Blut und Schlacht (Blood and Battle): A Learner’s Saga

[Specialist290]

No words of advice for the Thing, at least for tonight -- I've been working on a small home renovation project that's been taking a lot out of me each evening -- but just dropping a line to let you know I'm still following eagerly

 

[Bullfilter]

No words of advice for the Thing, at least for tonight -- I've been working on a small home renovation project that's been taking a lot out of me each evening -- but just dropping a line to let you know I'm still following eagerly

Thanks. If anything does occur to you, you have until around the end of July to let me know

 

[diskoerekto]

“My King, I have just received word that Marshal Hrolfr died today, at his post in the main barracks here in Nygarðr.”

I just realised that our Hrolfr was the great-great-great-grandfather of William the Conqueror.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rollo

 

[diskoerekto]

by the way, don't forget to vote in the Q2 ACAs for 2019

 

[Bullfilter]

The Fifteenth Þing of Eilif’s Reign – September 902 (a summary of advice from Chapter 79)

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

General Comments

Well we all know where the great bear went...

I would always pursue event chains lile that unless you really can't afford it.

Yes, into your ‘King in the North’ world! I too like to take the event chains where I can, mainly out of interest to see where they lead, as I’m encountering them for the first time (personally for sure and even vicariously via other AARs).

I don't like that monthly balance. I never like when more money is going out than coming in. Do something with that Tribal Army and then release it.

The deficit is a pain, especially when I haven’t been able to raid. Steady income is so hard with such an economically backward country.

A great victory for King Eilif, but with new lands will come new problems I would think, he should be wary of factions.

It was a smashing victory that has really made his name and brought him from out of his father’s shadow. But as you say, the new lands bring their own complications.

Well, I've finally read all the thread, very nice, well written and instructive. a suggested reading for any ck2 newbie, specially, but not limited to , for those playing pagans. Bravo.

As noted before, thanks very much!

You are very close to your vassal limit. Maybe you should consider some reorganization, transfer some chief (the one that don't like you) to some Jarl. that would take the chiefs out of your hairs and raise the jarl opinion of you at least of 10 for 10 years, more if she want to control that province

Yes, good advice, will have a look to see if there’s more to be done. Had done a little of that before (unloaded one real trouble-maker that way), may need to do more, as you say.

Some say the only thing worse than not getting what you want, is getting what you want.

I do wonder if Eilif doesn't feel a little like that in the aftermath of this grand victory. Once the hangover clears and in the cold light of the northern day he realises just how much extra hassle all these new lands are. No wonder people have gavelkind back then - it was a merciful system of inheritance to reduce the mental strain!

I think he definitely does feel that way – I do anyway! But he now needs to keep swimming with the tide, lest it overwhelm him!

I'm not really sure about this anyway, no need to feel inexperienced. There are so many mechanics in this game, every one of us are inexperienced about one thing or the other

Thanks mate.

Well maybe after the scandinavian wars and some raiding, eilif can go on a russian (or scandinavian, whichever would be easier at that point) empire rampage to declare an empire before a succession

Will consider that when I get the chance – perhaps after Naumadl if that becomes the next move.

Hey, I was telling about event chains in other life focus that could've brought piety, and on your first event chain of hunting focus you came across one. Sometimes things that are bound to happen just happen, you made the correct choice

Nice.

I hope microbes cannot spontaneously travel through space like bodily fluids do for reproduction.

Much as that is a faintly disconcerting observation, I must agree with it!

Excellent episode, and I'm already looking forward to August

Thank you very much – almost there now.

And so Garðariki comes out victorious. May Eilif see the dawn of the Fylkirate, or his efforts will need to be replicated by his successor.

The realm may be united behing him for now, but for how long? It is good to see the council unopposed to his war plans for once. Though they could also support at least a law that doesn't act against them.

Dealing with Buðli must be surprisingly pleasant after the experience with Dyre. Even though the latter showed his true side, recognizing Eilif's son. Doesn't he know that the idea of a virgin birth is a filthy Christian one or how does he explain that he managed to get a woman in Garðariki pregnant from the safety of his exile?

Speaking of which, I do wonder how Hakon's doing. Things should be looking good for him.

Enjoy your tour overseas!

I’m really hoping he can at least become Fylkir, if not feudalism or empire achieved in his lifetime. Can but try. I see some serious council-wrangling coming up in the future, and that will be useful learning as well.

Yes, Buðli has been a pleasant surprise – except for some of his inept battlefield command interventions. Who knows how Dyre’s treacherous mind works – but given the ability in CK2 for these miraculous conceptions to occur over vast distances, perhaps he takes it for granted!

Will see if Hakon’s quest to become a landed lord ever comes off: I’d expect to get some message about him in due course. Though if he dies in a ditch, Eilif won’t mind!

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q1: Threat. To confirm I’m reading this right, if I was to attack Noregr straight away, the only effect would be to fight their King and anyone else he may have an alliance with (principally, probably exclusively, his own vassals). Though another victory (which would be limited to the claim on Naumadl) would no doubt raise the threat level further. I’m not sure by how much. Is there a tooltip that tells you before you declare war? Or if not, an idea of the ballpark % it would likely add?

Threat is a problem you must be careful of. Everyone will start dogpiling you if you go beyond a certain point. And if a Christian defence league is created, they tend to start asking the pope if they can crusade against you

That is indeed my general concern, but if I don’t take Naumadl I can’t reform the faith … and the tribal army is very handy.

Q1. yes, if you attack now there should not be defensive pact. OTOH Noregr is a big country, there is a chance it would not enter a DP against you in any case (Dpacts are for many small nations to join against a larger one, if one is too large it can't join (or at least, that is my understanding)

Thanks, helpful: didn’t know that.

Q1: if you attack noregr immediately, as in before unpausing, you will just get them and their allies. But, with your current threat level, they can and probably would join a defensive pact against you. What the tooltip is telling you is that the Norse pact against you would not join forces with other religions pacts until your threat goes higher. You still could end up facing several Norse realms though.

Hmm, a risk – but then again, no risk no gain!

As far as I know there should be already a formed pact in order for them to fight back with you. From what I remember from the past chapters, there aren't any formed yet but they migh form in the upcoming days. So if there isn't already some pacts against you, you can attack anyone now freely. Noregr you can attack anyway since they are our religion.

The increase in threat from Naumadal would rise it no more than 4-5% I think, but I'm just telling from the top of my head. I don't know if there is a tooltip that tells you :/

That’s right, no formed pact yet, so fingers crossed that should not apply if I do attack. If that’s true re the threat, then it wouldn’t cross another threshold – just take longer to bring back down afterwards. I think.

