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Tinto Flavour #15 - 25th of April 2025 - Military Orders

Hello and welcome one more week to Tinto Flavour, the happy Fridays in which we take a look at the content of the super secret Project Caesar!

Today, we will be talking about the Christian Military Orders, and specifically, the Teutonic Order and the Knights Hospitallers! Let’s start without further ado:

The glorious Order of Brothers of the German House of Saint Mary in Jerusalem, also known as the Teutonic Order, faces its destiny on the stormy coasts of the Baltic Sea. Created to protect the Christian pilgrims on their way to the Holy City of Jerusalem, its objective shifted to Christianize the Pagan tribes of Prussia and the Baltic through the creation of a state on those lands.

Under the leadership of our predecessor, Hochmeister Werner von Orseln, the Teutonic Order has expanded its territorial holdings, but this expansion has not come without consequences. The Order's aggressive policies have created powerful enemies, as the Pagan tribes to the East have united and formed the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, then allying with our Catholic southern neighbor and rival, the Kingdom of Poland, which has set aside their Christian duty, joining with the pagans against us.

The time has come for our Order to prove that we are up to the crusading task that we have set for ourselves, and show the world that even surrounded by enemies, our faith stands triumphant.
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The Knights Hospitaller conquered the island of Ródos in the early 14th century, spurred by the fall of Acre in 1291, establishing a stronghold that would allow us to pursue our mission to protect Christian pilgrims. Ródos, a picturesque island in the Aegean Sea, has become a thriving center for our Military Order, marked by fortifications and a bustling economy. However, this prosperity is countered by relentless attacks by neighboring Muslim fleets. But we have demonstrated remarkable resilience, defending Ródos through ferocious battles, showcasing our martial prowess and unwavering dedication.

Nonetheless, the future of our Order looks bleak, as our enemies become more powerful and the disunity among the Catholic countries runs rampant. Recovering the Holy Land seems to be a fading hope with each passing day, but our determination is unbreakable, and we will pursue that objective until our last man falls.
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Country Selection Teutons.png

Country Selection Knights.png

As usual, consider all UI, 2D and 3D art WIP.​

The Teutonic Order starts with an interesting political and diplomatic situation:
Teutonic Order.png

Teutonic Diplomacy.png

The Teutonic Order has several vassals, including the Livonian Order; but also starts at war with Poland and Lithuania - something that is not final, since we’re considering representing this Teutonic-Polish conflicts with a truce, instead, as it was resolved peacefully a few years after the start of our game.​

While the situation of the Knights Hospitaller is also interesting, in a different way:
Knights.png

A Unique Location Minor with unique content spotted!​

All Military Orders share some common flavour, starting with a Major Government Reform:
Military Order.png

That unlocks some unique buildings:
Order Headquarters.png

Order Stronghold.png

Order Commandery.png

The Order Headquarters is a capital-only building (so just one per country). The Order Stronghold is a building that you can build in any location you own. While the Order Commandery is a foreign building, that you can build in the lands of any Catholic country with which you have good relations, making it a powerful tool to support your crusading effort.​

There’s also this Estate Privilege for your Clergy:
Military Orders.png

That unlocks a unique diplomatic action with other Catholic countries, the Sponsorship of Military Order:
Sponsorship Military Order.png

Sponsoring.png

Sponsored.png

As being theocracies, the Military Order also have access to unique Laws & Policies, such as:
Law Divine Cause.png

Law Holy Mission.png

Law Monastic Order.png

Law Celibacy.png

Going to the more unique content for each, the Knights have access to a couple more reforms and privileges:
Reform KNI Crusade Sea.png

Privilege KNI Local Commanders.png

The Teutons start with another unique Estate Privilege, and a Work of Art:
Privilege Kulm Law.png

Chronicon Terra Prussiae.png

And both have their own set of advances:

Teutonic Advances
Advance TEU Crusader Discipline.png

Advance TEU Teutonic Heavy Cavalry.png

Advance TEU Reformed Army.png

Advance TEU Teutonic Religious Authority.png

Advance TEU One Estate, One Religion.png


Advances for the Knights Hospitallers
Advance KNI Assistance Suffering.png

Advance KNI Reconquista.png

Advance KNI Scourge.png

Advance KNI Crusade.png

Advance KNI Order State.png

The Teutonic Order and the Knights also have a few dozen unique events each, but since today’s Tinto Flavour is already long enough, let’s just show one example per each:
Saint George1.png

Saint George2.png


Aftermath Crusade Era.png

And that’s all for today! Next Friday is a bank holiday in Tinto, so no Tinto Flavour; but remember that on Monday we will take a look at the Tinto Maps Feedback for Eastern, Central and Southern Africa, and on Wednesday there will be a Tinto Talks about Protestantism and the War of Religion. Cheers!
 

