- 1
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
You don't need focus trees or missions for that, you just need a better decision UI.
That said, I would like a better railway system that's detached from local infrastructure. Actual rail lines that fuel industry and mobility and can be targeted by armies, can be publicly and privately owned, turn a profit and fail, instead of just an incremental provincial modifier that's tied to the terrain (in ways that often don't make sense - for example, if the very populous capital province of a state has a mountain for its terrain it's going to have worse railways than an underpopulated woodland).
- 1
Obviously the game will have a lot of hate on release on these forums (or likely even sooner - when we see the dev diaries). Its just too overhyped not to be hated no matter how good and faithful to the vision of Victoria 2 it is. I don't doubt people will criticise it and cry about oversimplification - even if that is objectively false. If its Vicky 2 copied and pasted with QOL improvements, better tooltips and no bugs people will still shout its a simplified map painter compared to the Glorious Victoria 2.
I just hope there is no obvious mana system like I:R on release - not because I hate the idea of it(since I think mana if implemented well could be a good abstraction) but because the whole forum will be on flames if its in. Even though Vicky 2 arguably had some forms of mana.
I just hope there is no obvious mana system like I:R on release - not because I hate the idea of it(since I think mana if implemented well could be a good abstraction) but because the whole forum will be on flames if its in. Even though Vicky 2 arguably had some forms of mana.
- 8
Yes, diplomacy was blatantly handled through mana but few at the time minded because it was intuitive, wasn't based on rng, and it didn't totally subsume gameplay, unlike in EU4 which is what caused most of the animus towards it as a mechanic.
- 2
there are more reasons for the focus trees, like the ideological changes.
for example: to make sense on a civil war, in victoria 2 was needed a lot of coding with events/decisions.
In Hoi4 it was simplified, because those trees. It was easier to choose to support protectionism or free trade.
- 1
- 1
Are you legitimately asking for the politics in v3 to be simplified to the level of HOI4 focus trees....if you want the game to be HOI4 in the victorian era, just go and play one of those terrible mods that do that, don't ruin a stablished franchise and one of the most important mechanics in it.
- 6
Politics in the focus trees is jonestly the reason why the focus trees have become such monsters. Every country cab go every ideology and memey formables have to come along with it. The focus trees are indeed a decent tool for national devellopment, building up your army and economy, but politics and especially diplomacy should be seperated from it by a combination of the Great Wall of China and the Korean DMZ. Not to mention that for a game supposedly about ww2 most of the content in the focus trees has nothing to do with actual WW2
- 4
- 1
Civil Wars and revolutions shouldn't be popping up left and right in Vicky 2, they already frankly occur too easily as it is. Vicky 2 is already capable of simulating politics and ideology much more effectively than HOI4, we don't need to drag it down to its level.
- 6
the one saying that is you.
the core of politics are the pops. They are the agents defining the politics of any nation in victoria 2. Pops have consciousness and more variables.
You must check the code of the murican civil war. It is a lot of events, and decisions tangled that can be handled by focus trees with a lot more of sense.
- 1
You literally said that you wanted politics to be handled by focus trees like in HOI4, that's the opposite of what you are saying now.
- 3
I know who he is talking about, I was just referring in jest the person who was responsible for the start of the decline of EU4.
- 1
- 1
nope, I'm saying that is better to use focuss trees over the spam of events/decisions with a bazilliion of trigger flags that is never intuitive.
the core of politics are the pops. complex pops. Never the spam of events that many mods use,
Except, focus trees are not flexible, events are, and MTTH and such is a lot less frustrating in a immediate sense than a focus which you get kicked out of because the conditions don't apply anymore or less gamey that a focus who's conditions you fufill for only 1 day
- 2
- 1
I have never seen that problem of a focus that can't be completed because the conditions are obsolete. It must be a very bad modder coding it to that happen. that is the reason for the bypass conditions.
MTTH for a few events is ok. MTTH for everything triggering a decision you didn't expect has nothing of deterministic.
The problem with focus trees for representing political and economic events in Vicky 3 is that they are completely redundant with existing systems. Everything that could be handled by a focus tree can already be handled by decisions - those things that every Paradox game had up until HOI4 got rid of them on release, and then added them back in with WtT because focus trees just weren't cutting it. If a focus tree-like system absolutely has to be included, then it needs to be like EU4's or Imperator's missions; something to incentivize the player and AI to expand and sphere along historical trends and ambitions in a way that is transparent, and not as a 'click now to start revolution after x days' mechanic. But for now all that's really needed is just a better UI for decisions and event trees to explain how to trigger them. Hell, even reuse the disaster mechanic from EU4 if you're that desperate, because God knows EU4 hasn't used it.
The other matter is that Vicky's timeframe is much longer than HOI4's - HOI4 covers less than a decade, and only has focuses to meaningfully cover half of it. Because of that focus trees tend to go wide and encourage different playstyles as the same nation to keep the game fresh. But, for example, why would France not expand into Senegal regardless of whether or not the Orleanistes, Bonapartistes, Legitimistes, Republicans or Communards are in charge?
- 3
My point was that it still loops back to the other fellow since he was the one who put Jake in charge to begin with. Nevermind the decision to use mana for most basic functions.
- 2
I will actually dissent on this, I do think MTTH for most important events is bad. Since the ACW is already mentioned, I can't say how many times I've just stuck around years waiting for it to happen despite having more than enough pop consciousness and republicans in the upper house, and it ends up looping around to being more gamey than a click-to-trigger mechanic would because of that.
- 5
But it has more sense with the focus trees.
I have like 100 events and 25 decisions in my mod Colombia of Victoria2. an spamfest with triggerflags that always have to triple check.
With a focus tree it would need no more of 30 focus, 10 MTTH events and 5 decisions to implement the same results.
It is even better for new players because they can check what techs to prioritize.
Fair, something like a HoI4 timed mission/decision could work better in this case
Again, a better decision UI would fix that, we don't need to dumb down a core mechanic because something is overly convoluted.