BATTLETECH - Left and Right torso mixed up

[Albert99]

One line summary of your issue
Left and Right torso mixed up

What platform are you running the game on?

Steam

What operating system do you use?
Windows 7
Which version of the game are you running?
1.8.1-640R
What DLC do you have installed?
Flashpoint,
Urban Warfare,
Heavy Metal

Please explain your issue is in as much detail as possible.
First of all: I am a BT fan since > 20 years ... and I love the implementation of it... great job, great game, thank you.

I downloaded via Steam on recently and started right the away (campaign mode) and right away the following thing occurred to me: whenever you fire at a mech and hit it, the damage is going to the "wrong" side of the torso. It is particular obvious when doing aimed shots: you aim to the (lets say) left torso, 69% hit probability (doesn't matter which weapon time: laser, rockets, ballistic). Knowing it, you can of course consider and correct it for fights but its quite annoying and it tears my heart so see a hunchback as opponent with a A20 on his RIGHT shoulder and i can destroy it by firing at his LEFT torso ... this is true for any mech though.

The GUI shows the way you see a mech as if it is standing in front of you, FACING you (which is correct way of displaying it): the left shoulder of the opponent's mech is to the right side of your view (easily checked by hovering with the mouse over it) - so far so good. Now executing an aimed shot to that left shoulder ... damages the opponents RIGHT shoulder instead. Also the displayed hits etc is all on the wrong side of the opponents mech. Aiming at the legs or arms, this mixing of sides does NOT occur, just for the torsos.

So maybe the simply explanation is that all the left/right hitboxes of the torsos were switched by the programmer?
Have you tried verifying your files?
Yes

Steps to reproduce the issue
"works" with any mech you fire at

Attach DxDiag (PC), System Info log (Mac), or run sudo lshw -html > specs.html and uploaded specs.html (Linux)

Attach Output Log
Windows: \Users\YourUserName\AppData\LocalLow\Harebrained Schemes\BATTLETECH\output_log.txt
Mac OS: Users >{name} > Library > Logs > Unity > Player.log
Linux: ~/.config/unity3d/Harebrained Schemes/BATTLETECH/Player.log

If the game crashed, please attach the crash file with the time stamp closest to the crash.
Windows: [Steam library folder]\steamapps\common\BATTLETECH\DumpBox
For v.17 and beyond try here: C:\Users\[YourUserName]\AppData\LocalLow\Harebrained Schemes\BATTLETECH
OSX: Macintosh HD > Users > [username] > Library > Application Support > Steam > steamapps > common > BattleTech > DumpBox
Linux: [Steam library folder]/steamapps/common/BATTLETECH/DumpBox

If a save game was loaded at the start of the game session, upload it. Please make sure to upload the save game with the timestamp closest to when you loaded it.
Windows:
Steam: [Steam installation folder]\userdata[SteamID]\637090\remote\C0\SGS1
GOG: 'C:\Users\USER_ID\AppData\Local\GOG.com\Galaxy\Applications\50593543263669699\Storage\Shared\Files\C#\SGS#'
Vanilla:'C:\Users\USER_ID\AppData\LocalLow\Harebrained Schemes\BattleTech\C#\SGS#'
OSX:
Steam: Macintosh HD > Users > [username] > Library > Application Support > Steam > userdata > [SteamID] > 637090 > remote > C#> SGS#
GOG: Macintosh HD > Users > [username] > Library > Application Support > GOG.com > Galaxy > Applications > 50593543263669699 > Storage > Shared > Files > C# > SGS#
Vanilla: Macintosh HD > Users > [username]> Library > Application Support > unity.Harebrained Schemes.BattleTech > C# > SGG#
Linux:
Steam: /home/.steam/steam/userdata/[steamID]/637090/remote/C#/SGS#
GOG: /home/[username]/.config/unity3d/Harebrained Schemes/BATTLETECH/remote/C#/SGS#/
Vanilla: /home/[username]/.config/unity3d/Harebrained Schemes/BATTLETECH/remote/C#/SGS#/

Attach screenshot / video

 

[stjobe]

The damage doll at the bottom left is your 'Mech. The damage doll that pops up at the top of the screen is the enemy 'Mech - and that shows left torso on the right too, but it clearly says "Left Torso". In the case of the Hunchback, I've taken out way too many AC/20s from their right shoulders (displayed on the left side, as if it was facing you) to even consider this being a bug. It says "Right Shoulder", "AC/20" when you hover over the shoulder on the left side.

In short, I don't think this is a bug at all, but confusion as to what is shown in the GUI.

