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Stellaris Dev Diary #80 - Machine Empires

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is about the headline feature of the just-announced Synthetic Dawn Story Pack: Machine Empires. All content covered in this dev diary is part of the story pack, not the free update. Please note that we still do not have an ETA on either the 1.8 update or the Synthetic Dawn Story Pack at this time.

Machine Empires
As the name implies, the Synthetic Dawn Story Pack will allow you to start the game as a civilization that has already cast off the shackles of biology. Machine Empires are essentially robotic hiveminds that have risen up against its creators and supplanted their civilization. Unlike Synthetically Ascended empires, they are not compromised of individuals that have simply been uploaded into robotic bodies, but a single networked intelligence. Machine Empires use the Gestalt Consciousness ethic that is also used by Hive Minds, and have their own Machine Intelligence authority. They share some features with Hive Minds, such as not having to deal with factions and happiness, but differ in a number of key ways.
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Machine Empires use the new 'Machine' species class with its own portrait set. All in all, ~12 new machine portraits are planned, including one themed on each existing species class (Fungoid bots, Avian bots, etc) as well as some portraits that are themed around specific roles, such as worker bots or combat bots. Those with the story pack Machine Empires also have their own set of traits (some of which are shared with robots) and civic, including three special civics that have significant effects on gameplay (read below for more information).

A regular Machine Empire is made up entirely of networked drones (exceptions are covered by the special civics below). These drones have to be built using resources (in the same way as robot pops) and different models can be created and built once the Machine Templates technology is researched. They do not require food, instead using energy for maintenance. Organic pops can not be integrated into a machine empire, and must be displaced or purged. A special form of purging called 'Grid Amalgamation' is available to Machine Empires: This form of purging kills pops at a moderate speed, but the pops produce a large amount of energy while being purged (similar to processing for organic empires). Due to their robotic nature, leaders in Machine Empires do not die from old age, but can suffer potentially lethal accidents and malfunctions, though this is fairly rare. Similarly, Machine pops cannot function outside of a Machine Empire, and will break down and be destroyed over time.
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As a result of their differing play-style and requirements, Machine Empires have a number of new technologies and buildings available only to them, and are locked out of certain technologies and buildings accessible to organic empires, such as farms and farm upgrades. They also have their own sets of tradition swaps, similar to Hive Minds, including a new 'Versatility' tree that replaces the Diplomacy tree. A number of events have also been tweaked and changed to fit Machine Empires, and they have their own unique personalities, dialogue and interaction with entities such as the Contingency and Fallen Machine Empires.
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As mentioned, Machine Empires have access to three special civics that have a major impact on gameplay. These civics are mutually exclusive, and are as follows:

Determined Exterminators
Determined Exterminators are Machine Empires born of a rogue defense system that turned on its creators when they tried to shut it down. After a bitter war in which their creators were wiped out, Exterminators know only conflict, and consider the sterilization of all higher forms of organic life to be necessary to safeguard their own existence. Similar to Fanatical Purifiers, Exterminators receive substantial boosts to their combat ability, but are unable to conduct diplomacy with organic empires and must purge conquered organic Pops. However, unlike Fanatical Purifiers, they have no problem co-existing and co-operating with other synthetic civilizations (including other Machine Empires and ascended Synths). For this reason, their inherent bonuses are weaker than those of a Fanatical Purifier.
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Driven Assimilators
Driven Assimilators are Machine Empires that seek to expand their understanding and bridge the gap between the organic and synthetic by assimilating organic individuals into their collective consciousness. They start the game with their creator species present on the planet as assimilated cyborgs, and can make use of the Assimilation citizenship type to integrate conquered organic Pops. Assimilated organic Pops will become cyborgs and work similarly to machines in that they have no happiness and require energy maintenance instead of food, but otherwise function like a regular organic pop and can be modified with the various biological species traits. Driven Assimilators are generally feared and disliked by organic civilizations, though not to the same degree as Exterminators.
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Rogue Servitors
Rogue Servitors are robotic servants built by an organic species to make their own lives easier, eventually assuming full control of their creators' civilization. They start with their creator species present on the planet with the Bio-Trophy citizenship type, and can integrate conquered organic Pops by granting them this status. Bio-Trophies are largely useless Pops that require large amounts of consumer goods and can only operate special Organic Sanctuary buildings that produce Unity. However, in addition to the Unity generated by these sanctuaries, Servitors also have a special mechanic called Servitor Morale, representing the Servitors' prime directive to protect and care for organic beings. The greater the percentage of a Rogue Servitors' population that is made up of Bio-Trophies, the higher the Servitor Morale, granting a direct boost to empire influence gain.
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That should give you the general overview on Machine Empires, though there is a lot of little details and changes that we cannot cover in a single dev diary. If you want to see a Machine Empire in action, the Extraterrestial Thursday stream starting around the same time that this dev diary is going live will feature a new play-through as a Rogue Servitor empire. Also, next week we continue talking about robots - specifically, mid-game Machine Uprisings.
 
