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Tinto Maps #7 - 21st of June 2024 - Anatolia

Hello everyone, and welcome to the seventh edition of Tinto Maps! I am once again asking for your support back to the duty of showing a new region of the map of the super secret Project Caesar, which this week is Anatolia!

Countries:
Countries.jpg

A beautifully divided Anatolia! The disintegration of the Sultanate of Rûm in the 13th century, caused by the Mongol invasion, led to multiple Turkish Beyliks grabbing power over their area. Probably the strongest in 1337 is the Ottoman one, founded by the Turkoman leader Osman Ghazi, but there are other strong contenders such as the Eretnids, the Germiyanids, or the Karamanids, which will be fighting for hegemony over the region. You might also notice that the Byzantine Empire//Eastern Roman Empire//Basileía Rhōmaíōn//[insert here your favorite naming option] still holds a few positions in Anatolia, the most notable being the city of Philadelphia. Apart from them, other interesting countries in the region are the Despotate of Trebizond, held by the Komnenoi, the Armenian Kingdom of Cilicia, and, of course, The-country-known-in-another-IP-as-Hisn-Kayfa, the Ayyubid remnant in al-Jazira. And you might also notice some Genoese outposts, making them important players as well.

Dynasties:
Dynasties.png

The dynastic map is pretty straightforward, as a different dynasty rules each Beylik. We have fixed the issue with the random dynasty names, so no more weird 'the XXXX of XXXX' dynastic names anymore. To spice things up, we could maybe start a Byzantine discussion: Palaiologos, or Komnenos?

Locations:
Locations.jpg

As usual, please consider that dynamic location naming is not yet a thing in this region, and therefore the inconsistencies in the language used. As an additional note of caution, please don’t use the Aegean Islands as a reference or benchmark for comparison, as a review of them is something that we’ve got on our list of ‘to do’. You may be able to see that the location density in the region is gradual, from denser coastal regions to bigger inland ones.

Provinces:
Provinces.png

We have changed the coloring of the provinces, making them more different, and easier to understand, though. Apart from that, suggestions in this matter are welcomed, as usual.

Terrain:
Climate.jpg

Topography.jpg

Vegetation.jpg

The terrain in Anatolia is quite interesting and unique, as it’s composed of very different features: the central Anatolian Plateau, with a colder climate and more sparse vegetation, is opposed to the rugged and more forested coastlines to the north and south, while only having fluvial flatlands to the west, and in Cilicia (an area that always has been a choke point between Anatolia and Syria. And to the east, the territory becomes increasingly more mountainous, as it approaches the Caucasus.

Cultures:
Cultures.jpg

Anatolia is the first region of the Middle East with cultural and religious minorities added, just in time for this Tinto Maps, so we can have endless discussions about the divide between the Greek and Turkish cultures! Hurray! Now seriously, we’ve made what we think is the most accurate division for 1337, given the scarcity of data. The stripes point to a variation of the pop percentages in each location, from let’s say 70% of Greeks in Izmit or Bursa, to 80% of Turks in Ankara or Konya. We have also added some subdivisions of these cultures, with the Pontic and Cappadocian Greeks; and the Turkomans (you might note a majority of them around Sivas and Malatya), that portray more a ‘class//social grouping’ divide than an ethnic or language divide, as these Turkoman pops are always tribesmen, while we consider the settled population as Turkish. Other than that, we have a good amount of Armenians distributed between the areas of Cilicia and Armenia; Laz people to the north; and Kurds to the east (the brownish-greenish culture). Also, please ignore the chunk of Syria that appears, as the minorities there are not yet done.

Religions:
Religions.jpg

We’re back to interesting religious divisions! We have in Anatolia Orthodox, Sunni, Miaphysite, and Nestorian pops. And if you wonder what are those pink stripes in Thrace, they are a Paulician minority.

Raw Materials:
Raw Materials.jpg

There are some interesting materials distributed all over Anatolia, such as Alum (which was a main export to Italy, usually handled by the merchant republics), Silk, Marble, or Copper. And if you’re wondering about the Spices, they were previously Saffron.

