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Tinto Maps #12 - 26th of July 2024 - Germany

Hello, and welcome to another new Tinto Maps! I’m back to duty, after the review of Italy that we posted last Thursday, and Johan taking care of Scandinavia last Friday. Today we will be taking a look at Germany! This region comprises the modern territories of Czechia, Austria, Switzerland, and Liechtenstein. However, for most of the timeline in Project Caesar, it was better known as the Holy Roman Empire. This organization once was a feudal empire elevated from the Kingdom of the Germans, but by 1337 was mostly disaggregated into a multitude of temporal and ecclesiastical jurisdictions, with only a tenuous feudal relationship with their Emperor.

Let’s start diving deep into this nightmare, then…

Countries:
Countries.png

I’m showing here a bit more of what the region is, so you can have a clear depiction of how it looks compared to the neighboring regions we’ve previously shown (and so that the Reddit guy who is patchworking the world map has an easier day ). What I can say about this when the map speaks for itself… The lands of Germany are highly fractured among different principalities, making for an extremely complex political situation. The Emperor in 1337 was Louis IV von Wittelsbach of Upper Bavaria… Because, yes, Bavaria is also divided. He is married to Margaret of Avesnes, daughter of Count William of Hainaut, Holland, and Zeleand, while his son Louis is the Margrave of Brandenburg. But probably the strongest power of the period is the Kingdom of Bohemia, whose king John also Duke Luxembourg and rules over both lands in a personal union, while also being overlord of the Margraviate of Moravia, ruler by his son Charles, and the Silesian principalities. The third contender probably is the Duchy of Austria, ruled by Albert II von Habsburg. He also rules over some lands in the formed Duchies of Swabia and Carinthia. There are also plenty of medium and small countries all over the region, with very different forms of government, which will probably make this HRE a very replayable experience…

Dynasties:
Dynasties.png

The dynastical map of the HRE gives a nice picture of the situation explained in the previous one. The von Wittelsbach, de Luxembourg (John of Bohemia is considered of French culture, therefore it uses the French toponymic article ‘de’; if he would change to the German culture, then it would be the ‘von Luxembourg’ dynasty), and von Habsburg cover much of the map; you may note that the Wittelsbach rule over five different countries (Upper Bavaria, Lower Bavaria, the Palatinate of the Rhine, and Brandenburg); while the House of Luxembourg also control the Archbishopric of Trier through Balduin, uncle of King John. Other important dynasties, although in a secondary position, are the Welfen, von Mecklenburg, and Gryf, present in multiple countries to the north; the Askanier, who happen to control half of Upper Saxony, while the rest is in the hands of the von Wettin; and the von Görz, who rule over the Duchy of Tirol and the County of Gorizia.

HRE:
HRE.png

We obviously have to repost the HRE IO map again here. The purple stripes mark the imperial territory, while the different types of members use different colors. We currently have these divisions in the IO: the Emperor (1, dark blue), Prince-Electors (4, light blue), Archbishop-Electors (3, medium blue), Free Imperial Cities (23, light green), Imperial Peasant Republics (2, orange), Imperial Prelates (44, white), and Regular Members (280, dark green). So, yeah, that make for a total of 357 countries that are part of the HRE. And before you ask: No, we won’t talk about its mechanics today, that will happen in future Tinto Talks.

Locations:
Locations.png

Locations 2.png

Locations 3.png

Locations 4.png

Locations 5.png
Germany has the highest density of locations in the world, as we wanted to portray the historical fragmentation of the HRE at the most detailed level of any Paradox GSG. There are a couple of things that we are aware of and we want to rework: the location connections (as in some places they are not obvious at all, and we want to make warfare in the HRE not impossible); and the transition between the German locations and those at their east, making it smoother (something that we will be doing in the review of Poland, Hungary and this region [e.g. for Bohemia]). A final comment: if you click on the spoiler button, you may be able to see 4 more detailed maps of the region.

Provinces:
Provinces.png

Map of provinces. As usual, suggestions are welcomed.

Areas:
Areas.png

Areas. We are currently not happy with the area borders (or at least, one of our German content designers isn't, and let me note it while preparing the DD... ;) ), as they reflect more modern areas so we will be looking into an alternative setup for them with your feedback. They also currently use their German names, which will change to English ones to be in line with other areas, as usual.

Terrain:
Climate.png

Topography.png

Vegetation.png

Terrain mapmodes. The region is quite forested, in comparison to other parts of Europe.

Culture:
Cultures.png

Let’s open the Pandora box and take a look at the cultures! The German cultures have come through a couple of reworks, until we’ve found a spot in which we’re kind of happy (or, at least, our German content designers do not complain!). The German cultures are very linguistically related, as we thought that it would be the best starting point for 1337. Please let us know about your thoughts on them.

Religion:
Religion.png

Boring religion map this week, as the region is overwhelmingly Catholic. There are Ashkenazi Jews in a bunch of places (a quick account: they’re present in 204 locations all over Central and Eastern Europe), and you may also see the Waldesians we added in the review of Italy last week.

Raw Materials:
Raw materials.png

Raw materials! Plenty of!

Markets:
Markets.png

The main market centers of the region are Cologne, Lúbeck, and Prague. We have reviewed them a couple of times, and this is the configuration that makes for a good setup historical and gameplay-wise. And you may also see Bruges, which has been reinstated as the main market of the Low Countries, after some tweaks.

Country and Location Population:
Population.png

Population 2.png

Population 3.png

Populations 4.png
The population of the HRE is… Fragmented. In that regard, Bohemia starts in a very strong position, with a strong competitor to its south (Austria) and north (Brandenburg).

