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Has there been a "reunification of Christendom" event proposed yet? This would be a reversal of the Great Schism, a perhaps utopian solution to letting the Byzantines be happy with a form of Orthodoxy (the Pope reverts to the "first among equals", as in pre 11th century status.

Trigger: Byzantium has +100 or greater relations with ALL Catholic and Orthodox countries (does not matter the reltions with other relgions), and +170 or greater relations with the Papacy, Bad Boy rating no greater than 3, has expelled the Turks from Europe and Anatolia, and has liberated the Holy Land. It will then not appear that the Byzantines are asking for a reconciliation for security reasons.

If the relations with the Pope drop to lower than 150, the Pope calls off the Synod (the schismatics are not yet ready for unification); also if the stability for the Byzantines drops to -1 or lower, then the government had lost enough moral standing to lead the conference in the eyes of the Orthodox faithful, or something of that nature.

Here is a suggestion how it might go.

A. End of the Great Schism
1. Agreed. It has gone on for too long. (+10 relations with Papacy, go to event B.)
2. Forget it! Let the Schismatics in Rome burn! (nothing)

B. Where shall the Synod be held?
1. Convene the Synod in Constantinople. (-10 relations with Papacy (Pope is annoyed), +1 stability (government looks strong))
2. Allow the Pope to host the conference in Rome. (+10 relations with Papacy (Pope is grateful), -1 stability (government looks weak))
3. Ask a neutral state to host the synod, such as Venice, Cologne, or Florence. (+50 relations with the state (state gets large prestige), -1 stablity (government looks weak, asking barbarians for aid))

C. The Status of the Emperor
1. The Emperor remains Christ's Vicar on Earth and Equal to the Apostles. (+1 stability, -10 relations with Pope, -100 relations with whichever state is the seat of the Holy Roman Empire)
2. The Emperor is merely the ruler of the Eastern part of Christendom. (-1 stability, large revolt risk in any Western provinces, +50 relations with whichever state is the seat of the Holy Roman Empire)

D. The status of the Pope
1. Universal Head of Christendom. (+100 relations with Pope, +50 relations with Catholic countires, -50 relations with Protestant and Reformed countries, -50 relations with Orthodox countires, -1 stability (challenged Emperor's authority, as well as the other Orthodox bishops)
2. First among equals. (-20 relations with Pope, -10 relations with Catholic countires, +20 relations with Orthodox countries)
3. Just another Bishop, no greater than another. (-100 relations with Papacy, -100 relations with Catholic countires, +100 relations with Orthodox countires)

E. Toleration of Heretics
1. The Protestant heretics shall feel the wrath of the Romans! (-150 relations with all Protestant and Reformed countires, +150 relations with Counter-reformed Catholic nations, +100 relations with Catholic nations)
2. Let them find their own ways to Hell. (-20 relations with Catholics (dashed expectations of Byzantine support), +20 relations with Protestants and Reformed (they are relived they will not be persecuted in Byzantium))

F. Seat of Christendom
1. Let it be Rome! (-1 stability (important clergymen leaving Constantinople for Rome), +1 tax base to Rome
2. Let it be Constantinople! (+1 stability, +1 tax base to Thrace, -1 stability for Papacy

If the Byzantines and Papacy manage to agree on these, Byzantium and the Papacy each get +1000 VPs (Christendom is reunified, after all), but another event is held... It is not over yet!

G. Confirmation of the Synod (All Orthodox nations get this, aside from Byzantium)
1. It shall be so. Let us all be in communion again (+10 relations with Byzantium and Papacy, -1 stability (conservatives annoyed))
2. Never! The Emperor has sinned against the True Faith! (-200 relations with Byzantium and Pope)

Hope this can help a bit! Feel free to make suggestions.
 
If these events can be synchronized between Byzantium and Pope, then they make KILLER events. They will really help out in the game. Question: If things work out, what of Catholic and Orthodox religions?
 
Besides, it doesn't make conquering other pieces of land impossible just harder to do. For all I care you could go and conquer China... if you find it of course :D

no, splitting up the CB-shields is just a way giving the AI a more coherent battleplan and, more importantly, let's us make nice events that fit into a somewhat coherent (hi)story. Of course, if you feel lucky you could go and conquer faraway lands while the Turks are swarming all over Europe.
 
