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Victoria 3 - Dev Diary #124 - What’s next after 1.7

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Double Happy Thursday! As promised last week, today we’ll be returning to the future update plans, which we last touched on in Dev Diary #102. Just like the previous times, we’ll be going over what changes and improvements we have planned for the game in future free updates such as 1.8, 1.9 and beyond.

Once again we will be talking about the same key four improvement areas of Military, Historical Immersion, Diplomacy, Internal Politics as well as Other for anything that falls outside those four categories.

Just as before, I’ll also be aiming to give you an updated overview of where we stand and where we’re heading by going through each of these four categories and marking on each one with one of the below statuses:
  • Done: This is a part of the game that we now consider to be in good shape. Something being Done of course doesn’t mean we’re never going to expand or improve on it in the future, just that it’s no longer a high priority for us. Any points that were already marked as Done in previous updates will be removed from the list, to avoid it growing unmanageably long, but you can look at the older dev diaries (#79, #89 and #102) if you’re interested in what was done previously.
  • Updated: This is a part of the game where we have made some of the improvements and changes that we want to make, but aren’t yet satisfied with where it stands and plan to make further improvements to it in future updates such as 1.8, 1.9 and so on. Note that this section will mainly focus on updates made in 1.6 and 1.7.
  • Not Updated: This is a part of the game where we haven’t yet released any of our planned changes/improvements in any currently released updates but still plan to do so for future updates.
  • New: This is a planned change or improvement that is newly added, i.e. wasn’t present on the list in Dev Diary #102.
  • Reconsidered: This is a previously planned change or improvement that we have reconsidered our approach to how to tackle from previous updates. For these points we will explain what our new plans are, and change the list appropriately in future updates.

For the final bit of repetition: Just as before we will still only be talking about improvements, changes and new features that are part of planned free updates in this dev diary. I will also remind you that this is not an exhaustive list of the things we are going to do, and that something being ‘Done’ doesn’t mean we’re not going to bugfix, balance or make UX improvements to it afterwards. Alright then, onto the dev diary proper.

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Military​

New:
  • Making navies more important for projecting global power and securing control of coasts.
  • Adding a proper system of military access and finding solutions for the other remaining rough edges in the frontline system.
Not Updated:
  • Turning individual ships into proper pieces of military hardware that can be built, sunk and repaired rather than just being manpower packages.
  • Adding a system for limited wars to reduce the number of early-game global wars between Great Powers

Historical Immersion​

Done:
  • Ensuring unifications such as Italy, Germany and Canada don’t constantly happen decades ahead of the historical schedule, and increasing the challenge of unifying Italy and Germany in particular
    • Asides from the AI challenges when it comes to forming Germany/Italy, we are now relatively happy with the state of the unifications. There are certainly ways we want to improve unifications in the future, particularly in tying them much closer to the political systems, but that falls outside the scope of this particular point.
  • General AI tweaks to have AI countries play in a more believable, immersive way
    • With the introduction of Diplomatic Catalysts and various AI improvements in 1.7 we now consider this to be ‘done’, though in reality this is the sort of point that is never going to stop seeing improvements from our end.
Updated:
  • Tweaking content such as the Meiji Restoration, Alaska purchase and so on in a way that they can more frequently be successfully performed by the AI, through a mix of AI improvements and content tweaks
    • After the release of 1.7.2 we now consider this to be ‘almost there’ but still in need of a bit more work.
  • Going through the base game Journal Entries and events and making improvements and additions to ensure that they feel meaningful and impactful for players to interact with
    • We’ve made a number of changes and improvements to older journal entries in 1.6/1.7 such as the addition of scripted progress bars, but we still have more work to do here.
  • Adding more country, state and region-specific content to enhance historical flavor of different countries
    • As before, this is something we’re simply going to keep adding to every single update and is never really going to be ‘Done’. For now I am leaving this entry here to mark that this is still one of our top priorities

Diplomacy​

Done:
  • Improving and expanding on interactions with and from subjects, such as being able to grant and ask for more autonomy through a diplomatic action
  • Have Interest Groups weigh in on diplomacy, for example having the Armed Forces disapprove of an alliance with a country that recently took land from you due to revanchism (Lobbies)
  • Foreign investment and some form of construction in other countries, at least if they’re part of your market
Not Updated:
  • Make declaring and holding onto diplomatic Interests a more rewarding and challenging aspect of global empire-building
  • Allowing peace deals to be negotiated during a Diplomatic Play instead of only having the option to give in

