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I agree that it can be really strong (and I would extend this to upgrading land units into eachother, too) - I think the worst part about this is that it warps AI gameplay in a really weird way, because the AI can't do it in any way (that I know of) except having to manually setup menial events that would trade in divs on request. So it feels, to me, like the AI has to get weird boni to compensate so that it's even able to catch up to a smart player.. Though well, that's always been a problem in HOI, with most versions of the game just spamming thousands of spawned divisions and whatnot
Maybe have this as an event or decision option for only a small handful of nations that did this historically like U.S., Japan, and UK? And only for a limited number of capital ships. (Historically, Italy was in the process of converting an ocean liner into the carrier Aquila but they never finished it before the war ended). Also, others have suggested this for other mods, but would be interesting to be able to upgrade certain older WW1 battleships into more modern battleships like Italy, Japan, and UK did? But that can get complicated as the ships would need to be taken out of action for a couple of years. I think in past mods, the ships are removed entirely and a newer ship appears in the build que - or the mod begins with the upgraded ships already in the que. On the other hand, I feel like this is the point of the ship brigades (although the Improved Hull attachment can't be attached retroactively after a ship has been built).
Definetly... and even old Transports can be cheaply upgraded to CVLs. Absolutely too strong.
My suggestion would be:
No cross-upgrading but only to the next newer model of the same type: TP 1 to TP 2, CL 4 to CL 5, BB 2 to 3 etc. but not to carriers. Still quite strong but gameplaywise just too practical to not allow it (like in vanilla DH).
Same suggestion, btw, for land units: no cross-upgrading but only allowed within same unit type.
Since the introduction of passive upgrading within DH it needs some balancing since all cross-upgrades have become too strong.
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Transports sound like a mistake (I would've never even though to check them...) especially with the general buffs they received - I'll just remove the upgrade lines from them and hope nothing explodes x.x
I should upload a patch sometime next week that will address these concerns, add Northern Strike AI and AI events for Japan and Soviets, tweak some more events to clean-up the mess of a theater that could generate because of CHI-SOV conflicts, improve the AI pre-war production scripts and add extra for CZE, HUN, JAP, ROM, and... way way more, I worked on it a fair bit.
I should upload a patch sometime next week that will address these concerns, add Northern Strike AI and AI events for Japan and Soviets, tweak some more events to clean-up the mess of a theater that could generate because of CHI-SOV conflicts, improve the AI pre-war production scripts and add extra for CZE, HUN, JAP, ROM, and... way way more, I worked on it a fair bit.
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It's from EoD and, actually, has even an historic background. The first improvised carriers were often based on transports. Nevertheless in terms of overpowered and balance, especially if the AI doesn't know how to use upgrades, I'd rather go back to vanilla DH: no upgrades for ships at all except there is a specific event. And if, for player convinience, ships should be upgradeable, at least not crosswise but only straight.
In terms of upgrade price, I'd suggest 50% of the total price. That's rather expensive for 1 upgrade but that's around the price where I would start to think which ship to upgrade and which one not instead of just upgrading every ship... and thinking about choices and cost is always good in a strat-game.
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I've uploaded a new version and made a list of nearly all changes in my personal Jira, which I'm copying below. As always, let me know if any issues pop up, and huge thanks to everyone who comments for continued feedback I've focused on adding and integrating North Strike AI first, and then balancing/bugfixing current content further. One of smaller things I've worked on is vastly improved "Catherine" AI, which sometimes lets the UK attempt to be surprisingly proactive early into the war.
- making sure Japan and Italy have a specific puppet/occupied AI that is way less interested in war
- making sure SOV Baltics occupation is more foolproof (currently SOV can fail to acquire Baltic states if it's at war with Japan)
- probably making North Strike slightly less one-sided for Axis
- implementing my latest naval invasion findings wherever they can help the AI
- adding more weight / flavour / focus to Scandinavia (Norway is incredibly minor in-game and it does not really feel as though Germany requires control of Narvik as much as it should)
I've focused on adding and integrating North Strike AI first, and then balancing/bugfixing current content further. One of smaller things I've worked on is vastly improved "Catherine" AI, which sometimes lets the UK attempt to be surprisingly proactive early into the war.