Yes. Threat depends on both your realm size, the CB used and the conquered land. For conquest wars the gain is fairly small, I would guess it's a few percent for present Garðariki. There's no tooltip for the threat to expect, however. The only threat gains I can somewhat calculate with is that when you've got a big empire, any war gives you too much threat.

OK, useful to confirm. I just want to strike now and then take the time later to reduce threat, consolidate, raid and get the piety to reform the religion and hope I don’t provoke a firestorm on myself. Nothing much!

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q2: Revocation of Austerbotn. There you have it – in an epic own goal, I unthinkingly signed away one third of my newly acquired fleet by granting the county to Styrkar when I went ‘over the limit’ of titles. Sigh. This would limit the size of the force I’d be able to send raiding. But the revocation without a claim would antagonise my now very many vassals (we meet the main ones below). Any thoughts here?

Q2: I lean towards no, but there are good arguments either way. One thing to keep in mind is that if you’re raiding a relatively nearby target, you can just have your troops walk there and the ships sail around separately. I bet your new holdings in Brabant have some decent targets inside walking distance.

That is an excellent idea/approach. I guess another alternative would be to take an initial detachment, leave some ships off-shore to load treasure, and split part of the fleet to pick up more troops if it the target was a little more distant. Clunky, but perhaps workable in the right circumstances.

There would be other commenters with more experience than me but I'd just swallow the fact that a third of the fleet is now unavailable for raiding, I'd think about the revocation if we were in a more stable situation and not just after subjugating a huge kingdom. On second thought, maybe it's better to treat it like a band-aid and get it done quickly once and for all. On third thought, it might be too risky

Haha! First instinct is probably the safest. But does Eilif do ‘safe’? It remains to be seen.

Revoking just to have access to boats may not be a good idea. You've got Brabant now, after all, and Lotharingia doesn't look like it can defend itself. Plenty enough of loot to seize there.

For further in the future, once you've reformed, further increased tribal organization and adopted feudalism you won't need your own boats anyway (as long as your army isn't too big). It's cheaper to use your vassals', too.

Very sound advice I think. Caution would say absorb the mistake for now, slap the forehead and see what else can be done. It seems like there are a few short- and long-term options available to get around it.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q3: Runestone. It says ‘event chain’, so I’m thinking it may take a little while to pan out. Should I do this now, or wait until closer to the time? I have 258 gold in the coffers again, so ordering one now would leave me with 158: should be enough to fund another war (if Eilif does that instead of raiding), but after last time, I’m being careful. It could also pay for a mercenary band in extremis, so if I don’t need to do it now, I could hold off.

Q3 I'm confused. Maybe I'm missing something, but from the wiki it seems that Runestones give prestige and you need piety for the reformation. it can still be useful but it don't help with the reform.

As mentioned before, it was me that was confused!

Q3: the runestone does take a little time; more importantly it gives prestige rather than piety. Nice but hardly worth giving up your safety blanket for.

Indeed.

We're not in a hurry for piety, let's first finish the wars and erect the runestone when we start raiding. Having said that, keep in mind I have never played that event chain and just talking from my general sense. EDIT: I saw in other comments it gives prestige instead of piety anyway.

Ditto.

It doesn't take long. It's an event chain because you decide how you dedicate it, and then get your stone raised. You can hold off for now, though the runestone's opinion boost always comes in handy.

Yes, will worry about it some other time, if the cash is handy and the need sufficient. From memory (and without checking), Rurik raised one way back when.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q4: Naumadl. Any important considerations here I haven’t seen? And what do you think: attack now, or wait for Olafr to finish his war, disband his own tribal army, taking him down in slower time while I raid, build piety and let the Swedish vassals rebuild their strength? And also see if the Christians try to hit me early, as they were attacking Eirikr?

Q4: I’d attack now out of concern for pacts forming, as well as to keep the tribal army. Your ships should help the levies get back faster, even if it takes a couple trips to pick them all up. This is really the last territory you need for the foreseeable future, get it quick then raid for a few years while the threat goes down.

Noted.

I'd just attack now, try to get in and out quickly and hope we're quick enough before anything bad happens elsewhere. It's one province so less warscore would be enough and if we take there quickly it would tick into the warscore as time passes anyway.

Looks like there’s a consensus building.

Olafr winning the war could bring him back into tribal-army-raising prestige, so that's to keep in mind too. By quickly moving for Naumadal, you should be able to secure good ticking warscore before he's even left Luxembourg though, and then it may be a matter of only one or two battles. If you are lucky, it weakens him just enough not for more holy wars to target him.

Then again, you could also join Olafr in defense of his holy war. That's another chance to earn some piety in battle.

I would feel more like helping him against the heathen Christians if he didn’t hold that holy site … perhaps one days we will band together to fight them!

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q5: Succession – Eilif’s Vote. Any views as to whether I should ‘get with the strength’ and vote for Rikulfr? Or perhaps pitch in for Buðli to see if I can swing some favour in his direction? The latter certainly appeals for role-play and sentiment purposes. Clearly, there’s not a lot of point voting for Styrkar yet, until he reaches his majority.

Q5: Sometimes nominating a new person as your heir will also cause the clumped up votes to spread out a bit as they have someone new to consider, you are right that you should wait until Strykar is of age since there is almost no chance of getting him as your heir as a child.

Noted.

Q5: your vote can swing things dramatically, since it gives a modifier depending on how Much the voter likes you (there is a tooltip to see this in the new patch). It’s pretty hard to get minors elected, I generally pick my favorite adult.

Noted again. I can’t use the new patch on this game, alas, as it destroyed the game save and I had to revert. But the new tooltip sounds handy.

I think it makes sense to try for Budhli even if it's just to see if we can swing other voters. I wonder that as well, I have no idea

Noted.

Well, voting for Buðli would give him an opinion boost, but at least for now he's a good loyal brother. Still, if you wish to switch your vote from Styrkar, then it's best to do so for your favoured adult heir. Just going with the majority won't give Eilif any friends amongst his vassals, just make Rikulfr like him more. Buðli would deserve the support until Styrkar's majority. He's a good guy.

Good advice: at present Rikulfr is a nobody, Buðli and important and loyal lord. And yes, I have come to like the character.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q6: Swedish Succession. As discussed in response to previous comments and in the light of this, do I have the right of it here? Sweden would split under a separate king in an elective gavelkind succession? Anything else I should be bearing in mind there, or a legal or practical nature?

Q6: yep, it’ll split. I don’t think there’s much you can do since i think you can’t change away from gavelkind as unreformed pagan and can’t destroy a gavelkind title. The only solution is being an emperor or reforming. You will get a strong claim on it and can generally retake it unless your new ruler is pretty hated.