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Is there a foreign building map mode where you can see which foreign locations you have built buildings in and which of your own locations other countries have built in your land?
 
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Varus90 said:
This is looking great, but I'm a little distracted by the inconsistency in naming things here. There seems to be exonyms and endonyms used variously, like Ródos and Estonia, 'Akkā and Ösel. I don't remember if this was covered before, but are they dynamic names based on ownership? That makes sense, especially since it's called Rhodes in the flavor text, but then why use the Greek name when it's the Knights?
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It depends on whether the localization is dynamic, in which we favour endonyms, or literary, in which we favour English exonyms.
 
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Screenshot_20250425_154756_Chrome.jpg

I think it's werid for the Hospitallers to refer to the Byzantines as Romans considering that they were officially heretics for the crusaders, it makes more sense to call them Greeks
 
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Also, from Wikipedia, a map of the commanderies of the Hospitallers in 1300. Are any/some of these already represented as buildings at the game start?
1745589721794.png
 
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titan.bevel said:
Is the duplication of "clergy allowed to lead" between the major reform and the estate privilege voluntary, or an oversight ?
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Intentional, but we need to improve that tooltip, because it's a Privilege available to two different countries (Military Orders, and Catholic countries with neighbors of a different religion), with a different set of modifiers (the 5% Discipline is for the Military Orders, and 2.5% and the 'Clergy Allowed to Lead' is for the other countries).
 
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1745589291049-1.png


Since you consider changes over the Polish-Teuton war I'd like only to remind you of 1 thing. That Duchy of Inowrocław shouldn't exist in the game as in 1320s Father of current king of Poland made a deal with dukes of Inowrocław and Dobrzyn and they exchanged their Inowrocław/Dobrzyn Duchies for Duchies of Sieradz & Łęczyca.

After 1320s exchange of lands deal. The only independent Duchy in the region of Kujawy/Kuyavia was Duchy of Gniewkowo which should be added to the game with its own location of Gniewkowo too because it was a diplomatic ground in negotiations between two sides of war.

Take a look on these links and study it.

Władysław the Hunchback Duke of Dobrzyn that moved to the Duchy of Łęczyca in 1327​

Kazimierz III gniewkowski Duke of Gniewkowo Teutons occupied his duchy in 1332-1333​

Przemysł inowrocławski Duke of Inowrocław that moved to the Duchy of Sieradz in 1327​

(Kazimierz III gniewkowski(Casimir III of Gniewkowo) is not Kazimierz III Wielki(Casimir III The Great)​

 

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I guess to summarize what I'd like to see from military orders that has not already been confirmed:
  • Content around the reformation, and the splitting off of some portion of both orders to form Protestant chivalric orders.
  • More extraterritorial buildings at game start to represent commanderies (Edit: Present)
  • Transitions to Building Based Countries upon losing all territory, possibly also becoming Papal Vassals in the process.
  • More content around the Knights Hospitallers extensive slave trading, especially in Malta.
At that point I think the general feel of the orders would be about perfect to play.
 
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LordThanatos said:
I guess to summarize what I'd like to see from military orders that has not already been confirmed:
  • Content around the reformation, and the splitting off of some portion of both orders to form Protestant chivalric orders.
  • More extraterritorial buildings at game start to represent commanderies
  • Transitions to Building Based Countries upon losing all territory, possibly also becoming Papal Vassals in the process.
  • More content around the Knights Hospitallers extensive slave trading, especially in Malta.
At that point I think the general feel of the orders would be about perfect to play.
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There's a lot of fertile ground to play around with the Reformation - some commanderies might convert and become Protestant Orders, but there should also be options for the local country to just start seizing commanderies à la England.
 
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In 1291, Akka fell to the Egypt and...
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Shouldn't this read as either "Fell to Egypt" or "Fell to the Egyptians" ?

And, on the subject of the Knight Hospitaliers, is there a Tinto Talks about raiding/piracy mechanics planned ? I don't remember seeing anything about it
 
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Monty is staring at me said:
Does the order commanderie get manpower from foreign pops? In that case, does the foreign country lose pops when that manpower is destroyed?
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No, it employs your own pops, and if you lose manpower, your pops are killed; but it's a way of getting an early game manpower boost, since the manpower buildings are scarce in the first couple of ages.
 
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