_reforms.png
The missions “Strengthen the Kingdom” and “Acts of the Parliament” play heavily into the conflict between the monarch and the parliament during the Age of Absolutism, which eventually led to the English Civil War.

Completing both missions give you access to both mutually exclusive government reforms:
more_reforms.png

Speaking of, in order to properly represent the struggle between crown and constitution, you will eventually receive the following event as you enter the Age of Absolutism:
strife_king_and_parliament.png

absolute_power.png

Note: Background UI is still work in progress. The Monarchists will start the civil war when it reaches -100, not 100. Not shown in the image: if the value drops below 0 the modifiers change to: +4 Global Unrest, -10 Years of Nationalism, -10% Idea Cost and -1 Yearly Absolutism.

Resetting Debates, letting debates fail and revoking parliament seats increase your Absolute Power while giving away seats and letting debates win decrease Absolute Power. There are two ways of handling the mechanic altogether: you either juggle with the Absolute Power until the Age of Revolution starts or you try to reach either direction as fast as possible in order to trigger the following event:
escalation_event.png


If this event fires then the conditions to fire the English Civil War change to the following:
new_disaster_conditions.png

The disaster itself has seen little change per se. Pretender rebels on the parliament side have been replaced with a new, Parliamentarian rebel type which are basically Pretenders, but republican versions of them. The big change for the disaster is the end reward when you go through them.

If you side with the Royalists and end the Civil War without breaking to rebels you get the following reform:
absolute_britain.png

Letting the Parliamentarian win and choosing to become a republic will unlock the following reform:
parliamentarian_republic.png

And finally, if you let the Parliamentarians win, but decide to become a monarchy after Cromwell’s death:
british_monarchy.png
If you complete the mission “The Three Kingdom Wars” (which really should have been called “Wars of the Three Kingdoms”, but there was no space for it) by going through the hassle of the English Civil War, you unlock the following reward:
english_civil_war_mission_reward.png
These parliament issues are unlocked as you also unlock your national ideas. You have up to three issues which negate one of your national ideas in order to introduce a new strength.
ideas_altering_issues.png
These issues are, however, limited to three national idea groups in total though - they do not cover you if you form a nation which would not be typical in your England run like, let’s say France or Spain.

Of course you can toggle them off with a decision in order to have the space of your parliament issues not be occupied with them anymore, and you can revoke all of the adjustments - though at a heavy cost:
toggle_off.png

Note: Forming a different country will automatically revoke these modifiers. I am also considering making this cost a lot less severe though in order to promote flexibility. Maybe 75 ADM cost per adjusted idea is more manageable.

While these were the internal disasters and issues, there is more to the mission tree. The mission “Issue the Royal Warrant” goes more into the economical direction of your country. While the mission itself can be completed rather early, its big reward is more something you will unlock later on as you get the following reform unlocked for tier 8:
royal_charters.png

trade_protectorate.png

Note: Numbers are not final, as usual.

As it is somewhat of a running theme with 1.35, another mechanic of the old EU4 has returned once again, though this time it is a little bit different. Trade Protectorates are a voluntary relationship between you and the target country, and some AIs might even request to become such a subject in order to be protected from foreign forces. The Trade Protectorate and the overlord are free to annul the treaty, though they have to pay with 1 Stability unless the liberty desire is 100.

Only countries whose capitals are within your trade range are eligible to become your protectorates.

I should also mention that these Protectorates are not Great Britain only as any country which “Confirms Thalassocracy” unlocks the following government reform, which is part of the free update:
thalassocracy.png

The missions following “A House Divided” (which is more a reference to how the “House of the Parliament” is split into the House of Common and the House of Lords) are more internally related missions. Highlights here are “Expand the Royal Navy” which unlocks the special unit of your country:
expand_royal_navy.png

man_of_war.png

Note: The color should be actually green as a reduced Engagement Width means more ships are in combat at the same time.
You have 20% of your Naval Force Limit available for constructing Man of War.

The mission “The Royal Marines” makes your marine units to be the “special land unit” of your country as it gives -10% Shock Damage Received and +5% Discipline while “The Redcoats” is a flat +10% Infantry Combat Ability until the end of the game.