Right: all the more reason to take Naumadl and reform as soon as it can be managed.

Q6: Yes, if you die now then Sweden will be Strykars, one way to possibly avoid this however is change Swedens sucession law to elective monarchy or any other non gavelkind sucession(though this will be difficult since there is a requirment of no swedish vassal to have a negative opinion) and then destroy the kingdom title, which will cost prestige and a significant negative opinion modifier to swedish vassals, but all the vassals will still be inherited by your primary heir and there shouldnt be a split or any factions to install claimnants for sweden. One way to make this easier could be to transfer the swedish count vassals to swedish dukes so there are less people to improve relations with.

Useful advice, though it will take me a while to get my head around it! But I think there will be a few very badly disposed Swedish jarls for some years, so probably have to look at other options for hanging on to it. Even if it means a re-conquest subjugation war. If reform was achieved before then, it may not be so urgent. I mainly took it for the holy sites, though hanging on to the territory would be nice.

Yes I think it's a certainty the kingdoms would split. I think after we finish the Noregr war and subsequent raiding and absorbing, we'd better get to mopping up provinces from the Empire of Rus to keep the realm together in the event of a succession. If we manage to go feudal, that would solve a lot of succession problems as well.

I really don’t know (and not experienced enough to have a feel) whether achieving reform + feudalism or forming an empire would likely be quicker. But I need to do one of them.

If I get it right, your non-main title (created or creatable, which isn't relevant in Sviþjoð's case anyway) goes to your non-inheriting sons. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that may mean that if Styrkar inherits Garðariki without a brother, then he may inherit both kingdoms.

If vassals are less likely to vote for a son of the previous ruler which I think they are, then this also explains why.

Well, if he did get both (if it comes to it) that would be great, but my assumption is (per the screens) there’d be a split. But I’m largely in the dark so will just deal with whatever the game throws up there!

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Ch79 Q7: Law Changes. Are these the type laws that you can only change once every ten years? That is, if I was to get medium tribal approved, it would be another ten years before I could go for high, and so on? Or getting the revocation change up would prevent moving on organisation (or anything else) for ten years and vice versa?

Q7: there is definitely a cooldown, I think 10 years is right. I believe there are two “lanes,” one for “crown laws” e.g. tribal authority and one for “regular laws” e.g. revocation or centralization. So you should be able to pass one of each every 10 years (resets on sUccession). But I’m not 100% sure the rules were the same on the patch you’re using.

That is helpful, thanks. It’s the previous patch to the current one, with nearly all the major DLC except the last couple.

No idea about the question, but do we need to change the revocation anyway?

That’s mainly a technical question, but the extra revocation power could be handy I suppose. Main priority is pushing towards feudal. At the moment, the Council is against both.

That's right. If you get the law approved (or rejected, for that matter), then it's either infidel revocation or tribal organization (or obligation laws) for ten years until the next vote.

OK, thanks for the confirmation.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Thanks everyone! It’s good to be ‘back in harness’ after a long trip, travelling back for 24hr+ with a raging head-cold and then industrial strength jet-lag afterwards. Still getting over it six days later! But it was a great trip which I thoroughly enjoyed.

I really needed all that Q&A to get my head back into the game after the break, especially at such a crossroads in the gameplay. I’ll now make a few decisions and start the next session. Am bound to make some errors, possibly big ones or just cop hard circumstances, but it’s all a learning experience.

 

[diskoerekto]

I really don’t know (and not experienced enough to have a feel) whether achieving reform + feudalism or forming an empire would likely be quicker. But I need to do one of them.

I formed an empire before but never did a reform + feudalism so it's difficult for me to compare the two but feudalism seems like would take a lot of time just because of the cooldown period in successive law changes. On the other hand we can only take 1 county per realm per 5 years due to no fancy CBs so I think it will all come down to the number of independent (and preferably non-norse) realms per possible empire titles (scandinavia or rus) to determine the amount of years necessary for that. Detailed analysis follows.

The other one we already know I guess? 3 clicks x 10 years is 30 years if the cooldown period is 10 years, and we need to collect 750 piety before then. We will be going in this direction anyway, independent if we're pushing for an empire or not; so I see this as a safeguard and think in the worst case we'll get here but we need to keep Eilif healthy.

For Scandinavia empire, there seems to be 73 provinces in total and one needs 80% of them for that, so, 59? We already have 27 of them (I'm already counting Naumadal) so need 32 more. Denmark has 12 in the Denmark kingdom and 4 in various places in Norway kingdom (I don't know who has 2 Icelandic provinces). Noregr has 12 in Norway kingdom, or 14 if they have Iceland as well. In the western corner of the Norway kingdom there seems to be a single county Norse chiefdom (it's a pity we don't border them, we could've asked for a vassalization since they're 2 levels below us and they'd join us peacefully) and in the northernmost corner there seems to be the 2 province heathen chiefdom of Finmark. The 5 province kingdom of Kola seems to be divided between 3 hopefully non-Norse chiefdoms. Lastly there are 10 more provinces in the Finland kingdom, all between 5 heathen chiefdoms.

So we can take like 17 provinces from 9 different chiefdoms without needing to fabricate any claims. 14 of them (Livonia has 4 provinces and Karelia 3 needing as many wars to consume) can be taken in the timeframe of 5-10 years. If we're lucky and fabriacate a few duchy level claims along with county levels this amounts to around 10 wars with Denmark or Noregr. In the meanwhile if they experience succession crisises there can be counties that can swear fealty to us peacefully or our vassals eating into them. I say in total this would take around 20 years but if we make this our top priority and focus as such. We'd also create around 100-150 threat points to burn. Chancellor can help with that when he's not fabricating claims but it seems the threat burn rate would fit inside the waiting for truces to run out time.

For Rus empire, we need 53 out of the 66 total province count. We already have 29 so need 24 more. Murom has the only 3 provinces from the Rus kingdom that we don't currently have. In Ruthenia; Chernigov has 6, Poland and Hungary has 3 each and Lithuania has 2 (from what I can see). In the north in the kingdom of Perm we hold no provinces. Noregr has a puzzling one, 3 chiefdoms have 1 each, Perm and Ugra have around 3-4 each and there are 3-4 more provinces unaccounted for. In 10-15 years we can get around 20-21 total from Murom, Chernigov, Poland, Hungary, Lithuania, Ugra and Perm. The 3 lone chiefdoms would be conquered one after each other, and I'm guessing there's some other tribes further northeast. It's 75-100 threat in total I guess which also can be burnt in the timeframe.