And that’s it for today! I hope that we didn’t drive you into madness with this map… Next week we will take to a very different region, the Maghreb! See you then!
 
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What is the reasoning behind Silesian German existing at the start? It was a recent migration after all
That there were plenty of German already in 1337 in Silesia, we had to portray them in a certain way, and trying to make a detailed account of their origins was not easy at all. We followed a similar approach for all the Eastern Europe Germans, for consistency.
 
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Hmmm, so I've seen this several times (Notably the Croatian Coast and the Aegean)

Can we assume that "Strait Crossings" aren't a thing?
or is it just the names not counting that as connected land
 

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Hello,

as I promised to make my proposal for the southeastern part of the Holy Roman Empire, now it is here! There are some changes from the last proposal, as I additionally reviewed the political situation of each location separately. I've added population and culture suggestions.I have taken population numbers from previous Tinto Maps and taken into account the absolute value of provinces or areas. In the event that the values change, I would preserve the relationship between the cultures and increase the number of inhabitants by just a factor, because I recently found out that the modern borders of Slovenia in 1300 should have had from 450,000 to 600,000 inhabitants, which they now have in the game somewhere approx. 250,000. I hope that my efforts have paid off and that at least some of this will be taken into account.


Map of Locations, Provinces and Areas

SoutheastHRE_Areas_Provinces_Locations.png



Political Map

1723376046539.png
1722007670581.png



Map of Goods

SoutheastHRE_Goods.png



Map of Topography

SoutheastHRE_Topography.png



Map of Vegetation

SoutheastHRE_Vegetation.png



Localisation, Ownership, Goods, Population and Culture table.

