Victoria 3 - Dev Diary #82 - Voice of the People

[arctus]

I don't think the game is in a state where putting out this minor cosmetic stuff out is justified i would prefer it if manpower was focused on improving base game systems. Also i will never play france.

 

[yurcick]

I agree, but on the other hand, surely Paradox know how popular HPM and similar mods are, right? There's a reason most people's memories about Victoria 2 default to HPM or any similar rework, and not vanilla. People like it when nations have cool stuff unique to them. Vanilla Victoria 3 is better than vanilla Victoria 2, no doubt in my mind, but imo modded Victoria 2 tops Victoria 3 pretty much every time(It also runs better...). I'm glad we have modders who will do so much for the game in a shorter time while we wait for Paradox to do their thing. Stuff like VFM, OPB's Victorian Tweaks mod, Divergences, the Ultrahistorical reworks, etc are carrying the game hard for me.

That's just your opinion.
Sure, HPM was popular, but not universally liked. If vanilla wasn't broken, I'd take it over HPM all the time. Since it was, I'd take VRRP.

The reason is exactly the HPM's oversupply of "cool stuff unique to the nations", disrupting balance and taking away that sandbox feel, where everyone might have different starting conditions, but everyone ultimately plays by the same rules.

 

[Evethor]

Paris looks less "blocky"
Is this treatment given to other cities and does it mean that buildings wont cover the entire map in Europe now?

 

[grommile]

I don't think the game is in a state where putting out this minor cosmetic stuff out is justified

A bunch of folks paid for this DLC before the game was even released (sight unseen, which is silly of them), so it needs to be delivered in a timely manner.

i would prefer it if manpower was focused on improving base game systems.

The rest of the team need something to do while the C++ programmers are working on the engine.

Also, the major improvements to base game systems have to be given away mostly-for-free (to avoid some of the problems that afflicted the development of EU4 and CK2), so the DLCs are inevitably going to be focused on "flavour".

Also i will never play france.

Neither will I.

Which means you and I won't buy for this DLC (unless you already have?) but we'll still get all of Patch 1.3's gameplay improvements that the DLC revenue subsidizes.

 

[Orinsul]

I don't think the game is in a state where putting out this minor cosmetic stuff out is justified i would prefer it if manpower was focused on improving base game systems. Also i will never play france.

the people who do the cosmetic stuff and the people who do game systems are different people, you get that right?
programmers and artists are completely different skill sets and the game is made by both

 

[JPGM22]

France has fewer states now? It does not look pretty.

 

[Rubiedub]

Will you add a map mode for religion?

 

[Alvaricles22]

When Durruti

 

[Rocky the Good Boy]

I'm glad that PDX chose to ride with this type of DLC system. I liked everything I've read so far but I do wonder if we can see Mustafa Kemal Atatürk as an agitator. Playing Ottoman would be much more enjoyable and immersive!

 

[Chavolatra]

add Confederation of Rhine for Prussia if is vassal of France !!.

 

[grommile]

add Confederation of Rhine for Prussia if is vassal of France !!.

What? Prussia was never part of the Confederation of the Rhine.

 

[HotDoggerson]

That's just your opinion.
Sure, HPM was popular, but not universally liked. If vanilla wasn't broken, I'd take it over HPM all the time. Since it was, I'd take VRRP.

The reason is exactly the HPM's oversupply of "cool stuff unique to the nations", disrupting balance and taking away that sandbox feel, where everyone might have different starting conditions, but everyone ultimately plays by the same rules.

I wasn't expecting or wanting hundreds of events per nation that railroad the game, I wanted that there to be at least a small handful of unique events or journals that make most nations feel different to play, at least initially aside from starting resources, pops, and IG's, which I always felt wasn't a big enough difference per nation for me to consider each nation 'different'. A sandbox is nice, don't get me wrong, but just sand is a boring material at the end of the day. The Ottoman Tanzimats in the current game are really good, and I would have hoped that other nations get something similar. No other nation feels like the Ottomans, but there are many nations that feel like Siam. This new France content looks good, the way it lets you choose between the Monarchist factions will add to replayability and flavor, and it'll make France feel unique, exactly what I wanted.

 

[Chavolatra]

What? Prussia was never part of the Confederation of the Rhine.

So if made Baviera is a vassal for make Confederation of the Rhine.

 

[Muskar XII]

Ex monarch (or their heir) should become exiled agitator if you abolished the Monarchy.

 

[SeekTruthFromFx]

Hmm. So far not convinced that this DLC is going to justify a purchase, especially at £12.99. But obviously I will remain open-minded until I've read more of the Dev Diaries.

