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Code: 
# Arab refugees from Byzantium

event = {
	id = 90079
	random = NO
	country = MAM
	name = "Turkish refugees from Rum"
	desc = "The cruel Christians of Rum (Byzantium) have expelled some of their Sunni Arabs!  They will contribute much to our nation, but perhaps they should be shown the true faith first."
	style = 2

	action_a = { #Accept them
		name = "Accept them as Sunnis"
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = relation which = BYZ value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -2 }
		command = { type = infra value = 1000 }
		command = { type = land value = 1000 }
		command = { type = treasury value = 1000 }
		command = { type = inflation value = -12 }
	}
}

# Arab refugees from Byzantium

event = {
	id = 90080
	random = NO
	country = QAR
	name = "Turkish refugees from Rum"
	desc = "The cruel Christians of Rum (Byzantium) have expelled some of their Sunni Arabs!  They will contribute much to our nation, but perhaps they should be shown the true faith first."
	style = 2

	action_a = { #Accept them
		name = "Accept them as Sunnis"
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = relation which = BYZ value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -4 }
		command = { type = infra value = 1000 }
		command = { type = land value = 1000 }
		command = { type = treasury value = 1000 }
		command = { type = inflation value = -12 }
	}
	action_b = { # Convert them
		name = "Accept them as Shi'ites"
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = relation which = BYZ value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -4 }
		command = { type = infra value = 1000 }
		command = { type = land value = 1000 }
		command = { type = treasury value = 1000 }
		command = { type = inflation value = -12 }
	}
}

# Arab refugees from Byzantium

event = {
	id = 90081
	random = NO
	country = AKK
	name = "Turkish refugees from Rum"
	desc = "The cruel Christians of Rum (Byzantium) have expelled some of their Sunni Arabs!  They will contribute much to our nation, but perhaps they should be shown the true faith first."
	style = 2

	action_a = { #Accept them
		name = "Accept them as Sunnis"
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = relation which = BYZ value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -4 }
		command = { type = infra value = 1000 }
		command = { type = land value = 1000 }
		command = { type = treasury value = 1000 }
		command = { type = inflation value = -12 }
	}
	action_b = { # Convert them
		name = "Accept them as Shi'ites"
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = population which = -1 value = 5000 }
		command = { type = revolt which = -1 }
		command = { type = relation which = BYZ value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -4 }
		command = { type = infra value = 1000 }
		command = { type = land value = 1000 }
		command = { type = treasury value = 1000 }
		command = { type = inflation value = -12 }
	}
}

Here are the refugee events for Re-settlements of the Holy Land and Egypt. Based on the existing ones, of course. Mamelukes no longer get to convert them to Shiite since they are Sunni and also suffer smaller stab hit.
 
Originally posted by Juis
So here's another event fro claiming some land. The core provincese are from here:
http://www.euratlas.com/big/big0600.htm
The Pope event is rather harsh on the Pope. Perhaps it should rather be vassalisation and force conversion than annexation. Then again, Byzantium was pretty much annexed in 1204. The capital really has to be moved since Byzantium needs it :)

Does that Not = { or = {}} in event 90077 thingy work that way?
Click to expand...
Depends on what 'that way' should be. Your current trigger mean that the event will only trigger is neither Byzantium nor the Papal states own Marche. I can't find any logic in that...

Another thing: Why do you bring up the fourth crusade in relation to the Pope this way? It's not like it was commanded (or even sanctioned) by the pope...
 
Originally posted by Havard
Depends on what 'that way' should be. Your current trigger mean that the event will only trigger is neither Byzantium nor the Papal states own Marche. I can't find any logic in that...

Another thing: Why do you bring up the fourth crusade in relation to the Pope this way? It's not like it was commanded (or even sanctioned) by the pope...
Click to expand...

Yes that is exactly how it is supposed to work. Byzantium will not get the option to let the Papal state remain if someone else owns Marche. (btw I've no other reason to move the Pope to Marche than that it's near and it's owned by Papal State at the beginning of the game.)

