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Don_Quigleone

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Jan 19, 2007
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Yeah I'm setting up a LAN Hoi2 DD game of about 6 or so players, and I was wondering what I should look out for with regards to house rules, exploits and which nations to have players play (for instance is it a good idea to have someone play france?) and also what to do if a players nation get's eliminated, I'd like to have them play as a puppet (if they want) but I'm not sure if it's possible, if it isn't is there a relevant mod? Also are there mods more suited to multiplayer play? I have read all the stickied threads so I know what's said there, I'm just looking to see if anyone has more indepth suggestions.
 
You don't need a mod. Arm 1.2 is good enough. For house rules, check the aussie rule set, or the modified ruleset we are working on over at lord ederons forums.

Diplomacy and war entry guidelines

1. No major or minor war until Munich I (Sudetenland Krise), unless by event

2. No one may ally anybody until Munich I (Sudetenland Krise), unless by event

3. War entry guidelines:
3.1 Germany and Allies
- Germany may dow the Allies, when x = true:
- After Munich I (Sudetenland)

- Allies may dow the Axis (Germany), when x = true:
- by "Danzig or War"-time
- Germany attacks Mediums/Majors (BeNeLux, Denmark, Sweden, Norway,
Finland, Czechoslovakia, Poland,
Balkans, GOIed nations) -> immideately

3.2 Germany and USSR
- Germany may dow USSR, when x = true:
- whatever is decided at MR or custom NAP, earliest April 1, 1940.
- April 1, 1940 is a free for all for both parties. NAP may be extended.

- USSR may dow Germany, when x = true:
- whatever is decided at MR or custom NAP, earliest April 1, 1940, if not:
- Germany allies Poland -> immediately
- April 1, 1940 is a free for all for both parties. NAP may be extended.
- Germany allies/attacks Baltic Nations -> immediately

3.3 Japan and Allies
- Japan may dow the Allies, when x = true:
- No war in Europe by 1939 -> 1.1.1940
- War in Europe before 1939 -> 1.1.1939
- if Human Allies ignite war if Germany
attacks non-GOIed nation -> 3 months later

- Allies may dow Japan, when x = true:
- When Japan goes historical and then no longer advances -> 1.1.1942
- When Japan attacks Dutch East Indies and gets dowed by AI
discuss, please
- When Japan is at war with USA -> immideately

3.4 Japan and USSR
- Japan may dow USSR, when x = true:
- Chasan Lake/Chengfukeng Incident
- Base entry -> 1.1.1943
- Russia tears apart Germany, i.e. Berlin is held and 2 nearby provs taken
for 1 week.

- USSR may dow Japan, when x = true:
- Base entry -> 1.1.1943
- Japan occupies parts of continental USA/Canada for 3 months (not Alaska)

3.5 Japan/Axis and USA
- Japan may dow USA, when x = true:
- Base entry 1.1.1940

- USA may dow Japan/Axis, when x = true:
- Base entry 1.1.1942
- join 6 months LATER, when x = true:
- Sweden, Turkey, Spain, Norway, Brazil, Argentina, India
Netherlands, Persia, Tibet, Afghanistan are ALLIED
- join 6 months EARLIER, when x = true:
- Sweden, Turkey, Spain, Norway, Brazil, Argentina, India
Netherlands, Persia, Tibet, Afghanistan are AXIS/ATTACKED
- Germany holds 3 provinces of UK main isle for 1 week -> immideately

3.6 Italy and Allies
- Italy may dow Allies/Join Axis, when x = true:
- Munich I join Axis, only if attacked
- Paris is captured, 2 surrounding provinces held -> immideately
- when it is March 1, 1940

- Allies may dow Italy, when X = true:
- Italy decides to dow Balkan nations (everything south of Czech + Poland)
- Italy decides to "advocate the right result" in Spain by either allying
Nat.Spain or dowing Rep.Spain, before or after Nat.Spain loss.
- Base war entry March 1, 1940.