So if we can arrange the council in a way to greenlight our wars, I think going for the Rus Empire still seems the most doable way to secure succession. There are also a lot of separate religions in the target countries I guess (Tengri, Christian, Slavic, Romuva and Suomenuska?) so alternating between them can also cooldown religion specific defensive pacts. We just need to focus

Well, if he did get both (if it comes to it) that would be great, but my assumption is (per the screens) there’d be a split. But I’m largely in the dark so will just deal with whatever the game throws up there!

So killing every dynasty member but one would solve it crudely somehow? I doubt that's what Eilif would do anyway.

 

[Bullfilter]

Really appreciate that analysis @diskoerekto

There’s an interesting aesthetic at play here too: gaminess vs a broad attempt to be realistic about what a ruler may do. Part of me thinks yes, go for the technical solution that saves succession, the other says just aim generally for an ambition and see where it leads, and if there’s a succession war down the track just deal with it at the time.

I think I’ll probably do a mixture of both, if that makes any sense.

 

[diskoerekto]

Really appreciate that analysis @diskoerekto

There’s an interesting aesthetic at play here too: gaminess vs a broad attempt to be realistic about what a ruler may do. Part of me thinks yes, go for the technical solution that saves succession, the other says just aim generally for an ambition and see where it leads, and if there’s a succession war down the track just deal with it at the time.

I think I’ll probably do a mixture of both, if that makes any sense.

You’re welcome. Actually I think I missed doing those

Even the crazy way of killing everybody but one among the dynasty to secure succession isn’t really gamey as it was the official succession method for many kingdoms so I think none of the solutions are gamey. If they fit the RP profile of Eilif, well that’s entirely for you to feel.

Before the last episode I was thinking now is the time to digest the conquests but I’m starting to think we might keep on making wars (and keep the prestige troops intact) by serial declaration of wars after the noregr one is over. Let’s keep until the threat level becomes too dangerous and do the digesting during the burn off maybe?

I’m just curious to see what’s there on the horizon for our characters.

 

[TheButterflyComposer]

Now that is some in-depth study of options here. There is something further to say on border conflict CBs though: first they are very expensive CBs for what you get (a county), and second they are the single worst in the game (I think?) for negative stats after you declare war, especially if you win. Initially, you get an opinion penalty with at least everyone in diplomatic range about 'declaring a unjust war' and, as you might tell from the description, this opens you up to counter invasions. However, as you are unreformed pagan. I don't believe there is anyone who can grant said counter invasions to your enemies, so you got lucky there. However, your threat level will go through the roof and approach if not hit 100%, which means that Christian and pagan defensive pacts will form and work together to stop you. If you did in fact secure large portions of land using this method or declare an empire, you will undoubtedly be crusaded upon at some point.

This doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, but there will be some big issues about halfway through securing territory, I think.

 

[diskoerekto]

Now that is some in-depth study of options here. There is something further to say on border conflict CBs though: first they are very expensive CBs for what you get (a county), and second they are the single worst in the game (I think?) for negative stats after you declare war, especially if you win. Initially, you get an opinion penalty with at least everyone in diplomatic range about 'declaring a unjust war' and, as you might tell from the description, this opens you up to counter invasions. However, as you are unreformed pagan. I don't believe there is anyone who can grant said counter invasions to your enemies, so you got lucky there. However, your threat level will go through the roof and approach if not hit 100%, which means that Christian and pagan defensive pacts will form and work together to stop you. If you did in fact secure large portions of land using this method or declare an empire, you will undoubtedly be crusaded upon at some point.

This doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, but there will be some big issues about halfway through securing territory, I think.

Well of course threat burn should be taken care of but the good thing is that there's no single pagan defensive pact but rather each pagan religion has to pact with themselves so you can hit different religions round robin until all form pacts and then wait for some time to burn threat level down while they disband pacts one by one to rinse and repeat.

The stopping point of each round should be when a war puts us over 75% threat where all religious groups can band together. Mind that, you can start a war at 74% threat to a realm which is not part of a defensive pact while there are other defensive pacts around, take some land that carries you to whatever threat so everybody bands together in an all compassing defensive pact, and have no consequences if you just raid peacefully until the threat goes below 75% again at which point pacts dissolve to specific religions again. The thing is, threat burn is around 5 per year without the chancellor action, and more with it. So it is like 10-30 years of threat burn for the Scandinavia Empire and 8-20 years of threat burn for the Rus Empire.

For 3 Murom provinces that are part of the Kingdom of Rus, we can use the de jure county conquest CB which is cheaper in terms of threat but I guess has a longer truce (10 vs 5 years for pagan single county conquest?). This CB can also be used when enough counties from a de jure kingdom is conquered and the relevant title can be created. The thing is, if we ever want to expand in Eilif's lifetime, we're bound to these 2 CBs plus fabricating claims, or active vassals taking land from neighbors which also grow the realm but does little to help the Rurikid family.

 

[TheButterflyComposer]

Well of course threat burn should be taken care of but the good thing is that there's no single pagan defensive pact but rather each pagan religion has to pact with themselves so you can hit different religions round robin until all form pacts and then wait for some time to burn threat level down while they disband pacts one by one to rinse and repeat.

The stopping point of each round should be when a war puts us over 75% threat where all religious groups can band together. Mind that, you can start a war at 74% threat to a realm which is not part of a defensive pact while there are other defensive pacts around, take some land that carries you to whatever threat so everybody bands together in an all compassing defensive pact, and have no consequences if you just raid peacefully until the threat goes below 75% again at which point pacts dissolve to specific religions again. The thing is, threat burn is around 5 per year without the chancellor action, and more with it. So it is like 10-30 years of threat burn for the Scandinavia Empire and 8-20 years of threat burn for the Rus Empire.

For 3 Murom provinces that are part of the Kingdom of Rus, we can use the de jure county conquest CB which is cheaper in terms of threat but I guess has a longer truce (10 vs 5 years for pagan single county conquest?). This CB can also be used when enough counties from a de jure kingdom is conquered and the relevant title can be created. The thing is, if we ever want to expand in Eilif's lifetime, we're bound to these 2 CBs plus fabricating claims, or active vassals taking land from neighbors which also grow the realm but does little to help the Rurikid family.

Active claim fabrication can yield a surprising amount depending on chancellor skill and positing. Since there are a number of duke and kingdom tier targets, not only can we try for county acquisition but also claim the whole duchy title, which should speed things up. I wouldn't be too concerned about doing it all in one lifetime either, since really we're just trying to build as strong a realm as possible. If you want piety, just holy war from the huge amounts of targets you have, then give the land away to independents afterwards.

I suspect going after Rus and finishing it off is probably the best idea, and then conquering all of Scandinavia as a secondary campaign goal (and around the time we finish doing that, either the Mongols or some Steppe Horde should have shown up to fight too).

