• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Stellaris Dev Diary #169 - Origins Q&A

01_EMBASSY_PROPOSE

Today we're continuing the Q&A series we're doing, answering questions related to different topics. Last week we asked you to post your questions related to Origins, which were previously revealed in Dev Diary #160.

Here we go!

General Origins Questions

How will randomly created AI empires choose an origin? Will it be completely random, or are some more likely to show up than others? If the latter, which logic does it follow?
The weightings are scriptable. The default currently has a weight of 100, others that are available to the AI (which is most of them) have between 2 and 10, so statistically you are likely to have a few of them once you have 10+ AI nations. Some origins like Doomsday are also blocked for advanced AIs as that wouldn't fit the narrative.

Many are also restricted so they will only randomly generate if that origin is not already represented in the galaxy.


Are there any events related to each Origin? (And many similar questions.)
Yes. Some origins, such as the Galactic Doorstep, are primarily narrative-based and thus have many events. Others, like the Shattered Ring, are primarily changes to an empire's starting conditions and have few, if any (other than custom start text).

Will the preset empires have different origins? Will they have new civics picked to substitute those that become origins? (What will happen with the Xanid Suzerainty for example?)
Yes, preset empires have origins. Most of them have Prosperous Unification, but some have others.

Empires that previously had civics that have been turned into origins will have new civics given to them. As examples, the Xanid Suzerainty now has Corvée System and Cutthroat Politics, and the Lokken Mechanists have Technocracy and Meritocracy.

Can you change your origins through events?
No, that would involve timeline alterations and the potential destruction of the space-time continuum.

Will there be origins that allow for special tech, that is otherwise unobtainable? For example, could a Fallen Empire share tech for Fallen empire buildings with you if you choose the Scion start?
We do not currently have any origins that have unobtainable tech, but this would be possible.

I believe you mentioned before that each origin had special events. Will we still have the special start events of say Mass Extinction, Habitable planet survey, and Radical Cult events? Will they still happen even if we pick say Doomsday or Remnants or Void Dwellers?
Some event chains have been disabled for certain Origins, when they no longer made sense.

Do Fallen Empires have origins?
Yes, for flavor they have been given a unique "Elder Race" Origin.

Will origins affect the likelihood of precursor event chains?
No.

How will Origins for pre-FTL species that achieve spaceflight be determined?
This depends on whether they discover spaceflight on their own or if they’ve been enlightened.

Why can’t [empire type] take [origin]?
This varies from origin to origin. For origins that are event-heavy, the decision to exclude [empire type] may have been one to control scripting scope. Some others are for mechanical or balance reasons.

See the Bonus! section for the tale of the Iribots, when scripts go bad.


Are the special machine empire and hive mind types being moved to origins?
No. They remain civics.

What Origin (outside of doomsday) is the weakest? Which one is the strongest?
This is very subjective, but I’d say Life-Seeded and (non-Lithoid) Shattered Ring. (Though Life-Seeded is very strong with a certain precursor, and the two Federation starts can be quite strong as well.)

Prosperous Unification
upload_2020-2-13_9-41-43.png


4 extra pops will usually mean an extra building slot available. Will this be open or will it be pre-filled?
If an extra slot is available it will usually be open, but a few possible combinations do fill the slot. (For example, one of the Hive Mind starts has it filled with a Hive Warren.)

Did/would you ever considered including one or two other “generic” origins, as opposed to just prosperous unification? Why isn't there a "Unification by War" Origin?
Prosperous Unification does not necessarily mean peaceful unification. If a militarist or authoritarian nation unified their planet through war, the origin still works.

The main design desire for Prosperous Unification was to provide a “default” origin that could apply to a wide variety of empires.


Mechanist / Syncretic Evolution
upload_2020-2-13_9-42-5.png
upload_2020-2-13_9-42-17.png


After the update will slaver guilds still be incompatible with syncretic evolution?
Syncretic Evolution remains incompatible with several civics.

