HOI4 Dev Diary - Reflections and Romania

[Cimrmann]

Thank you for new DLC teaser!

Isn't' the fact French fell in six weeks proof of broken AI in itself?

RE Together for Victory> I understand what the metrics showed you... Most players are playing as Germany. I wonder if it's simply because Germany has been designed with really good combination of focus tree/research/non generic models of equipment and all that supported by good set of advisors/generals that it makes it very interesting/entertaining to play as Germany.
I tried playing as Canada for example but due to one choice in focus tree I denied myself better choices in Recruitment and had to quit the game right after I conquered USA simply because I didn't have the recruitable population to support further expansion. Yes, I couldn't load far back enough...I play in Ironman mode.

RE future DLCs> I hope to one day see two major DLCs...
World War I - the existing MOD shows how interesting it is to to have an option to start even earlier in 20th century.
I wonder if this is 'too big' to develop and make it work in the context of Hearts of Iron IV being primarily the WW2 strategy.

And yes of course why not continue with one more major DLC for the post WW2 era...something like the Modern Day MOD.

So...
a) Does this even sound plausible? Especially to keep being playable going through different conflicts and historical events...
b) Do you think the game would be too long to play if it would cover half or most of 20th century? I personally wouldn't mind...it is after all "grand strategy".

Thank you and keep up the good work!

 

[wildbillhdmax01]

I think the fact that HOI4 is miles ahead of the broken mess HOI3 was upon launch is a large part of why we aren't complaining more. It does show to me that PDX has learned something. Yes, HOI4 was announced too early and released too early (which is ironic, given that some people on the forums were up in arms about it taking too long). But it's an improvement, and we know that PDX doesn't abandon games.

Had HOI4 and Stellaris been at their current state, with PDX moving on to HOI5, Stellaris 2, or some other projects, I'd have been really irritated. As it is, while I don't like HOI4's current state, I guess I put up with it because I know the games will be supported long into the future.

Oh, and because they are way more complex and ambitious than most other games to begin with. HOI4 seems especially so, with the devs saying they got burned on several new features they had more difficulty getting to work than they were expecting. Battle Planner definitely is still a major problem, and I think the AI would have performed better if it didn't have to contend with it.

Yes I know and understand that HOI4 right now is much better, as it should be after almost a year, and 3 major patches.

 

[MarquisDeV]

"The other issue we noted ourselves was that the Commonwealth nations had very little interaction with each other. They each sat in their own little part of the world, mostly doing their own thing with their AI neighbours. That meant that even if you were playing one of the countries that got a new focus tree, you were surrounded by countries that still used the generic trees. All the interesting developments in your region were caused by you. We wanted to change that as well, and force you to pay attention to the world around you."

Glad you guys noticed this because although I rather like the new focus trees added in TFV, I broke free of Britain (Without so much as a fight or any bad blood between the me and them. Rather unrealistic if you ask me) and made Australia into a Republic only to end up with a very boring game stuck in my own corner with no one declaring war or asking me to get involved in any way. Now, historically speaking, this would have been nice for the land down under, of course, but it does not make for the most fun gameplay experience. :-D

Also, if you are doing new Focus Trees, China, China, China! The lack of a unique focus tree for them is a pretty major void in my opinion.

An idea I was also thinking of, although I am not sure whether it would fit into the approach you seem to be going for with the AI, is to have it use scripted division models and designs based on what the major powers actually used in Historical Mode. The AI could prioritize research leading up to these designs and implement them as soon as it has the XP and the tech. It would be nice to see the philosophies and designs used historically appear in game as well, instead of the AI just sticking with Light and Medium tanks throughout the war.

I also rather like Picard 359's idea of resources, particularly Uranium. Because, barring large changes the timeline and its territory, Bhutan should not be researching nukes.

As many people have also said, division shuffle and the air war should be prioritized above all else, though.

 

[Axe99]

Which I think is funny that actually come out and say it. Because every time I have I get called a hater... So if you look back Every Time they release a game it's in a buggy, broken mess that take many patches, DLC, and even... years to fix! Maybe this shows that Paradox hasn't learned anything? Everytime I state anything like that I get Respectfully Disagree, and told I'm a hater.

I promise I'm not calling you a hater . And I've yet to use that red X (although there are a few folk - but definitely not you - who have challenged my avoidance of it ) - on that topic, I wouldn't worry about the agrees/disagrees - they sometimes make little sense (I've made posts I expected to get 'hated' on that were fine, and others that I thought were about as controversial as a sunny day that got disagrees - internet is the internet and all that).