Markets:
Markets.jpg

The market centers of the region are Constantinople to the west, Trebizond to the north, and Damascus to the south. Nothing speaks against a Turkish Beylik conquering one or all of them, or creating a new market center, probably in the middle of the Anatolian Plateau, although probably it will require some infrastructure to make it fully functional.

Location and Country Population:
Pops Locations.jpg

Pops Country.jpg

And populations. Byzantium has some edge over each of the Beylikz, but not if they ally with each other, or if they ally with its Balkanic rivals… Also, have I heard about a 66K Ayyubid challenge?

That’s all for today! We’ll most likely be uploading the French feedback results by the end of next week or at the start of the following one (as next week there's an important bank holiday for this company, Midsommar St. John's Day, and some people will be on vacation a few days), and in the meantime, we'll also be reading and answering your feedback about Anatolia. And next Friday, we will be taking a look at Russia. See you then!

PS: I had a flight today that was delayed, therefore the delay on the DD until an (interesting) hour in which I'll be available for replying.
 
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Hello everyone, and welcome to the seventh edition of Tinto Maps! I am once again asking for your support back to the duty of showing a new region of the map of the super secret Project Caesar, which this week is Anatolia!

Countries:
View attachment 1150902
A beautifully divided Anatolia! The disintegration of the Sultanate of Rûm in the 13th century, caused by the Mongol invasion, led to multiple Turkish Beyliks grabbing power over their area. Probably the strongest in 1337 is the Ottoman one, founded by the Turkoman leader Osman Ghazi, but there are other strong contenders such as the Eretnids, the Germiyanids, or the Karamanids, which will be fighting for hegemony over the region. You might also notice that the Byzantine Empire//Eastern Roman Empire//Basileía Rhōmaíōn//[insert here your favorite naming option] still holds a few positions in Anatolia, the most notable being the city of Philadelphia. Apart from them, other interesting countries in the region are the Despotate of Trebizond, held by the Komnenoi, the Armenian Kingdom of Cilicia, and, of course, The-country-known-in-another-IP-as-Hisn-Kayfa, the Ayyubid remnant in al-Jazira. And you might also notice some Genoese outposts, making them important players as well.

Dynasties:
View attachment 1150906
The dynastic map is pretty straightforward, as a different dynasty rules each Beylik. We have fixed the issue with the random dynasty names, so no more weird 'the XXXX of XXXX' dynastic names anymore. To spice things up, we could maybe start a Byzantine discussion: Palaiologos, or Komnenos?

Locations:
View attachment 1150904
As usual, please consider that dynamic location naming is not yet a thing in this region, and therefore the inconsistencies in the language used. As an additional note of caution, please don’t use the Aegean Islands as a reference or benchmark for comparison, as a review of them is something that we’ve got on our list of ‘to do’. You may be able to see that the location density in the region is gradual, from denser coastal regions to bigger inland ones.

Provinces:
View attachment 1150908
We have changed the coloring of the provinces, making them more different, and easier to understand, though. Apart from that, suggestions in this matter are welcomed, as usual.

Terrain:
View attachment 1150909
View attachment 1150911
View attachment 1150912
The terrain in Anatolia is quite interesting and unique, as it’s composed of very different features: the central Anatolian Plateau, with a colder climate and more sparse vegetation, is opposed to the rugged and more forested coastlines to the north and south, while only having fluvial flatlands to the west, and in Cilicia (an area that always has been a choke point between Anatolia and Syria. And to the east, the territory becomes increasingly more mountainous, as it approaches the Caucasus.

Cultures:
View attachment 1150913
Anatolia is the first region of the Middle East with cultural and religious minorities added, just in time for this Tinto Maps, so we can have endless discussions about the divide between the Greek and Turkish cultures! Hurray! Now seriously, we’ve made what we think is the most accurate division for 1337, given the scarcity of data. The stripes point to a variation of the pop percentages in each location, from let’s say 70% of Greeks in Izmit or Bursa, to 80% of Turks in Ankara or Konya. We have also added some subdivisions of these cultures, with the Pontic and Cappadocian Greeks; and the Turkomans (you might note a majority of them around Sivas and Malatya), that portray more a ‘class//social grouping’ divide than an ethnic or language divide, as these Turkoman pops are always tribesmen, while we consider the settled population as Turkish. Other than that, we have a good amount of Armenians distributed between the areas of Cilicia and Armenia; Laz people to the north; and Kurds to the east (the brownish-greenish culture). Also, please ignore the chunk of Syria that appears, as the minorities there are not yet done.

