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Tinto Maps #17 - 6th of September 2024 - Arabia

Hello everyone, and welcome to one more developer diary for map lovers! This is the second this week, after the review of Poland, Ruthenia, and the Baltic. Hurray!

Today we will be taking a look at the lands of Arabia! So let’s start, without further ado:

Countries:
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Colored Wastelands.png
This week, we have two country maps: one without colored wastelands for clarity, and one with them under the spoiler button. You might also wonder why there isn’t a third one with the Societies of Pops for the region. Well, that’s because Project Caesar has several layers to portray the simulation of a believable world (if you remember, one of our design pillars). A couple of weeks we presented the Societies of Pops as a new type of country, but if you go back to Tinto Talks #4, the Government Overview, Johan mentioned the different types of governments, which now you know are for Settled Countries. One of them is Tribal, which we think makes for a good representation of the most complex and organized tribal societies, which have some estate-like features while keeping some other tribal features.

Therefore, the way we’ve decided that fits better to portray the simulation of the Arabian Peninsula is having a divide between those countries that are Monarchies (Mecca, Yemen, Oman, Ormus, and the Jarwanids), and those that are Tribal (the rest of them). An interesting feature of the latter is that their lands will be full of Tribesmen pops, making the Tribal estate the most important one to manage. As a final note, I’d like you to understand that this is our interpretation for the simulation of the game, although it might not be the only one (as it happened with the discussions about which European countries should be decentralized with several subjects, and which shouldn’t). The good news regarding this is that we will be open to feedback and making changes, as usual; but also, that this setup can easily be changed through the script of the game, thus making it completely moddable after the game is released; so there could potentially be mods making inner Arabia covered by Societies of Pops instead of Tribal Settled countries, if you don’t like/agree with our interpretation, or just prefer it to be different.


Dynasties:
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Among the dynasties of the region, you might find some old acquaintances, such as the Rasulids of Yemen or the Nabhani of Oman, while also having a bunch of new ones. And not a week without a bug, of course: the ‘al-Al’ prefix is an error, as those dynasties are using a locative, which is mixed with a second one, from the location; we will have that fixed, then.

Locations:
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The locations of the region, with more detailed maps under the spoiler button for three different sections (Northern and Central Arabia, Southern Arabia, and Eastern Arabia).

Provinces:
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Areas:
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Terrain:
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You might notice that most of Arabia is an arid, desertic plateau. The only exception to this is some fertile mountain valleys in Yemen, which was known as Eudaimon Arabia/Arabia Felix for a reason.

Natural Harbors:
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Cultures:
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The cultural division of the region is quite interesting, as it’s divided into several Arabic-speaking people. And for those that might wonder, yes, Socotra has its own culture, Soqotri. We still have to add some minorities here and there, though, so we will take the opportunity to do it during the map review.

Religions:
Religions.png

The religious division of Arabia is also interesting, having Sunni, Shiite, and Ibady majorities spread across the peninsula. We have yet to address the minorities, which were not ready for the Tinto Maps, so we will show what that looks like on the map, and review as well. By the way, we might do some work in the coming weeks regarding Islam, and one of the things that I think we may tweak is the coloring, as Ibadi is too similar to Shiite; so I think that this might be a good opportunity to ask for your preferences about the coloring of the different branches of the Islamic faith.

Raw Materials:
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Dates, livestock, horses, and some wheat and sand make for a healthy economy if you’re a Tribal country, I guess? Jokes aside, the desertic lands of Northern and Central Arabia have a more simple resource distribution, while Yemen and Oman, on the other hand, have quite rich resources, such as Pearls, Alum, Copper, Dyes, Silk, and Coffee (who doesn’t like a good mocha?).

Markets:
Markets.png

There are five market centers present in this region: Mecca, Al-Hajar, Al-Hasa’, Hormoz, and ‘Adan. Coupled with the resources in the previous section, the control over ‘Adan and Hormoz will be strategically relevant, as it was historically.

Population:
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This week there aren’t (almost) issues with the population of the region, so we’re able to show it to you. The entire region has around 4.5M pops, which are unevenly distributed; Yemen has 1.6M, and Mecca 776K, making for more than half of the total, while a good chunk of it belongs to the Mamluks (that control all the area around Madina.

And that’s all for this week! For the next one, I have good news: we have finished the feedback review of Anatolia, and therefore I’ll post it on Monday! That way it will make for a week without a Tinto Talks more bearable. And on Friday, there will be maps for a new region, Iran and the Caucasus! See you!
 
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There have been plenty of internal discussions on how to represent different polities and tribes, and it is still a matter of review.
From what was discussed in the earlier TintoTalks, perhaps ABCs be the best system to represent migratory peoples such as internal Bedouins.

It's hard to say until we get a proper run through of how the system works for hordes etc. though.
 
