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HOI4 Dev Diary - A New Germany

Hello everyone, and welcome to a new dev diary for the 1.5 “Cornflakes” update and the as-yet unannounced accompanying DLC.

For those of you who missed my introduction, I’ll briefly introduce myself. My name is Drikus and, after working briefly on DOD to help out the Content Designers on HOI4 back then, I re-joined the team in the summer to work on the next expansion, working with @Archangel85 and @Havebeard on all that CD goodness. Today I’ll be talking about some of the stuff we’ve been busy with since then.

Ever since release it’s become clear that the fanbase's interest in alternate history is far greater than we anticipated. Unfortunately, many of our focus trees for major powers are somewhat lacking in that regard, and it's something we want to change. So, while we will naturally be adding some new focus trees, this time around we will also be revamping two major nations. If this proves popular we plan to keep doing this in future expansions and eventually have all the majors with more options. For now, though, we figured a good start would be the most popular nation in HOI4: Germany!

In the next DLC, Germany will have its focus tree updated to bring it more in line with the new trees of minor nations, especially in terms of alternate history options. Furthermore, even players who do not buy the DLC will see some of these changes. For instance, we made some effort to flesh out the industrial part of the German tree. Initially only being a quick path of 4 focuses, it has now been expanded into a full 16-focus monstrosity, with paths leading into more fortification focuses, more domestic industrial focuses, and more focuses dealing with the ‘economic vassalization’ of Hungary and Romania and other areas of Europe. As a bonus, the 5th research slot is now accessible somewhat earlier, and no longer requires Air Innovations II. These changes do affect industrial balance somewhat, and we will go into how we handle that at the very end of the diary.

Germany Industry.PNG


All of the abovementioned will be free in the 1.5 “Cornflakes” update. What comes next, however, will be part of the DLC.

Use the full tree at the end of this dev diary to follow along. :)

Alternate history paths for Germany beg the question of when and how Hitler could have been stopped. These questions are very controversial, and there usually isn’t much consensus. We, however, have elected to explore the possibility of a concerted Wehrmacht opposition to Hitler, sparked by the Rhineland remilitarization.

Germany Civil War.PNG


A new path has been added, mutually exclusive with the Rhineland focus. It sparks a civil war led by the legendary August von Mackensen. Once won, the path splits, allowing the player to choose between reviving the old Kaiserreich (renaming the country to “German Empire”) and lifting Kaiser Wilhelm II’s exile in the Netherlands, or reinstating democratic elections and establishing a constitutional monarchy as a ‘compromise’ for the rather royalist (and powerful) Wehrmacht officers. In this path, Wilhelm II’s son will take the throne as Wilhelm III as a figurehead. In addition, there is a small 4-focus shared path focusing on the rebuilding of Germany after the Civil War, leading up to the German continental role as a “Bulwark against Bolshevism”.

Germany von Mackensen.PNG

Who wouldn’t want this guy leading their country?

In the Imperial branch, the player now gets the choice of either avenging the Great War, or letting bygones be bygones and focusing on the Communist threat. The former leads to Germany once again asserting its right of a ‘place in the sun’ (bullying China or Japan for the return of Tsingtao), focusing heavily on rebuilding its High Seas Fleet to challenge Britain (including some nice bonuses to battleship production and research), and then taking the fight to the British and French for their colonies. To this end, a new very powerful late-game focus has been added that will flip a significant amount of the country’s military production to naval production, in case the Soviet Union has been defeated and the player wishes to focus on the West (also available to fascists, if the player owns the DLC). The branch also enables the recreation of the Central powers via stimulating imperial sentiment in the Austro-Hungarian successor states and the assassination of Mussolini in favor of King Victor Emmanuel III.

Germany Wilhelm II.PNG

Can never have enough Pickelhaube...

The second Imperial path focuses on forgiving the British and giving up all dreams of an Imperial Navy. In return for accepting British naval supremacy, it is possible to form an alliance with them and stand together against the threat of Communism all over Europe. A punitive war with (Communist) France over Alsace-Lorraine can lead to an expulsion of the republicans from Iberia, as well as eventually taking the war directly to the Soviets, themselves. I minor shared branch, available for both the British alliance and the colonial route, allows for Germany to protect its eastern borders, retaking Memel, trading Danzig for military guarantees against the Soviets, and aiding the Baltics and the Finns with guarantees and some military support.

Germany Tsingtao.PNG

Can you taste that sweet Tsingtao beer? Ahhh, come to fatherland...