 

[Teutonic_Knight_2000]

Will we be able to send agitators into other nations (Lenin as an example)?

I would gladly buy those DLCs to be able to do that

Not something that's coming in 1.3, but if we do a Nationalism/Secessions rework we would absolutely incorporate Agitators into that

It would be nice if an adequate number of such agitators working for the independence of their nation appeared for all nations - also for the smallest ones (including for such nations that could appear in future updates).

For Rosa, Luxemburg is the canonical spelling (although Luxenburg or Luksemburg would also work), and "Polish-German" would be more accurate.
[EDIT: I see that her name is spelled correctly in-game, so all is fine]

Rosa Luxemburg was a Polish Jew and her real name was Rozalia Luxenburg. I think she should have Polish nationality and profess Judaism.

Would be awesome if she could get involved in Russia as much as in Germany.

If you exile her to Russia then she will work there

OwO, what's this?

I love these Monarchist opportunities for France

Will we be seeing the Revolutions of 1848 happening with this immersion pack? I'd love to see a major getting a revolution in or around '48 and causing a tidal wave of turmoil around Europe. If France is the originator all the better.

I think Spring of Nations mechanics would be best for an Austrian Immersion Pack. It could focus on the internal policy of the state, and more specifically on nationality and religious policy. It would be nice if there were mechanics such as: Assimilation (various options), Freedom for national and religious minorities (or oppression options) and resettlement and conversion of other nations and religions. Austria-Hungary with such a DLC could get unique bonuses related to these matters - and missions and events related to it.

Will Grand Edition owners get the pre-order bonus automatically?

I bought the boxed version of this game. I would like to be able to upgrade my base Victoria 3 to Grand Edition...

And will fascist leaders like Mussolini and Hitler start popping up in the late game?

I think more late-game content should be added because it's pretty boring at the moment - you can't really see any difference.

So, for such a big immersion DLC regarding agitation and the social question the whole focus is on France, but nothing for Russia?!

There is no other country like France that would be better suited for such a DLC. There was a lot going on in France in terms of politics during the Vic3 timeline. From 1830 to 1848, the king of France was Louis Philippe I of Bourbon. From 1848 to 1852 there was the 2nd French Republic. From 1852 to 1870 there was a second French Empire whose emperor was Napoleon III Bonaparte. The French Third Republic lasted from 1870 to 1940. I guess that's a lot for one century. With all this, Russia seems much more stable - only one revolution has contributed to changing the state system there.

I would be surprised if Russia didn't also eventually get a dedicated immersion pack.

Russia, of course, will receive some Immersion Pack. The better question is when and what would it be about. I think a DLC focusing on communism and other mechanics related to it would be perfect for a Russian DLC (of course, Russia should also get some Tsarist content in such a DLC). In contrast to this communist DLC, a USA Immersion Pack about capitalism could be created.

Any chance to finally be able to buy the entire expansion pass separately to get this? I obviously would have gotten the Grand Edition from the start, but sadly it was not available as a physical release.

I have the same problem as you...

Any plan to model France somewhat unique demographic stagnation during most of the XIX century?

I think a "Demographic Stagnation" penalty bonus at the start of the game would suffice, which could be removed thanks to political actions.

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I really don't care at all about any characters in the game. I have never bothered to care about any IG leader or any other character, CK has this as it's main focus for me already.

Victoria to me was always about the nation, the population as a whole, the underlying spirit, never about individuals.

If Victoria is also going to become another wacky character simulator I'm out. Just not what I'm looking for in a Victoria game is all, CK has that covered for me.

I hope the updates turns out well though for those that do like the character focus, just not my cup of tea.

I don't like CK3 character simulations. It's too extensive there, but I think a simple, uncomplicated character simulation would be really nice - I miss it in EU4.

It's nice that we will have three pretenders repesented for France. But it would be even better if this update would also include slight rework of pretenders for monarchies in general.

Now when monarch gets overthrown him and his dynasty disappears. Even when interest group which supported him do a counterrevolution later on they crown some other random dude. I think that game should remember who was a pretender for which interest group and if possible restore him or his heir to power. Foreign intervention for regime change should also restore a valid pretender rather than crowning random guy. This would be nice for immersion.

I fully agree with you. I think that probably more elaborate Monarchist mechanics would appear in another DLC - maybe in a big DLC or in the Immersion Pack.

Will the most well known political agitator of the 20th century make an appearance? I'm speaking of course about our good friend Adolf Hitler.

Don't tell me he's outside the scope of the time period, you're already including characters from the early 20th century and the beer hall putsch was in 1923.

