Perhaps you can plop one exactly over the other one, with anarchy and find it?
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Patch Notes 1.1.5f1 aka Economy 2.0 was Posted on Mon, June 24, 2024,
which was released 60 days after Thu, April 25, 2024 when Patch Notes 1.1.2f1 were released.
The economy patch was huge imo, (not perfect obviously)
So I'm counting on something huge'er this monday.
which was released 60 days after Thu, April 25, 2024 when Patch Notes 1.1.2f1 were released.
The economy patch was huge imo, (not perfect obviously)
So I'm counting on something huge'er this monday.
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Not exactly. They have given us a release window (Q2). That’s as much a goal as it is a promise for them. I have no doubt they would like to ship it. But wanting to, and being able to are two different things. And I’m sure there are trade offs involved.
The third option is:
Even though we plan to release Ports and Bridges, and will do so if it’s possible, significant uncertainties remain. In short, we plan to, we hope to, but it is possible that it may be delayed. If we choose to delay it, we will let the community know after we reach a definite consensus.
Let’s assume and accept that PDX can’t refund players for UE for reason they’ve stated.
Let’s further assume that releasing Ports and Bridges, given the current build of the game, would cause significant stability issues and create 2x the work for developers once they resolve Issue A. The current estimation for Issue A is 3 months. It would take 3 months to implement Ports. And another 3 months to modify Ports post Issue A resolution. 9 months all in.
Alternatively, you can provide the developers more time to resolve Issue A (3 months), delay the content to avoid doing the same work twice. Ports takes another 3 months to develop and complete and doesn’t cause all sorts of issues. And overall you’ve gained back 3 months of time for the development team.
What would you do? Or do you simply think they’re not releasing the Content to stick it to us?
Of course this is a hypothetical example, but these are the trade offs I imagine they’re considering.
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They absolutely can, though. Numerous devs and publishers have offered refunds, even partial refunds, via Steam. Pharaoh Total War did it! They've chosen not to because they want to keep our money. That's fine, but it also means our expectations are significantly higher since they've consistently said no to refunds.
Well Ports and Bridges was originally due in Q2 2024, so they've had more than 9 months at this point and still nothing to show for it.
I think they've having significant issues making a fun, functional citybuilder that meets the marketing we got. They refused the easy route of refunding us, which would have made so many of the dissenters happy to go away until it's fixed, so now they're stuck with an unhappy community that gets so little communication we can't even tell what bugs are being worked on.
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Why do people want more content before everything that is out yet is fully fixed is beyond me
There were 8 region packs recently (with 3 broken packs) and there will be new content next week again for ultimate edition owners that will probably introduce a bunch of new bugs and issues in the patch we get. Yet some of you want a whole new DLC in a game that has still shaky foundations asap.
The right priority should be:
- fix the base game
- fix the region packs
- wait and see if everything is fixed, if not do weekly hotfixes until all major things are fixed
- release content creator packs + radio stations
- do a City Skylines 2 reloaded patch with bikes/grass/animations/working snow layers/...
- release asset editor
Then start developing DLC.
There were 8 region packs recently (with 3 broken packs) and there will be new content next week again for ultimate edition owners that will probably introduce a bunch of new bugs and issues in the patch we get. Yet some of you want a whole new DLC in a game that has still shaky foundations asap.
The right priority should be:
- fix the base game
- fix the region packs
- wait and see if everything is fixed, if not do weekly hotfixes until all major things are fixed
- release content creator packs + radio stations
- do a City Skylines 2 reloaded patch with bikes/grass/animations/working snow layers/...
- release asset editor
Then start developing DLC.
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Seems we're back to square one, as if my post wasn't clear. A delivery date can't be a goal or a promise, it's a contract. It's so obvious for anybody who once pre-paid something I don't understand your point.
* If you're not sure when your product will be shipped/delivered, then wait until you are before selling it.
* If you don't want to wait because you're not a responsible company and then you fail to deliver at the date you communicated to your customers, then tell them they can be refunded if they wish.
* If you don't deliver your product and don't offer a refund to your customers, then you're breaking the law.
There's no interpretation or psychology, there, just plain facts obvious to everyone. Please don't tell me you don't care if a pair of shoes you paid on the internet is still undelivered after one full year, I wouldn't believe you.