Now that was the British Mission Tree. As you have seen, it is relying heavily on colonization and overseas ambitions. But not everyone might enjoy this kind of playstyle. Because of that there is a second path of the mission tree which is unlocked as soon as the Hundred Years’ War goes into its final phase. The mission “The Hundred Years’ War” fires an event which gives you the choice to play England in a new way which focuses a lot more on the continent:
angevin_path.png

This will of course update your mission tree accordingly:
angevin_missions.png

All of the colonial missions are replaced with missions which nudge you into conquering vast territories of Europe. Of course, your first target is France and securing the personal union over it. In order to complete the mission “Shatter French Nobility” you will have to enact a unique Parliament Action which might cause pain in the short run, but ensures France’s loyalty to the English throne:
curtailed_nobles.png

I mentioned earlier about the Acts of Union. For players, the Acts of Union will be an actual parliament issue which is available to you when you complete this mission “Unify the Isles” and have reached Administrative Technology 10.
acts_of_union_britain.png

gb.png

The AI will keep its decision though.

For the Angevin path we have something similar. The mission “The Angevin Kingdom” unlocks the English-French Acts of Union parliament issue which allows you to form a new tag:
acts_of_union_issue.png

angevin_kingdom.png

Note: Historically speaking, it would make more sense to have it as a name change as the “Angevin Empire” was mostly a name for the possessions of the Plantagenet dynasty and not a real political entity per se. For the sake of gameplay, however, I decided to make a new tag for it with unique ideas, colors and, most importantly, the flag.

angevin_flag.png
You might have noticed that the Angevin flag is already included in the already used English flag. We are aware that it can feel kinda weird when you form the Angevin Kingdom and your flag, which was previously a combination of the Angevin and the French flag, just returns to being the Angevin one.
Because of that we request your opinion on that matter, and want to know what you guys prefer:
  1. Keep the way it is presented here (same flag for England, three lions for the Angevin Kingdom).
  2. Give the Angevin Kingdom the current English flag and give England the three lions as starting flag.
  3. Give the Angevin Kingdom the current English flag and give England the St. George cross as flag.
  4. Other ideas / suggestions.
With that being said, let's take a look at the ideas:
Code:
AVE_ideas = {
    start = {
        global_manpower_modifier = 0.2
        improve_relation_modifier = 0.3
    }

    bonus = {
        years_of_nationalism = -5
    }
   
    trigger = {
        tag = AVE
    }
    free = yes        #will be added at load.

    angevin_decentralized_rule = {
        core_creation = -0.2
    }
    english_common_law = {
        global_tax_modifier = 0.15
        num_of_parliament_issues = 1
    }
    lessons_of_the_anglo_french_wars = {
        discipline = 0.05
    }
    the_many_thrones = {
        heir_chance = 0.5
        years_to_integrate_personal_union = -10
    }
    reformed_angevin_infantry = {
        infantry_power = 0.1
    }
    seneschal_of_france = {
        governing_capacity_modifier = 0.15
    }
    rule_of_the_plantagenet = {
        legitimacy = 1
        devotion = 1
        horde_unity = 1
        republican_tradition = 0.3
        meritocracy = 1
    }
}

Note: England and Great Britain too received a +1 Number of possible Parliament Issues. The Horde Unity and Meritocracy (as well as Devotion / Legitimacy / Republican Tradition) have been added to all ideas which give one of the 5 government measurements in order to promote more variety in campaigns where you can switch your governments without feeling at a disadvantage because of it.

From here on out your path is set to conquer Iberia and Italy, as well as pushing into the Lowlands and the HRE. Each of these regions unlocks a “Crown of <Region>” Parliament issue which lets you decide how to properly deal with your newly conquered territory:
the_three_crowns.png

îberian_crown.png

italian_crown.png

imperial_diet.png

Note: There will be a tooltip saying that you unlock HRE related parliament issues.

These issues will affect the HRE as a whole and not just your country.

Another highlight would be the ability to adapt the British culture group into the French culture group with the mission “The Angevin Culture”:
anglois.png


A final highlight would be “Claim the Empire Title” which gives your country a name fitting to your situation.
empire_name.png

republican_name.png

theocratic_name.png

And if you, somehow, manage to fall from grace…
sadge.png

That was it for mission tree content. However, there is still a lot more to talk about. As you might have noticed, the parliament plays a large role in the content. As such, it was only natural to improve the parliament mechanics in general and then to add something special to the parliament of England / GB / Angevin to make it stand out from the other parliaments.

So, let us take a look at the general improvements for the parliaments. First thing first, parliaments have now the ability to reset a debate.
reset.png
You can reset a debate only every 20 years and it brings some penalties with it. Still, it can be a nice QoL addition when you accidentally select the wrong debate.

