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The second ship in the class is to be deployed to the Falklands, I wonder if the Argies will have a go now! 
It's funny how US backs away from Monroe doctrine when Brits and Falklands are involved. Yeah, I doubt that Argentinians would do anything even without one of these babies over there.
The second ship in the class is to be deployed to the Falklands, I wonder if the Argies will have a go now!
Indeed, hopefully being without support of aircraft capable of considerable maritime strike and/or a Type 23 will be an excuse to make sure Dauntless goes with Harpoon and Phalanx 1B effectively putting her at nearly her full original combat specs. The Daring has been deployed to Iran, Phalanx was fitted but sadly sans Harpoon. Diamond is on stand by to reinforce the Daring and the 2 type 23 out there if need be. 2 Type 45 and 2 Type 23 is certainly a powerful group that would nicely form 2 SAG able to provide considerable outlayer protection to the American CBG's in the gulf.
I have, in certain areas, a lot of respect for America. That said she is ultimately a self-centered, money driven country that will not shy away from enforcing "her beliefs" on other countries with the use of force under the banner of "Our beliefs are freedom, justice and liberty and so therefore no-one should live without them". That said if the money doesn't look to be good then she won't usually get involved... Given that it would arguably benefit America more if Argentina possessed the Falklands Islands I doubt she will support the UK.
The best thing the UK could do would be to focus on a strong Navy that would truly become the 2nd most powerful Navy in the world. Coupled with France, Spain and Italy it would allow Europe to act independent from America and break the stranglehold she has on world politics. While this might seem to cause instability, the reality is that it would only cause instability to the American ideal... which is a far cry from European or Asian ideals. There would be far worse things than America having to get used to a "unified and independent" Europe no longer bent over the table... In fact I think America would relish it in a way.
just make type 45 ;D unbeatable, in news they said it could wipe all south american armies ;D one ship ;D propaganda?
Armies? Not so much airforces? Maybe. Most of the stuff they're flying around in down there is from the fifties and sixties and stand-off weapons are few and far in between.
I doubt (touch wood) it is propaganda, with a Type 45 and probably an SSN down by the falkands the S.American nations have nothing that can touch us. They have out dated aircraft... In an exercise against the US using in date equipment the Type 45 was asked to turn off its radar because it kept wasting anything that moved through the air. Coupled with its more modern gun the S.American nations navies don't pose a threat... Therefore their large armies that could pose a threat don't as they cannot be used against us.
Perfect demonstration of how Seapower enables you to influence land events.
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Perfect demonstration of how Seapower enables you to influence land events.
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Illusion. No such thing as "nothing can touch us". A trained frogmen team that attach bombs under the keel is enough.
True, but getting them in position is hardly a trivial exercise. Just getting there is a problem. It's 250nm from the nearest friendly landmass and the local population is anything but friendly. Add to that the presumably rather narrow window of opportunity since she's presumably going to be spending the vast majority of her time down there patrolling. (Good luck trying to attach limpets to a moving ship)
And then of course there's the guards and hydrophones etc. (What, you thought ships didn't have defences against these things?)
Bottom mines are not an option since you can't know if the next ship is the Daring or a fishing boat. Command detonated mines are out because your men will be noticed if they hang around until the ship gets there.
And then of course there's the weather. It's winter down there and the storm season is just around the corner. Unsurprisingly, storms in near arctic conditions are not conductive to camping or ocean swimming.
That is a gross simplification of the situation. While things can happen what I meant is that with respect to economy of effort and potential threat the Daring is more than adequate for the patrol she is deploying to.
It was just an example of asymetric warfare, there are numerous of way of dealing with the so called "invincible" force. If I told that a stealth F-117 could be shot down with just soldiers visually observing from the ground and calling it in on cell phones before the Balkan war, everyone would just laugh at me telling how invincible F-117 is against an ancient soviet AA. Yet it happened.
Underestimating the resourcefulness of the enemy is just as foolish as claiming that something is untouchable.
Underestimating the resourcefulness of the enemy is just as foolish as claiming that something is untouchable.
Overestimating the resourcefulness, capacity and capability of the enemy is even more foolish IMHO. Argentina special forces are exceptionally unlikely to be able to limpet mine the Dauntless given that she will spend most of her time in deep water, on mobile patrol and far from Argentine soil. It's about the most hostile and difficult mission to attempt in deep water. Not even including the fact that we might have an SSN around plus we have air support and the nearest land mass is going to be hostil towards your insertion also.
Why are people contemplating argentinian hostilities? Has there been any political statements from anyone or is it just wet (as in naval, of course) dreams of armchair admirals?
Anyway, the easiest way of killing a technologically superior surface vessel would probably be to let a submarine lay dead still at depth somewhere in the patrol area and hope the vessel passes by close enough at less than full readyness.
Anyway, the easiest way of killing a technologically superior surface vessel would probably be to let a submarine lay dead still at depth somewhere in the patrol area and hope the vessel passes by close enough at less than full readyness.
Well, Argentina still claims that Falklands is theirs, so there is a room for new conflict there. While Brutoni is nitpicking my examples, I'll just say it's examples. My point in general was that highly technological machines of war can still be taken down by unconventional means.
Didn't mean to nitpick. Just thought you were doing the same to start with... Perhaps I should of been clearer but of course there is always a way to reach out and touch things however the fact remains that it is unlikely that Argentina is going to be able to. I felt that you were trying to nit pick at that when it is entirely correct.
We dont have the naval assets to be a serious threat to any modern navy, for now the issue is nothing more than a way for both goverments to score a few points in domestic politics, I'm quite sure Mr. Cameron is happier talking about this stuff than cutting the budget or bailing out Greece, the same goes for our goverment
That said, it will always be a great "what if" scenario if you give us a few hypotetical vessels and aircrafts, perhaps as DLC
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Nice model
A few small details like Phalanx and the 30mm cannons missing but I'd rather have the game before I die of old age than have absolutely perfect models for everything!
Regarding Stingray - the ship can't, and never will, launch the torpedo itself, it is always used as an air-launched weapon from the Lynx (or Wildcat in the future) and Merlin helicopters the T45 can carry.
A few small details like Phalanx and the 30mm cannons missing but I'd rather have the game before I die of old age than have absolutely perfect models for everything!
Regarding Stingray - the ship can't, and never will, launch the torpedo itself, it is always used as an air-launched weapon from the Lynx (or Wildcat in the future) and Merlin helicopters the T45 can carry.
Given that then ship is designed to fire.sting ray as one of the design requirements and given that they are fire and forget torpedoes capable of being launched on a bearing only setting and given that the Type 45 is fitted to be able to take a proper hull.mounted and towed array sonar I'm curious why you think this??
It's more to do with RN policy than technical limitations although both have a role to play, but for security reasons I don't want to explain more on an open forum. Not an ideal answer I know but you'll just have to trust me on this one
Apparently we will have a submarine cruising around down there: http://uk.news.yahoo.com/navy-sends-submarine-falklands-092828454.html
Im sure Argentina will be ecstatic about this..
Im sure Argentina will be ecstatic about this..