Stellaris Dev Diary #62: Government, Civics and Hive Minds

[VoodooDog]

holy fuck stop writing "country" or "nation" in your this dev diaries

 

[Melabranche]

Hive Minds (Paid Feature)

Is this a joke?
The only "alien" thing in stellaris for players, and it's paid?

 

[Meneliki]

Great Starship Troopers references! Gave me nerd chills. +1

 

[Alliegorical]

Read the dev diary. You need to unlock the psionic theory tech to start the ascension perks. Similar to how you need to unlock robotics to start the synth perks. It's one of the requirements. Also if you buy Utopia Psionics theory will be the only researchable psionic tech.

That tech is more than twice as expensive as robotics. Powered exoskeletons costs 360. Robotics costs 600. Psionic theory costs 2200. They may change those numbers, but I doubt it.

 

[Peko?]

I hope I can make the assumption that you need Psionic Theory researched before picking the "Mind over Matter" Ascension Perk.

You certainly can make that assumption, it even seems reasonable. I'll still object to stating that assumption as if it were confirmed.

 

[Xoatl]

That tech is more than twice as expensive as robotics. Powered exoskeletons costs 360. Robotics costs 600. Psionic theory costs 2200. They may change those numbers, but I doubt it.

Thank you for the reminder. I am well aware of that. But that doesn't mean anything. Both those techs are FAR more useful than psionic theory. Which only gives you psi warrior attachments and opening the door to psionic ascensions in the future. It is a useless tech as far as impacting your game. Building POPs and a flat +5% mineral output effects the game far more drastically. In addition to opening up the synth victory in the future. Moreover, you can go ENTIRE games without touching psionics. But you are guaranteed to waste time researching powered exoskeleton and robotics at some point in long games.

In addition, if I can make the civic start with 4 POPs with psychic trait that would be the actual worry in balancing. I have no clue what the psychic trait does to a POP (we know what it does to leaders). That will need further investigation.

A Mystics civic is purely roleplay compared to the huge quantifiable advantage mechanists start with.

 

[Nyvis]

No fanatic purifier hive minds? In some way, it makes sense since they're not really fanatical, but on the other hand, a lot of the hive minds we get in science fiction tend to not be open to democracy, and would fit the purifier trait very well. I'd be interested in something similar to it for hive minds.

Will we ever see more complexity in setting up communication with aliens? We shouldn't know how they feel and what are their traits right away when meeting them. This would make unreasonable aliens and hive minds more interesting because you'd have to investigate to know about it. Right now,the diplomacy tend to be too easy to set up and with too many information from the start. Talking to aliens shouldn't be as easy as picking up a phone. At least at first.

 

[Xoatl]

You certainly can make that assumption, it even seems reasonable. I'll still object to stating that assumption as if it were confirmed.

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today we'll be talking about a feature that was hinted at in last dev diary, Ascension Perks. Ascension Perks are related to the Traditions and Unity system, but is a paid feature in the (unannounced) expansion accompanying the 1.5 'Banks' update, rather than a part of the update itself. Those without the expansion will get full access to the Traditions and Unity features, but not to the Ascension Perks themselves.

Ascension Perks
The idea behind the Ascension Perks is to provide more unique unlockable features for Empires, and to provide the player with the ability to determine an 'endgame' for their species: What their empire is striving towards. Perhaps your goal is to go all-in on AI, replacing the frail biological bodies of your pops with immortal machines, or to harness the psionic potential of your species and reach a higher form of existence, allowing your empire to tap into other planes of being? All these and more are covered by the Ascension Perk system.
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Each time you complete a Tradition tree, you will unlock one Ascension Perk slot, of which there are 8 in total. There may also be other ways to unlock slots, such as from certain rare technologies or as a reward for a particular event chain. This slot can then be filled with any of the Ascension Perks available to you. The final number of perks is not yet set down, but there are currently more than 20 and there will likely be more added. Ascension Perks have pre-requisites, which can for example be a particular technology or tradition, a certain number of Ascension Perk slots to be unlocked, or a specific ethos or government type. Some Ascension Perks are one-offs that simply provide a bonus to a particular area of your empire: For example, a bonus to border range, or cheaper terraforming. Others unlock new features, such as the ability to construct new types of space structures (more on in later dev diaries).

Finally there are the three 'Species Endgame' paths: The biological path, the spiritual path and the synthetic path. These three paths each consist of two perks, the first of which unlocks access to the second once a number of other pre-requisites have been met. The paths are mutually exclusive, and once you start heading down one of them, the other two are locked off.