Internal Politics​

Updated:
  • Adding laws that expand on diversity of countries and introduce new ways to play the game
    • Similar to the point for region-specific flavor, this is something that will never really be ‘Done’ but remains here to highlight that we consider it an important priority
Not Updated:
  • Turn legitimacy into a more interesting mechanic, where the strength of a government depends on their successes and failures, and highly legitimate governments can’t simply be ousted at a whim but have to be undermined first.
  • Introduce a concept of national pride which can increase or decrease depending on a country’s actions and which ties directly into legitimacy.
  • Have discrimination not be a purely binary status and reflect forms of discrimination aside from what’s written in the law, as well as making assimilation into a more meaningful mechanic in the process.
New:
  • Find a better solution for the ways ideologies appear, attract followers and create support for reforms than the current RNG-heavy leader ideology system.

Other​

Not Updated:
  • Improve on Companies by turning them into actual actors in your country that can own/expand buildings and interact with characters/politics.
  • Find a way to deal with the excessive fiddliness of the trade system in large economies, possibly by allowing for autonomous trade based on your laws in a similar way to the autonomous investment system.

As always, I cannot make any specific promises about when these things will be coming. However, I can tell you that the next update (1.8) will be a standalone free update that should knock a point or two off this list, but will mainly be focused on bug fixing, general polish and more AI improvements. Before then we also have at least one more hotfix (1.7.4) planned to address the remaining high priority issues from the 1.7 release (tentatively planned for next week) and part of the team will continue working for a few more weeks like I mentioned in last week’s dev diary.

Right then, that’s all for this time, and all for this side of the summer! Dev diaries will return on August 15th but until then, I can but wish you many a Happy Thursday in the sun (or possibly snow, if you happen to live in the south hemisphere). Regardless, I hope you have a great July!
 
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Thanks to the devs for all their efforts. I'm crossing my fingers that subsistence farm ownership changes (ie with homesteading or collectivization) will be in the next hotfix!
 
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I suppose one of the few suggestions I could make-- Something I'd personally like to see and would find interesting to go along with the planned idea of Companies being actual actors in the country, Unions ought to be an actual actor in the nation as well with a function similar to Companies being actors. I don't mean the trade unionist, but organizations capable of of certain demands that aren't quite revolutionary. Striking against Companies for better wages, grinding certain industries to a halt, seizing ownership if they do become revolutionary, and being able to facilitate lobbies on their own.​
 
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Make declaring and holding onto diplomatic Interests a more rewarding and challenging aspect of global empire-building

Maybe maintaining interests could be more costly the further away they are placed from your closest naval base (with the size of that naval base and naval tech as modifiers)? This would make the navy and getting a treaty port (or docking rights, not sure if that was a thing in that era) more important. That way, say, Austria couldn't just plop an interest on the Dutch East Indies anymore at the game start but would rather have to expand its fleet and/or get some territory along the route and/or negotiate/force docking rights somewhere.

Find a better solution for the ways ideologies appear, attract followers and create support for reforms than the current RNG-heavy leader ideology system.

Perhaps there could be moments of "organic crisis", as Antonio Gramsci called it: Times in which established recipes and solutions no longer work, and the ideological ground is fertile so new ideologies are more likely to be embraced by groups acting on the political terrain. Historical examples would be the Springtime of the Peoples or the Biennio Rosso in Italy, which redifined the political imaginations and cleavages in many countries. Based on historical examples, this could be abstracted into JEs that can fire in any country under the right circumstances.

The emergence of these JEs could be linked to the Diplomatic Catalysts introduced with 1.7, as losing a big war (1870/71, 1917/18) always was a crucial catalyst, as were economic crises (once we get some form of economic crisis mechanism, there could be a similar catalyst).

Of course, this is already reflected in the game through various JEs to a certain extent. But I think there could be more of these, giving the player more chances to intervene by either hastening or delaying the rooting of new ideologies. Such a system could still rely on the requirements and weights of ideologies, but rather than these values being fixed in the game files, the player would get opportunities to change the weight of a couple of factors.