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That Laila province might be the biggest of all...
i'm surprised there isn't locations along all the cosat , but maybe it was so inhospitable and sparsely populated it is rendered that way.
 
The ruler of Hormuz at this time was Qutb al-Din Tahamtan, so Hormuz would have been ruled by the Dinnid dynasty(If I'm not mistaken). Turns out I was mistaken, see also Streamlet's comment below. Given that Qutb al-Din was part of the 'New Kings of Hormuz' I think Qalhati is the better choice for a dynastic name.
The Persian Gulf in History by Lawrence G. Potter
 
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The ruler of Hormuz at this time was Qutb al-Din Tahamtan, so Hormuz would have been ruled by the Dinnid dynasty(If I'm not mistaken)
The Persian Gulf in History by Lawrence G. Potter
al-Din was part of his personal name, not a dynasty. More accurately, the dynasty could be called "Deramku" or "Qalhati" depending on how far you go back

 
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I dont mean having low control, I mean not being able own land, seeing Mamluks and Ottomans conquering Central Arabia is really weird looking no matter they havw zero control or not
I share your concern. However, whatever solution is found, it should not prevent addressing the threat posed by Central Arabia. I am thinking of the conquest of the Arabian Peninsula by the Wahhabi movement resp. by the Saudis. And it was Muhammad Ali, the wali of Egypt, who occupied Central Arabia from 1818 until 1840.
 
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I reread the TM and noticed you didn't specify wheither Yemeni Jews are in or not. They should be in and follow rabbinic Judaism.
 
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I share your concern. However, whatever solution is found, it should not prevent addressing the threat posed by Central Arabia. I am thinking of the conquest of the Arabian Peninsula by the Wahhabi movement resp. by the Saudis. And it was Muhammad Ali, the wali of Egypt, who occupied Central Arabia from 1818 until 1840.
I agree Bedouin culture could have resistance in their natural homeland maybe

And Muhammed Ali’s army was pretty Modern, thus it could be simulated by certain advances, until 1700s conquering inner Arabia should be hard and it should not be done by Ai
 
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"...so I think that this might be a good opportunity to ask for your preferences about the coloring of the different branches of the Islamic faith."

I have red-green colorblindness, and I can't distinguish all that many shades of green. For me, it's very difficult to differentiate the Shiite and Ibadi map colors. I did not realize Ibadi was on the map at all right away. I can easily distinguish the Sunni and Shiite map colors, though.

If I was the supreme God-Emperor of Paradox, I would request that my minions switch Ibadi to a shade that's much darker. Alternatively, a shade of green with significant yellow saturation would help.
 
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I love that you've updated the Arabic script (using dots for the emphatic letters and backwards apostrophes for 'ayn), but I wish you'd be more consistent with it. Half of the names show assimilation of the al- prefix (e.g., ar-Rayn, ad-Dawāsir), but half of them don't (e.g., al-Shammar al-Sudayr). The L should assimilate if the noun begins with a D, T, S, Z, R or N.

Also, why do you sometimes use transliteration of the Arabic for cultures (like Hijāzī) but sometimes leave it English (like Yemeni). It would probably make most sense to use the English for all culture names (so Hijazi or Hejazi both of which are fully acceptable spellings in English).
 
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al-Din was part of his personal name, not a dynasty. More accurately, the dynasty could be called "Deramku" or "Qalhati" depending on how far you go back

Thanks for letting me know, the same thing was mentioned one or two pages earlier in The Persian Gulf, I somehow managed to miss all of it. I'll edit my comment.
 
Small feedback, Ibadi has my single favorite color ever, so please just tweak Shiite a bit brighter and warmer and leave Ibadi untouched.
Also I agree that there should be at least a corridor between Yemen and Oman
Wish I knew enough about Arabia to give more feedback!
 
The Zayidi Rassids had at various points before and after start date influence over Yemen. Will they have any representation beyond the Shia pops currently shown, such as a state or an event?
 
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Some notes on the harbors.
Muscat has an excellent, if small, port; that has to be an oversight. On the other hand, the arabian gulf coast is very shallow and filled with shoals and sand banks that are exposed at low tide, all the modern ports that you see today required very extensive dredging and land reclamation. The Persian side is a little better, although even Hormuz isnt that great of a port in itself, it owes its significance to its strategic location moreso than its harbor.
FInally the Shatt al-Arab should be navigable up to Basrah and the natural harbors at Abadan and Az Zuwayr should be moved to Basrah.
 
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Exact borders for the imamate of Yemen are a bit hard to determine for this point but I would probably go for giving them the provinces of San'a and Ma'rib.
I would also favour imamate of Yemen over rassids as a name among other things because the starting imam isn't actually from the rassid dinasty (which was prety rare but still, the imamate wasn't technically hereditary so stuff like that could happen).