 

[diskoerekto]

Active claim fabrication can yield a surprising amount depending on chancellor skill and positing. Since there are a number of duke and kingdom tier targets, not only can we try for county acquisition but also claim the whole duchy title, which should speed things up. I wouldn't be too concerned about doing it all in one lifetime either, since really we're just trying to build as strong a realm as possible. If you want piety, just holy war from the huge amounts of targets you have, then give the land away to independents afterwards.

I suspect going after Rus and finishing it off is probably the best idea, and then conquering all of Scandinavia as a secondary campaign goal (and around the time we finish doing that, either the Mongols or some Steppe Horde should have shown up to fight too).

I agree about the efficacy of fabricating but the chancellor might be busy helping burn threat as well so it’s probably better to decide which one is more necessary any given moment.

One of the other good things about becoming an empire is that, we can ask Norse dukes to peacefully join our realm as well. Currently it’s only for counts.

I’m worried about the one lifetime thing because of a potential succession crisis.

 

[MatthewP]

Honestly, a succession crisis might not be the worst thing for the story

That aside, once the third holy site is secured I would focus on raiding for a decade or so at least, with opportunistic wars here and there. Getting the empire In eilif’s lifetime is certainly possible but tedious and gamey. Also, a war chest of a couple thousand gold + upgraded buildings from prestige pretty much guarantees any succession issues will be promptly resolved.

 

[TheButterflyComposer]

I agree about the efficacy of fabricating but the chancellor might be busy helping burn threat as well so it’s probably better to decide which one is more necessary any given moment.

One of the other good things about becoming an empire is that, we can ask Norse dukes to peacefully join our realm as well. Currently it’s only for counts.

I’m worried about the one lifetime thing because of a potential succession crisis.

Burning threat with chancellor is usually a waste. Threat only counts for offensive wars you start, and thus you can simply spend the time building a ton of claims instead, waiting for the threat to die down a touch (build up a war chest too) and then declare them all one after the other. Sure it's a bit cheesy/games but the only way to get threat that high to begin with is either seriously abusing the holy war mechanic or being the mongols or something.

Offering vassalage only works if you are the rightful liege lord, obscenely powerful compared to the vassal and usually, the same culture and religion. So Norse, pagan and Scandinavian emperor will help, but not in Russia, and vice versa. Even then, dukes tend not to bow if they have a chance of surviving a war with you I.e. You can't possibly annex their whole territory in one war etc will make them bold.

Succession crisis is going to be a worry, especially with gavekind and similar systems, but the only reason to play as a unreformed tribal pagan and stay that way is because of these mechanics. Feudal Christendom is so stable in contrast you often have to go out of your way to cause succession problems.

 

[Bullfilter]

Thanks guys for a very useful discussion here. There are some pact-related questions arising from the session I played after the Thing and have just finished writing up (to be edited and published soon) re pacts. But I'll keep all this info in mind as events unfold in the mid-longer terms.

You’re welcome. Actually I think I missed doing those

Even the crazy way of killing everybody but one among the dynasty to secure succession isn’t really gamey as it was the official succession method for many kingdoms so I think none of the solutions are gamey. If they fit the RP profile of Eilif, well that’s entirely for you to feel.

Before the last episode I was thinking now is the time to digest the conquests but I’m starting to think we might keep on making wars (and keep the prestige troops intact) by serial declaration of wars after the noregr one is over. Let’s keep until the threat level becomes too dangerous and do the digesting during the burn off maybe?

I’m just curious to see what’s there on the horizon for our characters.

Now that is some in-depth study of options here. There is something further to say on border conflict CBs though: first they are very expensive CBs for what you get (a county), and second they are the single worst in the game (I think?) for negative stats after you declare war, especially if you win. Initially, you get an opinion penalty with at least everyone in diplomatic range about 'declaring a unjust war' and, as you might tell from the description, this opens you up to counter invasions. However, as you are unreformed pagan. I don't believe there is anyone who can grant said counter invasions to your enemies, so you got lucky there. However, your threat level will go through the roof and approach if not hit 100%, which means that Christian and pagan defensive pacts will form and work together to stop you. If you did in fact secure large portions of land using this method or declare an empire, you will undoubtedly be crusaded upon at some point.

This doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, but there will be some big issues about halfway through securing territory, I think.

Well of course threat burn should be taken care of but the good thing is that there's no single pagan defensive pact but rather each pagan religion has to pact with themselves so you can hit different religions round robin until all form pacts and then wait for some time to burn threat level down while they disband pacts one by one to rinse and repeat.

The stopping point of each round should be when a war puts us over 75% threat where all religious groups can band together. Mind that, you can start a war at 74% threat to a realm which is not part of a defensive pact while there are other defensive pacts around, take some land that carries you to whatever threat so everybody bands together in an all compassing defensive pact, and have no consequences if you just raid peacefully until the threat goes below 75% again at which point pacts dissolve to specific religions again. The thing is, threat burn is around 5 per year without the chancellor action, and more with it. So it is like 10-30 years of threat burn for the Scandinavia Empire and 8-20 years of threat burn for the Rus Empire.

For 3 Murom provinces that are part of the Kingdom of Rus, we can use the de jure county conquest CB which is cheaper in terms of threat but I guess has a longer truce (10 vs 5 years for pagan single county conquest?). This CB can also be used when enough counties from a de jure kingdom is conquered and the relevant title can be created. The thing is, if we ever want to expand in Eilif's lifetime, we're bound to these 2 CBs plus fabricating claims, or active vassals taking land from neighbors which also grow the realm but does little to help the Rurikid family.

Active claim fabrication can yield a surprising amount depending on chancellor skill and positing. Since there are a number of duke and kingdom tier targets, not only can we try for county acquisition but also claim the whole duchy title, which should speed things up. I wouldn't be too concerned about doing it all in one lifetime either, since really we're just trying to build as strong a realm as possible. If you want piety, just holy war from the huge amounts of targets you have, then give the land away to independents afterwards.

I suspect going after Rus and finishing it off is probably the best idea, and then conquering all of Scandinavia as a secondary campaign goal (and around the time we finish doing that, either the Mongols or some Steppe Horde should have shown up to fight too).

I agree about the efficacy of fabricating but the chancellor might be busy helping burn threat as well so it’s probably better to decide which one is more necessary any given moment.

One of the other good things about becoming an empire is that, we can ask Norse dukes to peacefully join our realm as well. Currently it’s only for counts.

I’m worried about the one lifetime thing because of a potential succession crisis.