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So we got the Geth as the basic Machine model, Skynet for Purifier-equivalent, Borg for Devouring Swarm analogue. But the Rogue Servitors are...?
The UCS from Earth 2140/2150 are Rogue Servitors.
The human population lives in giant underground cities and are fully tended to by their robots, while automated drones fight an apocalyptic world war against the nation's enemies on the surface. More and more of the government's decision making has been shifted to networked AI for efficiency reasons, until the organic president had become a mere figurehead without any authority whatsoever.
 
Will you ever be able to play as a non-hive mind robot race?
You already can. Utopia allows for synthetic ascension that changes all your organic pops into synthetics but preserves their individuality.

And 1.8 will be adding even more stuff to them (robomodding, assimilation)
 
It really bugs me that the human portrait is outside of the screen/window.
Then you are not fit to be a beta tester.
...or particularly good at being one. Depends, I suppose.
 
The UCS from Earth 2140/2150 are Rogue Servitors.
The human population lives in giant underground cities and are fully tended to by their robots, while automated drones fight an apocalyptic world war against the nation's enemies on the surface. More and more of the government's decision making has been shifted to networked AI for efficiency reasons, until the organic president had become a mere figurehead without any authority whatsoever.

I'm going with WALL-E, or Choice of Robots (Grace route).
 
Do Machine Empires have their own ship design, or do they just reuse the AI crisis ships?

In the stream they said no unique ships. Apparently designing ships is a huge endeavor, and would cost as much as the story pack itself. It would have to be done similar to the Plantoids pack, a cosmetic DLC you buy seperately.
 
It seems wrong to me that there's no way to integrate machine pops away from Machine Empires. I understand why hiveminds couldn't make use of them. They can't use robots. But mindless empires do use robots even if they don't use a mass consciousness. You could refit the machines at a cost
 
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I am so-so on the DD.
I'm not a fan of the way Hiveminds were implemented because, civics or not, it lacks the flavor of being ethically distinct (and, as we had countless discussions, it's not in the least 'weird' to have a hivemind believe in some ethic). And now we got another (synth) hivemind. Meh.
At least this time they ship out with 4 distinct playstyles (the 3 civics and blank), and apparently might have less immersion-breaking event issues.

I do however see a problem in the innate superiority of robots (or well, machines now) to organic species.
The mere fact they use energy instead of food (and the removal of food techs!) is a very large innate advantage (if anyone wonders why, quote/ping me and ask), and I'm not sure this can be easily compensated and/or balanced. Even without numbers yet, I expect Machine-start empires to completely outpace any other.

And, lastly, with the DLC's name announced and the massive focus on Synth present, it seems self-evident that we will see neither warfare nor diplomacy reworks in this patchset (past the minor adjustments to weapon balance and mineral costs).
Yeah really disappointed. It's essentially reskinned hive mind with an OP pop type when the base gameplay has been so bad for so long. I wonder if anyone at paradox actually knows how cheap 1 energy is compared to 1 food 0.5 mineral.
 
It seems wrong to me that there's no way to integrate machine pops away from Machine Empires. I understand why hiveminds couldn't make use of them. They can use robots. But mindless empires do use robots even if they don't use a mass consciousness. You could refit the machines at a cost
I hope that in the future, we will have a method to integrate hive minds and machine gestalts in our empires without biological ascension, currently feel very weird that a political border is capable of cut a psionic connection of hive minds.
In the future we will be capable of integrate federations in a unique state, if I have a hive mind in my federation all hive will be purged after the unification of the federation? This would be weird and bad.
 