AreaProvinceID Loc.LocationOwnerGoodsPopulationCultures
Dalmatia/East AdriaticIstria
25.500​
1​
Pola (Ita.), Puola (Ist.), Pula (Cro.), Pulj (Slo.)Republic of VeniceWine
4.900​
Istriot (Dalmatian) 50%, Croatian 30%, Venetian 20%
2​
Albona (Ita.), Labin (Cro., Slo.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Coal
2.500​
Croatian 50%, Rumerian 50%
3​
Pisino (Ita.), Pixin (Ven.), Pazin (Cro., Slo.) Mitterburg (Ger.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Olives
4.200​
Croatian 60%, Rumerian 40%
4​
Rovigno (Ita.), Ruvèigno (Ist.), Rovinj (Cro.), Trebinje (Slo.)Republic of VeniceFish
4.700​
Istriot (Dalmatian) 45%, Croatian 35%, Venetian 15%, Slovenian 5%
5​
Capodistria (Ita.), Koper (Slo.), Kopar (Cro.)Republic of VeniceSalt
5.300​
Istriot (Dalmatian) 60%, Slovene 20%, Croatian 10%, Venetian 10%
6​
Piquentum (Ita.), Buzet (Cro., Slo.), Blzet (old Cha.)Patriarchate of AquileiaFruit
3.900​
Slovenian 40%, Croatian 35%, Rumerian 25%
Lika
74​
Fiume (Ita., Hun.), Rijeka (Cro.), Reka (Slo. Cha.)Lords of DuinoWool
8.700​
Croatian 90%,Dalmatian 10% (most Burgh.)
FriuliTrieste
280.100​
39.900​
7​
Trieste (Ita.), Triest (Fri. Ger.), Trst (Slo.)Commune of TriesteHorses
15.000​
Slovenian 75%, Friulian 25% (most Burgh.)
8​
Duino (Ita.), Devin (Slo.), Tybein (Ger.)Lords of DuinoLumber
7.400​
Slovenian 95%, Friulian 5% (most Burgh.)
9​
Aquileia (Ita.), Olee / Acuilee (Fri.), Oglej (Slo.)Patriarchate of AquileiaWheat
17.500​
Friulian 90%, Slovenian 10% (most Comm.)
Friuli
202.300​
13​
Cividale (Ita.), Cividât (Fri.), Čedad (Slo.), Altenstsdt (Ger.)Patriarchate of AquileiaWine
10.500​
Friulian 60%, Slovenian 40%
14​
Udine (Ita.), Udin (Fri.), Videm (Slo.), Weiden (Ger.)Patriarchate of AquileiaWheat
61.500​
Friulian 100%
14ALatisana (Ital.), Tisane (Fri.)Patriarchate of AquileiaSalt
23.400​
Friulian 100%
15​
Gemona (Ita.), Glemone (Fri.), Humin (Slo.), Klemaun (Ger.)Patriarchate of AquileiaLivestock
21.100​
Friulian 90%, Slovenian 10% (most Comm.)
17​
Spengenberg (Ger.), Spilimbergo (Ita.), Spilimberc (Fri.)Patriarchate of AquileiaLivestock
33.500​
Friulian 100%
18​
Pordenone (Ita.), Pordenon (Ven., Fri.)House of HabsburgWine
28.600​
Friulian 65%, Venetian 35%
19​
Portogruaro (Ita.), Porto (Ven.), Puart (Fri.)Patriarchate of AquileiaWheat
23.700​
Friulian 75%, Venetian 25%
Carnia
37.900​
16​
Tolmezzo (Ita.), Tumieç (Fri.), Tolmeč (Slo.), Schönfeld (Ger.), Schunvelt (Tim.)Patriarchate of AquileiaCopper
25.400​
Friulian 80%, Timavese (Southern Bavarian) 10% (most Comm.), Slovenian 10% (most Comm.)
16AForni di Sopra (Ital.), For Disore (Fri.)Patriarchate of AquileiaStone
12.500​
Friulian 100%
CarniolaGorizia
128.300​
21.200​
10​
Gorica (Slo.), Gorizia (Ita.), Gurize (Fri.), Gorisia (Ven.), Görz (Ger.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Clay
12.300​
Slovenian 84%, Friulian 15% (most Comm.), Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
11​
Idrija (Slo.), Idria (Ger., Ita.)Patriarchate of AquileiaMercury
2.500​
Slovenian 100%
12​
Tolmin (Slo.), Tolmino (Ita.), Tolmein (Ger.)Patriarchate of AquileiaLivestock
6.400​
Slovenian 100%
Oberkrain
39.700​
20​
Ljubljana (Slo.), Laibach (Ger.), Lubiana (Ita.)House of HabsburgWheat
9.200​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
21​
Kamnik (Slo.), Stein (Ger.)House of HabsburgStone
7.700​
Slovenian 98%, Southern Bavarian 2% (most Burgh.)
22​
Kranj (Slo.), Krainburg (Ger.)House of OrtenburgStone
10.600​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
23​
Bled (Slo.), Veldes (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of BrixenIron
7.000​
Slovenian 100%
24​
Škofja Loka (Slo.), Bischoflack (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of FreisingIron
5.200​
Central Bavarian 45%, Slovenian 35%, Southern Bavarian 20%
Innerkrain
25.700​
25Postojna (Slo.), Postumia (Ita.), Adelsberg (Ger.)House of HabsburgTimber
11.500​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
25ACerknica (Slo.), Zirknitz (Ger.), Zirconio (Ita.)Patriarchate of AquileiaFish
8.500​
Slovenian 100%
26Prem (Slo., Ger.), Primano (Ita.)Lords of DuinoWool
5.700​
Slovenian 100%
Mitterkrain
14.300​
27Ribnica (Slo.), Reifnitz (Ger.)House of OrtenburgTimber
9.000​
Slovenian 98%, Southern Bavarian 2% (Comm. and Burgh.)
27ALož (Slo.), Laas (Ger.)House of OrtenburgTimber
4.800​
Slovenian 98%, Southern Bavarian 2% (Comm. and Burgh.)
28Mahovnik (Slo.), Mooswald (Ger.) *House of OrtenburgWild Game
500​
Slovenian 100%
Unterkrain
27.400​
29​
Kostanjevica (Slo.), Landstraß (Ger.) **House of HabsburgWine
11.400​
Slovenian 98%, Southern Bavarian 2% (Comm. and Burgh.)
30​
Metlika (Slo., Möttling (Ger.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Clay
10.500​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
31​
Višnja Gora (Slo.), Weixelburg (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of Gurk (Salzburg vassal)Livestock
5.500​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
StyriaSanntal
263.600​
32.000​
32​
Celje (Slo.), Cilli (Ger.)House of CilliWheat
13.700​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
33​
Brežice (Slo.), Rann (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of Gurk (Salzburg vassal)Sand
11.100​
Slovenian 99%, Southernl Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
34​
Schönstein (Ger.) Šoštanj (Slo.)House of CilliCoal
7.200​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
Drauwald
48.100​
35​
Marburg (Ger.), Marprk (Slo.)House of HabsburgWine
12.700​
Slovenian 88%, Central Bavarian 10% (Comm. and Burgh.), Jewish 2% (Burgh.)
36​
Ptuj (Slo.), Pettau (Ger.)Prince-Archbishopric of SalzburgWheat
12.000​
Slovenian 98%, Central Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.), Jewish 1% (Burgh.)
37​
Bistrica (Slo.), Feistritz (Ger.)House of HabsburgFruit
11.300​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
38​
Slovenj Gradec (Slo.), Windischgrätz (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of Gurk (Salzburg vassal)Livestock
5.000​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
39​
Ivnik (Slo.), Eibiswald (Ger.)Lords of DuinoIron
7.100​
Slovenian 50%, Southern Bavarian 50%
An der Mur
72.000​
40​
Gradec (Slo.), Graz (Ger.)House of HabsburgWool
14.300​
Central Bavarian 100%
41​
Voitsberg (Ger.), Vojčperk (Slo.)House of HabsburgCoal
5.100​
Southern Bavarian 100%
42​
Lipnica (Slo.), Leibnitz (Ger.)Prince-Archbishopric of SalzburgStone
4.500​
Southern Bavarian 90%, Slovenian 10% (most Comm.)
43​
Weiz (Ger.), Vides (Slo.)House of HabsburgSilver
14.300​
Central Bavarian 100%
44​
Fürstenfeld (Ger.), Fölöstöm (Hun.), Knežje Polje (Slo.)House of HabsburgTimber
27.900​
Central Bavarian 100%
45​
Feldbach (Ger.), Vrbna (Slo.)House of HabsburgWheat
5.900​
Central Bavarian 100%
Mürztal
21.500​
46​
Bruck an der Mur (Ger.), Most ob Muri (Slo.)House of HabsburgTimber
12.700​
Central Bavarian 100%
48​
Mürzzuschlag (Ger.), Muriška Slaka (Slo.)House of HabsburgLivestock
8.800​
Central Bavarian 100%
Murtal
54.100​
49​
Leoben (Ger.), Ljuben (Slo.)House of HabsburgIron
20.100​
Central Bavarian 100%
50​
Judenburg (Ger.)House of HabsburgCoal
9.000​
Southern Bavarian 95%, Jewish 5% (Burgh.)
51​
Zeiring (Ger.)House of HabsburgSilver
6.500​
Southern Bavarian 100%
52​
Oberwölz (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of FreisingWheat
12.800​
Southern Bavarian 100%
53​
Murau (Ger.)House of HabsburgIron
5.700​
Southern Bavarian 100%
Ennstal
35.900​
54​
Liezen (Ger.), Lucen (Slo.),House of HabsburgSalt
14.100​
Central Bavarian 100%
55​
Rottenmann (Ger.), Črmljen (Slo.)House of HabsburgLivestock
12.300​
Central Bavarian 100%
56​
Gröbming (Ger.), Grebin (Slo.)House of HabsburgIron
9.500​
Central Bavarian 100%
CarinthiaMittelkärnten
113.000​
30.300​
57​
Celovec (Slo.), Klagenfurt (Ger.)House of HabsburgLivestock
11.500​
Slovenian 75%, Southern Bavarian 25%
58​
Sankt Veit (Ger.), Sveti Vid (Slo.)House of HabsburgStone
5.800​
Southern Bavarian 85%, Slovenian 15%
59​
Breže (Slo.), Friesach (Ger.)Prince-Archbishopric of SalzburgMarble
2.500​
Southern Bavarian 95%, Slovenian 5%
60​
Krka (Slo.), Gurk (Ger.)Prince-Bishopric of Gurk (Salzburg vassal)Timber
3.700​
Southern Bavarian 100%
61​
Trg (Slo.), Feldkirchen (Ger.)House of HabsburgWheat
6.800​
Southern Bavarian 65%, Slovenian 35%
Unterkärnten
19.300​
62​
Wolfsberg (Ger.), Volšperk (Slo.)Prince-Bishopric of BambergIron
8.800​
Southern Bavarian 85%, Slovenian 15%
63​
Velikovec (Slo), Völkermarkt (Ger.)House of HabsburgLead
10.500​
Slovenian 99%, Southern Bavarian 1% (most Burgh.)
Oberkärnten
50.000​
64​
Beljak (Slo.), Villach (Ger.), Villaco (Ita.), Vilac (Fri.)Prince-Bishopric of BambergLead
12.800​
Slovenian 75%, Friuian 15%, Southern Bavarian 10%
65​
Spittal (Ger.), Špital (Slo.)House of OrtenburgMarble
8.200​
Southern Bavarian 95%, Slovenian 5%
66​
Sovodenj (Slo.), Gmünd (Ger.)Prince-Archbishopric of SalzburgWool
5.400​
Southern Bavarian 95%, Slovenian 5%
67​
Zgornja Bela (Slo.), Obervellach (Ger.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Copper
7.600​
Southern Bavarian 95%, Slovenian 5%
68​
Šmohor (Slo.), Hermagor (Ger.)Patriarchate of AquileiaTimber
9.800​
Southern Bavarian 70%, Slovenian 30%
47​
Greifenburg (Ger.), Grabelje (Slo.)House of HabsburgLivestock
6.200​
Southern Bavarian 100%
Iseltal
13.400​
69​
Lienz (Ger.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Wheat
8.500​
Southern Bavarian 100%
70​
Matrei (Ger.), Mater (Slo.)Prince-Archbishopric of SalzburgLivestock
4.900​
Southern Bavarian 75%, Slovenian 25%
TyrolPustertal
18.500​
71​
Bruneck (Ger.), Brunico (Ita.), Bornech (Lad.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)What
6.400​
Southern Bavarian 100%
72​
Innichen (Ger.), San Candido (Ita.), Sanciana (Lad.)House of Gorizia (Gorizian branch)Livestock
8.900​
Southern Bavarian 100%
73​
Taufers (Ger.), Tures (Ita.)House of Gorizia (Tyrol branch)Stone
3.200​
Southern Bavarian 100%

