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Requesting information about the new crit system

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Hidden Gunman said:
Don't have any issue with what you say, except for the first point, which I will address. On the other though, Germany was not prepared for a long war, although it was probably inevitable...there was no real purpose to the war, while there was a lot of German aggression, they tended to stumble into things, their strategy was largely directionless. For instance, there was no real intent to go into the Medit. other than propping up Italy; there was also no actual plan for beating the Soviet Union, simply an expectation that if they killed enough, and captured a couple of cities which were important in the german mindset then the Soviets would give in. Similarly, the germans declared war on the US, with no real plan. German armoured development kicked on after the invasion of the Soviet Union, when they came up against their 1940 vintage tanks - T34's and KV's...that caused a shock.

Regarding the first point, there was a significant disjoint between US industry, and the combat front, combined with a lack of depth. There was no real single doctrine for armoured combat, resulting in a mixmatch where tanks were to fight anything but other tanks, and enemy tanks were to be fought by 'tank destroyers'. While an original concept of the US armoured force called for something around 60 armoured divisions, they eventually only reached around 20, but had enough tank destroyers to equip (if they had been tanks) another 16 divisions (in the European theatre). Added to that, there was a swarm of 'GHQ' tank battalions, supposedly to supplement infantry divisions etc. The British weren't much better, with the concept of cruiser tanks and 'infantry' tanks, but at least that was roughly comparable with the use of 'main force' tanks and 'heavy' tank units in other forces.

Battle wise though, western strategic art was far behind what the Soviets were up to. While the Soviet art of war cost massive losses, they were losses that they could and did accept, in a battle doctrine that was intended to overwhelm and shatter opposing forces on a massive scale...the strength of their abilities in that regard was to be able to do so, repeatedly, putting each of the German army groups through the mincer one after the other, while both logistically and administratively supporting those massive forces, and actually increasing them. At the same time on the western front, the Brits and US were attempting to emulate the blitzkrieg 'single point' breakthrough model of 1940, which was well and truly past its' use by date...they then, in 1945, had to resort to a broad front offensive, although by that stage the germans were no longer what they once were.
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The lend-lease program was voted the 11 march 1941. on the 14th of augustus they signed th e Atlantic chart. US were escorting shipping convoys to nations in war. Hitler gave orders to the u-boats to not fire on any circumstances on any american naval ship back then to avoid being forced in a war with US he didn't want but proposed in the same in time in july 1941 an offensive alliance to the Japs. He knew the naval battle was impossible to him and his u-boats and the colonies were everything to the war effort so he counted on the Japs to make the job. These orders were not respected, there was the USS Greer incident on 4 september 1941 and the HMS Broadwater being sunked on 18 october 1941. Then it continued with the USS Kearny on 17 october and USS Reuben James on 31 october 1941. All by wolf packed u-boats chasing the convoys. It didn't lead to any declaration of war. Pearl Harbor did the job cause there was there a clear intent to sink american naval forces and a few days later the entire Axis joined. All that was planned cause there was no possibility to win any war on the german side if the economy convoys from USA and british and french colonies were left untouched. The germany strategy was always to force quickly separate peaces. The whole bombing of english cities followed this logic as the rush to Moscow. It lead to the opposite effect though.

I wouldn't dare to speak about Soviets doctrine i don't know shit about that but afaik the Soviets were the perfect example of using people as meatshield... Not the US in that matter.
And i really don't know where you are going with this, we speak about 80 000 tanks losses on the Soviet side, not speaking about the personnal obivously... To me there is really nothing in there showing any "superiority".
 
Leenday said:
Continue talking here about politics and history, so we never get a crit system update or revert.

Mods, can you clear all the Wikipedia pastas from this thread?
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There is a community. It's maybe why there isn't anyone in this game, there are here a hell of a bunch of constant whinners...
Imo it is not with whinning posts you'll have any change at all. And it is probly your kind of last messages i would delete at first if i were a mod. What's the prob with the offtopic, there is nothing else to add to the crit subject everything has been said.
Why don't you let people talk if they are happy to talk, ask yourself.

