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It's time for the weekly dev diary and this time it's a biggie, as we proudly announce Horse Lords, the new Crusader Kings II expansion! So what makes the proud rulers of the endless steppes unique? Well, in short, their relative lack of permanent settlements. This expansion gives the nomadic peoples of the steppes a unique type of gameplay which is not centered around Castles, Temples and Cities at all. Playing as a Nomad, you are allowed to conquer and even own normal Holdings, but they are worth little to you except as vassal cash cows. What you really care about is more grazing land for your sheep and horses. Thus, nomad hordes simply have a total population, which grows relative to how many empty Holding slots exist in your provinces (steppe provinces are best, but some other terrain types are also acceptable).

Crusader Kings II - Nomad Population.jpg


A large fraction of your total Population counts as your Manpower, which is used to raise your regiments (much like the Retinue system.) Of course, if all your fighting men are dead, it will be a while before your Manpower replenishes! War on the steppes is fast and fluid; you only occupy an empty province for as long as one of your armies is standing there, or if you build a fort there to lock it down... and even then, you do not get much war score from the open wastes.

Crusader Kings II - The Empty Steppe.jpg


This brings us to the one Holding that actually means a lot to the hordes; their capital. Each nomad clan can only one of this special holding type, but there are more upgrades for it than any of the regular types, and these improvements have more unique effects too... To really defeat a nomad horde, you need to occupy their capital (or decisively beat them in battle, of course.) However, Nomads are allowed to move their capital around often; and that means they actually pull up stakes, 'buildings' and all, and move the whole thing to another location!

Crusader Kings II - Raising Hordes.jpg


Another special twist to the nomadic hordes is that even in defeat, they are still dangerous. Should a horde lose its last province, the tribe will still exist, and may use its remaining armies to conquer another land in which to settle. Naturally, nomads can choose to settle on a more permanent basis, by completely switching over to a Feudal, Tribal or Republican lifestyle. This is done by special decision, reminiscent of how Tribes work.

Now, as the astute among you might have wondered, Crusader Kings is largely about managing your turbulent vassals, so what replaces that important gameplay aspect for the Nomads? The answer to that, my friends, is the Clans, and that will be the subject of next week's dev diary! Until then...


Khaaaan.jpg
 
I can see that you are new to the forum. Doomdark has said that the name is unfortunate because it doesn't represent what the game is about. But it is too late to change. The name is therefore an invalid argument when discussing the game's content.

While true, I don't think his request is wrong. The great holy war system does indeed need some love. IMO the warfare system in general needs some love.
 
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I can see that you are new to the forum. Doomdark has said that the name is unfortunate because it doesn't represent what the game is about. But it is too late to change. The name is therefore an invalid argument when discussing the game's content.
True but the crusades are part of the game and work very badly atm so it'd be nice if they fixed them.
 
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Wooow amazing expansion, I am really happy to see horde mechanism, after watching Marco Polo series I was so pumped to play Mongols, now paradox make my wish comes true. Thanks a million.
 
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Wooow amazing expansion, I am really happy to see horde mechanism, after watching Marco Polo series I was so pumped to play Mongols, now paradox make my wish comes true. Thanks a million.
Someone on the dev team probably did too.
 
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Well it did represent the first game fairly well didn't it? The game has just evolved. They could ofcourse change it over time. if they call the next game CK3: [Other title that fits better]. and then by "ck4" they can drop the ck moniker entirly and just go with the other title. Of course that is probably 10-20 years into the future.

It's a classic move, loads of game series have done it.
 
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Well it did represent the first game fairly well didn't it? The game has just evolved. They could ofcourse change it over time. if they call the next game CK3: [Other title that fits better]. and then by "ck4" they can drop the ck moniker entirly and just go with the other title. Of course that is 10-15 years into the future.

It's a classic move, loads of game series have done it.
True. Just take Europa Universalis :p



Oh and btw also HYYYYPE!!!!!!!!!!
 
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damn, I have felt like this game really needs a mechanic to put defeated empires and kingdoms in there grave, since as it stands now, nations only have to wait a few months to regain military strength unlike say EU4 or Vicky 3 where if a nation loses all its manpower they often easily get dog piled and partitioned, but in CK2 levies, especially vassal levies seem to come back way too quick, makes it near impossible for rebels or hosts in win since even if they can win a battle or two, the ruler can just come back with another army in a year or so and the host doesn't get to replenish they have to suffer siege attrition instead

That should be normal. Though I agree the levies get replenished far too quickly as of the current CK2, the loss of manpower in later time periods would be more drastic since it necessarily means a greater loss of the total population, requiring just as so more time in order to recover.

That's not the case with these feudal realms, which raised at most some 1-2% (if even so) of the total populace.

Of course, if the king of France continuously keeps fighting in wars his personal demesne's bound to be decrepit of armed manpower. The game doesn't feature demography, so we wouldn't be able to reflect it on a more specific scale. My opinion is that (a few more) provincial modifiers would be sufficient enough for the game, so as not to remove the focus away from feudal politics (and yet satisfy the fact that emptying out a province continuously three times in a row is bound to have an effect on its manpower; e.g. a levy reinforcement rate penalty?).

P. S. Most TC mods reduce the levy replenishment rate (slightly).
 
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Wooow amazing expansion, I am really happy to see horde mechanism, after watching Marco Polo series I was so pumped to play Mongols, now paradox make my wish comes true. Thanks a million.

This. I waited for CM though, and then it turned out tribal Mongols were awful. So I stopped. Glad I get a chance to try it for reals.
 
It has been 3 years since this game came out and i am still waiting for actual crusades.I mean come on its right there in the title Crusader Kings how about an actual expansion that expands that field.

So, the fact that my Catholic rulers went on twelve different crusades in my last Catholic game (twice to Jerusalem, and once against Lollard heretics in Hungary) doesn't count as actual crusades?

You can even start on a date when an actual crusade is in progress and go fight it. You don't have to wait for the Pope to call one in a full game.
 
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True. Just take Europa Universalis :p



Oh and btw also HYYYYPE!!!!!!!!!!
They did? From what? I've heard said that it's sort of based of Svea Rike but I don't remember any svea rike: europa universalis.
 
Will tributaries be a thing for everyone or just the steppe hordes? Like, If I'm HRE, could I potentially have, say, Italy as a tributary? Not sure how historical that is, but it seems a preferable alternative to having a single strong Italian vassal-king, or bunch of Italian dukes who hate me. Especially as it would let me limit electorates.
 
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So, the fact that my Catholic rulers went on twelve different crusades in my last Catholic game (twice to Jerusalem, and once against Lollard heretics in Hungary) doesn't count as actual crusades?

You can even start on a date when an actual crusade is in progress and go fight it. You don't have to wait for the Pope to call one in a full game.

The crusades are fairly key events in the ck2 era, and they generally never succeed unless the player plays catholic and make sure they do. The early crusades were massive sucesses. it's only later that they start getting repelled. Catholicism realy does quite badly in game, in reality it spread like a wildfire. Being expelled from the holy land was basically the only major defeat of catholic powers as the hands of others in the period.
 
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Will tributaries be a thing for everyone or just the steppe hordes? Like, If I'm HRE, could I potentially have, say, Italy as a tributary? Not sure how historical that is, but it seems a preferable alternative to having a single strong Italian vassal-king, or bunch of Italian dukes who hate me. Especially as it would let me limit electorates.
Well the thing is that the feudal system isn't that diffrent from a tribute system in itself. The feudal lords supplied levies more than taxes but the diffrence isn't all that big. It certainly wasn't as organised as it seems in game.
 
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