My current future to-do list includes:
- making sure Japan and Italy have a specific puppet/occupied AI that is way less interested in war
- making sure SOV Baltics occupation is more foolproof (currently SOV can fail to acquire Baltic states if it's at war with Japan)
- probably making North Strike slightly less one-sided for Axis
- implementing my latest naval invasion findings wherever they can help the AI
- adding more weight / flavour / focus to Scandinavia (Norway is incredibly minor in-game and it does not really feel as though Germany requires control of Narvik as much as it should)
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Love your work, such a unique project.
But I need to admit: I'm playing Germany at hard, and sea lion was still pretty easy. Like, I had no real naval opposition despite turning on harder England event (this one from EoD) Navy just stayed in port and I had a real battle after taking port province lol. Maybe because of it? Still love the mod tho.
I don't understand two things, but maybe it's because I didn't play Dh in a while. First, I feel like enemy units surrender faster than in vanilla? It's like they always surrender around 85—95% attack progress. At the beginning I thought it's intentional, but it's also the case when the unit is encircled and will be destroyed. Enemy units just retread before battle progress hits 100% even if its pointless.
Second thing: I'm having +15 to attack despite hard difficulty, while enemy gets +7. (those values when you point the mouse at a unit in battle details.)
But I need to admit: I'm playing Germany at hard, and sea lion was still pretty easy. Like, I had no real naval opposition despite turning on harder England event (this one from EoD) Navy just stayed in port and I had a real battle after taking port province lol. Maybe because of it? Still love the mod tho.
I don't understand two things, but maybe it's because I didn't play Dh in a while. First, I feel like enemy units surrender faster than in vanilla? It's like they always surrender around 85—95% attack progress. At the beginning I thought it's intentional, but it's also the case when the unit is encircled and will be destroyed. Enemy units just retread before battle progress hits 100% even if its pointless.
Second thing: I'm having +15 to attack despite hard difficulty, while enemy gets +7. (those values when you point the mouse at a unit in battle details.)
ENG is sort of bottlenecked by not being able to move units fast enough between when they need to defend their homeland and when they need to defend Egypt, I hope to improve this over time but yeah for now the best bet at having more of a challenge is hopefully the Stronger Allies difficulty setting. If that's not challenging enough it's relatively easy to tweak difficulty values at least
Axis receives combat bonuses regardless of difficulty + via ministers; I changed some of the things that Hard (Stronger Allies+) affects with the update I uploaded just half an hour before your comment, which should hopefully make the setting more impactful.
I don't know how surrendering compares to vanilla and I'm not sure what are all exact combat changes between vanilla to EOD to this, my best guess would be that damage is slightly higher and units that can't fight surrender faster
Axis receives combat bonuses regardless of difficulty + via ministers; I changed some of the things that Hard (Stronger Allies+) affects with the update I uploaded just half an hour before your comment, which should hopefully make the setting more impactful.
I don't know how surrendering compares to vanilla and I'm not sure what are all exact combat changes between vanilla to EOD to this, my best guess would be that damage is slightly higher and units that can't fight surrender faster
Ok, but it literally says “difficulty” +10 (not 15 my bad) but ok.
Also, you maybe would like to check US priorities after fall of British Empire...
Well part of what I said is that Axis receives combat bonuses regardless of difficulty (nerfed to 5 in the aforementioned update, it was on my radar)
US can always be better, but I don't see anything immediately bad with them deploying a couple of divisions to Africa?
US can always be better, but I don't see anything immediately bad with them deploying a couple of divisions to Africa?
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Nice to see you are still going strong with this project!
Fun to have been here since the start because your view of how many things could be improved aligned much with mine. When I tried Germany and could get brazil influenced into axis, I knew I found a mod that keeps on delivering fresh content each play.
My favorite was when I half-defeated china, and they had a civil war while I was in the pacific war, while controlling all their coast, or when I had a nuke marathon in turkey vs USSR as germany in the 50's. They had joined the axis 10 years earlier. It's a mod that makes you try and do new stuff and I really like that.
Anyway the reason I came in here was because following this thread I saw that someone remarked that the real life stats of carriers were wrong and you just said that it matters more that they are OP, and ever since then as a guy who hosts multiplayer games for 2 years now I have thought of bringing it up for a game, but 33 mods are already pretty hard to balance and yours is somewhat experimental. How do you think it'd go?
Mostly curious and question is open to the public ofc.
Fun to have been here since the start because your view of how many things could be improved aligned much with mine. When I tried Germany and could get brazil influenced into axis, I knew I found a mod that keeps on delivering fresh content each play.
My favorite was when I half-defeated china, and they had a civil war while I was in the pacific war, while controlling all their coast, or when I had a nuke marathon in turkey vs USSR as germany in the 50's. They had joined the axis 10 years earlier. It's a mod that makes you try and do new stuff and I really like that.
Anyway the reason I came in here was because following this thread I saw that someone remarked that the real life stats of carriers were wrong and you just said that it matters more that they are OP, and ever since then as a guy who hosts multiplayer games for 2 years now I have thought of bringing it up for a game, but 33 mods are already pretty hard to balance and yours is somewhat experimental. How do you think it'd go?
Mostly curious and question is open to the public ofc.
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It's cool to hear about all of these scenarios on one hand, but ultimately I have to say that some of these are things that just are not foreseen or supported by main content of either EOD or this mod.
There is almost nothing that would regulate GER/BRA relations - I think in principle you could influence half of Latin America as GER - and China civil war in DH relies on vanilla HOI2 events and scripts to a degree that makes it really messy. Could be cool to implement more and more content over time but for the Brazil example, I think I would be hard-pressed to find a different role for them than a token Allies member (when comparing working on them against working on other countries)
I'm not super familiar with the verbiage but I assume 33 mods means mods starting in 1933, right?
I personally like the naval range/speed changes - It tends to make heavier ships feel more impactful IMO (Battleships can actually get some shots off before combat is over) and as far I can tell battles where 2 carriers delete an entire fleet without taking damage are less common, but I haven't received that many direct comments about it and god knows I myself am not good (or infinitely-knowledgeable) enough at this game to be able to definitively ascertain this.
What I'm getting at is, I can definitely use more feedback from people seriously playing this - but I wouldn't be able to say with a clear conscience that you will never stumble into anything broken.
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Uploaded a new small update that hopefully addresses some pain points with the mod. I've mainly focused on improving ENG/US invasions, major fronts that needed some help (GER vs SOV, CHI vs JAP) and fleet management for ENG - as well as some bug/logic fixes. Full notes below. I feel like the quality of my campaigns generally improved from what I could've tested, looking forward to feedback regarding if previously bothersome things seem to be better now.
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Just what the doctor ordered! I was just about to run a multiplayer game by myself playing Italy and Romania. Thank you.
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Hello,
this is a bit off-topic, but do you perhaps understand how event command air_percentage = works?
Documentation says its #true if we have at least value times the air forces of country TAG, but i don't understand it.
There is an event in EoD "The Luftwaffe Hits Soviet Airfields" where it's
success for Germany if: NOT = { air_percentage = { country = GER value = 0.9 } }
partial success if
air_percentage = { country = GER value = 0.9 }
NOT = { air_percentage = { country = GER value = 1.1 } }
and failure if: air_percentage = { country = GER value = 1.1 }
So I would assume to success, my force would be 1.0 times my air force. But when I hit, event at the very beginning when my forces are intact, it gives me failure and all my air units are at 100 strength. Do you maybe familiar how does it work?
this is a bit off-topic, but do you perhaps understand how event command air_percentage = works?
Documentation says its #true if we have at least value times the air forces of country TAG, but i don't understand it.
There is an event in EoD "The Luftwaffe Hits Soviet Airfields" where it's
success for Germany if: NOT = { air_percentage = { country = GER value = 0.9 } }
partial success if
air_percentage = { country = GER value = 0.9 }
NOT = { air_percentage = { country = GER value = 1.1 } }
and failure if: air_percentage = { country = GER value = 1.1 }
So I would assume to success, my force would be 1.0 times my air force. But when I hit, event at the very beginning when my forces are intact, it gives me failure and all my air units are at 100 strength. Do you maybe familiar how does it work?
You're pulling from a event that is triggered for SOV (or at least it should be/is in EODAIP), making those comparisons of SOV to GER air_percentage. Success rate goes down based on if Soviets have more planes than GER
Ah, this actually makes sense now. Well, it will a problem for me because they prioritized air force in event, so I guess I won't be able to catch up. Thank you for the answer.