Actually it even keeps the topic on top.
 
I suspect that the devs are very much aware of the angst at the crit. system. However, I will offer again that if anyone wishes to have a go at my views or continue to debate, I'm more than happy to do so on a specific thread.

On topic though, the question looked like it was answered.
 
It's not answered until there is any response from devs via updates, patches or simple forum posts.


20% kill chance by a front penetration? AT planes nerfed to the ground, AT guns nerfed to the ground.
Infantry ATs never have been so suicidal as right now - risking their lives hunting for the tanks in a 200m range... only for a "Tracks/wheels damaged"!

Ranked is "Which Armored deck is better" and you god know which it is.
Alternatively just fill your deck with a lot of vehicles of any kind. It doesn't matter how much armor - it will survive a couple of shots anyway.

Don't use infantry - it dies! Use armor instead - it survives. Survives 3-4 penetrating hits until it literally loses all its invisible HP to the AP fire and cracks open. Finally.
 
Leenday said:
It's not answered until there is any response from devs via updates, patches or simple forum posts.


20% kill chance by a front penetration? AT planes nerfed to the ground, AT guns nerfed to the ground.
Infantry ATs never have been so suicidal as right now - risking their lives hunting for the tanks in a 200m range... only for a "Tracks/wheels damaged"!

Ranked is "Which Armored deck is better" and you god know which it is.
Alternatively just fill your deck with a lot of vehicles of any kind. It doesn't matter how much armor - it will survive a couple of shots anyway.

Don't use infantry - it dies! Use armor instead - it survives. Survives 3-4 penetrating hits until it literally loses all its invisible HP to the AP fire and cracks open. Finally.
Click to expand...

Then how about posting on the devs' own forums? Which these forums aren't....
 
Leenday said:
It's not answered until there is any response from devs via updates, patches or simple forum posts.


20% kill chance by a front penetration? AT planes nerfed to the ground, AT guns nerfed to the ground.
Infantry ATs never have been so suicidal as right now - risking their lives hunting for the tanks in a 200m range... only for a "Tracks/wheels damaged"!

Ranked is "Which Armored deck is better" and you god know which it is.
Alternatively just fill your deck with a lot of vehicles of any kind. It doesn't matter how much armor - it will survive a couple of shots anyway.

Don't use infantry - it dies! Use armor instead - it survives. Survives 3-4 penetrating hits until it literally loses all its invisible HP to the AP fire and cracks open. Finally.
Click to expand...

Is there an actual question here?
 
Leenday said:
It's not answered until there is any response from devs via updates, patches or simple forum posts.


20% kill chance by a front penetration? AT planes nerfed to the ground, AT guns nerfed to the ground.
Infantry ATs never have been so suicidal as right now - risking their lives hunting for the tanks in a 200m range... only for a "Tracks/wheels damaged"!

Ranked is "Which Armored deck is better" and you god know which it is.
Alternatively just fill your deck with a lot of vehicles of any kind. It doesn't matter how much armor - it will survive a couple of shots anyway.

Don't use infantry - it dies! Use armor instead - it survives. Survives 3-4 penetrating hits until it literally loses all its invisible HP to the AP fire and cracks open. Finally.
Click to expand...
What you see in the video of the first post has been fixed, infantry and puppschen/pak37 rockets used to make very small damage.
 
EUG_FLX said:
What you see in the video of the first post has been fixed, infantry and puppschen/pak37 rockets used to make very small damage.
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Puppchen is still broken. Right now it's gonna take it 12 penetrating hits to kill a Sherman.
export Ammo_Rkt_Puppchen_88mm is TAmmunitionDescriptor
Arme = EArmeType/AP_20
TempsEntreDeuxTirs = 1.0
PorteeMaximale = ((2500) * Metre)
PorteeMaximaleHA = ((0) * Metre)
PorteeMinimale = ((0) * Metre)
PhysicalDamages = 1.0 <- this should be 6.0!
SuppressDamages = 800.0
TempsDeVisee = 1.0
TempsEntreDeuxSalves = 10.0
NbTirParSalves = 1

P.S. I really appreciate someone from Eugen replied.
I hope you understand that's not just my butthurt. I speak not only for myself - fix crits please! Percentages are ridiculously low and there is no reason to play an infantry deck. This is game-breaking right now and these aren't just empty words.
 
