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Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Update: V1.200 "Tyrannosaurus"

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Age of Wonders: Planetfall 3784 Bug reports 1669 Suggestions 539 User Mods 95 AoW: Planetfall: News and Updates Archive 41 Multiplayer 55
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Hmmm... no arborian sentinels, no biomancers
no -2 resist by scan
no sleep
no +3 shields for bombardon
no -shield mod (T6 laser for aborian sentinels)

correct setup should include all of this

p.s. anyway 5 heroes vs 2 and "Ofc as attacker I use all my prepared strat ops right before attack and have structures strat buffs put on if there were"
 
ImWist said:
Hmmm... no arborian sentinels, no biomancers
no -2 resist by scan
no sleep
no +3 shields for bombardon
no -shield mod (T6 laser for aborian sentinels)

correct setup should include all of this

p.s. anyway 5 heroes vs 2 and "Ofc as attacker I use all my prepared strat ops right before attack and have structures strat buffs put on if there were"
Click to expand...

T6 laser mod will not be that handy against units with 6 thermal res. Also u have to hit first. And again 3 hexes range difference. Large target against flier. As for sleep, there is first op in psy branch.

The damage from both units will not be big in comparison to hp. But sentinels will have to spend a tirn just to move in range while being bombarded. And catatonic+slow can make them useless.

And if we speak of 3 shields per bombardon, there I dnt see enough place to get enough sentinels. And I guess there was scan on some hero. The reason why there was heroes difference is prosaic. Another stack could not arrive in time to face fliers.

Anyways u see flawless victory of t2 units against pretty strong and often considered super strong t3 units. In my opinion, it should tell something about those t2 units strength.

The thing is: you need many instruments to gain enough power to only TRY to challenge a thing that does not need that much to smash your head.
 
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Satonir said:
T6 laser mod will not be that handy against units with 6 thermal res. Also u have to hit first. And again 3 hexes range difference. Large target against flier. As for sleep, there is first op in psy branch
Click to expand...
Sentinel - support. His role: +shield for bombardon and -shield for next target, dps is secondary. In addition, you are diversifying the attribute of attack

Satonir said:
Anyways u see flawless victory of t2 units against t3 units. In my opinion, it should tell something about those t2 units strength
Click to expand...
You have 5 heroes and good setup
 
ImWist said:
Sentinel - support. His role: +shield for bombardon and -shield for next target, dps is secondary. In addition, you are diversifying the attribute of attack


You have 5 heroes and good setup
Click to expand...

Screenshot is Freezer's. It is he who spams engulfers. I am the one who constantly tried to counter that as we get matched often in rated games. At some moment we even played fun games to see if he founds a way to counter my engulfer spam, and he didn't. Here is his channel:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNFjcEDrsLpQzPho93v4L6M9xFIUSEdYi

So what do u want to say by all that? That the suggested strat has a chance? Or that sentinels and heroes would tirn the tides? They would not and It doesn't.
 
Out of curiosity, did you ever try Amazon Lightbringers? They would be able to punch right through the shields. Of course they'd need to actually get close in the first place :p

Anyways, just to confirm we have some fixes ready to go that we're testing and evaluating now.
 
Seems Wist already covered most of what I would have responded with.

Anyhow, those T3s were horribly modded. TNI is a shadow of its former self and gives Bombardon minimal benefits. For the price of that and the accuracy mod they could have had Grounding Harness and Bioregulator which would make them incredibly tanky, especially since we're talking about a pre-patch battle.
Considering the unit has a 9 range artillery attack every second turn that ignores unit and line of sight penalties, the additional evasion on the Engulfers and range would have considerably less impact.
As for the Bio and Arc status effects, good luck applying that on a T3 with 4+ resistance to that status.

Now, to move on to the counter in the current patch, Wist was right to note how devastating Shield Breaker Module would be here. Focus: Venom and Flames will help Engulfers out, but they last only 2 turns after which they'll have to reapply the buff by sticking close to a Hero, which will either waste their attack potential by have to move them or make them artillery targets if they just stay together all the time.
Additionally, Cerebral Strain only applies Catatonic to Psionic units.
 
Round_Dice said:
Considering the unit has a 9 range artillery attack every second turn that ignores unit and line of sight penalties, the additional evasion on the Engulfers and range would have considerably less impact.
Click to expand...

Do you know that bombardon artillery works only on ground?

Round_Dice said:
As for the Bio and Arc status effects, good luck applying that on a T3 with 4+ resistance to that status.
Click to expand...

For arc only +2.

Round_Dice said:
Shield Breaker Module would be here
Click to expand...

Shield breaker destroys the shield, engulfer moves back and forth and gains their +3 swarm shield again.
 
Tombles said:
Anyways, just to confirm we have some fixes ready to go that we're testing and evaluating now.
Click to expand...

If it's possible, can you rethink possible results of evolving of emergent? It can transform into engulfer on turn 4 which makes situation even worse.
unknown.png


Maybe it could transform into Hidden or ABYSSIAN (if you let it be modded, ofc) or even tiny chance for some t3?
 
Tombles said:
Out of curiosity, did you ever try Amazon Lightbringers? They would be able to punch right through the shields. Of course they'd need to actually get close in the first place :p

Anyways, just to confirm we have some fixes ready to go that we're testing and evaluating now.
Click to expand...