Life-Seeded / Post-Apocalyptic
upload_2020-2-13_9-42-32.png
upload_2020-2-13_9-42-41.png


Will Agrarian Idyll civic be compatible with Post-Apocalyptic, Remnants, Shattered Ring and Void Dwellers origins or will there be some weird interaction between them?
Agrarian Idyll is incompatible with these origins.

Are there any changes to Life-Seeded pops (e.g. some sort of beneficial trait)?
No. Life-Seeded and Post-Apocalyptic have traditionally been considered “challenge” civics. Not quite as much as Doomsday so there’s no warning text, but they’re generally on the harder side.

Remnants / Shattered Ring
upload_2020-2-13_9-43-7.png
upload_2020-2-13_9-43-13.png


Will the Remnants or Shattered Ring origins set a species' habitability trait to Relic or Ring World, respectively?
Currently they retain their species habitability in both of these cases.

Does the Ringworld origin count as a megastructure, and such, increase the odds of rolling the megastructure tech?
Yes.

Do we have a way to repair the other sections earlier through events/anomalies, or do we have to wait for mega engineering?
Mega-Engineering is required as normal to rebuild the other sections.

Is the decision to be able to repair only 3 sections final?
We have no plans to change this.

Will the "Shattered Ring" Origin come with any intended downside?
Mineral acquisition tends to be a major issue for this origin. The “Arcane Generator” also pushes them to have a very unspecialized homeworld since it will only support one district of each type.

How will you obtain minerals? Will Lithoids be able to choose this origin, and if yes, will there be adjustments for them eating minerals?
Lithoids can choose this origin, but it won’t be easy for them, especially since while Ringworlds have an Agricultural Segment they don’t have anything similar for Minerals. They are likely to need to use the internal market to feed their pops.

How do Ringworld starts work in terms of segment jobs? Do they function the same as regular segments, in that they instantly give 20+ jobs upon completion?
They function as regular ringworld segments.

Void Dwellers
upload_2020-2-13_9-43-29.png


Are the 3 habitats inhabited at the beginning of the game?
Yes, all three habitats are inhabited.

Will the Void Dwellers origin give a discount on influence to build habitats? If not, will they have trouble keeping up with planet dwellers?
No discount on habitats, but they have other bonuses.

Do void dwellers lose their efficiency bonus outside of habitats?
Yes, and they also get a large growth penalty.

Is the void dweller perk locked with the habitability perk? Like for example, you can not keep this perk if you change your pops habitability to another climate type.
The Void Dweller trait is separate from their habitability preference. If you turn your pops into Desert Preference, they will still be Void Dwellers with Desert Preference, and will suffer large penalties on planets.

The opening text for Void Dwellers mentions starting in a trinary system. Does this override the selection made for system type when customizing your empire (like choosing the Sol system)? Also, do any of the other Origins have similar overrides?
Yes. Doomsday and Shattered Ring also override the system type selection in empire customization.

Scion
upload_2020-2-13_9-43-41.png


Can we have more details on the unique vassalage contract for Scions? (And many similar questions…)
Scions are able to expand, cannot be integrated, are brought into their overlord’s wars, and are permitted to engage in limited diplomacy.

They can Improve or Harm Relations, Insult, Declare Wars, Make Claims, Offer Trade Deals, Form Commercial Pacts, Form Research Agreements.

They can not Guarantee Independence, Create or Join Federations (though theoretically if their overlord awakened and ended up in one they’d come along…), or control their own Borders.

They also gain a special CB to bring other empires into their master’s loving family.

upload_2020-2-13_11-17-23.png


If there are many empires with Scion Origins, are you likely to be a vassal of the same Fallen Empire?
Yes. Scions typically end up as vassals of the materialist and spiritualist fallen empires, if they exist.

How will the scion origin affect relations with other empires?
This is mostly affected by being unable to pursue certain diplomatic actions.

How will standard diplomacy between FE and scion be different from normal?
Your overlord will have a higher opinion of you, and may involve themselves in your affairs from time to time.

How will the scion origin affect participation in federations and/or the galactic community?
As noted earlier, Scions cannot choose to join federations since they are vassals, but they are free to become members of the galactic community.