LOL...good vid. Who says that SD isn't like WG? I seem to recall a few WG metas that worked the same way...

There's no surprise in that though, we knew within hours of the change that grouped armour was the new meta, it's just an extension of using small groups to a rush tactic.
 
Leenday said:
Puppchen is still broken. Right now it's gonna take it 12 penetrating hits to kill a Sherman.
export Ammo_Rkt_Puppchen_88mm is TAmmunitionDescriptor
Arme = EArmeType/AP_20
TempsEntreDeuxTirs = 1.0
PorteeMaximale = ((2500) * Metre)
PorteeMaximaleHA = ((0) * Metre)
PorteeMinimale = ((0) * Metre)
PhysicalDamages = 1.0 <- this should be 6.0!
SuppressDamages = 800.0
TempsDeVisee = 1.0
TempsEntreDeuxSalves = 10.0
NbTirParSalves = 1

P.S. I really appreciate someone from Eugen replied.
I hope you understand that's not just my butthurt. I speak not only for myself - fix crits please! Percentages are ridiculously low and there is no reason to play an infantry deck. This is game-breaking right now and these aren't just empty words.
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Okay pupschen uses a different weapon than Pak37 for the rocket so it was forgotten.

I've made a check, besides puppschen the Hs129/Ju87G guns needed a fix. You'll get it in the next patch.
However I've verified, infantry weapons don't do 1 damage as I've heard in the last posted video.

Also note that some crits add damage, lowering the number of shot required to get a kill and increasing the one shot probability for light vehicles.
 
EUG_FLX said:
Also note that some crits add damage, lowering the number of shot required to get a kill and increasing the one shot probability for light vehicles.
Click to expand...

Thanks for update! What about small normal AT-guns like 6-pdr, pak 38, pak 36? Also did you check LG40/42?

EUG_FLX said:
Also note that some crits add damage, lowering the number of shot required to get a kill and increasing the one shot probability for light vehicles.
Click to expand...

Any details about mechanics?
 
Last edited:
@EUG_FLX, I'm also concerned about halftracks. Please, take a look:

  • All halftracks in the game have 8 HP
  • 37mm guns deal 3 DMG
  • 50mm guns deal 4 DMG
  • 75-76mm guns deal 5-6 DMG

Also consider that every hit besides HP damage is 20% kill, 80% crit.

With all of these in mind, every halftrack will survive the first penetrating shot and die after the second.
Bear in mind that these are accurate hits and guns tend to miss! So the average shots fired could be 3-4 on a single halftrack.

This is too much and there's not enough time to deal with a huge load of halftracks - they will overwhelm you in a current state.

I think halftracks should really have less HP.
 
Alex646 said:
Well, nothing new actually. Autocannon rush was good in SD since release.
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True, but as he said - It was never as powerful as it is now. Also, imo this has less chance of success on more open maps. On the other hand, on the open maps I struggle against Firefly/Cromwell opener, so it's just same.
EUG_FLX said:
Also note that some crits add damage, lowering the number of shot required to get a kill and increasing the one shot probability for light vehicles.
Click to expand...

Could we have this more detailed please?

Also could you guys do a Dev Blog entry that details all accuracy/penetration mechanics pretty please with cherry on top?
 
Alex646 said:
Well, nothing new actually. Autocannon rush was good in SD since release.
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It was good, but never this good.

These tactics are also viable in 1v1, especially with 9th Panzer. 2-3 squads of panzergrenadiers to hold the line, spend all your points on pzIs and pzIIs and maybe some flammpanzers and just fast move them.

If your enemy can't guess where your rush is coming from, you will win easily. If he can, you can destroy his at guns and medium tanks before your tanks die, you will still win, probably.
 
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