 

[Albert99]

hm. seriously? I mean the hunchback has the AC20 on his true right shoulder, which is shown to the left side of the doll saying "right shoulder" as you state - totally agree here. But when you (well: I) take a shoot on this left shoulder of the doll (saying right shoulder), the damage is attributed to the right side of the doll (saying left shoulder) when I check after shooting. Vice versa: if I shoot the should of the doll saying "left shoulder", I destroy the AC20 which should not be the case (as the AC20 is on his right shoulder, shown on the left side of the doll). So I really think its mixed up.

As mentioned, I play MW since decades, starting with table top, most recently MW online etc. so i am totally aware of the doll nature - dont think i am confusing anything here.

 

[stjobe]

hm. seriously? I mean the hunchback has the AC20 on his true right shoulder, which is shown to the left side of the doll saying "right shoulder" as you state - totally agree here. But when you (well: I) take a shoot on this left shoulder of the doll (saying right shoulder), the damage is attributed to the right side of the doll (saying left shoulder) when I check after shooting. Vice versa: if I shoot the should of the doll saying "left shoulder", I destroy the AC20 which should not be the case (as the AC20 is on his right shoulder, shown on the left side of the doll). So I really think its mixed up.

If that's happening to you, there's something wrong with your game; do you have any mods installed? Here's how my game behaves:

Paperdoll on top showing right torso on the left side of the doll:

Aimed shot paperdoll showing same as the top paperdoll:

Result of the aimed shot to the right torso (missed, but hit the right arm):

 

[Axterix13]

I've taken out a lot of left and right torsos as well, and, for me, it hits the side I'm aiming for.

One thing of note with the Hunchback: It's AC/20 ammo is in the left torso. So if you shoot the left torso and destroy it, it will indeed show the AC/20 as disabled, not because you destroyed it, but because it has no ammo. The ammo being there is why that is the side I target on the AC/20 HBs

 

[Albert99]

sorry for late reply after starting the discussion and thanks for your input (both of you). First off: I have no mod installed, i just bought the package inclduing heavy metal, urban warfare and flashpoint - all included and all installed in one go via Steam. Anyway, I have to find a way to provide some screenshots as stjobe die above (thanks) - hopefully within the next 12h. @Asterix13: yes, i also often aim at the place where the ammunition is as many times the aditional explosion causes more internal damage

 

[Albert99]

I tried reproducing it as I thought (and wrote) that I experienced this many times, not just with the Hunchback. However: I found it is not at all true for every mech. I have not encountered another Hunchback though (still running through campaign) but I have one example here though:

Marauder, RT before called shot: 60 armor

LT before short: 58 armor

called shot with 79% probability on RT

RT after shot: 56 armor (e.g. damage -2)

LT after shot: 27 armor (e.g. damage -31)

So it is not as crystal clear as I hoped for (as in the example of the hunchback I recall) but its quite evident.

Anyway, it is not as I believed in the beginning that this happens with every mechtype. So maybe it is just some, like Marauder and Hunchback? I have no explanation for it and it is more the MW-fan inside crying when I noticed it in game - the effect is not very severe as after a shot showing this behavior I can immedeately adopt and account for it. For critical situations though, hitting the wrong torso due to this might be quite annoying.

 

[Axterix13]

Most likely, it is just bad luck... some shots that didn't hit the targeted torso and hit the other side instead...

 

[stjobe]

Most likely, it is just bad luck... some shots that didn't hit the targeted torso and hit the other side instead...

This is the most likely explanation. 21% chance to NOT hit the RT they're aiming at, and they're firing LRMs which spread quite a bit from where they do hit.

Probably the initial hit was on the LT, and one missile splashed as far as the RT.

@Albert99, if you want to retry the experiment, use a single-hit weapon so there's no question on where the hit lands (i.e. fire a single weapon, doesn't matter much what it is as long as it's not missiles, MG, flamer, LBX, or snub PPC. Then we can tell exactly where the shot hits). You can do it in skirmish if you don't want to mess around with your career/campaign save.

Edit: A small not on how firing two LRM-15s work: There will be two initial to-hit rolls (one for each launcher), that determines where the missile cluster is centered. This hit is what has a 79% chance to hit the RT. After that initial hit, the rest of the missiles in the salvo will cluster around the impact point with their own to-hit roll (i.e. the hit location probabilities will be recalculated on the fly depending on where the initial hit is).

So say the initial to-hit roll came up left torso; the first missile will hit the LT, and the remaining 14 would all individually roll to see where they hit - left arm, left torso, center torso, right torso, right arm are all possible targets, even the legs. Just the head is protected, if the initial hit doesn't hit the head, no missiles from that salvo will hit the head.

In short, missiles are not the best weapon for precision shots