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Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today is the third week of post-Synthetic Dawn 'filler' dev diaries, as mentioned in Dev Diary 88. Regular dev diaries return on October 26th.

As we don't have anything in particular to talk about this week, I'm just going to give you another brief update on 1.8 post-launch support: We released the 1.8.2 update yesterday, with all the fixes from the 1.8.1 beta as well as some additional fixes and tweaks.

There has been a couple of script issues reported in 1.8.2 related to Devouring Swarms, Exterminators and Purifiers (missing tooltips and opinion modifiers) that we are going to look at and likely publish a fix for, but other than that we feel like we have now addressed all important issues reported in 1.8 and 1.8.1 and so will be wrapping up 1.8 post-launch support if no other critical issues are found in the live build.

As before, I'm going to sign off this dev diary with a screenshot, this one taken on the galaxy map in the internal development build, where everything clearly looks the same as it always has and there certainly aren't any significant changes being prototyped that I can't yet talk about. See you next week!
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So new border system will be based on solar system / galaxy province / "galaxy tile". This change is analog to border mechanic change from Civ 4 to Civ 5. I imagine while we retain ability to lay claim on a particular system manually (by spending influence, probably), we don't have to do this on each and every system. There shall be natural expansion by time, by filling some progress bar. I don't mind if it's a direct rip from Civ 5, that the progress bar is filled by unity. That at least gives unity a second (and localized) use.
 
Riftwalker said:
you mean modding or in-game?

I was wondering if border range techs instead make the claim go 1 system further out and the same for maybe xenophobe...
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Lets go with in-game for now, I somehow don't think we will have to assign each system individually, but that also rules of the possibility of trying to fix spagetti lines and other bordergore, I'm guessing we will get a semi-auto system where we can trade and exchange individual systems, but the initial claim from the output is automatic
 
BlackUmbrellas said:
My assumption is that there will be a cap on how many Frontier Outposts you can build (either a hard cap like Core Systems or a soft cap through scaling costs.)

Effects that boost border range- civics, technologies, the Xenophobe ethic, etc- will likely give some sort of discount on Frontier Outpost upkeep or push the cap higher (by raising a hard cap or reducing the scaling of a soft cap).
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The best way I can see this working is like Civilization, with nearby systems (to your colonies) being claimed automatically one by one with the rate of growth depending on your border pressure. Potentially with the option of buying additional systems with influence (or unity?) to hurry the process along.

Border growth has to be mostly automatic or this is going to be a disaster. I really like the current system and the ways I'd want to improve it are basically the opposite of 'claim each system specifically'.
 
terrycloth said:
The best way I can see this working is like Civilization, with nearby systems (to your colonies) being claimed automatically one by one with the rate of growth depending on your border pressure. Potentially with the option of buying additional systems with influence (or unity?) to hurry the process along.

Border growth has to be mostly automatic or this is going to be a disaster. I really like the current system and the ways I'd want to improve it are basically the opposite of 'claim each system specifically'.
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the reasoning from wiz on why they wanted this change was to make it so 1. hyperlane hopping didn't occur (you aquire a hyperlane peninsula but no way to actually fly there) and 2. to stop you from claiming a system when you had no actual presence there, like systems you've never even surveyed or even have intel on. This makes me think that some form of construction or action will be related to most of it.
 
Riftwalker said:
the reasoning from wiz on why they wanted this change was to make it so 1. hyperlane hopping didn't occur (you aquire a hyperlane peninsula but no way to actually fly there) and 2. to stop you from claiming a system when you had no actual presence there, like systems you've never even surveyed or even have intel on. This makes me think that some form of construction or action will be related to most of it.
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The first one kind of makes sense? Although it's an ignorable edge case.

But the second one is a really bad reason. You plant your colony or station to claim space, and the space has stars in it, and what's actually in the star systems isn't always the point.
 
Looks like they're moving away from the border projection mechanic and towards a claiming mechanic.

Possibly you'll have the ability to claim X number of systems, where X is calculated based on Population, Tech and Number of Colonies.
Then if you exceed X, it costs influence, much like the Core worlds and Naval Capacity mechanics

Border projection techs, civics, traditions and perks would then increase that X value.

It seems likely that you'll only be able to claim adjacent systems to frontier outposts/colonies, similar to how the sector management system works.