Notes:

* The area was almost uninhabited until the beginning of the 14th century, Slovenes lived in the outskirts, such as by the river Kolpa, and the rest of the area was covered by primeval forest. In the first part of the 14th century, Counts of Ortenburg began to settle the forest with Slovenes, then in the second part of the century with Germans from Carinthia and Tyrol. Kočevje (Slo.), Gottschee (Ger.) or Gətscheab (Got.) is mentioned for the first time in 1363, and before that it was called Mahovnik (Slo.) or Mooswald (Ger.).

** In year 1365 Rudolf IV, Duke of Austria established Růdolfswerde (Ger.) or Rudolfovo pristanišče (Slo.) the locals called the place Novo Mesto (Slo.) or Neustadtl (Ger.).

Ita. – Italian name

Ist. – Istriot name

Fri. – Friulian name

Ven. – Venetian name

Lad. – Ladinian name

Slo. – Slovenian name

Cro. – Croatian name

Cho. – Chakavian name

Ger. – German name

Got. – Gottscheerish name

Tim – Timavese name

Hun. – Hungarian name


Istria (Province)

In 1337, the western coast of Istria was in the possession of the Republic of Venice, before that it was part of the Patriarchs of Aquileia, Pula was appropriated in 1150, Koper in 1279 and Rovinj in 1283. Labin (1295 from P. of Aquileia) and Pazin (1209 from Counts of Weixelburg) were in the possession of the Counts of Gorizia (Gorizian branch), Pazin in 1342, it passed into the possession of Albert III of Gorizia (Istrian branch), as he renounced the County of Gorizia. After his death, the property passed into the hands of the Habsburgs in 1374. Labin was owned by the Patriarchs of Aquileia in 1381 and later in 1420 under the Republic of Venice. Buzet was owned by the Patriarchate of Aquileia and also became part of the Republic of Venice in 1420.