Honestly, a succession crisis might not be the worst thing for the story

That aside, once the third holy site is secured I would focus on raiding for a decade or so at least, with opportunistic wars here and there. Getting the empire In eilif’s lifetime is certainly possible but tedious and gamey. Also, a war chest of a couple thousand gold + upgraded buildings from prestige pretty much guarantees any succession issues will be promptly resolved.

Burning threat with chancellor is usually a waste. Threat only counts for offensive wars you start, and thus you can simply spend the time building a ton of claims instead, waiting for the threat to die down a touch (build up a war chest too) and then declare them all one after the other. Sure it's a bit cheesy/games but the only way to get threat that high to begin with is either seriously abusing the holy war mechanic or being the mongols or something.

Offering vassalage only works if you are the rightful liege lord, obscenely powerful compared to the vassal and usually, the same culture and religion. So Norse, pagan and Scandinavian emperor will help, but not in Russia, and vice versa. Even then, dukes tend not to bow if they have a chance of surviving a war with you I.e. You can't possibly annex their whole territory in one war etc will make them bold.

Succession crisis is going to be a worry, especially with gavekind and similar systems, but the only reason to play as a unreformed tribal pagan and stay that way is because of these mechanics. Feudal Christendom is so stable in contrast you often have to go out of your way to cause succession problems.

 

[Bullfilter]

Chapter 80: A Holy Mission (27 September 902 – 26 January 903)

Previously, on Blut und Schlacht … Victory over Sweden has made Eilif the leader of a massive Norse kingdom; inevitably, his neighbours did not like it – there was already talk, among those worried they may be next, of banding together to defend against the Garðarikian menace; while grand thoughts of empire and governmental reform were discussed, Eilif’s more immediate goal was reform of the Germanic faith to help resist the encroachment of crusading Christians; he had a tribal army ready for another campaign but had to consider the effect this may have on the already heavy threat others now perceived of his expansionist program.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

September 902

The recent Þing gave much for King Eilif to consider about the future of the realm. Some advisers argued for the building of a great empire to safeguard the Rurikid legacy from future dynastic division and dissipation. Of those, some favoured a Norse Scandinavian approach, others to bring the more diverse Rus into the Rurikid fold.

Whether in tandem with the pursuit of empire or separate, others called for the development of Garðarikian government on western European lines, where inheritance could be guaranteed by primogeniture succession, another way of keeping the Rurikid lands united into the future.

These grand projects would be considered carefully but would take decades to bring to fruition. Eilif’s more immediate concern was to reform the Germanic faith – for which the recently won claim on Naumadal, home to the sacred site of Mære, had been sought and won.

First, Eilif considered the current laws of the land. Stuck with elective gavelkind succession for the foreseeable future, he threw his support behind his favourite nephew Buðli, over the nondescript Rikulfr. And another ‘straw poll’ of the Council found only the now fiercely loyal Chancellor would support any change to royal laws to increase tribal organisation or introduce a religious control mandate.

​

The Council was as a group fairly loyal and now nicely balanced between pragmatists and glory-seekers, but to get any laws changed it seemed Eilif would need two more fully loyal councillors (or perhaps to buy favours, which could not yet really be afforded).

​

As the council met to advise Eilif on the next step following the subjugation of Sweden, the King sought a report on his counterpart in Noregr. They were both the same age and sons of conquering fathers, but King Olafr was very different to Eilif in most other respects.

​

The more he heard, the more Eilif was disgusted that the Germanic holy site of Mære rested in such dissolute and weak custody.

“I will not suffer this weakling to defile holy Mære by his presence any longer. It will be war!”​

The hard-won claim on Naumadal would be enforced.

Þorsteinn would take the main tribal army still under arms straight towards Naumadal, hoping for a quick and decisive blow in the Noregr heartland. The Huscarls – already marching from Gotland – would move to join them and form the basis of a follow-on force.

​

Eilif’s personal levy was raised and he decided to send the call out to all his vassals – old and new – to see who would respond. The answers were all received by 1 October: All those expected to accept did so; those considered unlikely declined. Of the six uncertain vassals, only one accepted their liege’s call to arms: young Tryggve (Hrölfr’s son). His brother Refil did not. Still, this should provide good follow-on forces when final mustered from the distant reaches of the kingdom.

​

The two remaining royal fleets were also raised and ordered to the Gulf of Finland, where they would ferry assembling levies over to the conflict. While inconvenient, the loss of Styrkar’s ships in Austerbötn would be taken in stride. For now, anyway.

​

The situation in the ‘Low Countries’ also needed to be considered now that the former Swedish holdings there were now under Garðarikian control and bordered a similar enclave controlled by Olafr of Noregr. None of Eilif’s vassal levies were raised there. The big considerations were around Olafr’s forces already engaged in defending (quite successfully so far) against a Christian Holy War launched by Duke Lambert of Luxembourg. There was also a large peasant revolt in Kleve, which may (with any luck) distract Noregr. Eilif was in no position at this stage to make any meaningful intervention there. In truth, he hoped he would be able to ignore that theatre while winning a relatively short, sharp war in Noregr itself.

​

Perhaps as a result of the new war for Naumadal, the next day news arrived that the troublesome Chief Vseslav had disbanded his independence faction.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

October 902

Early October saw all the Garðarikian vassal contingents that would respond now assembled and on the move, together with Eilif’s own levies. Many of the Swedish vassals companies would be reinforcing as they marched, small as they now were after their recent heavy losses in the subjugation war. And those in the east of the kingdom would have a long march via Finland and the island-hop to Uppland.

​

The initial orders to all the vassal contingents were to rendezvous with Þorsteinn’s main army, but this would be changed as contingents got nearer and the circumstances clearer.

​

By mid-October, two enemy levies (totalling around 350 men) were seen being raised in Holland. Olafr’s main army in Luxemburg made no move towards the nearby lands of Eilif’s new vassals.

“Nephew,” said Chancellor Buðli to the King some days later, “The Bloody Bishop has paid his own ransom to Jarl Nishkepaz and has been released. He is now back in Uppsala, where he serves Jarl Eirikr.”

“Curses! How I wish he had fallen into my hands – he would have received special treatment at the next blot! Is there anything we can do to depose him from his unholy occupation of our holy site?”

“He is Eirikr’s vassal, so you are unable to remove him yourself. Imprisoning him without legal cause would not take his title from him anyway and would see you branded a tyrant. You could seek to have him killed, though there is no guarantee Eirikr would not appoint another Christian to control the temple.”

“Damn him to Hel! I suppose I must suffer this infidel – for now, anyway.”​

​

Spoiler: Ch80 Q1: The Bloody Bishop

Ch80 Q1: The Bloody Bishop. Any crafty ideas out there? Or must I grin and bear his presence for now?