And these JEs might represent factional struggles within IGs, such as whether a social democratic party adheres to reform or revolution as their guiding principle. Right now, this is done in a black box that the player cannot directly interact with (although it is possible to favor the appearance of a certain ideology by using the weights shown in the wiki as a guide). If there is a "Power Struggle within the [IG]", this process might be more transparent and could be drawn out to allow for more player intervention.

I generally like JEs as a vehicle to model how IGs change ideologically. The only problem I have with leader-generating JEs at the moment is Corn Laws, as it puts the cart before the horse: historically, repealing the Corn Laws happened because Britain was already industrialized, whereas in the game, the JE is usually used to start the process of industrialization.
But in principle a few more ideology-related JEs could make the game more dynamic, especially for the political polarization that we saw in Italy and Germany in the 1920s/1930s.

  • Improve on Companies by turning them into actual actors in your country that can own/expand buildings and interact with characters/politics.

Ideally, I'd love Companies to be a double-edged sword for the player: on the one hand, they give bonuses and allow an economy to specialise. On the other hand, they should pose a threat to the player, as the second half of the 19th century saw the rise of monopolies, trusts and cartels. Having powerful companies potentially pose a threat to the player could be a nice mid-game challenge and might make the struggle over anti-trust legislation an interesting part during the second half of the game, no matter which side the player wants to see prevail.

Oh, and maybe companies should be able to put their weight behind lobbies (some authors argue that in imperial Germany, you had the chemical and electro industries pushing towards closer relations with the US, while the mining and steel-producing industries were rather eying the resource-rich territories of other European countries...)! Or they could simply approach the government directly with demands, similar to how lobbies and IGs can do it now: "Lower the price of [input good they need]!" or "We really don't like the consumption tax on [the good we want to sell]!"


Thanks for the work with the patch/DLC, and enjoy the summer break!
 
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I appreciate the new ownership system a lot but with Cooperative and State Owned economies, they're not finished. You can have a completely state owned economy but not be able to nationalize overseas holdings of your manor houses, even though your state can build and own buildings in other people's nations, which results in a huge upper class continuing to exist. Same with cooperative economies and them continuing to persist. Players should be able to nationalize/collectivize them.
 
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Considering that improving Journal Entries appears to be a key plan going forward, I have some suggestions from my own experience playing the game:

- Please improve the EIC's Journal Entries. I've made a forum post about it but I categorically do not like the way forming India as the EIC works - I think an independent India should be created via revolution or via a separate JE, not by declaring independence as the company. The "success point" of the EIC should be transitioning from an apartheid state into a dominion with Home Rule that has all the indian cultures as accepted, I think.

- I feel like the Austro-Hungarian compromise should be a little bit more of a loss state for Austria - ideally, they'd probably be aiming for a more pluralistic state without massive compromises to powerful Hungarian landowners. Obviously, I don't think the player should be encouraged to go ahead with their germanization policies as a "victory" state.

- Reconstruction in the US needs to be easier. 20% loyalists is actually insanely difficult to accomplish, let alone with the radicalism you get in the region - it's actually easier to make African-Americans a primary culture and get black presidents in the 1850s than it is to successfully reintegrate southerners into the union, which is crazy

- Countries need to have actual incentives to go against the Risorgimento. As it stands, pretty much every italian AI nation will declare support for unification, and as a result a player who wants to make use of the mechanic to foster radicalism in non-unifying Italian states will almost always be unable to.

- The "River of Coffee" JE for Brazil is absurdly difficult because the game mechanically does not create enough demand for coffee at the moment, even if the price of it is at literal rock bottom. This also makes it really difficult to complete the Brazillian National Identity JE without a massive amount of warfare

- Any JE that gives you assimilation as a reward should have this reward removed, because assimilation is almost useless right now - the "Conquest of Algeria" journal entry, for instance, will give you assimilation in the algerian coast. The problem with this is that assimilation literally cannot work in a minority group's homeland state, so this bonus does nothing except for foreign populations that do mass migrations to Algeria, which is clearly not its intended purpose. Either that, or Assimilation as a mechanic should be fundamentally reworked

- It is absurdly difficult to make the Boxer Rebellion happen. If you're doing well, it won't happen, and if you're doing badly you'll probably splinter before it happens.

