Werewolf Lite CDXXIII: Flight of the Eisenstein

[beartjah]

Well, got visitors over so I'm not sure how active I'll be able to be today

The case on Esemesas seems to be fairly baseless, I don't see any reason to assume that there has to be a wolf(or even that it is more likely) among the Arky voters.

I don't really see what the case on Yvanoff is either. He is somehow coordinating votes with Alynkio, which proves what exactly?


I'd like to see Ramius pressured a bit more because of his lazy voting yesterday. He voted Xarkan up ahead to three votes with no real explanation for why, but he didn't seem to have really been in too much danger anywhere and attention got shifted elsewhere. Let's see if we can put some pressure on him today to see that makes him a bit more explanatory of his actions.
VOTE RAMIUS

 

[Wagonlitz]

i think esemesas, while possibly a WITCH is not so clearly in the grips of VILE CHAOS as @Yvanoff .


seriously? you don't see @Yvanoff and @alynkio coordinating their votes? like... it's blatant wolfsign.

and going for the easy yak lynch is WEAK PLAY @esemesas . are you on their side?

Since you say that you think Yvanoff and Alynkio coordinates why not vote Alynkio then?

Well, got visitors over so I'm not sure how active I'll be able to be today

The case on Esemesas seems to be fairly baseless, I don't see any reason to assume that there has to be a wolf(or even that it is more likely) among the Arky voters.

I don't really see what the case on Yvanoff is either. He is somehow coordinating votes with Alynkio, which proves what exactly?


I'd like to see Ramius pressured a bit more because of his lazy voting yesterday. He voted Xarkan up ahead to three votes with no real explanation for why, but he didn't seem to have really been in too much danger anywhere and attention got shifted elsewhere. Let's see if we can put some pressure on him today to see that makes him a bit more explanatory of his actions.
VOTE RAMIUS

What do you think of Alynkio?

 

[esemesas]

@Wagonlitz I think that maybe you're focusing a little too hard on him, but he is kind of erratic, although I haven't played with him enough to tell of that is a wolfsign or not. Haven't been too active, although his posts aren't just "vote x" and then disappearing for about 20 hours. Lynching him would give us a lot of info though and we still have at least one more day in reserve

 

[Wagonlitz]

@Wagonlitz I think that maybe you're focusing a little too hard on him, but he is kind of erratic, although I haven't played with him enough to tell of that is a wolfsign or not. Haven't been too active, although his posts aren't just "vote x" and then disappearing for about 20 hours. Lynching him would give us a lot of info though and we still have at least one more day in reserve

Ehm how are his posts not just vote x? Aside from one post yesterday, the one where he made the "case" on me, he literally hasn't really posted anything, but vote x. (Aside from that one vote count, of course.)

And he normally is quite more active. Him being this inactive really is suspicious.

Also as you say that it'll give a lot of info to lynch him, why aren't you voting him then?

 

[Yakman]

Since you say that you think Yvanoff and Alynkio coordinates why not vote Alynkio then?

What do you think of Alynkio?

You can only vote for one at a time

 

[Yakman]

SPACE WOLVES!!!

 

[Hax]

Official Day 1 votecount

jeray2000: 6
beartjah[42]
esemesas[55 Yakman -> 79 Arkasas -> 86]
Arkasas[46 Yakman -> 68 jeray2000 -> 89]
Xarkan[93 Arkasas -> 105]
Yvanoff[38 alynkio -> 74 brovahkiin -> 95 Xarkan -> 125]
Hax[41 Yvanoff -> 61 brovahkiin -> 78 Hax -> 83 ramius3443 -> 87 esemesas -> 98 Arkasas -> 117 jeray2000 -> 122 aedan777 -> 124 randakar -> 126 Caillean -> 127 Xarkan -> 128 Yakman -> 129]

Xarkan: 3
Dedonus[43]
Yakman[44 beartjah -> 69 jeray2000 -> 76 brovahkiin -> 94]
Wagonlitz[60 Arkasas -> 96]

brovahkiin: 1
alynkio[66 jeray2000 -> 72]

Arkasas: 1
aedan777[49]

Yakman: 1
ramius3443[81 esemesas -> 82]

esemesas: 1
brovahkiin[39 Hax -> 85 Arkasas -> 90]

randakar: 1
Caillean[106]

Caillean: 1
randakar[109]

Not Voted: 1
jeray2000

 

[Yakman]