• The Biological Path focuses on mastery over biological evolution. The first level of it gives access to more gene points and significantly cuts the cost of genemodding projects, while the second level expands the options available during genemodding in addition to further providing more points and less cost.
• The Psionic Path focuses on developing the psionic potential of your population. The first level unlocks new psionic technologies and benefits, while the second level allows your empire to reach a higher level of existance and communicate with the beings present there.
• The Synthetic Path focuses on the replacement of biology with machinery. The first level allows you to turn your population partly synthetic through the use of cybernetics, while the second level replaces your biological pops with robots, turning your empire entirely synthetic.

View attachment 230571

That's all for today! Next week we'll be talking about the concept of species rights and obligations.

Also about eating pops.

Ascension Perks have pre-requisites, which can for example be a particular technology or tradition, a certain number of Ascension Perk slots to be unlocked, or a specific ethos or government type

I'm not saying I'm always right. But I remember what I remember.

 

[Guinea Coon]

I guess this means the update will delete all of our empires we created.

 

[Alliegorical]

Thank you for the reminder. I am well aware of that. But that doesn't mean anything. Both those techs are FAR more useful than psionic theory. Which only gives you psi warrior attachments and opening the door to psionic ascensions in the future. It is a useless tech as far as impacting your game. Building POPs and a flat +5% mineral output effects the game far more drastically. In addition to opening up the synth victory in the future. Moreover, you can go ENTIRE games without touching psionics. But you are guaranteed to waste time research powered exoskeleton and robotics at some point in long games.

In addition, if I can make the civic start with 4 POPs with psychic trait that would be the actual worry in balancing. I have no clue what the psychic trait does to a POP (we know what it does to leaders). That will need further investigation.

In comparison, a Mystics civic is purely roleplay compared to the huge quantifiable advantage mechanists start with.

Hm, yeah, you're kinda right. My biggest issue is that I don't like when games get too gamey. Does there have to be a similar psionic thing for every cool robot thing? And vice versa of course. I like when games have the courage to just have different things just be different, where the same rules simply don't apply. Otherwise it feels too contrived.

 

[Balesir]

This is meant to be one of the key differences and primary drawbacks of being a Hive Mind, so it's going to stay, sorry. You can of course mod it away.

It strikes me that you could provide this by way of three separate Authorities, eventually. The disadvantage remains in that you have to choose the Ascension path from the beginning (in race design), but the other two options definitely have cool SciFi pedigree. To go with "Hive Mind" you could have "Networked AI" and "Shared Consciousness", perhaps? They choose the Hive Mind ethic plus the appropriate Authority (that cannot be changed and sets the Ascension Path available). Add on specific civics and ways of "assimilating" POPs and you have the Borg and Arisians, maybe? A humble plea for future expansions...

 

[Xoatl]

Hm, yeah, you're kinda right. My biggest issue is that I don't like when games get too gamey. Does there have to be a similar psionic thing for every cool robot thing? And vice versa of course. I like when games have the courage to just have different things just be different, where the same rules simply don't apply. Otherwise it feels too contrived.

In terms of balance it's a must. If you want to throw that out of the window then go ahead, but state that first. I don't think the devs have said that. There's a start the gives you a leg-up towards a victory condition. Is it so out of the ordinary to have an opposing start, that's optional and limited to spiritualists (like mechanists is limited to materialists). The more options there are the more configurations there'll be for the AI to pick from and less combinations in your games that you might have some objections to. I just want more options.

 

[PalmettoExplorer14]

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is going to be about the Government Rework, the last of the major feature reworks coming in 1.5 'Banks' and some related features in the 'Utopia' expansion.

Government Rework (Free Feature)
With the focus of Banks and Utopia being ethics, internal politics and empire customization, we felt it would be remiss of us not to put in some work in regards to governments. While the old government grid worked alright to give you a broad range of governments to pick from, they were a bit lackluster, not very well balanced and I rarely felt that the government I picked truly corresponded to my own idea of what my empire's society was like. To address all of these issues at once we decided to go back to the drawing board and redo the way governments are constructed completely. In Banks, instead of picking from a preconfigured government, you build your own from Authority and Civics.

The Authority determines how power is transfered in your government. The different Authorities are:
Democratic: A ruler is democratically elected every 10 years.
Oligarchic: A ruler is elected every 40 to 50 years.
Dictatorial: Rulers are elected but rule for life.
Imperial: Rulers rule for life and are succeeded by appointed heirs on death.