Let's not assume and even less accept it because it's untrue. A boatload of base games can be upgraded to special editions and the contrary is also true. All the UE buyers could be downgraded to a base game and be refunded the difference. Or being refunded for the whole UE and told by PDX to buy the base game instead (but that would have been even worse for PDX as a lot of people would have kept their money and wait for the base game to be complete and fixed, which it's still not today).
What I would do is what nearly every game publisher does, only sell the finished or nearly-finished product (unless it's badged EA, of course). I just looked at the top 10 New & Trending and top 10 Top Sellers categories on Steam. None of these 19 games (one is in both categories) is selling future content. None.
PDX choose to do so in oct 2023, while knowing the base game they were releasing was still in a terrible state. Then it went downhill until the No Beach For You DLC which prompted the "way forward" communication (not only the DLC was rated a unheard of 4% rating but the base game was at the time around 30%). But nothing changed about their politics of taking the money first then delaying the delivery.
We're in march 2025 and when asked about Bridges & Ports, the most waited DLC (an expansion with new mechanics, not just another radio or CCP) one full year late, the official answer isn't: "it'll be released in the next quarter as you've been told, don't worry" but:
Then when asked to clarify what all this uncertainty means and if we should interpret it as the possibility of a 5th postponing, no answer.
PDX is a 2 billions $ multinational with a bunch of business lawyers. They know they're breaking the consumer laws. As for sticking it to us, I'll let you draw your conclusions yourself.
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Trying to compare the gameplay of these two games is not only impossible, it's off subject. This isn't about you and your opinion on NMS, friend. We're discussing how the two companies have had drastically difference takes on how to handle a poorly released game and the backlash that comes with it. The poor release and the backlash aren't up for debate.
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I would like to remind you once again that the contents of the region packs are created by modders (to whom we owe many thanks and compliments for having provided at least a little variety to an original game that was very lacking)...Evidently people want new contents and fixs from the developers of CO, new contents and fixs that address the countless gaps present in the base game?
I would also like to remind you that of these new contents and fixs from CO in 1 year and a half we have had absolutely nothing, almost 0 absolute...and I add that in a normal world, if we had already had the assets editor, I suppose that almost all these gaps coming from CO would have been filled and fixed by the fantastic modders, something that already happened in the past with CS1.
This is what people want, very simple.
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You didn’t engage in the hypothetical. You suggested they build a Time Machine. You want them to alter decisions that have already been made. And they can’t. I’m asking you, given the set of assumptions I laid out, what would you do?
And to be clear, I completely acknowledge that it may be well within their abilities to issue partial refunds. That being said, there are constraints and consequences in doing so. I’m guessing they don’t want to go down that path. And if I’m right about what that entails, I don’t want them to do that either.
It’s hard to make decisions when you have constraints isn’t it?
In any case, I’m off to build my city and I’m eager to plop new buildings next week when I’m able to play again. I hope you do the same.
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Happy 10th Anniversary to Cities: Skylines. I have been thinking about what this series has meant to me over the years since I began playing it. It has been a strange journey to say the least.
I won't go into detail on how I discovered the game, and then I stopped playing, only to pick it up years later. I will mention that a lot of enjoyment of this series comes from interacting with content creators on Youtube. I found immense inspiration from these people, and I enjoyed being a part of a massive city build. That city was Orchid Bay and that lasted 18 months. So I'll make it short and say I really had a lot of fun.
One thing I did not count on was how the serries changed how I viewed the world. I have lived in my community for 5 decades. So I have seen lots of change. I got to view the history of my community and city through the lens of a city builder player. I still remember hiking up a large hill, and at the top I spent a good 30 minutes studying the road infrasctrucure that I saw, wondering how I could implement the designs into a city I was working on. I remember driving with a relative and becoming excited because we had a chance to drive over a newly made interchange. I get the impression that this is something that the developers of this game have felt at one time or another.
So I can say that playing this series (2500 hours sunk into both games) has made a large impact on my life as it is now. It certainly allowed me to develop new interests and has given me an appreciation of my daily walks where I get a lot of inspiration for new builds. I wanted to say what this game you have created has meant to me over the years. So thank you for giving me a lot of hours of enjoyment. 10 years is a major accomplishment from the little company that could, and did create a lot of enjoyment for me and a lot of other people.