Official Day 1 votecount

jeray2000: 6
beartjah[42]
esemesas[55 Yakman -> 79 Arkasas -> 86]
Arkasas[46 Yakman -> 68 jeray2000 -> 89]
Xarkan[93 Arkasas -> 105]
Yvanoff[38 alynkio -> 74 brovahkiin -> 95 Xarkan -> 125]
Hax[41 Yvanoff -> 61 brovahkiin -> 78 Hax -> 83 ramius3443 -> 87 esemesas -> 98 Arkasas -> 117 jeray2000 -> 122 aedan777 -> 124 randakar -> 126 Caillean -> 127 Xarkan -> 128 Yakman -> 129]

Xarkan: 3
Dedonus[43]
Yakman[44 beartjah -> 69 jeray2000 -> 76 brovahkiin -> 94]
Wagonlitz[60 Arkasas -> 96]

brovahkiin: 1
alynkio[66 jeray2000 -> 72]

Arkasas: 1
aedan777[49]

Yakman: 1
ramius3443[81 esemesas -> 82]

esemesas: 1
brovahkiin[39 Hax -> 85 Arkasas -> 90]

randakar: 1
Caillean[106]

Caillean: 1
randakar[109]

Not Voted: 1
jeray2000

Are you fools blind?

UNVOTE YVANOFF
VOTE ALYNKIO

 

[Hax]

Hmm...

Thought xarkan might be a baddie...

SPACE WOLVES!!!

VOTE @Yvanoff

CLEARLY THE VILLAGE SHOULD NOW SEE TAINT OF VILE CHAOS!!!

PURGE!!!

PURGE!!!

SPACE WOLVES!!!

SHAME! villain!

SPACE WOLVES!!!

i think esemesas, while possibly a WITCH is not so clearly in the grips of VILE CHAOS as @Yvanoff .


seriously? you don't see @Yvanoff and @alynkio coordinating their votes? like... it's blatant wolfsign.

and going for the easy yak lynch is WEAK PLAY @esemesas . are you on their side?

You can only vote for one at a time

SPACE WOLVES!!!

Are you fools blind?

UNVOTE YVANOFF
VOTE ALYNKIO

All of Yak's posts since the latest update. Yakman is typically erratic but I find him to be a bit too active with the vote switching, and the same thing happened during day 1.

 

[Yakman]

chaos is amongst us!

 

[Hax]

Yakman: Read post above.

Wagonlitz: Yesterday he was acting quite suspiciously but some of his latest posts are quite rational. Hard to say...

Yvanoff: Slight baddie vibes. Dunno why really but some his posts are a bit off.

alynkio: I agree with Wagonlitz that alynkio has been flying low and haven't been that active.

randakar: Don't like some of his posts. The hunt on Caillean could perhaps have been a mercy kill for their road trip?

bearthjah, esemesas, Dedonus, aedan777, ramius3443 - Neutral

 

[aedan777]

I have to admit that I don't understand Wagonlitz's crusade against Alynkio. Sure he has only five game related posts, but they have decent substance to them, particularly the one yesterday where he made a case against Wagonlitz. I suppose usually Alynkio is a bit more active, but he's not so quiet to the extent I'd really say he's suspicious for it. Nor do I recall him being more likely to be quiet as a wolf anyways. And for Wagonlitz's other point on Alynkio, that he hasn't face pressure, I also find that weak. A lot of people haven't faced pressure. In fact of the living players I'd say on Yakman and maybe Wagonlitz have faced serious pressure over the past couple days. Singling out Alynkio feels weird.

I also have to admit that a substantial part of the reason I'm skeptical here is that all of this "case" can easily apply to me as much as Alynkio, and I know I'm a villager.

Now weak though the case is, it's not bad per se and with no dead wolves yet, it could be on to something. The part that I really don't get is Wagonlitz asking every single person what they think about Alynkio. I don't think I've ever seen Wagonlitz have such a single minded obsession with a single candidate before, not with a case as weak as this. I don't know what to make of that.

For the other candidates, Randy's case against Esemesas is weak. The wolves would've spread their votes out (ok I'm with you), so they would've voted for a major candidate (I don't think that necessarily follows), therefore one of Esemesas and Hax has to be a baddie (that's some strained logic). Neither major candidate was a wolf, so I think it could well be misleading to make assumptions about how the wolves voted. I also question Randy's defense of Hax here, more so than his logic to accuse Esemesas/Hax. Hax is "too crazy" to be a wolf? Complete nonsense, Hax can absolutely be crazy as a wolf.