Miscellaneous

4. Miscellaneous War guidelines:
4.1 Commonwealth troops are not allowed in the Med theatre until at war and must remain
in their respective home territories (No troops at the front until 1 month after dow)
In order not to have them on the ships ready to disembark once Italy dows

4.2 Japan and Russia must guard their respective borders with at least 1 unit of any type

4.3 No SRing away from the frontline, unless neighbouring provinces are empty or enemy
is retreating.
Also no SRing of units being bombed, unless bombing ceased for 24h.
SRing out of closing pockets only allowed when the above is true.

4.4 Units may not be disbanded when about to be encircled/are encircled.

4.5 Air Units must be allowed to leave airports about to be taken.


5. Unit trading guidelines / unit supply guidelines:
5.1. Limited unit trading while at peace/not allied, per country:
- 25 land units
- 25 air units (starting airforce)
- 20 ships (Maximum of 5 Capitals)

5.2 Unlimited unit trading when both parties are at war.

5.3 No units of France being traded away until June 1, 1941.

5.4 Units may not be based in foreign country's territory, port or airport while at peace.


6. General Trading:
6.1 Allies/Comintern may not trade for rares until February 1, 1936, they may however accept any
deals proposed by AI

6.2 Axis/future Axis countries may trade for rares starting with January 5, 1936.

6.3 USA may trade supplies/whatever with allies at a rate of x:
- date + no war < September 1, 1939 -> 100%
- date + war < September 1, 1939 -> 50%
- date > September 1, 1939 -> 50%
- alliance -> 0% (FFA)

6.4 Province trading in order to avoid annexation is not allowed

6.5 All other Province trading is allowed, except...

6.6 ...to abuse it, by preventing gearing (greenland, north africa, etc.)


7. Exploits/abusing the game engine:
7.1 No trade exploits

7.2 No supply exploits
- includes the points made in 5.3
- and when surrounding a capital cuts off supplies, then all efforts must be made
to annihilate the pocket.

7.3 No exploitation of spy engine against humans and AI, allowed is:
- Against humans:
- spying
- stealing techs
- killing ministers/leaders at war

- Against AI:
- spying
- stealing techs
- killing ministers/leaders at war
- couping

7.4 No units of France being traded away until June 1, 1941.

8. Other:
8.1 Military access is not allowed.

8.2 No GoIs.

9. Up to further discussion:
9.1 Airbase rule:
- Airbases may only be built by the province selection screen/menu (i.e.: rightclick on province, build airfield). This way,
once the repective province is caught, the airfield goes over to the new owner and can be completed.
 
Don_Quigleone said:
Yeah I'm setting up a LAN Hoi2 DD game of about 6 or so players, and I was wondering what I should look out for with regards to house rules, exploits and which nations to have players play (for instance is it a good idea to have someone play france?) and also what to do if a players nation get's eliminated, I'd like to have them play as a puppet (if they want) but I'm not sure if it's possible, if it isn't is there a relevant mod? Also are there mods more suited to multiplayer play? I have read all the stickied threads so I know what's said there, I'm just looking to see if anyone has more indepth suggestions.

Well, its true you don't need a mod, and in fact, I would probably avoid using a mod until you are familiar with why the mod exists and what problems the mod addresses. House rules are good, but if you are just starting out then likely other than a few basic rules you don't need a complex list. For my money the best starter rules set is Hiensen's rules which can be found also at Lord Ederon's.

Hiensen's Rules for the 36 Campaign

A lot depends on the number of players who are playing and what scenario you are playing.

But, the fact is that there are some serious game balance issues that come into play when you play the umodded game especially in the 1936 scenario, imo, when you are playing with experienced players. For example, it is very possible, in fact almost a dead certainty that experienced players playing UK and France at game start can defeat the Axis in 1939/1940 unless this is controlled by rules or modding. At the very least Allies can make the campaign for France and Poland so costly that there is no way Germany can defeat Russia.

The easiest way around this is not having human France at start. In a six player 36 GC game, this means that the 3rd allied player usually plays USA. All this does though, assuming adequate play by USSR, is end the game in 1941/42 when USA/UK combine for early D-day, while Barbarossa is still undecided. An experienced player can turn USA into a Juggernaught in the 36, and the Allies can ignore the Asian theater, and just invade France at the earliest possible opportunity in 41/42.