The Democratic path involves some sneaky diplomatic maneuvering, scaring the other nations in Europe into your sphere of influence by speaking up strongly against the Soviets and demonizing them. This leads to creating a Central European Alliance, in which most minor nations in Europe can be invited through various focuses, allowing for democratic Germany to challenge the historic French continental leadership role by creating its own power block. This course of action will likely result in the Soviet Union posturing threateningly, though, and gaining various bonuses to prepare them against what they perceive to be a threat to their sphere of influence. The end result of this mutual and intentional escalation is likely that it will not be possible to invite all nations you could potentially invite before the Soviets invade them. Eventually, Germany can take the fight to the Soviets, leading Europe in a war against the source of communism. In addition, it is possible for Democratic Germany to get a 6th research slot, and to strengthen their alliance through tech sharing and other cooperation.

Germany Democratic.PNG

Unleash the Swarm!

In addition, we have adjusted focuses like “Operation Weserübung” to give the player better control over the timetable of their invasions once the ball starts rolling. We’ve slightly buffed the naval parts of the core tree, adding an additional naval build-up focus or two, and adding some dockyards to Plan Z. In light of the significant improvements to Germany’s economic build-up in the new industrial tree, we are also revisiting the start-of-game balance of the nation. The intention is to make Germany initially weaker, but also quicker in building up, especially before any war has broken out. To that end, we have added a new idea upon startup. MEFO Bills will reduce the consumer goods by 20% (resulting in virtually no consumer good requirements at all), but have to be extended every three months. The price of extending these will progressively increase, as will the penalty that must be paid if these are not extended. Paying off these bills can be delayed by going to war, in which case the payment will be deferred until after the war’s conclusion (so be sure you can afford it by that point!). And finally, just as with the industrial segment of the tree, everything that was mentioned in this paragraph will be available without owning the DLC.

Germany MEFO.png


And finally, in its full glory:

Germany_tree.jpg


Don’t forget to check out the World War Wednesday stream later today, where @Da9L and @podcat will go through this dev diary while the rest of us get our asses handed to us by the Allies in South America. We look forward to showing you more cool stuff next week! :)
 
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Could be, it's Alternate History afterall. Still in OTL it took how many outrages for the allies to declare on Hitler? It could be jarring to see the allies prepare for war against a peaceful Germany sitting in her own borders trying to organize central and eastern European defense against the Soviets.

True that. The main reason I would argue differently was that people didn't really have a history with Hitler, but they did have a history with Willhelm II and that wasn't pretty. Its not like France would be glad to see Germany become a active power and create a network of allies again.
 
This is a smart move by Paradox. It will increase the appeal of the DLC to the many players who are mainly interested in playing Germany. But it also tries to appeal to those of us who don't want to play Nazis. I've never been interested in that, so this DLC would open up a whole new area of the map for me.

However, I am puzzled by the choice of von Mackensen. I respect the devs' efforts in trying to find a plausible alt-historical path, but a choice between a Prussian militarist and actual Nazis isn't a very wide spectrum. It's great that players can switch to Konrad Adenauer later on, but we're still talking about pretty right-wing choices. If the German content was the deciding factor in whether to hand over my money, then I'd really want to play as Otto Braun or Hans Vogel, who were genuine patriots in the best black-red-gold traditions of Germany.

But you can't please all of the people all of the time, and many of us will be delighted if the DLC does turn out to include a Chinese focus and other appealing elements.

Think there should be a Communist path. Odd to flesh out the alternate history paths for two of the other ideologies, but not communist.

Quite right. Germany actually had a Communist government from the late 1940s. Not the whole of Germany, and not by choice, but it still seems odd to exclude one of the historical outcomes. Obviously the content designers have limited time though, and if you're only going to have one alt-historical constitution, the semi-democratic regime gives much better gameplay than a communist one.

What are the 2 new symbols next to the training and production meny? Documents and policies?

Full marks for observation!

Is there any buff or any reason a player would choose the unhistorical path in multiplayer?

Sun Tzu said: "By altering his arrangements and changing his plans, he keeps the enemy without definite knowledge." (Art of War, 11.37)

PS: You're missing a capital A in 'Bulwark against Bolshevism'

As I can't access the bug forum, I might as well list these other localization/grammar corrections here... hopefully they'll be of use to you, as they deal with similar issues on the DoD focus trees, and another user in this thread has already mentioned the CZE fort focus name issues.


There was nothing wrong there!

English does not have fixed rules for 'title case' (writing the first letter of each word with a capital letter). However, there is a very common standard where you write the first letter of every word in capital letters except for articles (a, the) and prepositions (against, in, of....). That is the standard that PDX appears to have followed so far in NFs and IIRC the game as a whole. So changing 'Bulwark against Bolshevism' is either introducing an inconsistency, or changing to a new standard (which means making thousands of changes).