As October wore on, the main army was in Herjadal en route to Naumadal. The first ‘mainland’ vassal regiment of Olafr had been spotted in Jamtaland: they would arrive in Herjadal just five days after Þorsteinn vacated it. But he would not be diverted from his task, even if it meant some difficulty for the Swedish vassal companies also heading that way.

​

During the month, Buðli had been monitoring reports of the responses of Olafr’s vassals to requests to support him. Between 13 and 26 October, five had answered the call. The rest either had not been asked or had refused to come. Of these, only one of his most powerful Jarls seemed to have committed his forces: Jarl Þorfinn of Nidaros.

​

One of those responders – Dag of Heidmark – had now sent his regiment to join the attack on Herjadal and would arrive at the same time as their countrymen from Jamtaland.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

November 902

On 1 November a company of Olafr’s levy numbering just over 200 men was seen approaching Breda (the northernmost of Eilif’s new counties in the Lowlands) and would arrive there around 12 November. This was not yet a serious threat. In the north, most of the vassal contingents were now ordered to join with the Huscarls, commanded by Sverker, as the tribal army would soon be in Naumadal and the enemy were converging on Herjadal. Sverker would rally a force to contest the enemy once they combined.

In the Lowlands, Olafr still seemed preoccupied with reducing the holdings of Luxembourg: so far so good for Eilif’s plan to ‘risk-manage’ the threat there in the hope of securing the victory in the north.

​

By 10 November, the larger of the Garðarikian fleets was sufficiently loaded with levies to sail to Sweden, where they would contest the Norwegian invasion while Þorsteinn reduced Naumadal. The smaller fleet would remain until more fully laden.

​

In Breda, Olafr’s small company had arrived and was doing battle with the small remnant of a Brabantian revolt force that had been sheltering there: very handy, as Eilif was happy to see this vermin cleared from his new vassals’ lands. Olafr’s main army remained in Jülich.

​

Three days later, Þorsteinn was laying siege to Naumadal, which would take around 50 days to complete, after which the Temple itself would be besieged. One unfortunate Swedish vassal levy would be caught in Herjadal, while Sverker waited to be joined by the seaborne levies on their way join the war.

​

The battle in Herjadal between the army of Bragi of Upper Lorraine (268 men) and those of Heidmark and Jamtaland (805 men) began on 18 November. Bragi would be soundly defeated by 4 December in this one-sided exchange. But by then, the Sverker was in Helsingland and had been joined by the first contingent of the royal levy.

While this was happening, Olafr’s force had brushed away the small Brabantian revolt company but did not have the strength to besiege Breda. More worryingly though, Olafr’s main army had marched west and was now due to arrive in Breda on 28 November! Olafr’s war with Duke Lambert of Luxembourg was still unresolved [54% in favour of Olafr], in which eight of Olafr’s vassals had pledged their support. More than had taken up the cudgels to defend against Eilif.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

December 902 – January 903

The Battle of Sveg in Herjadal resulted in a clear (though minor) defeat for the unfortunate Bragi, who was taken prisoner by one of his opposite number.

​

Sölvi was given command of the levy army in Helsingland, Sverker taking one wing and the troublesome Chief Nikita the other. They were ordered to attack the Norwegians in Herjadal straight away. The ship-borne troops would have to regain their organisation as best they could on the march and hope their numbers would be enough to take down their opponents.

​

That day, the smaller fleet in the Gulf of Finland had almost been filled with nearly a thousand levies and it now set sail for northern Sweden as well. The larger fleet started making its way back to the homeland for more ferrying tasks. And the first of the royal levies making their way by land had arrived in Finland and had started making the island-hop to Uppland in small boats.

In irritating news, Nikita of Tver, despite his status as a commander, decided to join the independence faction. Maybe he’ll be killed in battle and good riddance, thought Eilif to himself. But he said nothing publicly and just ground his teeth, hoping the faction would come to nothing.

​

In the meantime, there had been no reports of any siege in Breda. In fact, by 22 December there were no major Norwegian forces in sight in any visible province! The avoidance plan there was working out better than expected. Though the whereabouts of Olafr’s main army would be handy to know.

​

On 26 December, Sölvi attacked the Norwegians in Herjadal. The enemy had concentrated all their forces in a central division. This presented no problems for the Garðarikians, who had them on the run by 7 January and the pursuit completed by 13 January with a healthy victory.

​

As the battle went on, the second contingent of ferried levies in the Gulf of Bothnia on 6 January. They were ordered to land in Medelpad from where they would march on and besiege Jamtaland.

The day the Second Battle of Sveg was won in Herjadal, the Norwegian commander Þorbjörn was captured. And Þorsteinn reported success in his siege of the Naumadal tribe, without suffering any losses.

​

By 26 January, the siege of Mære was progressing quickly. The larger Huscarl and levy army under Sölvi was sent south to reduce Raumariki, the next most prosperous county in mainland Noregr. The smaller levy army had newly arrived in Medelpad and began heading towards Jamtaland, as planned.

​

In the Lowlands, a small Norwegian levy was camped north of Breda and the Klevian Revolt troops had been sighted again, but there was still no confirmation of the Olafr’s main army was. Perhaps they had begun to head back to their homeland?

​

It was early days yet in the Claim War for Naumadal, but things were now flowing in Eilif’s favour. No more vassals had joined Olafr’s cause since 26 October.

​

While this new war had been unfolding, two pacts had – to no-one’s surprise – begun forming to oppose Eilif and his perceived ambitions.

​

The first was a pact of Christian countries – both Catholic and Orthodox – which commenced on 1 October 902 and was still attracting new members by 24 January.

​

The second was a Pagan Pact (Eilif’s own religious group) than began on 25 October and now had eight participants, with members from the Suomi, Slavic and Germanic religions.

​

Some pact members were very small, even single-county realms, but others were quite sizeable.

​

Spoiler: Ch80 Q2: Pacts

Ch80 Q2: Pacts. Some comments during the Þing have seemed to suggest that the pacts are ‘by religion’, but these are clearly organised in religion groups. So, both Catholics and Orthodox members would presumably join after an attack on any Christian member. But with the Pagan pact (given it is Eilif’s group), would they also all join together if any one of them was attacked? Or is that overridden in this case by the ‘own religious group’ (75% threat description) criterion? My specific question is the meaning/operation of ‘band together’ in that context. Does that mean just the various pacts banding together (ie Pagans coming to the aid of Christians in this case), or does it also mean at that threshold your own religious group will defend each other, but not before? My current working assumption is that if I attack any member of the Pagan pact (not that I intend to any time soon), then all the others in that pact would assist them, regardless of the overall threat level or if they are from a different religion in that group.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

Questions

Ch80 Q1: The Bloody Bishop. Any crafty ideas out there? Or must I grin and bear his presence for now?