Yakman's a loon. Could be a wolf, but I wouldn't bet on it. He's ranting about some Yvanoff-Alynkio cooperation, but I don't see it.

Ramius is an easy lynch. He always makes himself suspicious and is low on useful activity, which makes him a perfect scapegoat. But he also this way regardless of role, so he could also be a wolf. If a better candidate can't be found, lynching him might not be a bad idea.

For the case makers, I'm somewhat suspicious of Wagonlitz and Randy. Wagonlitz is really going after Alynkio, and I feel its excessive for the quality of the case he's peddling. That isn't necessarily suspicious, but it feels off to me. Randy's case against esemesas is really strained, which I'd say is unusual for him. I also think Hax has a potential point about him having possibly hunted Caillean.

I think that last point is worth some pressure.

Vote Randakar

 

[Hax]

Vote Yakman

A votecount would be handy.

 

[PanzerCorps]

Vote Yakman

A votecount would be handy.

You need only ask

~ 2 hours to deadline

Alynkio: 2
Wagonlitz[232]
Yakman[226 Yvanoff -> 248]

Yakman: 2
esemesas[238]
Hax[252]

Esemesas: 1
Randakar[227 Wagonlitz -> 235]

ramius: 1
beartjah[241]

Randakar: 1
Aedan[252]

Not Voted: 4

 

[alynkio]

I think we might want to look at Alynkio as he's been uncharacteristically quiet. He only has 6 posts in the entire thread and as one was the in post then he only has 5 posts actually pertaining to the game. I've quoted all his game posts here.

Day one he makes a threeway between Arky, Jeray, and Yakman.

Arky and Yakman then both change to jeray, putting him two up, and Alynkio changes to Bro thereby tying Arky and Bro for second, with Jeray being one above those two.

Day 3 he makes this which looks like a big case, but in actuality just boils down to voting me for thinking my case on Xarkan is bad, and I admit it wasn't the best of cases, and primarily that he wants to vote me as I had got no attention so far.

He then makes a votecount.

An lastly he breaks the threeway minutes to deadline, which doesn't really mean too much as both goodies and baddies would do that.

Alynkio also only has been votes two times in total, once during day 1 and once during day 2, both votes changing to somebody else later in the day. Hence he's not really had any pressure what so ever and looks like he's been flying quite low, but trying to appear more active than he has been.

Completely random vote, the very first vote of the game.

And here's Ese trying to probe Alynkio, but nothing really happened and he later switched away again.

So yeah, I think Alynkio is worth taking a closer look at.
Vote Alynkio

I really don't see how any of this adds up to me being the best candidate for the day. Looking at post counts is a suboptimal way of finding wolves. I try to compensate for quantity with quality; apologies if I've failed. Other people have been just as quiet. Don't even know what's supposed to be wolfish about my day 1 vote. As for day 2... which case was I supposed to make? I evaluated some of the other cases, and didn't like how people were fixating on the same couple of candidates. I thought you were trying to direct the village to blow it's TIE on easy lynches. Spreading attention around is a good thing, Herr Wagon. Apologies if you are a villager, but this is far from clear. Did someone else make an obviously better case on day 2?

As tempting as it is to revenge vote / tunnel here, I'll go after someone who could be a plausible WagonPack mate.

What's everyone's opinion on Yakman? I mean he is who he is, but this game he's been all roleplay and no substance.

Vote Yakman

i think esemesas, while possibly a WITCH is not so clearly in the grips of VILE CHAOS as @Yvanoff .

and going for the easy yak lynch is WEAK PLAY @esemesas . are you on their side?

I actually agree with Yakman here. Esemesas' vote was exceptionally lazy, considering there now is enough stuff out there to actually build cases. Esemesas fits well into a pack with basically everyone, and also hasn't had any attention yet either.

Well, got visitors over so I'm not sure how active I'll be able to be today

The case on Esemesas seems to be fairly baseless, I don't see any reason to assume that there has to be a wolf(or even that it is more likely) among the Arky voters.

I don't really see what the case on Yvanoff is either. He is somehow coordinating votes with Alynkio, which proves what exactly?


I'd like to see Ramius pressured a bit more because of his lazy voting yesterday. He voted Xarkan up ahead to three votes with no real explanation for why, but he didn't seem to have really been in too much danger anywhere and attention got shifted elsewhere. Let's see if we can put some pressure on him today to see that makes him a bit more explanatory of his actions.
VOTE RAMIUS

I still think this is lazy villager Ramius. Wolf Ramius usually tries harder. Yakman is always a target. It's not always the wolves who fail to explain themselves and are quiet; sometimes we've got to win with the village we have and not the village we'd like.