Guys who tried Amazon LB all concluded that they are very bad in everything. I tried to use Ramjets+siphoner devotion with armor bypass mod and defensive mods. Ramjets died like flies, 10 range of attack resulted in 3 killed prime rank Ramjets on the 1st GP tirn. Was a stack of engulfers+heroes against a stack of ramjets+heroes, eng with 1,5 stacks of syphoners, ramjets with a stack of syphoners and different dvar basic units.

I could not even do 2 strikes per tirn with remaining ramjets as 10 range is more then their max movement is.

Amazon lightbringers would not even have syphoners, so absolutely no chance to even get close.
 
Round_Dice said:
Seems Wist already covered most of what I would have responded with.

Anyhow, those T3s were horribly modded. TNI is a shadow of its former self and gives Bombardon minimal benefits. For the price of that and the accuracy mod they could have had Grounding Harness and Bioregulator which would make them incredibly tanky, especially since we're talking about a pre-patch battle.
Considering the unit has a 9 range artillery attack every second turn that ignores unit and line of sight penalties, the additional evasion on the Engulfers and range would have considerably less impact.
As for the Bio and Arc status effects, good luck applying that on a T3 with 4+ resistance to that status.

Now, to move on to the counter in the current patch, Wist was right to note how devastating Shield Breaker Module would be here. Focus: Venom and Flames will help Engulfers out, but they last only 2 turns after which they'll have to reapply the buff by sticking close to a Hero, which will either waste their attack potential by have to move them or make them artillery targets if they just stay together all the time.
Additionally, Cerebral Strain only applies Catatonic to Psionic units.
Click to expand...

Grounding harness does not apply to amphibious units. Bioregulator does not make you tanky against arc damage. Regen has nothing to do with focused attack.
Artilerry is ground only.

2 level 12 heroes refresh all psy buffs all the fight. 3 tirns is usually enough to kill 70% of enemy army. Staying on distance? No reason.

Shield destoying? Get a hit first. And is not it a thermal resistance check? Also all this shields are not innate, they all are from battle effects.

I repeat, bombardons had 5% chance to hit. Can't touch this!
 
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Zaskow said:
Shield breaker destroys the shield, engulfer moves back and forth and gains their +3 swarm shield again.
Click to expand...
You need to kill the unit in one turn. Use sniper hero with shield breaker, sentinel with shield breaker, scan, biochemical maceration etc
By the way there's an operation in biochemical which does aoe massive impact and destroys 2 armors

Satonir said:
So what do u want to say by all that?
Click to expand...
I don't think that engulfers are problem. I think that kir'ko 12-level perk is problem

actually i see few problems:
1. main attack borbadon
2. biomanser's scan
3. kir'ko 12-level perk
4. ignore armor by psionic attack with changed attribute (+ignore psi-def)
5. psi-fish t3 mod
 
Zaskow said:
Do you know that bombardon artillery works only on ground?
Click to expand...
Since when?
https://minionsart.github.io/aowp/Pages/Units/AmazonUnits.html
There is no "only affects Ground targets" text in Bio, you just have to choose whether to target air or ground units when attacking.
Also, the mod discussion was pertaining the prepatch battle.

As for Shield Breaker, as Wist said, you kill Engulfers in 1 turn. Focus: Flames will hinder you, but that -2 from Biomancer helps.
Point is Engulfers have a hard time killing you and you have a slightly easier time killing them since they can't remove your resistances or shields.

Why not just roll Sentinels with resistances and Network Links running an infinite regen loop? 70 HP (+Amazon Hero boosts) shield breakers with 5 shield, 4/3 resist that recover 8 HP + 33% HP per turn and are immune to status effects. Have a Hero in an Imperial APC if you worry about accuracy.
 
ImWist said:
You need to kill the unit in one turn. Use sniper hero with shield breaker, sentinel with shield breaker, scan, biochemical maceration etc
By the way there's an operation in biochemical which does aoe massive impact and destroys 2 armors


I don't think that engulfers are problem. I think that kir'ko 12-level perk is problem

actually i see few problems:
1. main attack borbadon
2. biomanser's scan
3. kir'ko 12-level perk
4. ignore armor by psionic attack with changed attribute (+ignore psi-def)
5. psi-fish t3 mod
Click to expand...

So we remove the 12 lvl perk as Zaskow suggested and everyone is happy?

Well, it ll kill about 60 percent of described OP-ness
 
Round_Dice said:
Since when?
https://minionsart.github.io/aowp/Pages/Units/AmazonUnits.html
There is no "only affects Ground targets" text in Bio, you just have to choose whether to target air or ground units when attacking.
Also, the mod discussion was pertaining the prepatch battle.

As for Shield Breaker, as Wist said, you kill Engulfers in 1 turn. Focus: Flames will hinder you, but that -2 from Biomancer helps.
Point is Engulfers have a hard time killing you and you have a slightly easier time killing them since they can't remove your resistances or shields.

Why not just roll Sentinels with resistances and Network Links running an infinite regen loop? 70 HP (+Amazon Hero boosts) shield breakers with 5 shield, 4/3 resist that recover 8 HP + 33% HP per turn and are immune to status effects. Have a Hero in an Imperial APC if you worry about accuracy.
Click to expand...

No matter what Tibbles wrote on his website, his Xenoplague units are not even animals.

To avoid you stacking all that dirt Kir'ko can just attack earlier. And even if u meet them with all that I doubt it will work.

I don't even want to ask if u Ever faced those things in Mp
 
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