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Modding Development Diary #1: Guest entry - Paradox Mods in Cities: Skylines II

Introduction​

Right! So the time has come to lift the lid off of the modding interface and its backing service.

As many of you know, Paradox has been running our own mods backend for years, inventively named Paradox Mods. As a matter of fact, the first game that we hosted mods for was the Xbox version of Cities: Skylines I.

In order to give players on all platforms the same possibilities, PC and console alike, the Cities: Skylines II team has chosen to use Paradox Mods to officially host mods for the game. Now, the discerning reader might be wondering what that means for players and how they interact with mods. Read on!

The player experience​

As we have seen in other titles, primarily Surviving Mars, offering access to mods from inside the game itself means that many more players interact with them and more people discover the fun that comes with modding a game.

In Cities: Skylines II, the interface to Paradox Mods will be found in the game’s main menu. Have a look:
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The Paradox Mods interface will allow you to discover, search and just plain browse through mods from inside the game. Additionally, our staff will highlight especially interesting, popular or unique mods for your consideration.

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In common with other games that use Paradox Mods, the interface will allow you to create and manage playsets. If you have played other Paradox titles, the concept might be familiar, but if it’s new to you, playsets are basically “playlists for mods that form easily togglable experiences.” If you place a mod that has a dependency in a playset, you’ll be automatically asked if you want to add all dependencies (yes, we do resolve the entire tree of dependencies).

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Of course, the in-game interface is not the only way to manage your mods: Playsets can be constructed from the Paradox Mods website as well. There, mods can be added, removed and toggled - and all of this will then be synced to your game automatically. Likewise, playsets are stored in our backend and will be replicated to all devices you happen to play the game on. And consequently: No, your carefully constructed playsets will not disappear if your computer lets out the magic smoke inside.

Mods discussions are also available directly from in-game - but the same discussions are also present on our forums, if you would rather post from a web interface. You can also find links to other (SoMe) platforms related to the mod, if pointed out by the creator.

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Naturally, there are other ways to get mods than from Paradox Mods; creating them yourself for instance. Of course, the game will allow you to add local mods of any source to your playsets - Be aware that these will not be cloud-synced and will indeed be lost on catastrophic system failure.

The creator experience​

Now, in order to have actual mods to play with there needs to be ways of submitting mods to the game.
You can find instructions on how to upload your map and code mods here.
And how to create them to begin with, which we’ll leave to our friends at Colossal Order to share more information about, starting tomorrow!

We can mention that, as a mod creator you can add metadata to your mod such as description, screenshots, dependencies, release notes, supported game version etc. This information can be changed at any time through the Paradox Mods website as well. If you so wish, you can also add a discussion section to your mod.

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This wraps up our little teaser from the Paradox Mods team, and we're buzzing with excitement to get this out to you as soon as we’re allowed. We're all ears for your feedback because, let's face it, we're on a mission to create something of value across all platforms, blemishes and all.

Tomorrow Colossal Order is back, they will go into detail about the in-game editor where you create the actual mods that will in turn populate the Paradox Mods library!

Paradox Mods releases on the 25th of March, together with the Beach Properties Asset Pack!
 
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this is more information than we've gotten out of every WOTW combined lol. please don't go anywhere @SimNationJan
 
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How does Paradox Mods handle deleted dependencies? If a modder wants to delete something everybody else relies on is there a mechanism for Paradox to instead preserve it as "abandoned" so that 1) everything that relies on it doesn't break and 2) someone could possibly take it over? Missing dependencies are a bane on the Steam Workshop.
 
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It also gives Paradox/CO better ability to moderate content for content they do not approve/like or that may have copyright violations. This will most likely be the most used use-case scenario of using PDX mods over Steam workshop.

If Paradox has a planned DLC but theres already products of it on mods then they can just remove the mods of similar products. Same if they receive a takedown notice, it'll be easier for PDX to remove subsequent content.

Not that I agree with these use-cases, but they are how I see PDX/CO using their own built in platform rather than a 3rd party like Steam

I'm all for dunking on Paradox and CO, but you guys have some weird ideas of what Steam and the Workshop there does. Every dev has the right and ability to moderate the mods on the workshop for their games too. Gabe isn't going to jump in front of them in shining armour to prevent removal of mods for the sake of the players. Its just another platform for mods, like Paradox mods is. Now, who knows if Paradox Mods is going to compare when it comes to ease of use and features. Guess we will see on that.
 