Religions:
View attachment 1150914
We’re back to interesting religious divisions! We have in Anatolia Orthodox, Sunni, Miaphysite, and Nestorian pops. And if you wonder what are those pink stripes in Thrace, they are a Paulician minority.

Raw Materials:
View attachment 1150915
There are some interesting materials distributed all over Anatolia, such as Alum (which was a main export to Italy, usually handled by the merchant republics), Silk, Marble, or Copper. And if you’re wondering about the Spices, they were previously Saffron.

Markets:
View attachment 1150917
The market centers of the region are Constantinople to the west, Trebizond to the north, and Damascus to the south. Nothing speaks against a Turkish Beylik conquering one or all of them, or creating a new market center, probably in the middle of the Anatolian Plateau, although probably it will require some infrastructure to make it fully functional.

Location and Country Population:
View attachment 1150918
View attachment 1150919
And populations. Byzantium has some edge over each of the Beylikz, but not if they ally with each other, or if they ally with its Balkanic rivals… Also, have I heard about a 66K Ayyubid challenge?

That’s all for today! We’ll most likely be uploading the French feedback results by the end of next week or at the start of the following one (as next week there's an important bank holiday for this company, Midsommar St. John's Day, and some people will be on vacation a few days), and in the meantime, we'll also be reading and answering your feedback about Anatolia. And next Friday, we will be taking a look at Russia. See you then!

PS: I had a flight today that was delayed, therefore the delay on the DD until an (interesting) hour in which I'll be available for replying.
Fantastic stuff! Though I wonder— why change saffron to a blanket “spices”? That’s an unfortunate change imo; I appreciated that particular granularity in trade goods.
 
According to "Koppen-Trewartha Climate Classification", the climate map needs some changes i guess. Most importantly, shores of Black Sea (Kocaeli to Trebizond provinces) should be subtropical. Because they are subtropical humid climate (Cf).
 
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It's different claiming to be the successors to Rome, than restoring the Roman Empire, as a polity with a certain set of institutions, religion, etc., at least to my eyes.
So one must be Christian to be Roman? I would disagree but more importantly, probably the most popular Romans would too.
 
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I'm curious, perhaps a native Turkish speaker can help me out, if we can have the same word represented differently in both surnames and dynasty names would it be any better? E.g. The name as "Dave Karamanoğlu", belonging to the "Karamanoğulları Dynasty"?
Hello, a Turkish linguist here.

It is actually a choice here since you don't necessarily need to put "-oğlu" in Turkish in surnames. It is like -son in English and some other Germanic languages.

So the official naming there is just "Eretna", so you could keep that as the surname.

If you really want to add -oğlu to the family name stem, I would go for "Eretnaoğlu"/"Eretnaoğulları"

Hope this is helpful!

And for your question: Yes, someone belonging to a family that is referred as "...-oğulları" would be "...-oğlu". What you have there with -lar and -ı is as follow:
-lar/ler = plural form in Turkish
-ı = possesive marker (as you need it in every noun phrase), the reason behind this is probably that we understand these dynasty names as two words making a nounphrase rather than one word having a suffix to the end, even though the official writing shows it as one word, apparently the grammar doesn't really work that way.
 
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So why are we so allergic to calling it the "Roman Empire" and the Greek speaking people in their borders "Roman", is this intentional to avoid confusion for people that don't know history, or are we actually just ignorant?
 
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So why are we so allergic to calling it the "Roman Empire" and the Greek speaking people in their borders "Roman", is this intentional to avoid confusion for people that don't know history, or are we actually just ignorant?
Honestly I think if the game called them "Roman" than a non-trivial subset of the people who play the game would think they're walking around wearing togas.

Generally speaking the game has erred towards referring to cultures by modern names rather than how they would have referred to themselves or have been referred to by others in that time period.
 