English does not require you to be consistent, but this particular change seems to be a simple mistake.

Very interesting.
What are the odds of AI Germany picking the non-nazi path if ahistorical paths are enabled ?

It would be nice to be able to force the AI to be non-nazi or to be nazi even with ahistorical paths enabled (if you want to fight an unpredictable Germany but still preserve the normal WW2 setting).

I would think that changing the odds is one of the easiest things to mod, if you wanted to do this.
 
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Yeah I was also wondering that..... On the other hand returning to the throne might have given him new life energy.
I hope Wilhelm's time gets expanded if he takes the throne.

One of the best role-playing aspects i managed to have on Kaiserreich is that he died on the same day when i managed to capitulate all my enemies, it kinda felt like he was on his deathbed and when he heard the war was finally over he passed away and then it was up to his son to take the throne and rule peacefully.
 
Well, if Paradox do a portrait for Wilhelm III then he can just succeed Wilhelm II when he dies. There's no reason to pretend he didn't die.
 
So, we get a massive alternative history path for Germany called "Oppose Hitler" ... and it's about restoring monarchy of all things?! Why?
No communist path and the democratic path is about constitutional monarchy?

After this and Hungary, why are all the most extensive althistory scenarios about turning this WW2 game into WW1?
Just release Vicky 3 already if that is what you want to make ...
Why wouldn't restoring the monarchy be a valid option? Monarchism still isn't dead as a concept today.
 
Why wouldn't restoring the monarchy be a valid option? Monarchism still isn't dead as a concept today.
It's a pretty dead concept today unless you count the fanboys on the internet. But if you had to decide which group of people could actually overthrow Hitler in 1936, I'd go with conservative army officers. They were already in a position of power while the KPD's membership was decimated via prison or worse.
 
An item which has me curious is the exact details of the Atlantic Wall NF. In many MP games I find myself wanting to build one and rarely getting around to doing much about it. I also see my German opponents make very little progress on building any such fortifications in the west. When D-Day comes it always tends to be overwhelming and Germany quickly collapses shortly thereafter.
 
So if I got this right if i buy the dlc i get the oppose hitler branch and the rest of the tree is free? Or am i missing something? It is little bit unclear exactly what is paid feture. Looks cool tho! Really nice focus tree! :D
 
So if I got this right if i buy the dlc i get the oppose hitler branch and the rest of the tree is free? Or am i missing something? It is little bit unclear exactly what is paid feture. Looks cool tho! Really nice focus tree! :D
The new economic stuff and some of the naval stuff is free with the patch. Rest comes with the expansion.
 
Is there no way to annex Austria and the Sudetenland as the Kaiserreich or democratic Germany?
No because those never belonged to the German empire they were under the rule of the AH one.

On the other hand, the German Republic and/or Kaiserreich has some backing because there is historical context of it being "possible" based on the idea of an "old military" revolt against Hitler when they had a chance to revolt.
Truth be told that had pretty low chances to in 1936. Hitler reinforced the military's loyality to him in 1934 by the night of long knives, that is also when the chances of a truly socialist national socialism died. But I have no problem they push these forward a bit since the game does not start in 1934.

How about a WW1 Expansion?
Well ww1 fits better with HoI mechanics than with Vic Mechanics.
 
No because those never belonged to the German empire they were under the rule of the AH one.


Truth be told that had pretty low chances to in 1936. Hitler reinforced the military's loyality to him in 1934 by the night of long knives, that is also when the chances of a truly socialist national socialism died. But I have no problem they push these forward a bit since the game does not start in 1934.


Well ww1 fits better with HoI mechanics than with Vic Mechanics.
There was almost an officers revolt during the Sudeten crisis. But making that tree only become usable 2 years into the game probably would mess with gameplay.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oster_conspiracy
 
Meaty. Thank you.

It would still be nice to know how Paradox will fix the naval engine so that you can't have a mega-naval battle that lasts days in which nothing is sunk except hordes of DD's. That just kills (slaughters, mutilates, exsanguinates) immersion. :)
 
If Kaiser Bill is back on the throne, then UK and France should get an immediate free war goal against Germany to overthrow or have him killed him. They would not stand for it after the first world war.
 
Can we have some more accurate political spectrum in HOI4? What about Communist - Socialist (more or less democratic, but more radically left than normal democratic left wing, and less radical than the Russian model of Communist regime) - Democratic - Authoritarian - Fascist? It just odd and unrealistic to through everything not fitting the "big three" into "non-aligned". Not even mentioning Spanish Republic were not Communist, but more fitting to Socialist definition.