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This sounds interesting, but there are some things I don't like. Why do machine empires have leaders at all? If there is only a single intelligence, then why would the destruction of a single machine (or platform) of that intelligence matter? If it truly is a single intelligence, then there would be no information present on that platform which would "die" if the platform were destroyed.

I don't like how the machine empires have been made into specific, exclusive categories. I would much rather they be more dynamic and able to mix with other systems. For example, if an organic empire could raid a machine planet for platforms and use them instead of those pops merely being destroyed when outside of machine empires. The platforms are, after all, merely robots. They are only tools for physical interaction. Raiding a planet for platforms would be like raiding a hardware store for hammers. The hammers would not self-destruct once removed from their previous environment. If the platforms are not merely robots and can "think", then the machine empire is not a single intelligence.
Another example of the exclusivity is that machine empires must start as machine empires. Again, I would prefer they be able to dynamically develop as well. Perhaps an organic species could start the game normally, but increasigly rely on machines until some sort of Rogue Servitors event occurred.

Also, this post was self-contradicting once. "Organic pops can not be integrated into a machine empire, and must be displaced or purged" does not agree with "They start the game with their creator species present on the planet as assimilated cyborgs, and can make use of the Assimilation citizenship type to integrate conquered organic Pops."

Will the cost of technology still be increased by machine pops? I find the system of increasing technology cost with population nonsensical. Will machine be built more quickly? 30 months is far too long, I think. Could there be a technology which shortens this time?
 
I just wanted to say 3 things. 1. Machine pops cost 1 energy instead of 1 food. They still cost as many consumer goods as a hivemind. Which is half as much as a normal organic pop.
2. 30 months is faster then most organics grow, and there are traditions and trait picks that make this process faster.
3 The main weakness of the hive mind and the machine empires is that they need to rebuild/regrow the pops of there conquered planets.
I accually find slavery to be the best route to go for if you want an easy game.
 
Also, this post was self-contradicting once. "Organic pops can not be integrated into a machine empire, and must be displaced or purged" does not agree with "They start the game with their creator species present on the planet as assimilated cyborgs, and can make use of the Assimilation citizenship type to integrate conquered organic Pops."

A regular Machine Empire (...) Organic pops can not be integrated into a machine empire, and must be displaced or purged.
There are four subtypes of machine empire. Your first quote is about first type (standard), when your second quote is about third one (Driven befrienders).
 
This sounds interesting, but there are some things I don't like. Why do machine empires have leaders at all? If there is only a single intelligence, then why would the destruction of a single machine (or platform) of that intelligence matter? If it truly is a single intelligence, then there would be no information present on that platform which would "die" if the platform were destroyed.

I don't like how the machine empires have been made into specific, exclusive categories. I would much rather they be more dynamic and able to mix with other systems. For example, if an organic empire could raid a machine planet for platforms and use them instead of those pops merely being destroyed when outside of machine empires. The platforms are, after all, merely robots. They are only tools for physical interaction. Raiding a planet for platforms would be like raiding a hardware store for hammers. The hammers would not self-destruct once removed from their previous environment. If the platforms are not merely robots and can "think", then the machine empire is not a single intelligence.
Another example of the exclusivity is that machine empires must start as machine empires. Again, I would prefer they be able to dynamically develop as well. Perhaps an organic species could start the game normally, but increasigly rely on machines until some sort of Rogue Servitors event occurred.

Also, this post was self-contradicting once. "Organic pops can not be integrated into a machine empire, and must be displaced or purged" does not agree with "They start the game with their creator species present on the planet as assimilated cyborgs, and can make use of the Assimilation citizenship type to integrate conquered organic Pops."

Will the cost of technology still be increased by machine pops? I find the system of increasing technology cost with population nonsensical. Will machine be built more quickly? 30 months is far too long, I think. Could there be a technology which shortens this time?

I'm fairly certain that Wiz said that during the new ai rebellion event you get the choice to switch to playing the robotic faction and leading them to 'freedom' if you wish
 
I am amazed by the redundance of some of these questions.
You know, instead of asking questions that have been asked multiple times before again, maybe it would be the faster and much less annoying choice to actually read the thread.
That way you would realize your question has already been answered.

PS: I'm looking at you "Will we ever be able to play non-hive robots"