(Many questions about Scion events.)
Scions have more frequent (and unique) encounters with the fallen empires. Your overlord will make more demands of you than they would of a normal empire, but will also help you more often. They are likely to intervene if you get yourself into too much trouble - you are their favorite pets after all.

Is scion a status that can be maintained or lost? If so, what kinds of events or actions could bring such about? What would be the benefits/detriments of maintaining or losing scion status, if such a status can be lost?
Like other vassals, you can free yourself from your oppressive masters, throwing off the burden of having a helpful fallen empire overlord that is especially fond of you.

Galactic Doorstep
upload_2020-2-13_9-43-54.png


Does the gateway in Galactic doorstep lead to a unique system or is it a simple gateway?
It’s a common gateway, and will as such have a ‘counterpart’ in another, random location in space. The real difference is the potential of having access to remote places before anyone else. Which can be both boon and bane.

Will you be able to activate the gateway without the technology (for example by an anomaly project on the gateway).
In a sense, but generally no. However, the required Gateway Technology is linked to the Origin chain of events.

Tree of Life
upload_2020-2-13_9-44-4.png


How exactly does the sapling work? Do we get another Tree of Life with the same benefits on newly colonized and conquered planets?
The colony ships used by the Tree of Life hives are significantly more expensive, but will place a sapling on other worlds. The saplings aren’t as mighty as the original.

upload_2020-2-13_9-44-18.png
upload_2020-2-13_9-44-24.png


Will it still allow us to Terraform to Hive worlds?
Yes. The tree is part of the hive.

How does the "Tree of Life" work with lithoid Hive? Is is just normal tree or lithoid tree?
They have a normal tree of life.

How will other Empires interact with Tree of Life, if they conquered planet with Tree? Especially if another Empire is "Tree of Life" Hive too?
If the tree wasn’t destroyed during the bombardment, it will be destroyed if the planet changes hands. Other tree of life empires will want their own tree.

The Tree of Life just seems like a straight up massive buff for hiveminds; realistically, if you lose your homeworld, you're already toast, as a hivemind; this just gives a ton of free bonuses; are there hidden downsides?
Downsides include the more expensive colony ships and that you’ll suffer penalties on planets that do not have a sapling, such as after invading a planet.

On the Shoulders of Giants
upload_2020-2-13_9-44-35.png


Are there different outcomes possible to certain Origin-related events? For example, does the Origin "On the Shoulders of Giants" always end in the same events or are things randomized enough that the related event chain could end in multiple different outcomes or benefits?
Yes. In the beginning the differences are trivial, but the later part of the Origin provides more potential divergence. That being said, all outcomes are within the same ‘realm of narrative’, meaning that they revolve the same theme (which is the Origin’s story).

Calamitous Birth
upload_2020-2-13_9-44-46.png


Do they still have normal Colony ships?
Yes.

What about other special ones like the Civilian Colony Ship that now resides with the Megacorp Civic?
Yes.

Resource Consolidation
upload_2020-2-13_9-44-56.png


Will there be any drawbacks to picking a machine world start? / Will the resource Consolidation remove your starting resources from the planets and asteroids that are in your home system? The flavor text seems to point towards this.
Your starting system is entirely devoid of resources (except for the star), as they were all used to build the Machine World.

Common Ground / Hegemon
upload_2020-2-13_9-45-12.png
upload_2020-2-13_9-45-19.png


Is it possible to choose the portraits and species names for the federation and hegemon starts?
No, these are always randomized.

Will there be an option for the "Common Ground" Origin (or maybe another Origin in the future) to start in a different form of Federation like the Trade league?
There is no such option at the moment, but you can change your federation type later in the game.

Will the Common Ground origin let you change, immediately, your federation type?
Only if you can get your federation members to agree to do so.

For Common Ground and Hegemony -- are your sibling empires in the starting federation fully functional AI empires? If they are fully functional empires, does the player have any tools to direct their expansion?
They are indeed fully functional AI empires, and as such there is no way to direct their expansion.

Are you moving the form federation tradition to the opener effect or are you actually getting two traditions for free to start?
If you pick these Origins, you will start with the Diplomacy tree unlocked and "The Federation" tradition.