In terms of HoI4 - at launch, in my view (noting obviously my memory's more prone to mixing things up than the average) was substantially better than HoI3 (and HoI1/2 - HoI2 was probably best of the bunch up to HoI4, although while it worked at launch, the AI had all sorts of issues (and still does). There was a clear line between pre-CK2 games (although Vicky 2 was an improvement on HoI3's launch I hear, although clearly not for me) and CK2 and onwards. I personally argue the reason CK2 and EU4 got an easier ride was because their AI has far less to do (the number of units HoI has to manage is insane, and the scale of the war far larger, with greater land/sea interaction, and air as well), than because HoI4's AI was "bad" (note - a WW2 GSG must be all sorts of hell to program the AI for - presumably why Matrix's World in Flames still doesn't have an AI* - and I'm not suggesting for a second the AI doesn't have issues that the game would benefit greatly from working on). In other words, it was a quality AI for a WW2 GSG at launch (I haven't seen any WW2 GSG come close to HoI4's AI at launch), but the complexity of the job means that it still has a ways to go.

Anyways, that's enough rambling by me - deffo not trying to cause trouble (and glad I don't sound short ). Sympathies for the downvotes and here's hoping we're both happy with 1.4/Oak .


* Sorry, sadface is because WiF was my WW2 boardgame of choice back in the day - I'd be surprised if I'm not always a HoI fan (well, as long as it stays a WW2 GSG), but if they ever do manage to give WiF an AI, I'll be playing that as well.

 

[cis272]

It'd be interesting to see more monarchist government options allowing you to put the Kaiser, Tsar and other monarchy's back into power. Maybe even see Monarchist alliances form.

 

[ltccone]

I think the fact that HOI4 is miles ahead of the broken mess HOI3 was upon launch is a large part of why we aren't complaining more. It does show to me that PDX has learned something. Yes, HOI4 was announced too early and released too early (which is ironic, given that some people on the forums were up in arms about it taking too long). But it's an improvement, and we know that PDX doesn't abandon games.

Had HOI4 and Stellaris been at their current state, with PDX moving on to HOI5, Stellaris 2, or some other projects, I'd have been really irritated. As it is, while I don't like HOI4's current state, I guess I put up with it because I know the games will be supported long into the future.

Oh, and because they are way more complex and ambitious than most other games to begin with. HOI4 seems especially so, with the devs saying they got burned on several new features they had more difficulty getting to work than they were expecting. Battle Planner definitely is still a major problem, and I think the AI would have performed better if it didn't have to contend with it.

HOI4 did work when it first came out. Maybe not the way people wanted it to work, but work it did. And HOI3 WAS a broken mess when it first came out. Does anyone else remember Finland always joining the Allies?

 

[Broletariat90]

It'd be interesting to see more monarchist government options allowing you to put the Kaiser, Tsar and other monarchy's back into power. Maybe even see Monarchist alliances form.

Monarchy as a an actual form of government doesn't really fit well into a WW2 themed game. Also realistically there were zero chances for the Kaiser or Tsar of coming back.

Edit: Also countries that did have a monarchy in this period were not absolute monarchies. Either the monarch's power was contained by a dictatorship ruling in their name like Romania, Hungary, Italy and Japan in some cases or the monarch served a purely ceremonial role such as in the U.K, Denmark, Belgium, Sweden, Norway and the Netherlands.

 

[Dei5ani]

When its gonna be released?
I am a romanian and seeing a romanian focus tree is
Cool to say the least.

 

[Gamer_1745]

I think the idea is for a June release, but I am far from sure on this.

 

[Broletariat90]

I think the idea is for a June release, but I am far from sure on this.

Makes the most sense since they have that July break. Let's just hope it goes better then last June.

 

[Alex_brunius]

Because, barring large changes the timeline and its territory, Bhutan should not be researching nukes.

But Belgian Congo should? (Since they are one of the historical locations of Uranium used for the Manhattan project)

The way to prevent minors researching nukes should not be through resources, but through ensuring they don't have enough capability to research things like Nukes, Heavy tanks, Carriers or Strategic bombers inside a WW2 timeframe.

 

[pete_ts]

Not impressed. Pimping focus trees is just in-house modding. How about some new functionality? There are troves of great suggestions in the forum. Leave the modding to the community and start coding!

 

[scroggin]

Thank you for new DLC teaser!

Isn't' the fact French fell in six weeks proof of broken AI in itself?

RE Together for Victory> I understand what the metrics showed you... Most players are playing as Germany. I wonder if it's simply because Germany has been designed with really good combination of focus tree/research/non generic models of equipment and all that supported by good set of advisors/generals that it makes it very interesting/entertaining to play as Germany.
I tried playing as Canada for example but due to one choice in focus tree I denied myself better choices in Recruitment and had to quit the game right after I conquered USA simply because I didn't have the recruitable population to support further expansion. Yes, I couldn't load far back enough...I play in Ironman mode.

