Srivijiya/Indonesia

[Don_Quigleone]

NOTE!!!!: The first few posts might seem rather nonsensical, this thread started as one thing and became something completely different, so note all it is now about is events for countries in the east indies


Here's a nation idea to fill a gap in pacific, western america and east asia, howabout a country in california, doesn't come in contact with europeans but instead goes out and explores and perhaps meets the chinese and/or explores eastern siberia, pacific, east indies, could perhaps convert to confucianism or somesuch, what do you guys think, cause often enough california isn't explored until well into the 1600s, it would only require one nation tag, and besides america needs "aberrated" more, I'll elaborate more if and admin doesn't slam it

EDIT: or they could originate in the pacific, maybe the polynesians got up to more than we thought...

 

[orimazd]

The Polynesians went everywhere except maybe Easter Island. In the Pacific. Interesting idea, and the Polynesians would be the only ones who would explore. There aren't many trees in southern california.

 

[MattyG]

We have the Dichali nearby already and the California region is the main target of the Korean colonial ambition.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

hmm how about new zealand or australia, the polynesians are rather left out...

 

[unmerged(16159)]

hmm how about new zealand or australia, the polynesians are rather left out...

Maybe New Zealand, but the geographic and resource limitations that existed IRL wouls a;so make it difficult to suppose any nation doing anything in the game. But perhaps the maoris take on Fiji, and a single culture develpos on some of those larger islands...

 

[Don_Quigleone]

maybe, but as far as I know britain is not much better than new zealand, and both are quite fertile(australia in south east)

 

[orimazd]

New Zealand was filled with a lot of different warring tribes, none of which gained any upper hand over the others until the British introduced the potato (food that can last) and guns (advanced technology). AFAIK none of the tribes individually had it in them to develop guns themselves, and potatoes were indiginous to South America.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

hmm yes but in a abberated world maybe one of the tribes ended out raining supreme through exploration, or not, but more pacific powers are needed, also maybe the agceep map should be used insteafd of the standard one, I don't think it adds any new provinces and I do find those ocean currents are nice, it makes pacific exploration more feasable,

 

[orimazd]

They didn't have the manpower to subdue the other tribes. Unless you can find a way around that...

 

[Don_Quigleone]

ho hum... well okay, say an empire arises in indonesia or somethings, they conquer south eastern australia, the empire collapses and splinters, this splinter kingdom goes off and colonises new zealand so we have newzealand-australian empire

 

[orimazd]

I think indonesia might be a better (and cooler) idea, as in EU2 the place is potentially very rich. Plus, if would be awesome. A potential kingdom to use is Srivijaya or a state modelled off it, or its competitor the Melayu Kingdom.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

You do have a point... but the thing is I've always thought thte colonisers should be outside the region they colonise, besides that nothing ever happens in australia and new zealand

 

[orimazd]

Something I should have done with the Inca region a long time ago.



That's Srivijaya at its furthest extent in the 1200s. Obviously, if we are going to have something there, we don't want it to be that big unless it is falling apart at game start. Both Melayu and Srivijaya started off in the Jambi province, which should produce gold because there were gold mines there.

I'm for Srivijaya's collapse holding off until game start; perhaps it could be held by Chola, as its kings are Cholan like Spain and Austria were Hapsburg. Is Chola Hindu or Buddhist? If it is Hindu as I think it is, then the king of Chola could be cracking down on Buddhism and/or Islam in its territories for whatever reason (did this ever happen in Indian history? I mean, Islam is possible, and it probably happened in Vijayanagar), causing Srivijaya to rebel against its Cholan overlords. Indonesia could split up into three regions--Malacca and the northern halves of Sumatra and Brunei Muslim; the southern half of Sumatra, the southern half of Brunei, and the Eastern two provinces of Java Buddhist; and Sulawesi, the rest of Java, and the other islands between java and timor Hindu.

I know this for the most part reflects vanilla in 1419, so if you want to get rid of one of the regions (probably Hindu, since there won't be a Mataram) or want to shift them around some that would be much better.

Since Srivijaya colonized Madagascar, a Buddhist Madagascar in its infancy as a nation forgotten by its colonizers would rock. If this was mymap; I forgot that its two provinces in vanilla map.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

While madagascar would rock it only has two provinces so... well if we have a prospective coloniser in the east indies we could have them focus on the spice trade to europe or something (I do know that cinnamon went from indies to europe via madagascar) we could have the united kingdom collapse at game start and the player choose which part they control, and the rest declare independent, but maybe from gameplay perspective it's best they all start off seperated out, I don't know nearly enough about the region to really say anything though, but we could have a coloniser here who focuses on southeast asia, east africa, siberia and (maybe maybe) western us (well korea needs a competitor...) what you think? that said we'd need some way for europeans to get in there so they can't be too strong

 

[orimazd]

the Muslim and Buddhist state would concentrate on southeast Asia. I just brought up Madagascar because Srivijaya colonized it (there is no doubt of this, even though it is so far away).

In the real world, I don't mean randomly in interregnated world. Jared Diamond mentioned it in Guns Germs and Steel, and it says so on Wikipedia, so it must be true!

 

[Don_Quigleone]

I know they (or another south east asian nation) did so because the cinnamon trade came through there, but I don't think it would be feasible in game for it to be independent because it's just two provinces, maybe if it was united with several other islands/provinces, gosh we've sure gone far away from california

 

[orimazd]

If the Srivijaya empire can go to Madagascar, they could probably make it all the way to california. Feel better?

 

[Don_Quigleone]

indeed , though the pacific is slightly harder to cross then the pacific

 

[orimazd]

in the game, its about as hard to cross the pacific from the philippines to south America as it is to cross the indian ocean from table to sunda. At least for me.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

yeah but you can make a stop off in india (pretty easy, you just give a nation enough money till they like you enough to give you military access) also you don't need explorers either, so I would say it's harder to cross pacific (plus you can easily get lost exploring and not find the islands you're looking for