Secondly, parliament bribes will no longer spawn for an issue which would give this resource as an effect when the issue gets passed. Example: the parliament issue “The Draft” which gives manpower scaled to the seats will never have any parliament bribe which requests you to pay with manpower.

Thirdly, the prices of bribes have been revisited and have been tuned down to a manageable number.

Fourthly, parliaments of a size of 40 seats unlock new bribes which have “National” in their name. These bribes are more expensive than their local version, but have the bundled effect to automatically flip all seats with this kind of bribe in favor of the bribe. This way parliaments of big nations with many seats are not as annoying anymore as they were in the past.
national_bribes.png
Finally, manually placing a parliament seat no longer reduces absolutism. Getting seats assigned automatically, on the other hand, does cost absolutism.

All of these parliament updates are available if you have Common Sense (the original DLC which unlocks Parliaments) or the new DLC (which unlocks Parliaments too in case you don’t have Common Sense).

Now back to England / GB which have a bit more refined version of their parliament. Most issues they have access to now scale in their effect power with the influence of one of their estates:
influence_scaling.png

Note: I consider to push this all one level up, so that the 100% of the normal effect would be achieved between 20% and 40% already.

This has not an effect on the modifiers from the issues themselves though, only on the instant effects, so keep this in mind.

Bribes, on the other hand, scale with the loyalty of the estate:
loyalty_scaling.png
If an estate is disloyal, the cost of the bribe increases by 100%. However, if the estate is loyal then the bribe gets reduced by 50%. This stacks with the government mechanic of halved parliament issue costs, so it is possible that a single bribe might be as cheap as 1 Monarch Power.

Now with that all being said, let’s end this dev diary with the additional events England / GB / Angevin receives:
flavor_gbr.3.png

flavor_gbr.4.png

flavor_gbr.5.png

flavor_gbr.6.png

flavor_gbr.9.png

flavor_gbr.7.png

Note: This event is the starting point of 8 events in total which depict the different ways of how the English monarchs handled the reformation. Each option leads to different events. The AI always picks the one option which fits their ruler’s religion - even if it is against their country’s religion.

flavor_gbr.8.png

flavor_gbr.10.png

Note: the conditions for this event to happen are similar to the ones for its Reformed equivalent.
flavor_gbr.11.png


chapel_ENG_DD.png

And that was it for this week. Next week @Pavía will present content for the minor Great Powers, unique government reforms and additional estate privileges.

Until then I wish you all a nice week!
 
  • 116Like
  • 44Love
  • 18
  • 9
  • 3
  • 2Haha
Reactions:
As I saw some people speaking out on the major issues that come from the space race of the Americas, I feel one fairly simple way to curb it until *at least* 1500, is forcing the player and AI to require needing Caravels, not just Barques, as Caravels were what enabled Portugal and Spain to traverse across the open ocean more safely in the first place
 
  • 5
  • 2
  • 1Love
  • 1
Reactions:
Playing colonial doesn't stop you from conquering France, and vice versa, it will be just less rewarding and harder. And that's good because one country being able to easly conquer all of Western Europe and colonise half of the world in so short time would be just OP compared to anything we have seen before


Your only concern is fact that you have to pick between going easy Colonial and easy Expansion in Europe and lack of possibility to do both at once
All I am asking is that they keep the current missions to PU France for GB. And as for my concern, yes I do want to be able to do both just as I can now, but currently I do not even get the choice as I want to play as GB not as a new nation.
 
  • 2
  • 1
Reactions:
All I am asking is that they keep the current missions to PU France for GB. And as for my concern, yes I do want to be able to do both just as I can now, but currently I do not even get the choice as I want to play as GB not as a new nation.
you can play Great Britain and do conquest in Europe, but it will be harder now, getting so good missions for both colonialism and expansion in Europe would be just too OP
 
  • 2
Reactions:
The continued claims upon the French throne were by that time more a matter of principle than a seriously pressed claim. It is not puzzling precisely because if England had succeeded becoming the French kings, they would indeed have had little reason to establish colonies aside from the very same reason that the French engaged in colonialism, which was extra money for little investment. We would not see the same settler colonies that England did establish in the New World given that England wouldn't need them as badly as they ended up.