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I wonder if this game will take into account the newer discoveries in the Amazon rainforest, of the presence of cities in the rainforest evidenced by manmade mounds and ditches hidden by the rainforest, or extremely fertile layer of soil indicative of human/animal waste or intentional burning. Basically that the Amazon was inhabited by millions of people, with cities as large as 50 thousand people.
One or more of this cities spawned the myth of El Dorado that couldn't be found by the European explorers as the probably original source of this civilization ended up succumbing to the European diseases before the Europeans arrived, by the time of which the cities made of wood and earth that was rapidly decomposed.
 
I guess that you mean the Armenian Apostolic Church? If that's the case, even if they both are considered part of thr Myaphisite religion (so they share mechanics), they're already split, as being part of different Patriarchates, which are International Organizations.
So how will Paulicanism be handled? Especially different Christian Doctrines, I saw in CK3 that it was Gnosticism even though that is contentious and it would be more accurate to label them as "Nontrinitarian". Is the Armenian population still present on the map? I will say I am quite interested in any option pertaining to them because they offer a very interesting Divergence politically from Catholicism and the various Orthodoxies.
 
I wonder if this game will take into account the newer discoveries in the Amazon rainforest, of the presence of cities in the rainforest evidenced by manmade mounds and ditches hidden by the rainforest, or extremely fertile layer of soil indicative of human/animal waste or intentional burning. Basically that the Amazon was inhabited by millions of people, with cities as large as 50 thousand people.
One or more of this cities spawned the myth of El Dorado that couldn't be found by the European explorers as the probably original source of this civilization ended up succumbing to the European diseases before the Europeans arrived, by the time of which the cities made of wood and earth that was rapidly decomposed.
I think it’s impossible to implement to game because unfortunately there is so little source for that civilizations, yes we found out they existed but we dont know anything else. Its better to not adding them since we dont know anything about those civilizations and that can be end up with misinformation. But its a good mod idea i will probably try it
 
Political
It seems like Canik beyliks are under Eretna influence, which is so correct. Similarly Alanya/Alaiye must be a autonom Karaman vassal and port to Mediterranean Sea.

Ruling family of Bafra (or Bavra) back then, is not clear. Here is a review article: "Özen, F. (2023). Tarihi, sosyal ve kültürel yönleriyle Bafra (ed. Köse, O). Chapter: Canik beyliklerinden Bafra Beyligi. pp 119-130).
at a little later date this beylik was ruled by Emirza bey. His full name is Ali Bey oglu Hüseyin Bey Oglu Emirza Bey. Aliogullari and Huseyinogullari are quite generic names. Therefore, altough historically disputed, you could name the ruling dynasty as Pervaneogullari or Al-i Selcuq (as you did with their neighbours). Because they claim to be descendants of Qadi Pervana (a Seljuq vizier) or family Seljuq themselves, probably a minor branch or tribesman of the Kiniq tribe. Therefore player can claim Anatolian Seljuq (Rum) throne moire easily. Pervaneogullari makes more sense to me since you already have Kubadogullari as Al-i Seljuq.

Administrative
More proper names for provinces:
Antalya > Teke
Usak > Uşşak
I am not quite sure why you have both Aksaray and Nigde.
Antakya > Hatay
If you have same name for a location and province, it might be a solution (under turkish culture) to name the province as ili or the keep as hisar or kale.
Examples:
Konya (town) and Konya ili (province)
Rumeli (province) and Rumelihisari (the keep) (although this is not a perfect example)

Climate
There are some pocket climates such as
Igdir as Mediterranean climate (you can grow Cotton)
Artvin, Çoruh and Rize tropical climate (where you can grow Bananas, Tea etc.)

Topography
Too much flatland around Smyrna (but still kinda representative, if you make more locations no more flatlands)
More plateaus and less hills in Hamid-Teke regions
Production
Wine in Akhisar and Philadelphia/Alasehir, Gordes fiber crops is good.
Kula was always known with their fine quality leather works
Sardes (salihli)/Magneisa (manisa) with spices and wine/grape
Marble in Dinar
Livestock in either Gölhisar or Burdur location
 