Will the other federation types, research, military and trade, have their own origin types. If none of these currently do can these be added in / modded in?
Other federation types do not have their own Origins, but this would be easy to mod.

Will federations from origins increase the number of ai in the game?
Yes, the federation members that are spawned from these Origins are added on top of the AIs that were specified in the game set up.

Does Hegemon require authoritarian ethics?
No. It is open to non-gestalt, non-xenophobes that are not locked out of diplomacy. The flavor of the origin suggests that the Hegemony has been around for a while, and it’s possible that your empire had an authoritarian past.

(Xenophobes are blocked from the federation starts because your generated partner empires tend to be generally aligned with your ethics, and a coalition of xenophobes proved to be entertainingly but unpleasantly unstable.)


Will Megacorps start in a trade league if they pick the federation origin?
No.

Will a Hegemony start have any advantage over the lessers in the federation to avoid getting usurped early?
They will not have specific advantages, but based on the initial laws, to seize leadership of the Hegemony a minion will have to exceed your Diplomatic Weight by 25%. (It may prove difficult to retain control on higher difficulty levels.)

Doomsday
upload_2020-2-13_9-45-32.png


Can the Origin of a randomly appearing AI empire be set to Doomsday?
If no players have selected it, a randomly spawned AI empire can start with the Doomsday Origin. Only one, though.

Are there any novels or movies that inspired Doomsday?
Well, yeah… Pretty much any story with exploding planets (#neverforgetalderaan). But the biggest influence may very well be the contemporary situation with Earth and its climate.

Any hope for a slider changing the amount of time it takes for your homeworld to blow up in the "Doomsday" origin?
Nothing like that is planned, no.

For Doomsday ... is 64 years the final value?
Nope. It’s changed to be more random. And shorter, so you’d best be moseying off that rock ASAP!

Will there be a mechanic to evacuate the population of your home planet to your colonies?
Resettlement and immigration push.

Is there something special planned with the remains of the destroyed home-world?
It does leave a resource deposit behind.

Are fanatic egalitarian empires that take the Doomsday origin… doomed? (Since they can’t resettle their pops?)
Pretty much.

Lost Colony
upload_2020-2-13_9-45-42.png


Will there be events and/or Diplomatic Modifiers linking you to the other empire? Something i didn't like with the Commonwealth of man in the Base Game was that the United Nations usually disliked you since you were Xenophobe and vice versa, despite you being members of the same species originating from the same planet not so long ago.
No new diplomatic modifiers beyond those that already exist. Even if you happened to originate on the same planet, there will still be friction between you if your ethics clash.

Does the Commonwealth of Man / United Nations of Earth utilise the Lost Colony origin? Will there be any more specific events when re-discovering each other?
The Commonwealth uses the Lost Colony origin, and there is now a unique first contact message when it encounters the UNE.

Other Origins

Are you planning to add more Origins after Federations? / Will there be some type of origin allowing you to start in the L cluster? / Are there plans for a Psionic Origin in the future? / Do you plan to add specific Origins for mega-corporations?
We are likely to add more Origins in the future, but can’t comment on what they will be at this time.

Any cool origins ideas that didn't make the cut? / Could you share any origins that were considered, but rejected for one reason or another?
Many. Origins started with a massive brainstorming session, which gave us a list of dozens, which we then had to cull.

Some that didn’t make the cut for now included:

  • Third Time’s a Charm: Your empire’s first two attempts at colonization utilizing STL-technology have failed. Your empire starts with low intel on their guaranteed planets. Those two planets have leftover districts already built.
  • Fratricide: Must be Xenophobe, may not be pacifist. Your starting system also contains a tomb world. Another sentient species used to exist in the same star system, but after many decades of unspeakable violence, your species came out on top.
  • Escaped Slaves: The captain of a slaving vessel suffered a fatal accident at the hands of his cargo, and they’ve managed to land on a nearby world. Start with a mix of pops from other species in the galaxy instead of just your chosen species.