English as the court language in England was relatively new by 1444. In fact, it was the previous King, Henry V, who was the first to speak English as his mother tongue. On the point of your claim that becoming Angevine/French is an affront to England or however you wish to put it, England by that point still had a deeply Anglo-Norman nobility, which considered French, first and foremost, the mother tongue, while English was only becoming more prominent due to recent defeats in France (Orleans, Verneiolle, Patay, Burgundian Defection, etc.). English continental ambitions were dead in the water by 1444, and it was only another 9 years that England would be confined to the Channel Islands and Calais. Calais would be lost in the mid 16th century. Thus, just like an England that manages to win the Hundred Years' War will now be forming colonies in a manner far more similar to France, an England that loses the Hundred Years' War or refuses to form the Angevine Empire will have the same difficulties experienced already in game and now with the upcoming DLC in forming a continental empire. France's missions to conquer England are a direct reference to Napoleon's planned invasion and the Capetian monarchs' meddling in English succession affairs, including the Jacobite Rebellions. So this is rather not as much of complete fiction as much as it is more the possible successful outcome of those Capetian and Napoleonic plans.
By 1801 it might have been a complete fiction but Henry VIII certainly tried to reclaim the French throne albeit unsuccessfully. Also Edward III changed the language used in the government of England to English 80 years before the start of the EUIV timeline. As for forming colonies similar to France, France has vast overseas colonies before the Seven Year War, including Louisiana and Canada, as well as possessions in India. So I really do not buy the argument that continental entanglements preclude a vast overseas empire.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
They've been absent pretty much for a month now, although in each DD they promised to look at the feedback. I don't doubt they are looking, but there were a couple of things raised in each of the February diaries that In my opinion would have warranted at least an acknowledgment, even if not outright engagement with the player response. So it's not just this DD they are absent from, it's also the past 3-4 where we haven't heard a single squeak from them after the diary dropped.
Thanks for letting me know.
 
you can play Great Britain and do conquest in Europe, but it will be harder now, getting so good missions for both colonialism and expansion in Europe would be just too OP
England/GB has such missions already and are now loosing the continental missions. I am not asking for all the Angevin missions being added to the GB tree, though I would not mind that, what I am asking is to keep the missions to subjugate France, after that you could give the player the choice to get additional continental missions with a change to a different county. I do not think it is reasonable to reduce the ability of the player to do both compared with the status quo.
 
  • 2
  • 1
Reactions:
As I saw some people speaking out on the major issues that come from the space race of the Americas, I feel one fairly simple way to curb it until *at least* 1500, is forcing the player and AI to require needing Caravels, not just Barques, as Caravels were what enabled Portugal and Spain to traverse across the open ocean more safely in the first place
Well Caravels are tech par at 1518, which seems a bit late to be discovering the Americas. We definitely need the ability to explore from Western Europe to the Gulf of Mexico before 1500. But I can see Caravels being tied to the +15 Settler increase that is currently in Tech 3.

What really needs to be done is better model the reasons colonial growth kicked into high gear when it did: religion and money. Religious "exoduses" helped the Dutch, English, and (to a lesser extent) French colonies in northern NA. So pre-Reformation = little colonization. And money was the impetus for the colonization of Brazil, the Caribbean, and southern NA. But there wasn't much money to be made until they figured out how to extract it in large scale from plantations. No Triangle Trade = little to no colonization.
 
  • 5
Reactions:
Give the Angevin Kingdom the current English flag and give England the St. George cross as flag.
This^
It makes much more sense to have St. George cross especially if England have different dynasty, republic or released as a puppet.
Angevin Kingdom should have current English flag because it combines english with french, which is basically what Angevin Kingdom supposed to be
 
Other Anglican countires should have an additonal relationship bonus with England/GB as the GB Monarch is their religious head, this should be reflected more than just a plus 10 with same religion
 
  • 6
Reactions:
England/GB has such missions already and are now loosing the continental missions. I am not asking for all the Angevin missions being added to the GB tree, though I would not mind that, what I am asking is to keep the missions to subjugate France, after that you could give the player the choice to get additional continental missions with a change to a different county. I do not think it is reasonable to reduce the ability of the player to do both compared with the status quo.
Except it doesn't fit what PDX is trying to do, it just looks like they are trying to give player a more historical way and fictional way, each has pros and cons compared to each other.
And again - giving very powerful bonuses to conquest and colonialism at the same time would make this nation OP since it would easly dominate both - colonial regions and European front
 
  • 3
Reactions:
Except it doesn't fit what PDX is trying to do, it just looks like they are trying to give player a more historical way and fictional way, each has pros and cons compared to each other.
And again - giving very powerful bonuses to conquest and colonialism at the same time would make this nation OP since it would easly dominate both - colonial regions and European front
But it does not not even give the player two ways to play England/GB since to access the European missions you have to play as a different country. Also other countries like France and Spain are allowed to to keep colonial and continental missions, some of which are not historical.
 