VOTE ESEMESAS

 

[Yvanoff]

@Panzer Commader it'd be nice if by now you'd have learned to differentiate @Yakman and myself - we're nothing alike ! For once, he wants to lynch me, while I'm not supportive of the idea.

RE: the cases, it very much feels we're waiting for the Seer to rescue us here. We don't have a lot to go on, which is really problematic. While @Wagonlitz 's defense of TIEs is not stupid, his obsession with a subpar case is indeed intriguing. Yakman is really a problem for me - his behavior could mean anything, it's impossible to read

 

[esemesas]

Ehm how are his posts not just vote x? Aside from one post yesterday, the one where he made the "case" on me, he literally hasn't really posted anything, but vote x. (Aside from that one vote count, of course.)

And he normally is quite more active. Him being this inactive really is suspicious.

Also as you say that it'll give a lot of info to lynch him, why aren't you voting him then?

Because you're pushing too hard for alynkio, feels like we need discussion, not just "here is why we should lynch alynkio, why aren't you guys voting alynkio?"

 

[Hax]

Not Voted: 4

-alynkio

So who haven't voted yet?

 

[Dedonus]

i think esemesas, while possibly a WITCH is not so clearly in the grips of VILE CHAOS as @Yvanoff .


seriously? you don't see @Yvanoff and @alynkio coordinating their votes? like... it's blatant wolfsign.

and going for the easy yak lynch is WEAK PLAY @esemesas . are you on their side?

I think this needs some more explanation. How exactly are Yvanoff and alynkio coordinating their votes? Besides them both voting for Brovahkiin on Day 1 around the same time (~7 minutes apart), none of their votes were close (or on the same people). Maybe I'm just not seeing something that other people are.

I feel the first part of Wagonlitz' case on Alynkio has some reason in it. The switch on Day 1 does look a little peculiar. Although it looks apparent that he wasn't saving someone because Jeray was lynched and turned out to be a villager. His second point is that breaking a tie does not rule you out as a wolf, which sounds reasonable. But his last point could be applied to many people in this game. Most of the players who has been run up in the last two days are dead.

Honestly, the one person who has not seen pressure yet was Aedan. He has only been voted by Hax and that was during his 12 vote switches on Day 1, which I honestly don't think really counts as pressure.

Vote Aedan

 

[Yvanoff]

OK, so a couple notes (in disarray and vaguely chronological order, sorry about that):
- esemesas got run up for a bit day 1 before the pressure vanished into thin air. Also, brovahkiin was hunted that night - he voted esemesas (only voter). That doesn't deserve to be called a clue, though
- very lazy Wagon yesterday. First, he votes Hax because "he's acting weird". While Hax sure went crazy day 1.... How meaningful is that ? Not very, not at all. Why be so awfully quick to follow randy's vote on Hax with such a weak argument Wagon ?
- Then he proposes a ramius-Xarkan tie. While his arguments about TIE make sense (and anyway, that's Wagon), we can not: a) he no longer mentions Hax who he was voting earlier in the day (logical considering how baseless his vote was, but still notable b) lazily proposes a TIE between a very passive villager and one who got run up the day before. While Xarkan made sense, proposing ramius feels like Wagon is mostly interested in going with the flow (just previously there were people - including arky - noting how lazy ramius was after he very lazily voted).
- alynkio voted Wagon first, so Wagon's crusade against alynkio feels a lot like revenge voting gone overboard (especially since Wagon's justification for it - alynkio being inactive - is weird considering a lot of players are inactive)
- randy was very lazy day 2, true. Though I note Caillean, who was hunted Day 2, had requested to be subbed out (and there seems to be no sub - besides brova and jeray I guess). Could be randy directing the hunt. Could be the wolves doing Panzer a favor, just like the Village did day 1
- randy's day 3 post was better than day 2.
- ramius and Dedonus trying to hide (though ramius got some attention previously). beartjah is meanwhile not getting a lot of attention IMHO but putting thoughts into his posts. aedan is, well, aedan, Yakman is crazy, esemesas got a bit of attention then hid once more.

Well, yeah.

Vote Wagonlitz

For clearly being more interested in lynching anybody than lynching a wolf