I suggested a naval event in an earlier post and just for practice wrote up two suggested events.

Following the defeat of the turks and the reclaming of much lost territory the empire was growing stronger again. Much of the byzant power had historically relied on a powerfull navy but such things had been ignored while the fight against the turks was raging. Should we now commit ourself to build a powerfull navy so we can safeguard our coasts? This will however not be appreciatet by the great naval powers of the eastern Medditerranian

#The Naval reforms#
event = {
id = 32001
random = no
country = BYZ
trigger = {
owned = { province = 321 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 320 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 356 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 358 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 359 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 360 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 478 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 476 data = -1 }
owned = { province = 1609 data = -1 }
}
NOT = {
exits = TUR
}
name = "EVENTNAME32001"
desc = "EVENTHIST32001"
style = 1

action_a = { # Initiate Great Naval Reforms
name = "ACTIONNAME32001A"
command = { type = stability value = 1}
command = { type = domestic which = LAND value = -3 }
command = { type = domestic which = ARISTOCRACY value = -1 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -150 }
command = { type = relation which = GEN value = -150 }
command = { type = naval value = 4000 }
command = { type = trigger which = 32002 }
}
action_b = { # We can only afford small investments
name = "ACTIONNAME32001B"
command = { type = domestic which = LAND value = -1 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = GEN value = -50 } command = { }
command = { type = naval value = 1500 }
}
action_c = { # No the army needs the resources
name = "ACTIONNAME3704C"
command = { type = domestic which = LAND value = 1 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = 50 }
command = { type = relation which = GEN value = 50 }
}

If you chose alternative A it triggers the next event.

Following the commitment on becoming a great naval power rumors in europa grew that the Byzantine Empire was in great need of shipbuilders. Several Italian shipbuilders answered this call and they proposed a major shipyard to be constructed, othervice a major fleet could never be maintained. This will however further annoy the other naval powers and the cost is quite high.


#The Great Shipyard#
id = 32002
random = no
country = BYZ
name = "EVENTNAME32002"
desc = "EVENTHIST32002"
style = 1

action_a = { # We can afford this
name = "ACTIONNAME32002A"
command = { type = domestic which = LAND value = -2 }
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = -50 }
command = { type = relation which = GEN value = -50 }
command = { type = gainbuilding which = 357 value = shipyard }
command = { type = naval value = 2000 }
command = { type = type = treasury value = -400 }
}
action_b = { # Waste of our resources
name = "ACTIONNAME32002B"
command = { type = relation which = VEN value = 50 }
command = { type = relation which = GEN value = 50 }
}

So what do you think? Do they need to be balanced? I think something like this is worth a shot.
 
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Originally posted by David Commenus
Question: If things work out, what of Catholic and Orthodox religions?
Click to expand...

Here is the tricky part. Assuming the Emperor manages to fulfil the prerequisites for the Synod (a feat in an of itself), he and the Pope must agree on all of the topics (the AI Pope will favor a stronger Papacy, the AI Emperor will likewise favor his interests). In the small possibility this is accomplished, we have the question of What Christianity should be: Catholic or Orthodox?

If Orthodoxy and Catholicism remain true to EU1 (can marry with each other, same tech values, etc) then I would care less what the base religion for Europe or Asia Minor becomes. But, we have to keep in mind the Orthodox can notconvert to Protestantism or Reformed, unlike Catholicsm. Likewise, Orthodox can not convert to Counter-reformed Catholics.

Since CRC is basically temporary (expires at the Edict of Tolerance), and Protestantism is more permanent, I would favor that the base religion of the provinces of Spain, France, Italy, etc become Orthodox. It would not be good to allow a Protestant Byzantium, Novgorod, etc after all!

Also, the events should be spaced one year or so apart from each other. Synods and meetings of this sort took quite a while to finish. Look at Trent!

What do you think of this?
 
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Originally posted by Constantine XI


1) The Byzantines had every desire to rule people who weren't christian. They wanted to christianize them!
Click to expand...

Hmmm. When? Again, historically they refrained from conquest of Moslems when they had the chance. For example, they spent the pre-Manzikert days in the 11th century sparring with the Kingdom of Sicily, which would've been happy to let them be, instead of trying to take swaths of territory from the shattered states in the Middle East. Is there even a single example of ambitious conquest attempts against the Moslems?

Originally posted by Constantine XI


2) I have stated this time and again. The Byzantines could not afford to field mercenaries anymore. They had no money to speak of, and what little they did went to feeding the populace and even the bread system broke down over and over.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I hadn't read the "Byzantine Army" thread prior to posting. My writing was sloppy. I would have been more precise if I knew this was a sore spot :D

My exact claim was that a significant number of foreigners where present even at the end, and your numbers (which I don't dispute) are about 35% Italian at the siege--definitely significant. Foreigners were previously used as mercenaries. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that attempts to form an offensive force would have to rely on foreigners, and that these foreigners in a semi-revived empire would be mercenaries or adventurers; either way, people with agendas other than the good of the empire. Hence a combination army reform/rebellion event.

Originally posted by Constantine XI

3) There is no way to simulate mercenary revolts in EU2 because the player may not always buy mercenaries. Unless you can code it so only a mercenary band goes revolutionary, which I believe you cannot.
Click to expand...

You can abstract the effects by civil war, rebellion, desertions or a stab hit. IMHO there's no need to worry about distiguishing the recruitment technique (obviously, I view EU2 "mercenary" distincitons as pretty abstract).

Originally posted by Constantine XI

4) Conclusion: You want to see Byzantium die instead of allowing the player even a slim chance of making Byzantium real.
Click to expand...

Hardly. For a human, it's a trivial job to prosper, and maybe win outright, as the current Byzantines. The AI consistently survives. I started two games (Very Hard/Furious) as Byzantium and found both too easy, eliminating the Ottomans by ~1450; I got bored and quit. In some significant ways (stab costs, hostility of neighbors) the Ottomans are in worse shape than the Byzantines in EU2 at 1419. This skewed balance of power is blatantly, phenomenally, utterly, totally, excessively ahistoric. And no, I don't think that's a good thing ;)

Originally posted by Constantine XI

5) Grr.
Click to expand...

Hey, relax :D The event was just a suggestion. It's not like other nations don't get civil war/rebellion/-6 stab events. I'm not going to spend a lot more time posting on this thread either, so I'll be easy to ignore. My main source is Treadgold, and driftwood already pulled out the cool events from that :)
 
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Oh, by the way I made up a little list over province code-numbers that are likely to be needed when coding for byzantium. I found it bitching hard to look for them everytime I needed them. Anyone want it?

Dang my coded events slipped into the former page, well look at them and tell me what you think. It´s my first try so don´t flame me to hell please.
 
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Originally posted by joak
Hmmm. When? Again, historically they refrained from conquest of Moslems when they had the chance. For example, they spent the pre-Manzikert days in the 11th century sparring with the Kingdom of Sicily, which would've been happy to let them be, instead of trying to take swaths of territory from the shattered states in the Middle East.
Click to expand...

I disagree. Sicily was Byzantium's arch Western-enemy until 22 November, 1270, when The King of Sicily's invasion fleet was ravaged in a storm. I hardly think Robert Guiscard and Bohemund were just sipping tea when they sacked Durazzo and Antioch, repsectivly. Guiscard wanted to make himself lord of the Balkans, and Bohemund wanted to take the Emperor's legitimate possesions in the Holy Land away, and make them a feif of Sicily's.

"The last thing he [Guiscard] wanted was peace with Constantinople." -Lord Norwich, Byzantium: The Decline and Fall, p.17.

"Now it [Antoich] had been siezed by a Norman adventurer [Bohemund] who, despite his oath, had no intention of surrendering it and making no secret of his hostility. He had even gone so far as to expel the Greek Patriarch and replace him with a Latin..." -ibid, p.43

EDIT: Nevermind. The Crusades came After Manzikert. Still the principle remians. Palermo and Constantinople did not get along well.
 