  • 3
  • 1
Reactions:
But it does not not even give the player two ways to play England/GB since to access the European missions you have to play as a different country. Also other countries like France and Spain are allowed to to keep colonial and continental missions, some of which are not historical.
You get whole nation that is not historical + it's nice to see some fictional stuff since it gives more ways of playing the game.
Also Great Britain is united British isles, that means England, Wales and Scotland (and Ireland) so it would make no sense to form it as union of England and France (it also makes no sense to form Angevin kingdom but its better than GB as union of Fra + Eng). Imo it should be just named France because of Simple fact that it was more prestigeous (or just give player a chance to choose which name he wants)
 
  • 3
  • 1
Reactions:
Except it doesn't fit what PDX is trying to do, it just looks like they are trying to give player a more historical way and fictional way, each has pros and cons compared to each other.
And again - giving very powerful bonuses to conquest and colonialism at the same time would make this nation OP since it would easly dominate both - colonial regions and European front
We are already past OP for most of the Great Powers.
So Spain which now gets a base government form that gives +1 ADM to ruler, and 2 diplo slots, and can revoke estate privileges, AND +1 on any mana for 10 years, AND scaling 5% Admin Efficiency (and splendor), PLUS other bonuses of your choice is not OP right now? That is, at base, 240 extra mana every 10 years for free.
Let's not mention the Universal Empire... Or that Spain gets free -5% states governing cost (and extra reform progress)... Or that by allying France it can get 25 PERMANENT Power Projection. "‘Rein in France’ can be completed either by defeating or by allying with France, giving permanent Power Projection as a modifier.'"
Not to mention it keeps all its other continental ambitions plus its large colonization trees.

Spain, undoubtedly, was one of the greatest powers of the time, and deserves these missions, but Great Britain was just as impressive. Just having the option is more than enough. They don't need to cut off half of the possible choices, just allow them to be unlocked if the player (or AI, which will almost undoubtedly fail) goes for the French union.
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
Hey @Ogele does the Act of Union parliamentary debate remain possible if you tag switch?

Asking so I can pre-plan my “American-based Great Britain” play-through.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions:
By 1801 it might have been a complete fiction but Henry VIII certainly tried to reclaim the French throne albeit unsuccessfully. Also Edward III changed the language used in the government of England to English 80 years before the start of the EUIV timeline. As for forming colonies similar to France, France has vast overseas colonies before the Seven Year War, including Louisiana and Canada, as well as possessions in India. So I really do not buy the argument that continental entanglements preclude a vast overseas empire.
Let's explain this simply and concisely. From Wikipedia:
This reinforcement of the aristocracy and the emerging sense of national identity must be seen in conjunction with the war in France.[78] Just as the war with Scotland had done, the fear of a French invasion helped strengthen a sense of national unity, and nationalise the aristocracy that had been largely Anglo-Norman since the Norman conquest. Since the time of Edward I, popular myth suggested that the French planned to extinguish the English language, and as his grandfather had done, Edward III made the most of this scare.[86] As a result, the English language experienced a strong revival; in 1362, a Statute of Pleading ordered English to be used in law courts,[87] and the year after, Parliament was for the first time opened in English.[88] At the same time, the vernacular saw a revival as a literary language, through the works of William Langland, John Gower and especially The Canterbury Tales by Geoffrey Chaucer.[89] Yet the extent of this Anglicisation must not be exaggerated. The statute of 1362 was in fact written in the French language and had little immediate effect, and parliament was opened in that language as late as 1377.[90] The Order of the Garter, though a distinctly English institution, included also foreign members such as John IV, Duke of Brittany, and Robert of Namur.[91][92]

It's amazing that from your claim that Edward III was the one to make English the court language. No, it was during Edward III's reign that English experienced a revival, including the making of English the language in law courts. Parliament opened for the first time in English. Yet we can see that the very statute making English the language to be used in law courts was written in French. Parliament continued to conduct its affairs in French until 1377. The monarchy remained Francophone as its native language until Henry V.

France indeed colonised parts of the New World, but it was, as emphasised before, a matter of investments made with only slight interest. Colonisation was a peripheral interest for the French, who built a relatively small colonial empire that while claiming massive amounts of land, actually controlled only a small portion of it. In fact, Britain did more for the spread of French in North America by ensuring that the Province of Quebec (1763-1791) remained Francophone, which also gave the Metis a way to spread West into the Prairies. Again, it has been stressed enough that you can certainly make a colonial empire as the Angevines, you just need to take the appropriate ideas and not have the mission tree hold your hand.