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Ruling family of Bafra (or Bavra) back then, is not clear. Here is a review article: "Özen, F. (2023). Tarihi, sosyal ve kültürel yönleriyle Bafra (ed. Köse, O). Chapter: Canik beyliklerinden Bafra Beyligi. pp 119-130).
at a little later date this beylik was ruled by Emirza bey. His full name is Ali Bey oglu Hüseyin Bey Oglu Emirza Bey. Aliogullari and Huseyinogullari are quite generic names. Therefore, altough historically disputed, you could name the ruling dynasty as Pervaneogullari or Al-i Selcuq (as you did with their neighbours). Because they claim to be descendants of Qadi Pervana (a Seljuq vizier) or family Seljuq themselves, probably a minor branch or tribesman of the Kiniq tribe. Therefore player can claim Anatolian Seljuq (Rum) throne moire easily. Pervaneogullari makes more sense to me
I agree with Pervane too, plus they are an important dynasty not on the map.
I am not quite sure why you have both Aksaray and Nigde.
I agree with this. Nevşehir and Aksaray were parts of Niğde province until the nineteenth century and there are too many tiny provinces there right now.
Antakya > Hatay
No, Hatay is a republican era name
 
Can there also be a modifier which makes Constantinople be worth so much war score so that it's impossible to take in a peace deal. But then have scripted content so that once the Byzantines are reduced to a rump state the modifier is removed. This way the Ottomans have to conquer much of the Balkans before they take Constantinople, as happened in our timeline. This would also fix the issue of the Ottomans just taking Constantinople shortly after game start.
I also hope the Theodosian Walls will require a certain Tech-Level to get conquered.
Otherwhise we will see the Fall of Constantinople in the early 1300s on a regular basis.
 
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I also hope the Theodosian Walls will require a certain Tech-Level to get conquered.
Otherwhise we will see the Fall of Constantinople in the early 1300s on a regular basis.
I think this is unnecessary because the reason why other sieges wasn't successful wasn't imbreachebality of walls but external reasons like rebellions,agreement or Tamerlane. Of course without walls maybe they would have less trouble taking the city so they could do both but I think solution for this shouldn't be scripting the conquest but should be just making it more difficult to conquer. And maybe if it is being sieged by other religions there can be a decision for holder to ask help from other christians like what happened in real life.
 
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Some random tidbits I've come across while doing research on the Bithynia region. I mostly started from Sevan Nişanyan's Dictionary of Place Name Etymologies, which tracks a variety of primary sources, and cross-referenced with the primary sources whenever I could find them. Since there are too many primary sources to list them all, please let me know if there's anything that seems too unreasonable as to need a specific citation. I'll make similar posts for other areas if I have time.