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joak: For those concerned about Byzantium having too many CB shields at first (for the AI), I only give them Thrace, Macedonia, Hellas, Morea, Smyrna, and Ionia for the first stage of (mostly historical) events.

Basileus: For the Union of Churches event - there's one coded and set to be included in 1.02 (I believe), so I've been waiting to see what that is. BTW, I find your name intimidating. :)

Laur: I tried to simulate some of the effects of the struggle between the military and civilian parties in Growth of the Magnates events (since the magnates basically formed the military party). You support them, gain bonuses to aristocracy, serfdom, land, quality, etc. You support the civilian party, and basically the opposite happens.

Constantine: I don't think the Byzantines had much desire to rule non-Christians. When they did, they set up population swaps with Muslim principalities right across the border. I don't know if they thought it would be too hard to convert them, or if they just didn't want to try, or what. They certainly (in the past) sent missionaries to other heathens.

Idiotboy: I like your event, and wouldn't mind that province list.

Ugh, I hate working. Tomorrow I get off at 5 pm, and then I'm going to try and finish off another few events. Except that I can't log into the site. Oh well.

edit: Oh, you just can't copy and paste your password. Hehe.

driftwood
 
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Originally posted by driftwood
Basileus: For the Union of Churches event - there's one coded and set to be included in 1.02 (I believe), so I've been waiting to see what that is.
Click to expand...

I think the one in 1.02 revolves around what actually happened in the final year in RL, where the Emperor personally converted to Catholicism to gain western aid against the Turks, but the people did not, so it kind of fell through. There are still Byzantine Catholics today, if I am not mistaken.

My Union of Christendom event would have the Empire attempt to re-unify the two churches on a much stronger position, rather than a desperate plea for aid.

BTW, I find your name intimidating. :)
Click to expand...

Good! :D
 
I edited a savegame file so the Turk capital is in Bursa, and found it just as hard to expel the Turks from the Balkans... I had to wait till they were reeling from a lost war with Karaman/Tekke/Dulkadir before I could strike, and then only with the aid of Serbia and Trebizond!! I believe the Bursa capital makes them stronger.

Oh and I also put the Byz in latin tech for the game too... *sigh* I can't stand seeing the Roman Empire always lagging in technology.

And there needs to be culture adding events to this on a grander scale, such as the acceptance of Arab culture too. After the conquest of the Mameluks, my income increase was negligible due to the fact i was losing 60 percent of it to culture/religion differnces, and only getting some of it back through stability. It was harsh...

I have the initial file saved as a beta to work with should some events be thrown at my way, and YES YES I'll change their tech back to orthodox... *sigh* don't flame me.
 
Basileus: Oh, I thought I had edited my post. Yes, I realized quickly that your event would be very different. Very cool, though! Do we need an entire event dedicated to the filioque? ;)

Since changing tech groups will be in after 1.02, maybe we can do a whole string of Renaissance interaction events, starting with the trade-Venice-Genoa stuff (someone should write up some actual ideas on that). Then you could decide to lend support to the Italian Renaissance, Accept Cultural Exchanges, or Both. After the Union event (or not?), maybe you could adopt some Western views or something and change to the Latin group (with the usual threats of civil war, etc. this isn't an all-good, easy event!).

Come on, we could easily write a Resurrect the Senate option after the American and/or French revolutions. Let the Emperor continue to appoint senators, let the people elect an Assembly of the Plebs, you're all good. :D

Constantine: That sounds good about Turkey. Did you try that with my 1421 events in there? I wonder if the civil war actually slows them down at all.

I can't think of any very good reason to add Arabic culture to Byzantium. They never seemed at all interested in accepting that culture, whereas you could make a good argument for how they would adopt Turkish culture too. Any ideas?

driftwood
 
The website

I submitted my e-mail, etc for a password to the site... Haven't received it yet. I'd love to try some of this stuff out as it gets submitted.

I'm not a coder, but I am a systems engineer (work for IBM) in addition to having a fair knowledge of Byzantium.
 
I´m still having trouble activating my events.

1. I written the events in correct code and put them in a file along with the other event files.

2. I edited the text.csv file so story appears.

3. I edited the events.txt as well

What is left?
 
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