One last point: forming the Angevine Empire is really an affirmation of England's commitment to its French claims and being the legitimate French state in the person of the English King. The Hundred Years' War is a period in which England was hyper focused on France, and successfully conquering France is a confirmation that it is worth it for England to be intimately intertwined and directly shaping how things should go in Europe, rather than being the peripheral player that England really was. England's successes in this period are rarely continental, and much of England's continental affairs involve being defeated multiple times by the French and only in 1714 becoming the Hannover Electors. The Napoleonic Wars were a massive act in cooperation with the other European powers, and even then success was only found after 1812. If England becomes the Angevine Empire, it is taking France's place, and France was at this time seeking to compete with the Holy Roman Empire and the Spanish kingdoms. Another major goal was being the deciding power in Italy. If that isn't more proof that France's interest in overseas colonies in the New World was peripheral and even uninterested. One doesn't see, for example, France grasping for Quebec, despite the defeat of Britain twice with the American War of Independence and the Treaty of Amiens. The remaining empire was, like the French colonies in the Americas, a collection of trading posts, with little interest in establishing any settler colonies. This is why Quebec, Acadia and Lower Louisiana were unique for having larger free settler populations.

The biggest problem I see is that you are giving the English far too much credit for their capabilities than what actually existed.
 
  • 8Like
  • 2
Reactions:
Its natural rival France on the other hand gets to do it all, without ever having to choose and without ever having to give up being France. This is in part a game that allows players to go beyond what countries achieved historically, with e.g. France getting missions to conquer England (a feat they never managed in the EUIV period) and historically plausible routes into e.g. Italy. Yet British missions seems limited to only allowing them to achieve the historical expansion that they actually managed in the period, hiding a major ambition and claims of British monarchs (their claim to the French Throne) behind abandoning everything else, including the name and culture of the country. I really cannot understand why people find it difficult to see why I and others are greatly concerned and saddened by this development.
Between 1444 and 1821, it is best not to assume that England was on a par with France. France was the richest and most populous country in Europe, while England, though moderately rich, was no match for France.
France's national power allowed it to have everything it wanted at the same time, whereas England did not. The fact that England is now seen as an equal rival to France is a result of England's continued success with fewer resources.
 
  • 2
Reactions:
Step 1: pick continental path
Step 2: proceed down mission tree, do not actually form Angevin state (presumably an end game tag)
Step 3: form some other formable tag, reset missions
Step 4: brute force form Great Britain, get the colonial mission tree.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions:
We are already past OP for most of the Great Powers.
So Spain which now gets a base government form that gives +1 ADM to ruler, and 2 diplo slots, and can revoke estate privileges, AND +1 on any mana for 10 years, AND scaling 5% Admin Efficiency (and splendor), PLUS other bonuses of your choice is not OP right now? That is, at base, 240 extra mana every 10 years for free.
Let's not mention the Universal Empire... Or that Spain gets free -5% states governing cost (and extra reform progress)... Or that by allying France it can get 25 PERMANENT Power Projection. "‘Rein in France’ can be completed either by defeating or by allying with France, giving permanent Power Projection as a modifier.'"
Not to mention it keeps all its other continental ambitions plus its large colonization trees.

Spain, undoubtedly, was one of the greatest powers of the time, and deserves these missions, but Great Britain was just as impressive. Just having the option is more than enough. They don't need to cut off half of the possible choices, just allow them to be unlocked if the player (or AI, which will almost undoubtedly fail) goes for the French union.
They don't cut half of the avaible content, you can just choose to go for Colonial or European missions but it doesn't stop you from doing both.
Also don't forget that Spain will get a new civil war at the start of the game.

For me it feels that these nations feel OP because other nations got old content and and look really weak compared to them, but next week we will see minor great powers so probably nations like Portugal, Austria, Prussia and other similar nations will also get comparable stuff
 
  • 2
Reactions:
Step 1: pick continental path
Step 2: proceed down mission tree, do not actually form Angevin state (presumably an end game tag)
Step 3: form some other formable tag, reset missions
Step 4: brute force form Great Britain, get the colonial mission tree.
picking continental will probably give you a flag that prevents GB honestly, so you can't come back even if you switch to somebody else (like, y'know, France)
 
  • 3
Reactions:
@Ogele Looks great!
I would like to request a QoL for parlament debate. Every time you click give in demands, every same demand will also get accepted like fire advisor.
Your development team saved EU4 for me, great job!
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: