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MattyG

Attention is love.
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Mar 23, 2003
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I just have to stop.

I could keep on editing and changing and tweaking until I die. Actually, that's not the worst of it, it's all the little side projects I keep thinking up that lead to other side projects. And The Americas are pretty big. So enough is enough, time to get this thing tested out a little.

Plus I have a young son and get only 4-5 hours a week for this project.

So, I need some people to playtest this BETA version of Aberrated New World. This will eventually form a core of the Aberrated II we will make public in the not-so-distant-but-it-seems-a-long-way-off-future.

Please PM me you email address if you are interested and I will send you the .rar version ready-to-play. Thanks to jcain for the moddir.

Before you start using it and tearing it to shreds there are some important notes.

1. The focus of this part of the New World project is the Caribbean basin. Specifically there are two strong minors detailed, the Maya and the Dichali (the people we contemporraneously call the 'Pueblo' or 'Anasazi', both insults). There are also new files for the Aztecs and Zapotec, but the colonization history for these two is more difficult and most times will result in their destruction, so I have given it a little less attention. Zapotec will surely be a challenge, and have a good story, so feel free to give it a go.

2. I have also re-established the other Americas countries to a bit more of their former glory, but I have done nothing of real significance with any of them, even the Inca and Chimu (see the introduction ... ) I also have fewer great ideas for their particular Aberrated histories which would make them significantly different from their real world ones. And spending a lot of my very limited time shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic is irresponsible.

3. This beta also contains the Smallpox events, which will devestate any of the provinces the Europeans take and will eventually hit each native nation even if it survives.

4. Two major projects, the heavy redesign of the Colony file and the European-North America Trade War cycle of events remain in pieces on the cutting room floor. They are works in progress whose progress is holding up beta testing, so they will have to wait. But they add yet more intrigue to things and will be worthy additions.

5. The critical design ideas at work here are to beef up the Americas, and to explore more closely the cataclysmic changes that European invasion and colonisation bring to the New World. But also how people respond in adversity, and how cultures under pressure either collapse or change.

6. Remember that I have not altered the European files. In Aberrated II their will be fewer conquistadors and explorers who last shorter time spans and arrive later.

7. Finally, play the Europeans as well, to get a sense for the richness (or lack thereof) of the events and storylines, and to guage whether I have the power levels right. The Maya and Dichali should put up stiff resistence, but succumb to a concerted European effort. Alternatively, I hope I have made them complex enough that they can make viable allies in the new world, should the European player chose to take that route. Whichever way, they will enrich the MP experience by adding variety to an otherwise predictable affair.

Regards,

MattyG

As suggested by Incompetant, here is the link to the thread with the download.

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4147067#post4147067
 
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Beta you say? I've been looking forward to seeing this! :D

I can do a bit of testing myself, but unfortunately my machine runs EU2 quite slowly and tends to crash if you leave it running 'hands-off' for a while.

I gather you can't actually upload the file to this forum as you don't have mod powers. But it could still be uploaded to the 'EU2 - user-made scenarios and mods' forum, from which anyone can get at it. Alternatively I can host the beta on my website, but as it's on the university server, there may be some issues with that in a few weeks' time when I graduate.
 
cool, been waiting for this too. I am back in town now after a nice 3 week vacation. I should have some time Saturday and sunday to run hands off, and play some games. Can't wait to try it.
 
Please throw all of your polite and helpful comments in this thread. I can answer queries, explain storylines, justify events etc. And ultimately, we can make sure the New World section moves ahead in a quality direction.

Thanks all.

MattyG
 
Note,

The whiteman values for Maya and Dichali are a mistake. I have changed this in the version available in the thread above. If you wish to change them by hand yourself, go to

apa_1419
maa_1419

and remove the entire whiteman line

whiteman = 20

from the above files.

Sorry

Matty
 
Are Zapotec supposed to attack the Mayans instantly after campaign start ? They always do and start kicking my inept Mayan armies around like dogs! :) I've yet to see further in this war, but it doesn't look good since they can only beseige Mayan capital and never go after the southern provinces so I'm not sure what are they supposed to gain from this war.
Mayan armies are in a very bad shape, my 16000 horde always loses even to 1000 Zapotec. ;)
 
Sekenr said:
Are Zapotec supposed to attack the Mayans instantly after campaign start ? They always do and start kicking my inept Mayan armies around like dogs! :) I've yet to see further in this war, but it doesn't look good since they can only beseige Mayan capital and never go after the southern provinces so I'm not sure what are they supposed to gain from this war.
Mayan armies are in a very bad shape, my 16000 horde always loses even to 1000 Zapotec. ;)


The Zapotecs are definitely the superior army, in organisation and leadership. They start 1 landtech higher than other pagans. In the 'official history' they attacked the Mayans and took the capital. This triggers the Mayan event to flee the Peninsula and redesign themselves as solely naval-trading culture. The capital shifts to Guantanamo.

So, the Maya are 'supposed' to lose the war and retreat (to come back and fight another day?). If you follow the faux-historical route, then just give in to them, they are and should be too tough. Nice, though, to have a challenging ai to play against, eh?

If the Zapotec capture Yucatan and take over the Aztecs, the price is that they lose the CoT in Atlixco, and it shifts to Guantanamo. It will also inevitably do this once the Europeans arrive on the scene.

You can certainly try a different history and not have the Maya follow the naval-trading route, but it will be more difficult and they lose a couple of neat events. Then again, if you conquer the Aztecs and Zapotec, that would be pretty sweet as well, but very difficult.

When the Zapotec lose their CoT it triggers a "what do we do now?" event where the standard ai option is to pursue the Maya more vigorously. They gain a conquistador and can find and attack their southern provinces (and the Dichali to the North). But, not being a naval power, the Maya are safe from them until the Europeans arrive.

Oh, and the Zaptoec are Fierce. They are still on a cultural high after being led brilliantly back from near-submission at the hands of the Maya and Aztecs to now dominate the Isthmus.

MattyG
 
The second election of Dichali, the year needs to be changed, its the same as the first. Also no attack by the Zap yet on the Maya. I will edit this as I go along, but so far, its pritty boring. :)

If the Zaps take the aztexs as an AI, the under the sun god event fires twice, once as the main one, the other as the ai one. You need to toss in a not for one of the events. Oh and are they suppose to have aztex culture on their capital, seems a little wierd.

Election of 1471 shows up as an "Unknow String Wanted" in the Desc.

Event #202267 never happened, made it really easy to stomp out the rebellion since they had no army. Might want to make 266 trigger it, also had the first religon event pop up, but had to quit as it was getting very late.
 
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Billdo said:
The second election of Dichali year needs to be changed, its the same as the first. Also no attack by the Zap yet on the Maya. I will edit this as I go along, but so far, its pritty boring. :)

Thanks for that.

Yes, pagans can be a little tedious until the Europeans arrive. The Dichali are an isolationist culture to begin with. You can always do some housework while you wait for elections, random events and DP change times.

As for the Zap, they won't always attack. That's the ai for you, not always predictable.
 
Dichali

After a few turns getting land tech to 1 and amassing about 500 gold i went out and first sacked Aztecs with Zapotecs for some reason jumping in and attacking Aztecs too. too bad i was there first and annexed them.

Moving onto Zapotecs. a mostly horse army. which is probably should be disallowed before the europeans are in Americas bait, line and sinker, took out a 2x times bigger Zapotec army and then upon reaching yucatan sat there without any progress for 4 years as Yucatan has siege food ration supply limit of "ZERO" why is it soo much harder to occupy this land i do not know

Also allthe leaders in Dichali elections come without any legend, that is there is no particular reason to vote for one as opposed to the other.

then milking the economy for a few turns for gold and finally becoming settler positive allowed to connect the zapotec and azztec territory to dichali and this brought another 20% gold to already gold rich nation. Which allowed to pay back 2 loans (loans? from who?) anyways. this also allowed to become bbuddy buddy to maya and share maps. then ging for inca empire. Now putting the settlers in the istmus of america will be tough order as they drip at painfully slow rate but likely will pay off in the long term.

ratehr easy on VH and normal agression
 
Tarakan,

Most of the early Mokai have no options because there is so little that is different between them. There culture is largely in cruise mode until Yiska comes along, although Hototo at least gets the army going a little. However, I think I will add legends to the choices so that there's no "Unknown String" messages. Apart from Hototo they are all pretty bad until Yiska and Doba anyway.

It's always easy for experienced players to do crazy things with pagan countries before the Europeans arrive, because their theatres are so limited and the few ai countries pose little threat. There is just no way to prevent players from 'abusing' ai set ups without highly deterministic, harsh events which would try to force you to do virtually NOTHING, which is what the pagans 'should' do until the Europeans arrive. Or else have them each territorially isolated, another harsh approach.

The fact that people can get world conquests with places like Benin shows that with the right skill you can do horrendously impossible things with EU2. I have no inention in fighting against this.

Storylines and the events built around them can't be written with potential 'abuse' in mind, becasue they need to be reasonable and have a structure that the ai will also follow.

The Zapotec should not have cavalry, and I have no idea how they got it. There was an error in this regard with the Dichali and Maya, but the version I posted the next day removed that. I never gave the Zapotecs a leg-up with whiteman, so this totally confuses me, and I have no intention of having horses in the New World before the Euroepans arrive with them. :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

Sounds like you are bored out of your brain with this. maybe it needs to stay an ai region for you!

Thanks again for your comments.
 
I got to about 1615 with Dichali before I got one of the fun ctd with no auto save for the last 50 years or so. :( Before that I converded to cathlic, had some problems, but nothing too bad. Mayan did get diped by the incas, kind of wierd, but I ran with it. Some other things I noticed:

If the Zaps take the aztexs as an AI, the under the sun god event fires twice, once as the main one, the other as the ai one. You need to toss in a not for one of the events. Oh and are they suppose to have aztex culture on their capital, seems a little wierd.

Election of 1471 shows up as an "Unknow String Wanted" in the Desc.

Event #202267 never happened, made it really easy to stomp out the rebellion since they had no army. Might want to make 266 trigger it.

Overall I played the part, I had a free rain colonizing california and texas after getting the two explorers. I think I jumped the gun tho cause I had several pagan provance that I need to convert. Overall it was not a bad game, just alot of waiting around. Think I am going to do mayan next.
 
I meant to say my army was all horse.
I just imagined buffalo riding indians.
i will modify the string
 
after using your latest patch dichali has iroqois troop commander names with names like "ottawa" and such
 
Yes, the names for the generic commanders I have not inserted yet. The named commanders should still be Dichali.

Ah, right, so you meant you had the cavalry. Please note this is definitely not meant to have occured. Never my intention.
 
Billdo said:
I got to about 1615 with Dichali before I got one of the fun ctd with no auto save for the last 50 years or so. :( Before that I converded to cathlic, had some problems, but nothing too bad. Mayan did get diped by the incas, kind of wierd, but I ran with it. Some other things I noticed:

If the Zaps take the aztexs as an AI, the under the sun god event fires twice, once as the main one, the other as the ai one. You need to toss in a not for one of the events. Oh and are they suppose to have aztex culture on their capital, seems a little wierd.

Election of 1471 shows up as an "Unknow String Wanted" in the Desc.

Event #202267 never happened, made it really easy to stomp out the rebellion since they had no army. Might want to make 266 trigger it.

Overall I played the part, I had a free rain colonizing california and texas after getting the two explorers. I think I jumped the gun tho cause I had several pagan provance that I need to convert. Overall it was not a bad game, just alot of waiting around. Think I am going to do mayan next.


Excellent, thanks for your playtesting on this. Once I get in a few more comments I will change all of the reported errors.

More importantly, I need to know if the Dichali make sense. Is the storyline interesting? (It continues right up until the 1800s with some interesting braches and events). Are they too powerful? Are they too weak?

Weird the Mayans getting done in by the Inca. How did they get across the water????
 
MattyG said:
Excellent, thanks for your playtesting on this. Once I get in a few more comments I will change all of the reported errors.

More importantly, I need to know if the Dichali make sense. Is the storyline interesting? (It continues right up until the 1800s with some interesting braches and events). Are they too powerful? Are they too weak?

Weird the Mayans getting done in by the Inca. How did they get across the water????

The story line is fine, I ended up opening up the event file to get a feel for the later events and they seemed fine. I promish I will sit down and finish this game later in the week, just did not have the time for now. Overall, I think that you need to make sure that they have a coloniztional ai when they need it and none when they don't.

Other then that, its a fun side state that I don't know how much I could play again, it is isolated and fun later on, just alot of waiting for the events to kick in. (talkin 2 to 3 hours on high speed)

BTW the mayans ended up getting in an alliance, vassalized, then annexed by the incas, personatly I don't know why you have them knowing each other. Maybe chicas knowing the mayans but not the incans. Just a comment I had.
 
Billdo said:
The story line is fine, I ended up opening up the event file to get a feel for the later events and they seemed fine. I promish I will sit down and finish this game later in the week, just did not have the time for now. Overall, I think that you need to make sure that they have a coloniztional ai when they need it and none when they don't.

Other then that, its a fun side state that I don't know how much I could play again, it is isolated and fun later on, just alot of waiting for the events to kick in. (talkin 2 to 3 hours on high speed)

BTW the mayans ended up getting in an alliance, vassalized, then annexed by the incas, personatly I don't know why you have them knowing each other. Maybe chicas knowing the mayans but not the incans. Just a comment I had.

Yes, the pagans are always a little dull early on. Minor countries like this will always be played only occassionally, but hopefully the roleplaying aspect of the Maya and Dichali is more attractive than most minors. What is really important is that they are a more significant presence for the Europeans when they arrive. (That said, a good player should be able to take the Maya or Dichali and conquer the world with them if eberything goes well.) I also see value in these countries in MP, especially in a later scenario, should we get around to constructing one.

The Mayans know about the Incas only so they can get into their CoT. The Incas don't know about the Mayans, but steal the maps from the Chimu. I think that I need to script more relational events between the Chimu and Maya, such that if the Chimu get attacked or annexed, the Maya get continual -200 relations with the Incas, to ensure that rampant ai DiploAnnexation does not occur (the bane of EU2!!!!).
 
the cost of placing a merchant in Maya COT in the place of the future american detention camp in Guantanamo is 13 gold. Placing a merchant in the COT that is in the capital of the nation that wants to place the merchant should not be that expensive