If you mean my comment at the end of the post, I mean that taking Rome from the Papal States would be like taking Constantinople from Byzantium in both cases effectively crumbling the government.

During the Latin Empire the Pope did try to crush the Orthodox faith. So I just figured that he would be someone the Byzantines would love to hate. (Didn't know that the crusade wasn't sanctioned by him. In any case he was quick to try to take over the Orthodox church after the fall of Constantinople)
 
Originally posted by Constantine XI
The fourth crusade was by no means sanctioned by the Pope. After it sacked Constantinople, it was condemned quite harshly by the Pope. Afterwards, the Pope did not try to crush the orthodox faith. He didn't do much to help it either, however.
Click to expand...

Allright, possibly "crush" was a bit too strong word. But the Pope didn't allow the Byzantines to appoint an orthodox patriarch to Constantinople (which resulted in one being appointed in Nikea). Also lots of orthodox bishops were replaced by catholic ones and orthodox monasteries taken over by catholics. Here's a poorly translated bit from a book I've been reading.
"Emperor Theodoros Laskaris sent a delegation led by Mesarites in 1214 to Constantinople. The reason was an appeal by the monks, which complained about oppression of the orthodox monks. Roma's Pope's underling Cardinal Pelagius threatened them with persecution if they did not become Pope's subordinates." (The meeting didn't really achive anything btw. Mesarites expressed his opinion that Pelagius wasn't doing the right thing and Pelagius said that he is prepared to go even further with the persecutions (mispelled this?) and that the Emperor of Nikea should become "a faithful son of Rome").
The quote is merely an example of went went on between the churches. The book is Ajaton Bysantti (Timeless Byzantium or something like that) by Jarmo Hakkarainen and a publication of The Department of Orthodox Theology of the University of Joensuu, so the source might be a bit partial, but the Pope defineately did try to bring the orthodox church under his command.
 
Really I do not think that Russia and Byzantium would have been at ends with each other because didn't they have family ties within their royal families? Not to mention that there was not to many powerful Orthodox states so I would guess if two where to come around they would try as hard as possible to stay together, not fight over silly differences. But then again I could be wrong. Also do we have any events for a 18th century Byzantium and how it would interact with the French Revolution, and other developments of that kind? It might be better to think about such things as that, rather than argue over what they have claims on. Would Byzantium embrace or repel the Revolution? Would they be parliamentary by then like England, or would they still be an archaic Empire like Russia and Austria? Or even more interring would they be able to stop the revolts like the rest of Europe or would the revolution engulf them too? Personally I am rather wishy-washy on weather they could get acceptance by foreign people, but what really interest me is how they would interact with the rest of Europe in the later years. A good example is witch side would they have taken in the Seven Years War if any side at all. I think they would have more to gain from taking sides with England and Prussia, but then again they might support Russia because of religious reasons. I personally think this is much more worthwhile than the argument that has been going on since the start of the project and will probably still be going on if and when Europa Universalis 3 comes out. I say we agree on what ever gets put in 1.3 should be the last of the Byzantium conquest and the start of the getting on with Byzantium European politics. Also Byzantium should have no chance after the mid-seventeenth century for these large scale claims because by then most empires where in a sort of this is our national borders thing where with only a couple exception Europe had stable borders until the time of Napoleon. Yes, wars where waged and land was won but not to the extent that Byzantium or any one else was claiming gigantic portions of Europe as their own. Of course something could be said for people like Catherine who claimed all of the Balkans, but no one really accepted this claim. I cannot think of any other claim that is anywhere close to someone claiming all of Northern Africa or Italy.
 
I'd like to see Byzantium either hurt or badly hurt by the new ideas. I think giving them bad events from 1700 on would be a good idea. 'After reaching the peak of their power around year 1700, the Byzantines had to face reality: the Roman empire could not be re-created the way it had existed a millenia ago.' etc. and the Empire would be torn apart by ideas of freedom, powerful enemies and economical decline.