- The Meiji Restoration operates on the assumption that the Shogunate are outside of the government but the Shogun is still in power. It makes it seem like the shogunate is abolishing itself, which doesn't make a large amount of sense. Outside of that, I'd say the Meiji Restoration is one of the better JEs, so less complaints here

- The "Earning Recognition" JE operates on standard of living and GDP per capita, which are ridiculously difficult to increase for countries with very large populations - I don't think this makes a lot of sense, considering that a few great powers frequently won't have GDP per capita and SoL in the top 50, which will frequently be dominated by random tiny british protectorates. I genuinely believe it makes more sense for this to be changed to total GDP, rather than GDP per capita. Literacy rate certainly makes sense, but I also think technological progress should count towards earning recognition. This JE was added to try and make earning recognition diplomatically more of an option, but right now it seems like not only do the diplomatic maluses to recognition count more than the diplomatic bonuses, it also seems like earning it through warfare has gotten harder, too.
YES! I agree with you on that Honorable Restoration part. It doesn't make sense for the shogun kicking his own IG out of the government then abolishing its own government.

Devs, if you are reading this, try to rework this specific JE and try to include Japan's Forced Opening and the Boshin War as contents within this Journal

Make the Japans great again!
 
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First of all, thank you for 1.7 and for keeping imroving the game. I do feel that the games moves to the right direction.
But can we, please, have an AI-focused update. Having new features is fun and we all love it, but the AI needs some love too. And by "some" i mean "a lot". There is so much room for improvement in all of the aspects of ai's decision-making: economy, internal managment (i mean there was a lot of revolutions in the game's timeframe, sure, but not that many, after some time most ai countries have more radicals than bolshevik party and just get into some civil war loop), military, diplo etc.
I'm pretty sure that competitive AI will add much more fun to the game than some new features and mechanics.
 
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Maybe try adding a system that emulates .... The Concert of Europe

;)

Just a Balance of Power mechanic would be great, to be honest. Kinda like legitimacy, but the more diplo plays are resolved peacefully the higher it goes, but the more unstable it becomes, the more the chances of a world conflgration increase.
 
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  • Improve on Companies by turning them into actual actors in your country that can own/expand buildings and interact with characters/politics.
YES!!! Give us company leaders and quid pro quo’s with powerful businessmen, please!
 
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Will making ships distinct also include support for selling and capturing ships? It was quite common during the period for ships to be sold or taken by several different navies.

Another common thing in the 19th century was for ships under construction in a foreign shipyard to have their contracts canceled, then the ship would be sold to a third party. An example is Confederate States of America ironclads, which were sold to nations like Japan and colonial administions after the war. A global market for ship hulls and construction contracts would add some awesome historical flavor while sparing smaller economies from having to build expensive shipyards.
 
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Adding a proper system of military access and finding solutions for the other remaining rough edges in the frontline system.
Any teases on what this might entail? My current largest annoyances with the military system are:
  • Power of naval invasions to bypass an army on a frontline
  • Naval invasions UI making it unclear why troops are taking a long time to land
  • 2k units on an unmanned front able to force out 100k men from a state because I didn't split the army fast enough
  • The micro of managing orders by general rather than by front or army
  • Lack of build diversity, based on laws, industries, resources, or military doctrines
Edit: Just remembered
  • Army supplies and overseas armies. Lack of supply should debilitate an army, and an army should not be able to even land if sea nodes are patrolled by navies, and if they do land they should need constant supplies or be starved out. States should be able to carry a certain amount of supply depending on their infrastructure, so Russia can't put 1,000,000 men on the Chinese border and call it a day
 
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Personally, I think the next expansion should focus on military and internal politics:
  • Bring back Great Wars from Vicky II
  • The planned navy rework
  • The planned discrimination rework
Also, I just wanted to say that between this and the planned DLC for CK III, I'm noticing a trend of going back to doing big, meaty old-school expansion packs. I heartily approve.
 
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Premise: I enjoy playing Vicky 3. But do you truly believe that nation unifications are "complete" in the current state? Have you ever seen the map of a unified Italy IRL in 1870? Never ever have I seen a believable unified Italy since launch day. I have never seen Sardinia-Piedmont unifiy Italy, never ever have I seen an italian minor team up with France (or any other major for that matter) to take Lomabardy-Venetia (treaty of Turin). Not even once in hundreds of playthroughs.
 
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