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Will we able to choose where mods are downloaded? Asset files can get pretty big and if default location is in main drive it might cause problems for people with small main drive and a separate drive for games
Since the files get stored in the AppData/LocalLow folder structure it looks like you need to have your users folder data being saved to your desired drive to have this a thing... it's not something M$ recommend but it is doable.
 
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Cool, a mod repository. Was it worth all the effort to replicate what we already had established with the steam workshop?

Also you keep saying this - “In order to give players on all platforms the same possibilities, PC and console alike, the Cities: Skylines II team has chosen to use Paradox Mods”

But anyone paying attention knows that Console players will not receive code mods, and therefore will not receive any assets or maps that rely on code mods. So is it purposely disingenuous language? Or do you just not fully understand that the same possibilities will not be possible on console?
As they say themselves, PDXMod has been around for a while and is working fine. The delay has nothing to do with it. The problem is that the game did not handle mods until recently (and it still cannot support asset import).
 
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That’s probably not the case for some subsection of assets and maps.

There’s likely to be a comparability toggle. At a minimum, many assets and maps will be vanilla and not require a mod dependency.

It’s not misleading, just nuanced. I imagine most players who are interested in taking advantage of these features will dive into the weeds.
It’s nuanced? Okay fair - Please tell me what nuance that CO has used then. Because all of their messaging says it’s “mods for all” yet console will receive NO mods.
 
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I think the problem is even a lot of players are calling assets mods. Seen it times and times again. For example the entire "modding" community for TpF and TpF2 is mostly just assets. But they are still called modders for some reasons.

This code/asset thing is indeed confusing for most everybody. Any MODification of the game should be called a mod. Especially since an asset can run some non-vanilla code, like the services or even some buildings. And as Gaseous Stranger said, some maps and assets depends on code mods.

On another note: the first things that leapt at me when I opened the CS1 Steam workshop were the new mods from authors I followed. I hope we'll be able to follow authors in PDXMods.
 
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+1 for Geforce Now compatibility. I know they said in the FAQ that it wasn't going to work on Geforce Now, but EU4s Paradox mods and assets works in Geforce Now.
 
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It’s nuanced? Okay fair - Please tell me what nuance that CO has used then. Because all of their messaging says it’s “mods for all” yet console will receive NO mods.

It’s nuanced and I think you’re right. I saw and liked your subsequent post. Co/Pdx can and should be more clear about their language selection to avoid confusion.

I tend to believe consumers have some responsibility to know what they’re buying and how it works, but I also know that some don’t do that sometimes.

So PDX should be more clear, including in those twitter and IG post that use screen grabs but don’t highlight that some images may be from modded cities.

Assets
Code Mods
Custom Maps

It really isn’t that hard.
 
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I know a lot of work went into this but I still kind of hope it fails quickly so that Paradox will allow the Steam workshop to be enabled. No matter how much work goes into reinventing the wheel, Steam's ergonomics aren't a reasonable target for any company without their level of funding and focus.

Steam workshop sucks as a mod platform. It’s just convenient. Get over it.
If it's convenient, that means it doesn't suck. Convenience is the purpose of a mod platform. If not for convenience, you might as well just download the mods from the creator's git.
 
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The browse tab is suspiciously missing from the main post.
Are you hiding the paid mods part?
For the record, I believe there will be an ability to add a donate button to a mod.

Alright, so - I really have to know because this sensitive nerve from various communities has always struck me a bit odd.
How would offering a creator be able to monetize their creations be strategically any different than say, Patreon?
Maybe I'm biased because I'm in software, but what's the big deal with offering a platform for creators to make a few bucks for their mods?
 
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For the record, I believe there will be an ability to add a donate button to a mod.

Alright, so - I really have to know because this sensitive nerve from various communities has always struck me a bit odd.
How would offering a creator be able to monetize their creations be strategically any different than say, Patreon?
Maybe I'm biased because I'm in software, but what's the big deal with offering a platform for creators to make a few bucks for their mods?
There are two issues: donation/purchase and what share the game developer/mode platform takes.
 
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It’s nuanced? Okay fair - Please tell me what nuance that CO has used then. Because all of their messaging says it’s “mods for all” yet console will receive NO mods.
There's a lot of other distribution platforms on PC other than Steam and these customers didn't receive any mods or custom assets for CS1. CO doesn't want to repeat this with CS2 again
 
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