Ch80 Q2: Pacts. Some comments during the Þing have seemed to suggest that the pacts are ‘by religion’, but these are clearly organised in religion groups. So, both Catholics and Orthodox members would presumably join after an attack on any Christian member. But with the Pagan pact (given it is Eilif’s group), would they also all join together if any one of them was attacked? Or is that overridden in this case by the ‘own religious group’ (75% threat description) criterion? My specific question is the meaning/operation of ‘band together’ in that context. Does that mean just the various pacts banding together (ie Pagans coming to the aid of Christians in this case), or does it also mean at that threshold your own religious group will defend each other, but not before? My current working assumption is that if I attack any member of the Pagan pact (not that I intend to any time soon), then all the others in that pact would assist them, regardless of the overall threat level or if they are from a different religion in that group.

ᚔ ᚱᚢᚱᛁᚲᛁᛞ ᚔ​

It is time for more blood and battle – but then again, when isn’t it?​

 

[TheButterflyComposer]

Ch80 Q1: The Bloody Bishop. Any crafty ideas out there? Or must I grin and bear his presence for now?

Murder him.

Ch80 Q2: Pacts. Some comments during the Þing have seemed to suggest that the pacts are ‘by religion’, but these are clearly organised in religion groups

This is true but honestly slipped my mind because it's rare to have a realm large enough to have borders with both catholics and orthodox.

Does that mean just the various pacts banding together (ie Pagans coming to the aid of Christians in this case), or does it also mean at that threshold your own religious group will defend each other, but not before? My current working assumption is that if I attack any member of the Pagan pact (not that I intend to any time soon), then all the others in that pact would assist them, regardless of the overall threat level or if they are from a different religion in that group.

If they are in the pact, they will have to fight you. Regardless of threat. Rulers will slowly drop out as threat lowers. If they are not in the pact when war is declared, they will not fight, umless they have a claim/excuse as per usual.

Thus, very easy to be swanped because if all your neighbours are in one pact, they will all go to war together. Pacts are seperate entities though so you only need concern yourself with one at a time...until you go over the threshold and every single pact will defend each other as well as themsevles. And as pacts grow when threat is high, being at this level means most rulers will be in pacts against you.

 

[diskoerekto]

Burning threat with chancellor is usually a waste. Threat only counts for offensive wars you start, and thus you can simply spend the time building a ton of claims instead, waiting for the threat to die down a touch (build up a war chest too) and then declare them all one after the other. Sure it's a bit cheesy/games but the only way to get threat that high to begin with is either seriously abusing the holy war mechanic or being the mongols or something.

Offering vassalage only works if you are the rightful liege lord, obscenely powerful compared to the vassal and usually, the same culture and religion. So Norse, pagan and Scandinavian emperor will help, but not in Russia, and vice versa. Even then, dukes tend not to bow if they have a chance of surviving a war with you I.e. You can't possibly annex their whole territory in one war etc will make them bold.

Succession crisis is going to be a worry, especially with gavekind and similar systems, but the only reason to play as a unreformed tribal pagan and stay that way is because of these mechanics. Feudal Christendom is so stable in contrast you often have to go out of your way to cause succession problems.

Again I agree with the general outline but there are a few points I'd like to make, threat would go up anyway if you use the tribal county conquest or press your fabricated claims so if you're not short on wars to declare burning threat would be useful a lot of the time.

Re: vassalage, this is another angle which makes going for the Empire of Rus more logical. The heathen provinces can be taken by force in this empire while once we have the empire title fellow norse dukes can peacefully join us as long as we have a big army to wave at them.

And another ‘straw poll’ of the Council found only the now fiercely loyal Chancellor would support any change to royal laws to increase tribal organisation or introduce a religious control mandate.

Seems like we'll have to stuff the council with more yesmen

The Council was as a group fairly loyal and now nicely balanced between pragmatists and glory-seekers, but to get any laws changed it seemed Eilif would need two more fully loyal councillors (or perhaps to buy favours, which could not yet really be afforded).

Spymaster seems a little weak as well, maybe can be replaced by a fully loyal and more competent one?

“I will not suffer this weakling to defile holy Mære by his presence any longer. It will be war!”

North Sea here we come!

“He is Eirikr’s vassal, so you are unable to remove him yourself. Imprisoning him without legal cause would not take his title from him anyway and would see you branded a tyrant. You could seek to have him killed, though there is no guarantee Eirikr would not appoint another Christian to control the temple.”

This Eirikr guy is either really misguided or a major traitor. About the bloody bishop, it's interesting that the take concubine option is not greyed out. Does the game really let us take landed male clerics as concubines?

In irritating news, Nikita of Tver, despite his status as a commander, decided to join the independence faction. Maybe he’ll be killed in battle and good riddance, thought Eilif to himself. But he said nothing publicly and just ground his teeth, hoping the faction would come to nothing.

Can't we meddle in the education of our vassals' children? Maybe we can focus their education in faith so they become good Norse stock.

While this new war had been unfolding, two pacts had – to no-one’s surprise – begun forming to oppose Eilif and his perceived ambitions.

Seems I was wrong about each Pagan religion having their own pacts :/

Ch80 Q2: Pacts. Some comments during the Þing have seemed to suggest that the pacts are ‘by religion’, but these are clearly organised in religion groups. So, both Catholics and Orthodox members would presumably join after an attack on any Christian member. But with the Pagan pact (given it is Eilif’s group), would they also all join together if any one of them was attacked? Or is that overridden in this case by the ‘own religious group’ (75% threat description) criterion? My specific question is the meaning/operation of ‘band together’ in that context. Does that mean just the various pacts banding together (ie Pagans coming to the aid of Christians in this case), or does it also mean at that threshold your own religious group will defend each other, but not before? My current working assumption is that if I attack any member of the Pagan pact (not that I intend to any time soon), then all the others in that pact would assist them, regardless of the overall threat level or if they are from a different religion in that group.

Pagans wouldn't come to the help of the Christians or vice versa unless we're over 75% or at least that's my understanding. I think your current working assumption is correct.
There are still many neighbors not part of any pacts that we can directly attack after Naumadal

Thanks for an action packed episode, the characters and the events were missed as were you

 

[TheButterflyComposer]

I would agree with going after rus first. Not only for nicer borders and the reasons above but because it provides a better buffer against attacks from nomads in the east, and also keeps the realm together regardless of gavelkind

 

[diskoerekto]

Murder him.

I'd also think just by virtue of having a lot of Norse realms in diplomatic range, his liege has a good chance of replacing him with a Norse cleric once he's assasinated. I'm not sure though how he selected this one in the first place.