If you are intersted in a Mod, it is best to get an MP mod specifically. There is the MEM mod, and the EIR mod that I designed, both have 38 scenarios that take you right to war more or less immediatly, so if that is what you are looking for you could consider either. MEM is primarily a combat system modification, and is an excelent system overall, especially in this department. The EIR mod is designed primarily to address overall game balance issues through event modding, though there are some changes to the combat system overall. Latey we have been playing the 38 EIR mod with four players in a 2 v 2 and ending the scenario with the defeat of France. Basicly the victory condition is the Axis must hold onto Africa and defeat France by January 1941, to win.

But if you are just kicking the game around for the first time, probably the best thing to do is play the vanilla game with a simple rules set like Hiensen's rules, and see what happens. :)

If there are just two of you try the 1936, as Japan and China, with the rule being that Japan can not DOW China until the Marco Polo Bridge incident and can not ally Chinese minors. This is fairly balanced and a good MP experience. If China is not defeated by 1941 then China wins.
 
Last edited:
Don_Quigleone said:
Yeah I'm setting up a LAN Hoi2 DD game of about 6 or so players, and I was wondering what I should look out for with regards to house rules, exploits and which nations to have players play (for instance is it a good idea to have someone play france?) and also what to do if a players nation get's eliminated, I'd like to have them play as a puppet (if they want) but I'm not sure if it's possible, if it isn't is there a relevant mod? Also are there mods more suited to multiplayer play? I have read all the stickied threads so I know what's said there, I'm just looking to see if anyone has more indepth suggestions.

Honestly I think the best way to go about it is get a conversation started with the other players. First reliable players are good. Second talk with them and their experiences playing SP or MP. See what they like. As you can see on these boards everyone has a different idea. If you have differing views then someone has to compromise. Just try to make it fair. It just like playing politics man:)......Most people do play a france with that person switching to the US after Vichy though.

Good luck
 
Speaking of which, when are you going to get into a game Cyrprian?
 
son of liberty said:
You don't need a mod. Arm 1.2 is good enough.

(snip).... deletes HUGE LIST

I think that huge list of rules in itself proves the vanilla ARM1.2 is not good enough. Really paradox playtesting and balanceing was done in 1 way - handsoff AI v AI.. you cant balance a game that way.
 
Cueball said:
Speaking of which, when are you going to get into a game Cyrprian?


When you can spell my name right......lol just kidding Cue. Let me see what I can work up after 8 months my kid is finally starting to calm down, but its been a heck of a ride man and time is still tight. Might be able to set something up but my time would be very strict, so I wouldnt be able to extend and I still may have parenting duties during game time....Those are kinda my fears. I hate to have to leave a game and not be reliable:)
 
Well, you can can call me Cuebell or something in revenge. It would be great to have you on board even as minor or an alternate available sub. Most of the games I set up are fairly regular, one day a week for a minimum of 4 to 6 hours affairs, so they are fairly easy to schedule.

It would be great to have you on board for sure! I still remember that counter Invasion of Bilbao we almost pulled off in 1940 as Canada/UK.
 
Cueball said:
Well, you can can call me Cuebell or something in revenge. It would be great to have you on board even as minor or an alternate available sub. Most of the games I set up are fairly regular, one day a week for a minimum of 4 to 6 hours affairs, so they are fairly easy to schedule.

It would be great to have you on board for sure! I still remember that counter Invasion of Bilbao we almost pulled off in 1940 as Canada/UK.

Agreed, that was a nice try it was all we could do really....But about playing The most I would be able to do at a time is 4 hours and that would have to be at the right time that is why it has been so hard. But soon, I can see the light at the end of the tunnel and I have a friend or 2 who might play this summer as well....maybe a US fri. or sat night game 4 hours at a pop or something.
 
just let me know when is convenient for you.

Also we are doing these 2 v 2 playtests with the mod starting in 1938, and its a short game only lasts a couple of sessions, so if your limited in time we could do that. Its pretty fun and fast.