We also had a Birthed by Calamity origin proposal that involved Space Amoebas for fans of Bubbles.


Modding

Can you make an origin require a civic, or vice versa?
Yes.

How deeply integrated with other game files will Origins be? I.e. how easy will it be to create separate Origin mods without causing a file conflict?
Everything Origins-related are in separate files, and fairly easy to find. However, much like with space ships, Origins often involve work in several different files in order to work, not to mention the fact that the type of Origin may very well make it 'bleed' into other types of files. It's not complicated, but it is complex. It's not uncommon for a single Origin to have more than a dozen anchors in different files.

Origins can be made infinitely complex, and thus have infinite potential to conflict or not conflict with other elements of the game. (More seriously, modders should be able to do a lot with no conflicts - depending on what they do of course! Startup effects are the one bit that might be complicated, but I think they can get around conflicts there.)


From a modding perspective, is there anything origins can do that civics can't, and vice-versa?
Origins can select the system initializer the country uses for its home system. Civics can be unpicked.

While creating a new empire, do we select authority and civics first, or select the origin first? Since some origins are locked behind certain authorities, do they have country scoped potential and allow in script wise?
Origins are before Government and Ethics in the empire creation screen. Selecting incompatible ethics, civics, or authorities will render the origin selection invalid. You can script playable and possible restrictions as desired.

When an AI empire is created, does it select its origin or civics first? (important for me to know so I can balance the ai weights accordingly)
Ethics, then origin, then civics.

Bonus!

What is the weirdest bug you've encountered with origins so far?
Pretty early on in development, I noticed some weird things going on in the galaxy, so I switched over to observer mode to see what happened. Let me regale you with the story of the Iribots...

The Iribot Experiment was a perfectly normal machine empire. Introspective, with OTA updates, and Primary Link Qube oversaw the Iribots efficiently do their thing on the desert planet of Ir.

upload_2020-2-13_9-45-52.png


Tragically, as a Lost Colony (before any restrictions were implemented), they had lost contact with their original homeworld.

So, where was their original homeworld?

Across the galaxy, in the Chibblar system upon the world of Clanck.

upload_2020-2-13_9-46-1.png


A world with a dark secret.

And no atmosphere.

upload_2020-2-13_9-46-13.png


Clanck is a barren planet, with no buildings since it's not actually a habitable world. See, machines have no habitability preference, so when the Lost Colony script tried to make an advanced empire with a matching habitability, it found a world that had no habitability!

Now little things like having an atmosphere didn’t stop the Iribots from forming a Megacorporation. They were an Authoritarian, Xenophobe, Pacifist Media Conglomerate that had an Indentured Workforce.

They were led by Chief Executive Officer Affinitor, who was a Fertility Preacher. On a barren world. For robots.

upload_2020-2-13_9-46-25.png


Oh, and since they were a bunch of robots that aren't part of a Machine Intelligence, and didn't have the Droids technology...

upload_2020-2-13_9-46-31.png


They were literally a mindless media conglomerate.


Next Week

Next week, our Tech Lead Moah will be posting a dev diary giving an update on performance improvements planned for the 2.6 "Verne" update.
 
Last edited:
  • 1Like
Reactions:
The reason for the -20% on the same climate, is that even within "continental" there is variation.
The bonus to Homeworld habitability only applies if it has not been terraformed.

So the reason for the -30% on Habitats (wich is easily offset by the time you got to Habitats) is actually what is in effect here. It might be perfectly controled, but it is still that disconcerting.

this is my point:

A human gets 100% on our perfect Earth, as does their ideal replicated conditions on Ring Worlds or terraformed planets. Other continental planets with slightly less ideal conditions get 80% max without any other bonuses. The habitat gives them slightly lower than that 70%. A Wet planet that isn't continental like Jungle gives them 60%. And completely different planet types like Dry and Cold give them 20%