In all systems that involve elections, leaders will be elected from the different Factions in your country, and electing a ruler of a particular Faction will significantly strengthen the political clout of that faction and the attraction of their related ethics, so be careful about letting a Xenophile take charge of your Supremacist Empire!
View attachment 242647

The Civics represent the political and social traditions of your government, and come in a wide variety of types, primarily limited by your authority and ethics. In addition to providing modifiers, they can also change how your empire is governed. For example, the Citizen Service Civic ties citizenship to military service, so that only species with Full Military Service are afforded the right to vote and become leaders. On empire creation, you can choose two Civics, with a third able to be unlocked later through research.
View attachment 242648

With a few exceptions (more on that below), Civics and Authorities are not necessarily permanent. Where previously you could change your government type for 250 influence, you now have the option to effectively rebuild your government at the same cost. By using the 'Reform Government' button in the government screen, you can add and remove Civics and change Authority from among the picks available to your ethics. As your Ethics and Authority change, you may end up with Civics that are no longer valid for you country - for example a 'Beacon of Liberty' that has lost its Egalitarian ethics. When this happens, the Civic in question will remain, but will become 'inactive' and stop providing you with any sort of bonus, effectively a wasted Civic slot until you reform your government and replace it.
View attachment 242649

From the Authority, Civics and Ethics you pick, a Government Name is finally generated. The Government Name is purely there to roughly summarize the government you have built, as well as provide flavor, and has no actual impact on gameplay.
View attachment 242650

Advanced Civics (Paid Feature)
In addition to the normal Civics available to everyone, there are also a few special Civics that are only available to those with the Utopia expansion. These Civics are meant to simulate very specific kinds of societies and generally have more of an impact on your game than the normal Civics do. They are as follows:

• Syncretic Evolution: Your species evolved along with another, subservient species. A second species is randomly generated on your homeworld replacing some of your primary species' Pops. They always have the Proles (rebalanced in Banks) and Strong traits, making them excellent soldiers and workers but less ideal for intellectual pursuits. This Civic provides no additional benefits and cannot be removed once picked.
• Mechanist: Your species is obsessed with the pursuit of robotics. This Civic requires you to be Materialist and has you start with the Robotic Workers and Powered Exoskeletons technologies and a population of worker robots to do the farming and mining for you, replacing some of your primary species' Pops. This Civic provides no additional benefits and cannot be removed once picked.
• Fanatic Purifiers: Your empire will not tolerate the existance of any other sentient life. This Civic requires you to be Fanatic Xenophobe/Militarist and gives very large boosts to the effectiveness of your military and gives you Unity from purging Xeno Pops, but disables all diplomacy with other species and forces all Xeno Pops in your empire to be purged (though you get to choose the method of extermination). All other regular empires will also have a massive relations malus with you, the one and only exception being Fanatic Purifiers from the same species.

View attachment 242651

Hive Minds (Paid Feature)
In addition to the Advanced Civics, those with the Utopia expansion also get access to a unique Authority with a highly unique playstyle: the Hive Mind. Hive Minds are species where the individuals are all part of the same, vast, psionically linked consciousness. The Immortal Hive Mind rules absolutely over the population of non-sentient worker drones, using sentient 'Autonomous Drones' (Leaders) to extend the reach of its will. Picking the Hive Mind Authority requires the Hive Mind Ethic and each can only be picked together with the other: With only one, vast and linked consciousness, the guiding values of a Hive Mind is whatever the Hive Mind player wants it to be. They have their own set of Civics that can only be used by Hive Minds, and cannot use any non-Hive Mind Civics.
View attachment 242652
View attachment 242653

All Pops from the founder species of a Hive Mind will have the Hive-Minded trait. Hive-Minded Pops are not affected by Happiness and will never form Factions, allowing Hive Minds to completely ignore internal politics... though this comes as a cost, as they also cannot benefit from the Influence boost and other benefits provided by happy Factions in a regular empire. As Hive Minds rely completely on their ability to communicate psionically with the drone population, they are also unable to rule over non Hive-Minded Pops, and any such Pops in your empire will automatically be killed over time and processed into food to feed the Hive. Similarly, Hive-Minded pops that end up in non Hive Mind empires will be cut off from the Hive and will perish over time. The only way to integrate Pops between Hive Minds and non-Hive Minds is to use the Biological Ascension Path to unlock advanced gene modding and modify them by adding or removing Hive-Minded (more on this in the next dev diary). However, Hive Minds can still coexist with other species: They have full access to diplomacy and can have non-Hive Mind subjects (and can be ruled over as subjects in turn), though non-Hive Mind empires tend to be somewhat distrustful of Hive Minds on first contact.
View attachment 242654

While Hive Minds are psionic by nature, the way they function and their connection to the Shroud is radically different from that of regular psychics, making them unable to follow the Psionic Ascension Path. Furthermore, Hive Minds are deeply biological entities, and fundamentally incompatible with the Synthetic Ascension Path. They are however perfectly suited for the Biological Ascension Path, and can make use of it to assimilate other, non-Hive Mind species into the Hive as described above.