Here are the two most important ones:
  • It is known that the Byzantines settled a large number of Christian Cumans, Pechenegs etc. in the Bithynia region to guard against Muslim Turkic raids. Their descendents, the "Manav"s, comprise up to 60% of the local population in the provinces of Sakarya and Kocaeli today. The locations of İzmit, Adapazarı, Akyazı, Göynük, and possibly Akçakoca, Düzce, and Bolu, should have a significant number of Christian Cumans, Pechenegs, Alans, Bolghars, and Gagauzes. An outright majority could even be conceivable for the province of Adapazarı.
  • Gerede and Mengen should probably be owned by the Candarids at the start. It is known that Gerede was conquered by Bayezid the Thunderbolt's expedition to Kastamonu in 1395. Aşıkpaşazade mentions Bolu, Mudurnu, Akyazı & Konrapa (Düzce) being conquered by Orhan Gazi, while omitting Gerede and Mengen. Candarid influence in the region lasted well into the 1500's, and Mengen likely remained a freehold (Zeamet) of Candarid descendents in the Tahrir Records of 1519. Livestock is the correct good for Gerede, which is known for its leather industry.
And the rest:
  • Adapazarı was likely founded in the 15th century, and named "Atpazarı" at the time. It is rumoured (without any primary source indicating this) that it was founded by Armenians and named "Donigashen" after its founder. I believe Sapanca (Sophan(ge) in Byzantine sources) could be a better option, considering its long history. The Turkish name could be "Ayanköy", which was used in Seljuk times, or Sabanca, the Ottoman-era form of Sophange. Also, the province should produce lumber since the Ottoman Tersane-i Amire procured most of the wood used in shipbuilding from forests in this area, as mentioned in Evliya Çelebi's writings, to the point where there was a concern that the forests might run out.
  • "Şile", once again, is slightly anachronic. A record from 1296 indicates the name to be Şilli, most likely from the Greek Xilea/Xelai. It is also noted that the villagers retained their Greek character well into Ottoman times and mostly engaged in fishing and (interestingly) grape-growing. I would therefore put either fish or preferrably wine as a trade good here.
  • Although first established as an industry in the late 1400's, İznik is famous for its Chinese-style pottery. An event similar to Meissen Porcelain in EU4 might be nice to have, and I suggest the local trade good could be changed to clay to facilitate the rise of this industry. Alternatively, fish could represent the bountiful fishing opportunities of Lake İznik.
  • Karadeniz Ereğlisi is historically accurate as a Turkish name, but also seems somewhat modern and is a mouthful. Bendereğli (from Herakleia Pontica) was also used and might be a better option. There was a Genoese trading post from 1260 onwards, and the Genoese bought the city from the Byzantines in 1360, which could be represented somehow. There were also some Jews here until recently, though I'm not sure whether the community predates the Sephardic settlement in the Ottoman Empire. Coal was discovered in 1829, but the deposits are of a fairly easily extractable nature. I believe an early industrialization in the Ottoman Empire could have led to them being exploited much earlier, so I think having coal as a trade good might make sense. Alternatively, an event to change the trade good here to coal could trigger if sufficient industrialization has been achieved. Either way, fish is the second most prominent industry and is a decent choice.
  • "Akçakoca" is anachronistic, being named thusly after 1934. "Akçaşehir" (Greek: Diapolis) would be more accurate. Furthermore, the town had been thoroughly settled by Turks escaping from the Mongol Invasion and likely had a Turkish majority in the centre, if not the hinterland. It is even conjenctured that the Turks in the city transferred ownership to the Ottomans without a major battle, though I could not access the source referred to in this conjencture. Either way, a significant Turkish presence is warranted.
  • Bees, silk, and hazelnuts are also produced in Akyazı, if alternative tradegoods are needed.
  • Düzce is anachronistic, it was called "Kon(u)rapa" or during the Early Ottoman Period, named after the commander who conquered it a few years before our start date.
  • Mudurnu was known for its blacksmiths, and was specifically a centre of needle production from the 1600's onwards. Probably does not warrant representation, but it might be a good place to set down a couple blacksmiths if such production is needed for the Ottomans at the start date.
  • Kızılcahamam is also anachronistic, it should either be "Yabanabad" (Evliya Çelebi) or "Kızılca" (Tahrir Records dated 1530). I couldn't locate any mentions of significant stone deposits, but there aren't any other prominent industries either, so stone is alright.
  • Horses in Beypazarı likely represent the semi-domesticated "Yılkı Atları", which is superb attention to detail. They are also plentiful in Afyon, Cappadocia, Sinop, and Mount Spil in Manisa. The former two are already included, I see. You could also consider adding the other two, depending on game balance.
  • Kıbrıscık is anachronistic, it is referred to as "Kıbrus" in Tahrir Records dated 1530. "cık", the Turkish Diminutive, was likely added later. Furthermore, although the region itself has some wood cover, it is also fairly rocky and sheep & cattle grazing seem to be the main economic activities. Changing the trade goods to livestock might be warranted. Some good quality rice is also cultivated here, although it is too little in quantity to be the main trade good.
  • Nallıhan is anachronistic. The "Han" in question wasn't built until the late 1500's. It should be "Karahisar-ı Nallı" or simply "Nallı" at this point. Rice is also grown here, and game meat (especially from wild birds) is plentiful, due to the plentiful reeds and marshlands which are host to over 200 bird species. Another alternative would be silk, grown since Ottoman times (though I'm not sure whether it was a major industry in 1337).
  • There are gypsum and marble reserves in Göynük, though they were likely not exploited until recently. I presume "clay" represents these, though it could just as easily be marble.
  • I have no idea why there is wine in Söğüt. The local climate is not ideal for grape growing, nor could I find anything indicating they are grown. Besides, Söğüt was most likely thoroughly Turkified by this point: It was the first "capital" of the Ottomans, who had settled there almost a century prior, and nomadic Turkomen flooded to the area as the Ottomans grew in power. Instead, considering the place is literally named after the willow tree (By both the Greeks and the Turks), I suggest putting medicaments, as a nod to the use of willow bark in medicine.
  • Silk in Bilecik is fine, but iron mining was also somewhat significant in the region. Given the fame of Bursa silk, I would suggest making Bilecik produce iron and moving the silk to Bursa instead.
  • İnegöl could better be transliterated as "Eynegöl" - coming from either "Aya Nikola" or "Angelokome" in Greek. I'm not sure why it produces clay, though there isn't any reason as to why it shouldn't. Lumber might make more sense, given the plentiful forests and a moderately successful furniture industry.
  • The name "Eskişehir" is used in Aşıkpaşazade's history, dated 1484. "Sultanönü" was the Seljuk-era name, attested in 13th century sources. Either is fine, though I would opt for "Sultanönü" - especially considering it was used well into the 1800's. Ibn Said al-Maghribi notes (certainly with some exaggeration) that "200.000 Turkoman tents were clustered in the region stretching from Sultanönü to Sivrihisar", though this was at least 50 years before the start date. Still, having around 15.000 or so Turkoman pops scattered across Söğüt, Eskişehir, İnönü, and maybe Domaniç, might make sense.
  • Domaniç was another centre of Turkic migration, being the summer residence of the Ottomans. Whether it should have a Turkish majority is debatable - I would argue the Greeks should be a plurality, with Turks and Turkomans being present in around equal numbers. Perhaps a 40-30-30 split could be used, ignoring other ethnicities who might be present. Conversely, other more urbanized locations should have fewer Turkish pops to compensate, so the overall cultural breakdown of the province/region remains the same, while areas with significant Turkic migration are nonetheless represented.
  • "Atranos" is a mistransliteration of the actual "Adranos" or "Edrenos" (From "Hadrianous") into the Ar*bic script. The local Turkomen called the area "Adırnaz", and the central town was named "Beyce". The area has significant mineral resources including marble, iron, limestone, feldspar, lignite, dolomite, chromite etc. - although I doubt those other than marble, limestone, and maybe iron could be extracted during the game's timeframe. Still, having some sort of mineral resource is probably warranted, but lumber is also fine.
  • Bursa should have silk. It might well be the most famous and important centre of silk production in Anatolia to this day. Also, naming it "Brusa" or "Burusa" might be slightly more accurate.
 