20% for any planet type for people who became adapted to artificial space habitats (that still have some terrain, vegetation, etc as we saw in the pics) makes sense. But 20% for a ring world doesn't make sense. There should still be some compromise like we play Earth but still colonize Jungle and Ocean planets with the 60% hab - not great, not terrible either. A ring world is something between a real planet and a space station.
Yes, all Phobias are stupid. Being stupidly excessive is the definition of a phobia.
i'm taking back this "phobia" argument completely cause Void Dwellers aren't belters stuck in tin cans like was suggested on previous pages, as we see in the artifact Habitats have domes, you see space or whatever sky they choose to display there. They are *not* space dwarves

Normal species do not get a +15% to Yield on a Habitat either and their penalty is -30% despite the ideal controlled environment.
So again, your argument is inherently wrong.

i wouldn't call it inherently wrong. a habitat is still not as good as a planet even with domes.. more restrictions, less space, etc. its still better than another planet type though. going the other way way, that more freedom is going to make the Void Dwellers suffer as bad as a jelly fish on a desert planet is just mental gymnastics. Tomb World preference still gets decent hab in all other planet types.
Also how much growth and habitability penalty are Void Dwellers getting? I see no figure here.
Ringworlds and Gaia still start at 100% (like all other ideal Planets), so even a -20% habitability is trivially offset with technology.

i presume its going to be -80% before any bonuses just like regular planets
 
Nope. Aliens in Stellaris all breathe the same nitrogen-oxygen atmosphere per planet type descriptions and are largely separated by the biome they are adapted for, not by anything else. Ringworlds can support all species because they're MASSIVE and have room to include every possible planetary biome in excess. So you can have a few planet-sized deserts for desert-dwelling species to inhabit alongside a few planet-sized glacial regions. Or mix them all up a bit more, same end result.

However, you CANNOT replicate a low-gravity sterile environment on a ringworld surface without enclosing it within specialized infrastructure. Which is what the low habitability maluses reflect the effects of.

i concede the nitrogen-oxygen point cause its right there in the description for Gaia worlds but everything else is just your interpretation. how do you know they're not separated by anything? invasive species even between different parts of Earth can be devastating. there is still a 20% difference between the hab of your homeworld and other worlds of the same type, this gap must be closed and maintained by artificial means so it perfectly suits the host species physiology. unless you are going to say next that that homeworlds of every species in the galaxy also just happen to have 100% compatible biomes that don't interfere with each other which is another retarded hand-wave like 1 G.

finally, at the very least these ideal 100% hab conditions for species are "enclosed in specialized infrastructure" when it comes to WORK cause completely different species with different habs work in not only the same districts but the same buildings/building complexes. Why is it that closed environments of some sort are possible for this but not for Void Dwellers?
 
finally, at the very least these ideal 100% hab conditions for species are "enclosed in specialized infrastructure" when it comes to WORK cause completely different species with different habs work in not only the same districts but the same buildings/building complexes. Why is it that closed environments of some sort are possible for this but not for Void Dwellers?
Presumably because it's a lot easier to regulate the environments of individual decks than it is of a wide-open planetary environment.

Habitats are, AGAIN, climate-controlled tin cans with a fully closed-loop environment. The biodomes are glorified gardens sitting on top of a huge facility with a combined internal volume comparable to the surface of a small moon. Void Dwellers are adapted not just to live in that tightly-regulated, enclosed space, but also on pre-FTL/low tech ships for mining and maintenance purposes (per the Void Dweller backstory being three separate habitats that only recently made contact with each other after some inferred previous calamity).

That's not something you can replicate on a planetary surface, no matter how large, without making sacrifices to productivity and spending more on the living standards of individual POPs.

Like habitability maluses represent.
 
Presumably because it's a lot easier to regulate the environments of individual decks than it is of a wide-open planetary environment.

Habitats are, AGAIN, climate-controlled tin cans with a fully closed-loop environment. The biodomes are glorified gardens sitting on top of a huge facility with a combined internal volume comparable to the surface of a small moon.

it is not a planetary surface, it is an artificial space station that looks and feels like a planet. if the space station systems stopped working it would all go to hell. it is just as "closed loop" as a habitat.