In addition to drinks (wine) and food (cheese (livestock farming), olives, fish, fruits), there were also two important raw materials in Istria. In the northwest (location of Capodistria) were or are still one of the largest salt evaporation ponds in this area, and in the southeast, in the location of Albona, there was the largest coal mine in Croatia.

The vegetation in the west of Istria is predominantly agricultural, while sparse forests dominate in the east. The topography is flat in the western part, hilly in the north and more plateau in the east.

Throughout history, Istria has been very culturally mixed, especially in 1337, it was probably very colorful. In the west, the Istriot (Dalmatian dialect or even their own language) dominated, among which the ruling culture (Venetian) was already immigrating, mostly in the form of the bourgeoisie. On the outskirts of the cities, there are already the first Slavic settlements, which are attracted by lucrative opportunities. In the north of Istria, the majority are Slovenes, and in the central part, Croats. In the east of Istria, the Rumerian culture predominates.

1721999935671.png



Friuli (Area)

Friuli (area) was majority owned by the Patriarchate of Aquileia, which its parts in 1420 became part of Republic of Venice. The exception was Pordenone, which had been owned by the Habsburgs since 1278, but before that it had been owned by the Přemyslids. In 1508 it became part of the Republic of Venice. Next Trieste, which was an independent commune until 1382, after which it submitted to the Habsburgs. Duino was owned by the Lords of Duino, in 1399 with their extinction the property was inherited by the Walseer-Enns lords. In 1466, they also died out and the property came into the possession of the Habsburgs.

In Friuli, the production of raw materials is mostly based on food and wine production, the exception being the two smaller provinces of Carnia and Trieste. In mountainous Carnia, the largest yield of mineral raw materials is found in Tolmezzo, where there were copper mines (Monte Avanza and Timau) and the western part of Carnia was dominated by quarries. In the province of Trieste, above the city of Trieste, horses have been bred since time immemorial, and the Lipica stud farm still exists there. In the location of Duino, one of the main raw materials was wood, as it comprises part of the Karst Plateau, which was covered with an oak forest even before it was cut down to build Venice. The location of Aquileia, like most of Friuli, had wheat as its raw material. In the province of Friuli, in the south, there was one exception in Latisana, where salt was also produced.

The vegetation in the flat part was predominantly agricultural, sparsely dense in the hills, dense forest in the mountains and plateaus.

Friuli was mostly inhabited by Friulian culture, along the borders it mixed with Venetian culture in the west, in the north with Timavese (Southern Bavarian) and in the east with Slovenian culture. Venetian culture came to the Friuli cities later, when Patriarchate of Aquileia became part of the Republic of Venice, so in my proposal there is none in central locations of the area. Trieste also became Venetian during the Habsburg Empire, but before that it was Friulian. The countryside of Trieste remained Slovenian for a long time.


Carniola (Area)

Carniola was dominated by two political powers in 1337, the first, which also controlled a wider area, the Habsburgs, owned Ljubljana, Kamnik, Postojni and Kostanjevica, which they appropriated from the Přemyslids in 1276. The second was the Ortenburgs, who owned Kranj, Ribnica, Lož and Mahovnik (Kočevje). Kranj was acquired in 1102 from the counts of Weimar-Orlamünde. Ribnica was acquired from Andechs in 1248. Lož was acquired in 1335 and Mahovnik in 1336 from the Patriarchate of Aquileia due to a dispute, and the severance was paid with the lordships. The Patriarchate of Aquileia owned Idrija, Tolmin and Cerknica in Carniola. Tolmin and Idrija belonged to the Republic of Venice after 1420, later in 1509 they were conquered by the Habsburgs. In 1395, Cerknica was donated to the Carthusian monastery in Bistra, which was part of the Habsburg territory and thus Cerknica became part of it. The Counts of Gorizia of course owned Gorica (acquired from the Aquileian Patriarchate in 1120) and Metlika (acquired from the Aquileian Patriarchate in 1277). Metlika, in 1342, it passed into the possession of Albert III of Gorizia (Istrian branch), as he renounced the County of Gorizia. After the death of Albert III in 1374 and the failure of the Istrian branch of the Counts of Gorizia, the property passed into the possession of the Habsburgs, who then sold the property to the Counts of Celje in the same year. Smaller players in area were Lords of Duino who owned Prem (acquired from Andechs in 1248), Prince-Bishopric of Brixen owned Bled (acquired in 1004 from the Liudolfingers), Prince-Bishopric of Freising owned Škofja Loka (acquired in 973 from the Liudolfingers) and Prince-Bishopric of Gurk, which owned Mokronog, but due to the insignificance of the place I assigned them Višnja Gora, they got the property from Hemm von Gurk (1045), who was later in 1439 captured by the Counts of Celje during the war with the Habsburgs, they ceded it to them for an agreement.

In Carniola, the raw materials are a little more diverse depending on the landscape. Oberkrain was dominated by mineral raw materials, such as iron and stones, Ljubljana as a flat part, which in the south was mostly marsh, was its biggest source of food (wheat). Gorizia is also strong in terms of mineral resources, as it has a mercury mine in Idrija and clay in the Gorizia location. Tolmin is known for its dairy products. Unterkrain is last which contains mineral raw material (clay). The province is known for its wine and livestock (pork). Mitterkrain is known for its wooden products and its rugged nature, which offers many meaty "fruits". Wood as a raw material continues to be a more important resource also in the province of Innerkrain in the location of Postojna. As an interesting point, there is an intermittent lake in the east (Cerknica), which made it possible to catch large amounts of fish, or literally gather fish. The third raw material in the province was wool.