I hope he comes in this DLC. I will gladly exile this painter from my Deutsches Kaiserreich

The Immersion Packs DLC model is not a bad thing on its own, but the fact that you have the base game absolutely EMPTY of flavour content makes it a scam.

Basically you released the game empty of historical content, the events and journal entries for specific countries are almost non-existant.

I think you should add a little bit of flavour to the 15-20 countries most important of the game, because most of them, don't even have a single specific event or journal entry for them. Every Paradox game like EU4, CK3, HOI4 or even Vic2 had specific country events/decisions for a bunch of countries in the base game. Base game of Victoria 3 has almost nothing.

Immersion Packs DLCs? Yes, it's a good idea to grab money for keeping the game development going.
Immersion Packs DLCs when the base game has almost non existan flavour content? No. You should have added more base game content before starting the release of Immersion Packs.

And also this is gonna make the game look very unbalanced regarding flavour content. Now France will have a lot of content while all the other countries in the game are all generic and have almost no specific events or journal entries. Making an Immersion Pack for a specific country (France) when all the other countries, even important ones, have no content, is gonna look extremely weird.

You should release with 1.3 Free Update a bunch of basic content for the 15-20 countries most important of the game, I'm not being very ambitious here, not any specific mechanics, just some events and journal entries to fill up a little bit the world of historical immersion.

You're right! I think this game should have at least a few flavors added for free for at least 10-20 of the biggest powers in Vic3. Other countries could receive a few generic flavors - they would be assigned to the nationality of the countries.

I strongly agree with this, however I don't know which interest group he would fit in the most. He was just a normal member of the working class in poverty prior to world war I. After World War I was when he started to take over Drexler's party and formed the NSDAP. Normally member of the working class are part of trade unions, but that would be illogical in Hitler's case as he banned them and formed a National Labor Union in its place. The Armed Forces wouldn't really make sense either as Hitler often had disputes with the upper hierarchy of his military, despite the fact that some members of the military supported Hitler initially (Ludendorff). The PB (which is the interest group that supports fascism in the game) wouldn't make sense either as Hitler wasn't really a member of the middle class (wasn't a shopkeeper or anything like that). Maybe Paradox could create a new interest group filled with workers that are staunchly anti-communist? Any thoughts or comments?

Add skinheads as a interest group xDDDDD

Seriously, you already have the NSDAP party in this game. You can add more Flavor ideologies to this game - one of them would be Nazism. In this way, something specific could be made, so that Hitler could be the leader of it.

2. This pack is France centered but will future updates bring more agitators to other countries? If you do an immersion pack for Germany will they get agitators in that update or the agitators we get this update are all the agitators we are going to get?

I think brand new Agitators would come with future updates as free new content for owners of Voice of the People DLC. For example, the Immersion Pack is released, which would focus on Italy, then the map of Italy would be reworked for free - the owner of the Voice of the People DLC would additionally receive Italian agitators.

Ex monarch (or their heir) should become exiled agitator if you abolished the Monarchy.

In such a situation, there should be a special event for monarchist countries - the possibility of military intervention to restore the monarchy in the country (the possibility of forming a coalition of monarchist countries against revolutionaries) or a more benign option, i.e. accepting the monarch at your court.

In the event of the overthrow of a monarch by another monarch (for example, the overthrow of the king Bourbon by the emperor Bonaparte), it could trigger a war between monarchist states (if they supported one of the parties to the conflict).

 

[Teutonic_Knight_2000]

I am interested if the changes on the map apply only to France and Algeria or also to other places in the world?

I'm also interested in whether this update will also offer new nations, cultures and TAGs?

 

[Utik]

That's just your opinion.
Sure, HPM was popular, but not universally liked. If vanilla wasn't broken, I'd take it over HPM all the time. Since it was, I'd take VRRP.

The reason is exactly the HPM's oversupply of "cool stuff unique to the nations", disrupting balance and taking away that sandbox feel, where everyone might have different starting conditions, but everyone ultimately plays by the same rules.

What prevented me from enjoying HPM was how it changes the map to make it less historical.

 

[Wendigo514]

Stuff like VFM, OPB's Victorian Tweaks mod, [...] the Ultrahistorical reworks, etc are carrying the game hard for me.

I hope the devs will continue to add/take inspiration from some of these mods features in the future. They already did with OPB's one in the previous patch and will do in the next one implementing their own version of Land Reform, and I'm glad for it.

 

[Anna_Gein]

Wow this is exactly what I did not want for Victoria 3 : Railroading content through nation focus and scripted event. This is why I did not like HoI4 dlcs and recent years EU IV dlcs.