RE future DLCs> I hope to one day see two major DLCs...
World War I - the existing MOD shows how interesting it is to to have an option to start even earlier in 20th century.
I wonder if this is 'too big' to develop and make it work in the context of Hearts of Iron IV being primarily the WW2 strategy.

And yes of course why not continue with one more major DLC for the post WW2 era...something like the Modern Day MOD.

So...
a) Does this even sound plausible? Especially to keep being playable going through different conflicts and historical events...
b) Do you think the game would be too long to play if it would cover half or most of 20th century? I personally wouldn't mind...it is after all "grand strategy".

Thank you and keep up the good work!

I think extended timelines are diificult to ballance. Also a good player will have beaten all the difficult countries and there wont be much of a challange left by the time you finish the current timeline.

Extended timelines work best for playing as a minor where a lot of time can be spent developing from a small country to a large one.

 

[scroggin]

I promise I'm not calling you a hater . And I've yet to use that red X (although there are a few folk - but definitely not you - who have challenged my avoidance of it ) - on that topic, I wouldn't worry about the agrees/disagrees - they sometimes make little sense (I've made posts I expected to get 'hated' on that were fine, and others that I thought were about as controversial as a sunny day that got disagrees - internet is the internet and all that) .

Ive noticed that you are always positive and pleasant. I always enjoy reading your posts axe99. You are a ray of sunshine in the often dark place of the internet. Its easy to get carried away with our typing and forget that there is a person at the other end.

 

[fabius]

I think extended timelines are diificult to ballance. Also a good player will have beaten all the difficult countries and there wont be much of a challange left by the time you finish the current timeline.

Extended timelines work best for playing as a minor where a lot of time can be spent developing from a small country to a large one.

Think the game need real costs associated to holding down whole countries in annexation. And down the line decent rebellion, insurgency mechanics to give post major killing a bit of life.

 

[Picard 359]

It'd be interesting to see more monarchist government options allowing you to put the Kaiser, Tsar and other monarchy's back into power. Maybe even see Monarchist alliances form.

I also would like to see alternative history focus tree for Germany maybe based on Oster Conspiracy in which player will remove Hitler and Nazi from power and restore exiled Wilhelm II as Emperor or become democracy! But don't worry WW2 will still happen because:

1. Wilhelm II surly want revenge for shameful terms for surrender of Germany in WW1 so he will take German army which Hitler rebuild and try to get it.
2. if Germany become democracy WW2 will still happen due Stalin ambition to expand USSR.

Into about Oster Conspiracy for members who don’t know more about it: The Oster Conspiracy of 1938 was a proposed plan to overthrow German Führer Adolf Hitler and the Nazi regime if Germany went to war with Czechoslovakia over the Sudetenland. It was led by Major General Hans Oster, deputy head of the Abwehr and other high-ranking conservatives within the Wehrmacht who opposed the regime for its behavior that was threatening to bring Germany into a war that they believed it was not ready to fight. They planned to overthrow Hitler and the Nazi regime through a planned storming of the Reich Chancellery by forces loyal to the plot to take control of the government, who would either arrest or assassinate Hitler, and restore the exiled Wilhelm II as Emperor.

 

[Xuanzue]

I'm ok with this DD.

It's a lot better than the 1st diary of TfV.

There are some issues still irking me

- why tha AI team is not using more "tensorflow" or "monte carlo"? at least to optimize a good amount of ai_will_do factors. Every week I see amazing and scary things from people working with tensorflow, where the machine learns by itself.

- 10 months have passed and some bugs reported in June are still there. Same with the QoL

- In Air the UI is not enough, if you are reworking the air part, then the next diary is a good moment to tell us about it.

- The navy still have this bothersome bug where auto-detach fleets for repairs decide to engage everything at sight. bug reported since june

- Battleplans. the part where they become absolutely crazy just after taking 1 or 2 provinces is an horrible problem. it was discussed heavily when you decided to put the blitzkrieg plan behind the paywall of the dlc. Still is a problem, and still is absurd to have to delete or edit (A LOT) the frontlines because they become a mess after some changes in the provinces' ownership.

 

[Karpatron]

could you guys give south america some more love? they are actually the most boring continent to play

 

[The-False-Being26]

could you guys give south america some more love? they are actually the most boring continent to play

They didn't really do anything in ww2 so I would imagine they are very low on the priority list.

 

[Temudhun Khan]

- In Air the UI is not enough, if you are reworking the air part, then the next diary is a good moment to tell us about it.

They are definitively reworking the air warfare in this dlc (they told it several time) but I think the next dd will talk about something they teased with the Romanian focus tree (probably licences) since Podcat stated repeatedly that releasing the dd in another order wouldn't have make sense.