Another idea: Around 1670 Byzantium would have to make a choice on whether to focus on west or east. Focusing to east would make them lose Italian culture and Latin tech and Italian shields, expect Rome (and also most of the North African shields). Focusing on west would keep them in the Lating tech group, but they'd lose their eastern shields expect Judea and Alexandria and "Copt" and Syrian state cultures. This would also make them suffer more badly from the enlightment.
 
I think in terms of situation at the beginning of the game Byzantium had a lot in common with France. They where weak and had many states with in their state, and an out side invader trying to take over. The only difference is Byzantium didn't make it, and France did. So I am not to sure the enlightenment it's self would hurt them as badly as right after when these ideals truly started to form into opinions through out the world as opposed to being a thing witch was embraced only by artisans, merchants, and aristocrats. I would think the enlightenment it's self would be used by the monarchs in the same fashion it was used in France, to justify their monarchs divine right. The problem I have with this expansion is really it would take so many powerful rulers along the same line as Lewis IV, Peter the Great, and Fredrick the Great that I do not see how they could go forth with such a gigantic plain. By the end most Byzantium rulers where weak self indulgent and convinced of their own superiority. I do not understand how after so many weak leaders all of the sudden they could have almost 200 years of some of the most powerful leaders on earth. Men of the list above are few and far between, and it would have been a blessing for Byzantium to get one man of this caliber, let alone enough to build an empire the size of witch you are talking about. Not to mention most of the time when a monarch of that cabler dose come around his successors are not in any way prepared to keep such an empire in tact until another great one comes along. The only reason the Ottomans where lucky enough to do it was they had 4 consecutive monarchs who where all great men.

PS I know I am all over the place, Just voicing some thoughts
 
Originally posted by Faeelin


Well, I don't know. "I hardly think those orthodox Greeks will willimgly submit to their Muslim Turk overlords."

But then, Mehmet might have something to say to me.

Byzantium doesn't necessarily need shields for the entire mediterranean. What it does need is a way to gain some of the cultures over territory; in EU2, those are much too set in stone. With anatolia, the EEP addresses this slightly by giving the byzantines a series of events (which are far too spread out, imho, but that's another story).

The same thing could be applied to the levant. Syrians could become the driving force in jerusalem, for instance. Or the greek minority in alexandria and the coptic church could we reintigrated in egypt (although the culture of egypt is a whole different story; they never really accepted their turk overlords).
Click to expand...


Don''t forget the armenians in the caucasus, georgians in the crimea. Having events for these two groups (along with the syrians) returning to the empire (and converting large swathes of land to orthodox armenian/syrian/georgian is plausable. Egypt could turn greek/coptic, not to mention north africa could turn berber... later orthodox even. These are all potential cultures for byzantine reconquista events.
 
Constantine XI said:
First of, STOP CALLING IT HAGIA SOFIA!! Until the Turks made it a mosque it was St. Sophia. Got it? OK, on to my next topic.
Click to expand...

Heh. Yeah, this thread is ancient. Still, a response on it will let it be searchable, so that's not the worst thing in the world.

Anyway, just to point out to anyone reading through this thread nowadays that while Hagios corresponds to the Latin Sanctus and thus is the title of Greek saints, its actual meaning is "Holy." While Hagia Sophia is often (mis)translated as Ste. Sophia or Sofia on the basis of such practice, in fact the church's name is not eponymous with an early saint but with God's divine Wisdom herself. As such, the only proper English rendering must be "the Church of Holy Wisdom" or (what the Byzantines themselves more often referred to her as) "the Great Church."

Further, whatever hatred Greeks have of the Turkish treatment of Aya Sofia, Hagia Sophia is in fact its Greek name and is never an incorrect monicker for her.

jay.
 
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