Void Dwellers are adapted not just to live in that tightly-regulated, enclosed space, but also on pre-FTL/low tech ships for mining and maintenance purposes (per the Void Dweller backstory being three separate habitats that only recently made contact with each other after some inferred previous calamity).

thats great for them, they can live on mining ships if they have to and be fine, other species not so much.

That's not something you can replicate on a planetary surface, no matter how large, without making sacrifices to productivity and spending more on the living standards of individual POPs.

replicate what? we are already building entire separate "decks" or "facilities" for every type of species to have 100% hab while they work, where's the cost of that?
 
it is not a planetary surface, it is an artificial space station that looks and feels like a planet. if the space station systems stopped working it would all go to hell. it is just as "closed loop" as a habitat.
Mm, no. We're talking about the difference between "a terrarium as a closed loop environment" versus "the planet as a closed-loop environment".
 
why, what's the difference? they are both bubbles in space, one is just donut space and bigger and more complex. none if this implies a habitability malus for one specific species but 100% for the rest. and stop hitting the disagree button if we're the only 2 people talking its cringe
 
After the update will slaver guilds still be incompatible with syncretic evolution?
Syncretic Evolution remains incompatible with several civics.
upload_2020-2-13_9-42-17.png

How about Indentured Assets? That does the same as the slave guilds but is not on this list.
Is it because the IA uses the new slave rights and so has enough specialists?
upload_2020-1-16_10-26-41.png
 
why, what's the difference? they are both bubbles in space, one is just donut space and bigger and more complex. none if this implies a habitability malus for one specific species but 100% for the rest. and stop hitting the disagree button if we're the only 2 people talking its cringe

In short: the difference is complexity.

Long answer: A planet has thousands of separate ecosystems, billions of animals, and a whole bunch of other stuff. A ringworld is effectively multiple planets which are fully connected to each other (based off tiles, around 10 times a planet. Base off of realism, around 3 million times a planet). A habitat is a series of connected terrariums, each of which has a complexity significantly less then even the least habitable planetary biomes. Any plants or animals exist either to fulfill a mechanical purpose (CO2 -> 02, food) or purely for the sake of the organic crew. While there are areas that are bio-domes with gravity and are virtually identical (at a surface level) to planetary surfaces, it's only a few areas.

So what about Void Dwellers? They key thing to remember about this trait is it gives +15% production to habitats. How do you get people being more productive? Because they are used to exploiting the natural advantage of an orbital habitat: low/null gravity. Even the heaviest loads can be moved by a single worker, various production techniques can exploit the lack of gravity (or suddenly shifting gravity in multiple directions).

Someone with Habitat Habitability is used to the limited, constructed ecosystem of habitats, and so requires a similarly balanced/perfect ecosystem (such as a ringworld, Gaia planet, or ecumenopolis) to thrive. Someone with the Void Dwellers trait is used to low/null G, and so the constant gravity of a ringworld, Gaia planet, or ecumenopolis is still draining/crippling to them.

And before anyone asks, a ringworld has to spin for the physics to at all work out. I mean sure you could hand wave it, but still.
 
How about Indentured Assets? That does the same as the slave guilds but is not on this list.
Is it because the IA uses the new slave rights and so has enough specialists?
Seems more like an oversight. Normal slaver guilds can use the new slavery type too.

I want to know why, of ALL things, Shared Burdens is on the list.
 
Seems more like an oversight. Normal slaver guilds can use the new slavery type too.

I want to know why, of ALL things, Shared Burdens is on the list.
I think it's because syncretic evolution imply superior and inferior relationship via trait prole so it's incompatible with share burden that means all are equal(?)
 
I think it's because syncretic evolution imply superior and inferior relationship via trait prole so it's incompatible with share burden that means all are equal(?)
Yeah, it very much seems a "thematics" issue. A society with Shared Burdens seems unlikely to have culled and selectively bred their sibling-species until they were just big dumb children.
 
Unless the so called “late game lag” defect is fixed (yes, it’s a defect)
Please give a exact definition of this Problem (exact computer stats and background processes included) and a proper "solved" definiton.
Without that it is not a solveable defect.