Most of the vegetation is forest, the locations of Ljubljana and Kostanjevica are more agricultural, as the topography allows. The north is mountainous, the western southern part is dominated by plateaus and karst fields at altitudes of 500 m and above. The east is dominated by hills. Only Ljubljana is a larger plain, but a large part of it is bog.

In the year 1337, Carniola was part of Slovenian culture, except in towns and markets where Germans (Southern Bavarians) were mostly present. In the southern part, there were some small pockets of the German peasant population, so that the name of the villages "Nemška vas" (German village) has been preserved to this day. In the north, or more precisely in Bischoflack, a larger colony of Germans from Bavaria (Central Bavarians) and Carinthia (Southern Bavarians) existed. The Freising bishops settled them there in the 11th century. The location with the smallest number of inhabitants, currently called Mooswald (Mahovnik), was mostly forest in 1337, except by the river Kolpa (Kupa) where a handful of Slovenes lived. It was only at the end of the 14th century that the Counts of Ortenburg settled in South Bavarians and the location was renamed to Gottschee (Kočevje).

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Styria (Area)

Styria was almost entirely owned by the Habsburgs, who had appropriated it from the Bambergs in 1246. The Counts of Celje owned Šoštanj (acquired from the Counts of Heunburg in 1322) and Celje (Žovnek was owned since 1130). Prince-Archbishopric of Salzburg owned Leibnitz and Ptuj (acquired from the Kingdom of Hungary in 977), then fell back to the Kingdom of Hungary in 1479 and then returned to Salzburg again in 1511, which was then sold to the Habsburgs in 1555. Prince-Bishopric of Freising owned Oberwölz (acquired in 1007 from the Liudolfingers). Prince-Bishopric of Krka, which owned Bizeljsko, but due to the insignificance of the place I assigned them Brežice, they got the property from Hemm von Gurk (1045). The property was then acquired by the Tattenbachs in 1608 and later in 1671 by the Habsburgs. In the year of 1335 PB Gurk also leased Slovenj Gradec from Patriarchate of Aquileia which was later annexed in 1362 by Habsburgs. The Duino lords owned Eibiswald, which they acquired in 1325 from the Wildon lords.

There are quite a few deposits of mineral resources in Upper and Middle Styria, such as iron, silver, coal, stones and salt. When I was reading the resources, I was already on the verge that every location would have mineral resources, but in the end it was not like that. Based on the topography and the hairiness, I decided on natural raw materials (wood, livestock, wheat), Graz was especially known to produce wool. In Lower Styria, food commodities dominate, other commodities are coal (Velenje mine), sand (quartz mines in the south of location) and iron (Ivnik Mine),

The majority of Styria is a forest country with a predominant sparse forest. A denser forest is in the north above the Mura River and in Pohorje. The predominant agricultural vegetation is in the location of Graz and Pettau. The topography is very contrasting, Upper Styria has mountains and Middle and Lower Styria hills.

Styria was largely German, except in Lower Styria where Slovenes dominated. Marburg and Judenburg also had Jewish communities, especially Judenburg, which was even named after them. The western part of Early and Middle Styria contains the South Bavarian culture, as there is also a dialect border with the Central Bavarian dialect, which represents a large part of the Styrian culture. Slovenian locations also contain German burghers, just like in Carniola.

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Carinthia (Area)


In 1337, the largest landowners in Carinthia were the Habsburgs, who acquired their estates in 1276 from the Přemyslids. Prince-Archbishopric of Salzburg owns Friesach, Gmünd and Matrei. The Counts of Gorizia owned Obervellach (in 1164 from Brixen) and Lienz (acquired before 1090 from the Patriarchate of Aquileia). Prince-Bishopric of Bamberg owned Villach (acquired in 1007 from Prince-Bishopric of Brixen) and Wolfsberg (acquired in 1007 from the Liudolfingers). The Ortenburgs owned Spittal as their capital (acquired from the Counts of Lurn in 1135). The Friulians owned Hermagor, which was then owned by the Counts of Gorizia in 1342. Prince-Bishopric of Gurk, which owned Gurk, got the property from Hemm von Gurk in 1045.

Carinthia is dominated by lead (Mežica and Bleiberg) and marble, followed by iron, copper and stones. Other raw materials are wheat, livestock, wood and wool. (source)

Most of Carinthia is sparsely forested, as the higher areas have pastures, the valleys are cultivated, and the steep areas are covered with forest. Klagenfurt has the largest agricultural areas. The steepest slopes are in the southwestern part of Carinthia, and as a result, the forest there is much denser. Most of the area is mountainous, especially the western part. The east is dominated by hills and one location of with large plain which is on high altitude so that it has more of a plateau character than being a flatland.

In Carinthia, Southern Bavarians and Slovenians intermingle much more. Although the distinct national border runs along the Drava River, both cultures are found in smaller amounts on both sides. The locations which contain 5% of Slovenian culture and the Matrei location with 25% Slovenian culture (the last Slovenian colonization of Carinthia in 1300) represent the last spots of this culture, which were assimilated into German by the 15th century. A small minority of Friulian culture is also present in the Villach location.