One thing I don't like about this mechanic is that not every system has claiming value. So what happens with those ones? Are you going to win up with little pockets of nothing within your bodies? That doesn't sound aesthetically pleasing.



I don't mind these changes in theory. Guess we'll find out what it's like when 1.9 comes out.
 
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terrycloth said:
The first one kind of makes sense? Although it's an ignorable edge case.

But the second one is a really bad reason. You plant your colony or station to claim space, and the space has stars in it, and what's actually in the star systems isn't always the point.
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Realistically speaking though, a star empire would think about acquiring resources it needs, interesting things to look into to make better use of resources, and anything of strategic value that they would discover, along with planets that they wish to colonize. I doubt they'd look only into owning as many stars as possible, ignoring what's around them, unless they were to a point where it wouldn't really matter.
 
terrycloth said:
The first one kind of makes sense? Although it's an ignorable edge case.

But the second one is a really bad reason. You plant your colony or station to claim space, and the space has stars in it, and what's actually in the star systems isn't always the point.
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yes, but i have claims in my current game where i've never had a ship before. I'm xenophobe so i have closed borders, and so i can keep people out of systems i've never even been to before.
 
Wiz said:
we feel like we have now addressed all important issues reported in 1.8 and 1.8.1
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There is a thread which has been front-page active on this forum for over a week regarding how empires are too often starting with the same border colours, and how it is considered to be a serious issue for some, including myself.

I will repeat what I have written in that thread countless times. We are at least looking for an acknowledgement of this problem.
 
NEXUS12 said:
There is a thread which has been front-page active on this forum for over a week regarding how empires are too often starting with the same border colours, and how it is considered to be a serious issue for some, including myself.

I will repeat what I have written in that thread countless times. We are at least looking for an acknowledgement of this problem.
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kinda solved for the most part.
136% sure they've said nothing because they can't with the new development. basically they can't talk about hot code until corporate says so.
 
Riftwalker said:
kinda solved for the most part.
136% sure they've said nothing because they can't with the new development. basically they can't talk about hot code until corporate says so.
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Not really:

a) It's still perfectly possible for the game to spawn two empires with both the same primary and secondary colors.
b) It's fine for telling where the boarders are, but when you zoom out it's still not going to give you a good at a glance sense of who has what where.
c) 1.9 isn't going to hit until the new year, probably.

I mean, sure it's an improvement and the boarders do look way nicer, but it's not like we're talking about one of the great unsolved problems in strategy game design here: just don't reuse colours until all the available colours have been used. This is basic, basic stuff. I honestly can't comprehend what the big deal about it is. Just, you know, fucking get it fixed.

The little icons over the construction ships and science ships are cool, though.
 
Riftwalker said:
they probably 'couldn't' due to the implementation of the new borders.
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Uh huh
 
Tim_Ward said:
a) It's still perfectly possible for the game to spawn two empires with both the same primary and secondary colors.
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Yeah it's possible, but nevertheless you will differentiate both empires since take the 2. pic as an example ...
Maybe you will get 2 empires with blue as their primary and yellow as their secondary colour, but nevertheless these 2 blue blobs will be separated via their (thicker ?) yellow border-line ...
It's better ...

Tim_Ward said:
b) It's fine for telling where the boarders are, but when you zoom out it's still not going to give you a good at a glance sense of who has what where.
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But it seems, that each star-systems, even yet un-claimed ones, have their own influence-zone, so that you will never have such a situation again, that a "border" runs exactly through a star-system, so that you can't recognize to which empire this star-system belongs to ...
It's better, too ...

Tim_Ward said:
c) 1.9 isn't going to hit until the new year, probably.
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Yeah, probably.
 
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Tim_Ward said:
Uh huh
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hopefully, i'm detecting sarcasm correctly.

Basically, corporate policy would have made it so that they couldn't be working on the same areas of the code while the had a on-going project that is even tangentially related.

that is my belief, not that I think it's impossible to think they simply didn't react to the color problem at all.

@Kayden_II, #B is a very good observation
 
Will this be like a new Claim/Core/Ownership System? Like you can declare war to an Empire that has taken a system you had claimed with the Reconquest CB, even if you didn't have a colony on it. Useful since that CB generates less threat when used. Also you can claim a system with influence rather than having to build an outpost, maybe?
 
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