I won't go into detail on how I discovered the game, and then I stopped playing, only to pick it up years later. I will mention that a lot of enjoyment of this series comes from interacting with content creators on Youtube. I found immense inspiration from these people, and I enjoyed being a part of a massive city build. That city was Orchid Bay and that lasted 18 months. So I'll make it short and say I really had a lot of fun.
One thing I did not count on was how the serries changed how I viewed the world. I have lived in my community for 5 decades. So I have seen lots of change. I got to view the history of my community and city through the lens of a city builder player. I still remember hiking up a large hill, and at the top I spent a good 30 minutes studying the road infrasctrucure that I saw, wondering how I could implement the designs into a city I was working on. I remember driving with a relative and becoming excited because we had a chance to drive over a newly made interchange. I get the impression that this is something that the developers of this game have felt at one time or another.
So I can say that playing this series (2500 hours sunk into both games) has made a large impact on my life as it is now. It certainly allowed me to develop new interests and has given me an appreciation of my daily walks where I get a lot of inspiration for new builds. I wanted to say what this game you have created has meant to me over the years. So thank you for giving me a lot of hours of enjoyment. 10 years is a major accomplishment from the little company that could, and did create a lot of enjoyment for me and a lot of other people.
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Honestly, as a consumer, I don't really care. They're not doing this for charity, after hours, they're just selling it at full price as a full-fledged product. They consciously announce more DLCs and it's their damned duty to keep their agreements.
One or two delays are understandable, but in the case of CS2, delays apply to literally everything.
Their behavior shows that apart from business, nothing unites us, so let's finally start treating them the same. And what if keeping the agreement means they have twice as much work? Well, that's their mistake and their problem. Pacta sunt servanda.
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Your assumptions are false so your question doesn't make any sense. They had numerous opportunities since oct 2023 to refund their customers and each time they choose the postponing road without a refund. Not only that but they could at any time decide " OK, we won't refund the UE buyers, too bad for them but we feel entitled to their money. But as we have no idea if this situation won't repeat itself, we'll stop selling the UE as we're already breaking the law". Did they Q1 2024? Q2 2024? Q3 2024? Q4 2024? Q1 2025? No, they did the contrary: they added a pass to sell their still non-existent content to the base game owners.
Of course not, the money's too good. That's the only constraint they cared about with this whole mess of future content not delivered: to make money. The law wasn't a constraint as they choosed to ignore it. The consequences we know about: a whole customer base disgusted by their commercial politics.
In the real world, you mean? Not the hypothetical one where you insist to place the debate? Oh I know about constraints, I ran a shop for 15 years. Never accepted money for anything I wasn't sure I could deliver in time. And when I happened to be wrong about the delivery (yes, it may happen as I was only the seller, an intermediary) the refund was automatic. Money was sometimes scarce the first years but hey! You want to build trust and a profitable business, small or big, you have to respect both the law and your customers, right?
No I won't because I'm still waiting for the game to be fixed and completed. I can't enjoy CS II in its current state.
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Damn! It's the right quote but the wrong poster.U quoted the wrong person.
I think I did a multi-quote because I wanted to reply to you as well, then I deleted some quotes. Sorry.- 1
LOL the one time they actually communicate with their audience and they decide, after the fact, that they don't wanna.In other news: they unlisted their anniversary live stream on YouTube
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You need to remove the Generative AI promotional imagery. I am so incredibly disappointed. People like REV0 and bsquiglehausen and other content creators you work with are posting about how disgusting this is. Youre turning your back on prominent community members that have been incredibly patient with this game and that you have brought on to create art only to spit in their face with this. Downright insulting.
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I'm curious about this. I don't follow these creators so I have no idea there was an issue. Got any links?
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Unfortunately pdx forums wont let me post the message with the links included. They both posted about it on bluesky though. For a bit more info on those creators though, bquiglehausen worked on the USA NE and SW packs, and REV0 worked on the french pack. So neither are directly associated with these new creator pack dlcs, but have very recently worked with cities skylines on the region packs