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More general political changes later:

In 1399, after the extinction of the Duino lords, the entire Duino lordship passed into the hands of the Walseer-Enns lords. When the Walseer-Enns died out in 1466, the estate became part of the Habsburgs.

After the death of the Ortenburgs in 1420, all their property passed into the hands of the Counts of Celje. After their extinction in 1456, the entire Principality of Celje passed into the hands of the Habsburgs.

In 1363, after their extinction, the estates of the Counts of Gorizia of the Tyrolean branch were became part of the Habsburgs.

The County of Gorizia, which the Counts of Gorizia from the Gorizian branch did not lose until their extinction, passed to the Habsburgs in 1500.
 

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Very nice:D

I'm assuming the market borders will change significantly upon the promised major-river review?

Also slightly disappointed that none of the Wadden islands qualified to be its own location :p
 
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If someone makes a post about a region yet to be tentatively finalized - say, some hypothetical region called uh "Bindia", do people take a look at it or leave it till the Tinto Map feedback time?
The second.
 
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And to think that the first Tinto Maps comprised of just Low Countries. Was it a test run or only after posting it you realized that in such a speed it will take you ten years to go through the entire world map?

Also: do you have somewhere total population of HRE? At least approximate? I'm curious how it compares to other regions in Europe.
 
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We might do the German Alps a bit more functional after the review, as we did with the French and Italian areas.
noooo, don't remove locations from there, have mercy. wider Slovenia region is always crap in paradox games density wise (province density). don't make alpine regions suffer even more ;( keep the location density please :(

and Carinthia was important :c
 
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Hello, and welcome to another new Tinto Maps! I’m back to duty, after the review of Italy that we posted last Thursday, and Johan taking care of Scandinavia last Friday. Today we will be taking a look at Germany! This region comprises the modern territories of Czechia, Austria, Switzerland, and Liechtenstein. However, for most of the timeline in Project Caesar, it was better known as the Holy Roman Empire. This organization once was a feudal empire elevated from the Kingdom of the Germans, but by 1337 was mostly disaggregated into a multitude of temporal and ecclesiastical jurisdictions, with only a tenuous feudal relationship with their Emperor.

Let’s start diving deep into this nightmare, then…

Countries:
View attachment 1167612
I’m showing here a bit more of what the region is, so you can have a clear depiction of how it looks compared to the neighboring regions we’ve previously shown (and so that the Reddit guy who is patchworking the world map has an easier day ). What I can say about this when the map speaks for itself… The lands of Germany are highly fractured among different principalities, making for an extremely complex political situation. The Emperor in 1337 was Louis IV von Wittelsbach of Upper Bavaria… Because, yes, Bavaria is also divided. He is married to Margaret of Avesnes, daughter of Count William of Hainaut, Holland, and Zelland, while his son Louis is the Margrave of Brandenburg. But probably the strongest power of the period is the Kingdom of Bohemia, whose king John also Duke Luxembourg and rules over both lands in a personal union, while also being overlord of the Margraviate of Moravia, ruler by his son Charles, and the Silesian principalities. The third contender probably is the Duchy of Austria, ruled by Albert II von Habsburg. He also rules over some lands in the formed Duchies of Swabia and Carinthia. There are also plenty of medium and small countries all over the region, with very different forms of government, which will probably make this HRE a very replayable experience…

Dynasties:
View attachment 1167613
The dynastical map of the HRE gives a nice picture of the situation explained in the previous one. The von Wittelsbach, de Luxembourg (John of Bohemia is considered of French culture, therefore it uses the French toponymic article ‘de’; if he would change to the German culture, then it would be the ‘von Luxembourg’ dynasty), and von Habsburg cover much of the map; you may note that the Wittelsbach rule over five different countries (Upper Bavaria, Lower Bavaria, the Palatinate of the Rhine, and Brandenburg); while the House of Luxembourg also control the Archbishopric of Trier through Balduin, uncle of King John. Other important dynasties, although in a secondary position, are the Welfen, von Mecklenburg, and Gryf, present in multiple countries to the north; the Askanier, who happen to control half of Upper Saxony, while the rest is in the hands of the von Wettin; and the von Görz, who rule over the Duchy of Tirol and the County of Gorizia.

HRE:
View attachment 1167615
We obviously have to repost the HRE IO map again here. The purple stripes mark the imperial territory, while the different types of members use different colors. We currently have these divisions in the IO: the Emperor (1, dark blue), Prince-Electors (4, light blue), Archbishop-Electors (3, medium blue), Free Imperial Cities (23, light green), Imperial Peasant Republics (2, orange), Imperial Prelates (44, white), and Regular Members (280, dark green). So, yeah, that make for a total of 357 countries that are part of the HRE. And before you ask: No, we won’t talk about its mechanics today, that will happen in future Tinto Talks.

Locations:
View attachment 1167616
Germany has the highest density of locations in the world, as we wanted to portray the historical fragmentation of the HRE at the most detailed level of any Paradox GSG. There are a couple of things that we are aware of and we want to rework: the location connections (as in some places they are not obvious at all, and we want to make warfare in the HRE not impossible); and the transition between the German locations and those at their east, making it smoother (something that we will be doing in the review of Poland, Hungary and this region [e.g. for Bohemia]). A final comment: if you click on the spoiler button, you may be able to see 4 more detailed maps of the region.

Provinces:
View attachment 1167621
Map of provinces. As usual, suggestions are welcomed.

Areas:
View attachment 1167622
Areas. We are currently not happy with the area borders (or at least, one of our German content designers isn't, and let me note it while preparing the DD... ;) ), as they reflect more modern areas so we will be looking into an alternative setup for them with your feedback. They also currently use their German names, which will change to English ones to be in line with other areas, as usual.