Please note that there are close to infinite other computer stats, and solving it from any one of the first may have priority.
Also note that there are minimum and reccomendet stats. For anything below them it is not a defect.

A human gets 100% on our perfect Earth, as does their ideal replicated conditions on Ring Worlds or terraformed planets. Other continental planets with slightly less ideal conditions get 80% max without any other bonuses.
What the heck are you talking about????

Terraformed Planets start at 20%/60%/80% Habitability like all other of that Climate as defined by the Habitatbiltiy trait for the species.

Indeed homeworlds have a 80% habitatbiltiy too. But Homeworlds also give a passive +30% Habitability bonus to every species marked as considering it their "home planet" (this planet is saved in the species properties), until terraformed into anything else.

i'm taking back this "phobia" argument completely cause Void Dwellers aren't belters stuck in tin cans like was suggested on previous pages, as we see in the artifact Habitats have domes, you see space or whatever sky they choose to display there. They are *not* space dwarves
You are not capable of "taking away" our arguments.
Your attempt to "disproove" them does not work. Agoraphobia might not be triggered if you have a Skylight. The same way the claustrophobia of the planetdweller species is not countered by having that skylight. Or you know, whatever else is responsibe for those -30% despite the ideal environment.

upload_2020-2-13_9-42-17.png

How about Indentured Assets? That does the same as the slave guilds but is not on this list.
Is it because the IA uses the new slave rights and so has enough specialists?
upload_2020-1-16_10-26-41.png
What is your problem with that lockout?

If you could take Slaver Guild you are Authoritarian. So you already can enslave those Xenos.

Slaver Guilds is about enabling Self-Slavery, something not possible by default rules. Nothing more, nothing less.
That Slave yield bonus? A happy side effect. And not something they will casually allow you to stack on top of of the Synchretic Bonuses.

Also Indentured Slavery will kinda ruin any offset there might have been, allowing your species to work as Specialists while the Synchretic one is blocked to Worker by their special trait.
 
What is your problem with that lockout?

If you could take Slaver Guild you are Authoritarian. So you already can enslave those Xenos.

Slaver Guilds is about enabling Self-Slavery, something not possible by default rules. Nothing more, nothing less.
That Slave yield bonus? A happy side effect. And not something they will casually allow you to stack on top of of the Synchretic Bonuses.

Also Indentured Slavery will kinda ruin any offset there might have been, allowing your species to work as Specialists while the Synchretic one is blocked to Worker by their special trait.
1. Slave guilds fit with this orgin (make sense that the empire knows how to use slaves with a servant spieces)
2. slave guilds gives a nice bonus on top of the other bonussen (slave type, traits, ect.)
3. It is not about balance, it's about role playing.
4. In my first game in 2.6 I'm going to try to reach a 90% slave/robot servant ratio. It would be nice to start at 75%.
 
1. Slave guilds fit with this orgin (make sense that the empire knows how to use slaves with a servant spieces)
Every Authoriatarian and Xenophobe knows "how to use Xeno Slaves".
Again, Slaver Guilds/Indentured Servants the Civic is about enslaving your own species. Something that normally is blocked.

2. slave guilds gives a nice bonus on top of the other bonussen (slave type, traits, ect.)
Synchretic already gives you a massive bonus before you even tailor them to the work you need done.

The devs learned early that giving Slavery too many, to easily aquired bonuses is a balance mistake.

3. It is not about balance, it's about role playing.
Then it should be no issue to mod out that Restriction. Here is one that does it as a side effet:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1588007968&

Or just roleplay it as "Stratified Economy" or "Academic Privilege".

4. In my first game in 2.6 I'm going to try to reach a 90% slave/robot servant ratio. It would be nice to start at 75%.
The mod I linked above allows you to define Auto-Slavery with a percentage.
 
I'd love that. But I imagine maybe its a balance concern or something.

I mean the servile species already gets a flat +10% job output for worker jobs, and a happiness bonus. The addition of "prosperous unification" will also mean that having a syncretic species means you start down 4 pops at the very onset. Given that, I can't see how being able to start with a second species that doesn't have the servile trait would be a bigger advantage than already exists.