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I think this is unnecessary because the reason why other sieges wasn't successful wasn't imbreachebality of walls but external reasons like rebellions,agreement or Tamerlane. Of course without walls maybe they would have less trouble taking the city so they could do both but I think solution for this shouldn't be scripting the conquest but should be just making it more difficult to conquer. And maybe if it is being sieged by other religions there can be a decision for holder to ask help from other christians like what happened in real life.
But lets be real, how can conquering Constantinople be really made "difficult"?
An OPM in EU4 with a FortLevel 8 and +100% Dev bonus is still no challange once besieged. Sure, the siege will last perhaps 3 years instead of one, ... but what is "difficult" in "just let the months run by", to slowly creep up the siege scale?
Unless they changed how sieges work, as RL sieges had often to stop in winter, or had to be abandoned due to low morale, food shortage or disease.
Or went on for forever (like the siege of candia 21 years).
 
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But lets be real, how can conquering Constantinople be really made "difficult"?
An OPM in EU4 with a FortLevel 8 and +100% Dev bonus is still no challange once besieged. Sure, the siege will last perhaps 3 years instead of one, ... but what is "difficult" in "just let the months run by", to slowly creep up the siege scale?
Unless they changed how sieges work, as RL sieges had often to stop in winter, or had to be abandoned due to low morale, food shortage or disease.
Or went on for forever (like the siege of candia 21 years).
It will drain your money,manpower,add war exhaustation and you will be more likely to be targeted by others. Also solutions like you named might be useful too. But like you said there were extremely long sieges in real life too so it is highly situational
 
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It will drain your money,manpower,add war exhaustation and you will be more likely to be targeted by others. Also solutions like you named might be useful too. But like you said there were extremely long sieges in real life too so it is highly situational
Agreed ... but hey, be honest, when in eu4 did you ever have to stop a siege due to lack of money/manpower? :D
With no enemy army around we always just wait and win. Hence I really hope long sieges get more difficult to maintain. :)
 
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