Terrain:
View attachment 1167623
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View attachment 1167625
Terrain mapmodes. The region is quite forested, in comparison to other parts of Europe.

Culture:
View attachment 1167626
Let’s open the Pandora box and take a look at the cultures! The German cultures have come through a couple of reworks, until we’ve found a spot in which we’re kind of happy (or, at least, our German content designers do not complain!). The German cultures are very linguistically related, as we thought that it would be the best starting point for 1337. Please let us know about your thoughts on them.

Religion:
View attachment 1167629
Boring religion map this week, as the region is overwhelmingly Catholic. There are Ashkenazi Jews in a bunch of places (a quick account: they’re present in 204 locations all over Central and Eastern Europe), and you may also see the Waldesians we added in the review of Italy last week.

Raw Materials:
View attachment 1167630
Raw materials! Plenty of!

Markets:
View attachment 1167632
The main market centers of the region are Cologne, Lúbeck, and Prague. We have reviewed them a couple of times, and this is the configuration that makes for a good setup historical and gameplay-wise. And you may also see Bruges, which has been reinstated as the main market of the Low Countries, after some tweaks.

Country and Location Population:
View attachment 1167633
The population of the HRE is… Fragmented. In that regard, Bohemia starts in a very strong position, with a strong competitor to its south (Austria) and north (Brandenburg).

And that’s it for today! I hope that we didn’t drive you into madness with this map… Next week we will take to a very different region, the Maghreb! See you then!
The Rhine River should split up Köln location. It is the only one which is not split up by it. I will allow for so many natural borders!
 
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Since we see Holland on this Tinto Map, may I respectfully submit historical modifications to Holland and Zeeland locations? I was very late to the game, but I did document all my suggestions last week in my post here. Thank you for your consideration.
 
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Quick feedback:
  • Slovenian Styria should be "Untersteiermark" (Lower Styria).
  • Turing should be Turingen (with umlauts ofc).
  • Once again re-think the useage of "Kashubian" for all Slavic Pommeranians (Kashubia is but a small region of Pommerania).
  • Polish shouldn't extend into Lebuser Land, it should be either Sorbian or Polabian there. This region should also have a sizable Silesian population as it was historically part of Silesia more than Greater Poland.
  • Consider maybe adding some Slavic pagans in Pommerania, they were historically very hard to convert and most likely the belief system remained in some isolated regions for a long while.
  • Polabian being the majority near Stettin makes no sense - it would some variant of Slavic Pommeranian (what you call "Kashubian") here.
  • Last thing tregarding Poland and Carpathia, the Polish access to mountains (Podhale) should be flanked by Orava and Spis locations, making the Polish access more narrow (as it was historically).
 
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Wow, German map is so BIIIIG

I have two suggestion about province name. First, since the domination culture in Tesin (Tesin Principality, vassal of Bohemia) is polish, don't better name is Cieszyn (like in polish, not czech). Secend, since the domination culture in Żary (Żagań Principality, vassal of Bohemia) is sorbian, don't better name is Sorau (like in german, not polish). Another metter is a question of sorbian language, but i don't know what is used in this time.

Once again, this map is awesome!
 
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Still feels very weird for the Swiss to be in the Genoese market. Previously, it was said that there would be improvements to the logic for rivers. Is this after those improvements, but the position of the Rhine markets in the north (and the lack of markets on the Rhone) has resulted in Switzerland being detached from the Rhine/Rhone markets; or are those changes still in the works, and at some point down the line markets will be more geography-based, and less distance-based?
 
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Reposting from France feedback, since you said you'd be doing Alsace here:

The boundary between Rhenish Franconian and Lorrain in the Saulnois region still seems reflective of the situation *after* the Thirty Years War and the subsequent repopulation of the Saulnois region by Romance-speakers. This led to a large chunk of the region going from Germanophone to Francophone. (Note: I'm using Germanophone and Francophone to refer to regional dialects, not to German and French as we know them today) According to the linguist Alain Simmer (Source: https://hal.univ-lorraine.fr/tel-01750396, p. 95):
La zone ainsi gagnée par le français se définit par une ligne passant au nord par Arriance, Morhange, Albestroff, Sarrebourg, Abreschviller, le Donon et, au sud, par Château–Bréhain, Marsal, Réchicourt–le–Château

The zone thus gained by French is defined by a line passing in the north by Arriance, Morhange, Albestroff, Sarrebourg, Abreschviller, le Donon and, in the south, by Château-Bréhain, Marsal, Réchicourt-le-Château
Particularly of note here is that Morhange, which in the maps posted lends its name to a predominantly Lorrain location, was just north of the affected region, whose southern boundary stretched south-east from Château-Bréhain (about 10km SW of Morhange) through Marsal (about 7km east of Vic-sur-Seille) to Réchicourt-le-Château (not far north of the modern département's southern border). That is to say, in 1337 Morhange and its environs were Germanic-speaking, and Vic-sur-Seille was not far to the west of the converted region. The below map showing the change seems to be more or less consistent with Simmer's description:
1720113417617.png


(Note: Morchingen = Morhange, Vic-sur-Seille is a little southeast of Château-Salins)
It's a little hard to tell what areas precisely are represented by the locations of Morhange and Vic-sur-Seille, but imo considering this it's incorrect to represent Metz as having a larger Germanic minority than the area directly to its east, or the area immediately to the west of Sarrebourg as Romance-speaking.
 
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