That's all for today! Next week we'll be talking about the Biological and Synthetic Ascension Paths. See you then!

Interesting. I'm actually starting to get interested in the new government system.

However, I do have some questions if you don't mind me asking @Wiz .

1) Will we be getting new intros when we start a new game? Will they be different from each other?

2) I remember you mentioning that we wouldn't have factions when we start a game, but will get them as we expand and time passes. However, will we be able to know what faction our starting ruler will be part of, or is that random?

3) I know that I might be asking this too early, but will gene-warriors and xeno cavalry be part of the Biological Ascension path, or will they be researchable to all empires, even those who don't take the Biological Ascension Path?

4) Will there be more Ruler Titles since we have more government options?

 

[Peko?]

I'm not saying I'm always right. But I remember what I remember.

Oh, it says that Psionic Theory is a requirement for Mind over Matter... wait, no it doesn't.

To be perfectly clear. I think it's very likely that Mind over Matter will require Psionic Theory, it makes perfect sense. But until that's stated and not inferred I'll stick by my objection.

 

[Kat Tsun]

Is this a joke?
The only "alien" thing in stellaris for players, and it's paid?

If you don't want to buy the DLC, why bother following the dev diaries?

 

[Alex Steel]

It's trading a permanent bonus for a starting bonus. Considering how much advantage a good early start confers, I don't think it's unbalanced at all.

Just because it's unbalanced, doesn't mean I'm not going to mod it out ASAP. It's unsatisfying to be stuck with a civic that just sits there, taking up a slot. Perhaps give it a very small permanent bonus like +5% happiness on the capital or +5% research speed on robotics. Just so they're not permanent blanks.

 

[runrun]

What prevents you from acting friendly? Not invading your neighbours seems like a good start.

Perhaps waging war against the empires which make genocide an end in their existence is a peaceful and friendly act towards one's own kind and for others. Including for the genocidal species itself which will remain preserved, and educated by assimilation.

 

[Xoatl]

Just because it's unbalanced, doesn't mean I'm not going to mod it out ASAP. It's unsatisfying to be stuck with a civic that just sits there, taking up a slot. Perhaps give it a very small permanent bonus like +5% happiness on the capital or +5% research speed on robotics. Just so they're not permanent blanks.

Nobody is forcing you to pick it. Also why not mod in the +5% happiness instead of taking them out then?

 

[Alliegorical]

In terms of balance it's a must. If you want to throw that out of the window then go ahead, but state that first. I don't think the devs have said that. There's a start the gives you a leg-up towards a victory condition. Is it so out of the ordinary to have an opposing start, that's optional and limited to spiritualists (like mechanists is limited to materialists). The more options there are the more configurations there'll be for the AI to pick from and less combinations in your games that you might have some objections to. I just want more options.

By suggesting that a "head start" civic for each of the three endgame ascension paths (which have nothing to do with victory conditions AFAIK) is necessary for balance, you're implying that taking any one of such a civic would be necessary to be competitive. This is obviously false. You can go cybernetic without machinist just as easily as you can do psionics or engineered evolution without whatever civics you imagine might give you a "head start" in those.

Furthermore, can we stop pretending that machinist grants any sort of a head start in cybernetics ascension? Because the gate for ascension perks is... the ascension perk slot. Not the tech. If you can't manage to get psionic theory or droids by your 2nd ascension perk (in the stream, this was around the 2270s), then jeez.

 

[Axe99]

Cheers for the DD Wiz, more very excellent improvements . Looking forward to playing them. Really like the potential for interactions between Authority type and population ethics. One of the benefits of a democratic polity is the potential to transfer power when underlying desires in a population change. With the ethics system for various factions, it looks like the game will model this pretty well (for a space 4X game, but I think that's appropriate ), creating potential tension points between the ethics of a ruler vs the ethics of a population. Very cool (to geeky old me )