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The Butterfly Effect: A British AAR

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Nathan Madien - A good argument, but I think I've come up with a cunning plan for those ships in any case. More importantly the Aussies will need to save their defence money for the plans in the next update. ;)

KiMaSa - Glad you liked it, can I say at this point it's been a pleasure to see Forging Destiny make a come back.

As you say commanders are usually key, the far east stations were usually dumping grounds so it's not promising. However at present the Eastern Fleet is arguably the second most powerful force in the RN, that makes it a prestigious posting. Certainly I don't think many high flyers will be sent to command the 'R's bobbing around the Med so they'll have to go somewhere else, why not east?
 
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Why not strip the armaments out and use them in shore batteries? Are the Italian 8 inch weapons suitable for British/Commonwealth munitions?
 
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Sir Humphrey said:
Why not strip the armaments out and use them in shore batteries? Are the Italian 8 inch weapons suitable for British/Commonwealth munitions?
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I don't think so, at least the Italian 8 inch guns used on the Zaras use almost 50% more propellant charge than the British 8" Mark VIII (42.8 kg vs 29.94 kg). So me think using British munitions on Italian guns would result in much degraded gun characteristics. ;)
 
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Interesting, never thought of that. Didn't they also have short barrel lives as well?
 
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Carlstadt Boy - It's a fairly popular combo, seeing those two face-off? And who doesn't want to see Zeroes and *New FAA toy* clashing over the South China Sea while *Different new FAA toy* make torpedo runs on the Combined Fleet?

Sir Humphrey - Italian 8" were all about range, accuracy was bad and wear rates were worse.

Now for a shore installation range is key while accuracy slightly less important (after all the gun isn't moving so it's not as tricky as pure naval gunnery). Sadly even with their long range an 8" is just too short, any decent BB will out-range it and pummel the installation with impunity. That alone kills it even before all the logistical and maintenance issues.

EDIT: I see you beat me to some of that. ;)
 
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Quick slip of the fingers old chum.
 
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One of life's spooky coincidences clearly.
ja.gif
 
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Sir Humphrey said:
Interesting, never thought of that. Didn't they also have short barrel lives as well?
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I suppose that since the Italian guns have higher muzzle velocity compared to their British counterparts, their barrel wear should be worse than the ones on the British CAs.

El Pip said:
Sir Humphrey - Italian 8" were all about range, accuracy was bad and wear rates were worse.
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I'd say their guns are pretty potent in terms of destructive power, since they fire a heavier shell at a higher velocity than the British 8". (However, it is also true their shells' burst charges are smaller.) Accuracy was bad because the guns were too close together. (bad design :p)

El Pip said:
Now for a shore installation range is key while accuracy slightly less important (after all the gun isn't moving so it's not as tricky as pure naval gunnery). Sadly even with their long range an 8" is just too short, any decent BB will out-range it and pummel the installation with impunity. That alone kills it even before all the logistical and maintenance issues.

EDIT: I see you beat me to some of that. ;)
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I'm not too sure about having 8" guns as coastal guns in the first place if the shore is likely to be bombarded by battleship-sized ships. But as you all might know, installing naval guns as coastal guns usually mean the range of the guns will be extended by at least some 30%? using different shells and/or propellants. The guns on the Zara have a range of around 31.5km. With the added 30% it will be like 41 km, which actually outrange the KGVs' 14", the South Dakotas' 16" and the Iowas' 16".

But anyways, it's not like those coastal guns can hit anything out that far in the first place without proper fire control. And 8" guns won't damage BBs significantly. ;)
 
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Lovely update, Pippy. Splitting the fleet is scary, but the point is well-made that without the spectre of a joint German/Italian navy, the force in the home waters is sufficient. Not entirely sure that the eastern force is, though. Looking forward to the next one.

Vann
 
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Carlstadt Boy - It's popular because it's the obvious choice, Cunningham was one of the outstanding British admirals of the war. If your sending your best and brightest East he'd have to be on your short list.

Therefore I'll probably do it as it's one of those times when 'cool alt history to see' coincides with 'What people would actually do'

Vann the Red - If something has to be under-resourced, it's not going to the Home Fleet so the East had to get less than it 'needs'. Certainly the Admiralty will be agreeing with you and looking to re-unite the fleet as soon as they can. That or pushing for even more tonnage so they can have two fleets that are big enough. :D
 
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It better get beefed up, otherwise the IJN will squeeze that Eastern Fleet until El Pip squeaks! :D

Dury.
 
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Bafflegab - Huge fleets are the answer to almost every question, except those starting 'How does the Treasury save money'. :D

Duritz - True words, but the fleet wont be on it's own as you shall soon see... ;)
 
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El Pip said:
Bafflegab - Huge fleets are the answer to almost every question, except those starting 'How does the Treasury save money'. :D

Duritz - True words, but the fleet won't be on its own as you shall soon see... ;)
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Then I take it that the RAF will be making serious deployment of assets to the Far East? Especially long range reconnaissance bombers and fighter aircraft?
 
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KiMaSa said:
Then I take it that the RAF will be making serious deployment of assets to the Far East? Especially long range reconnaissance bombers and fighter aircraft?
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If that happens, perhaps the Repulse and Prince of Wales might live to see another day.
 
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I wonder if the success of torpedo carrying a/c in the Italian campaign will see the RAF with a greater emphasis on land-based torpedo bombers like the Beufort--a wing at Singapore would be v.useful and a great help to an inferior (in numbers) RN fleet.

The fact that there are multiple carriers on station gives the fleet organic air cover, much better than trying to coordinate same from land. Hopefully we'll soon hear what the FAA is getting in terms of fighters--hopefully a competitive single-engined monoplane...
 
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DonnieBaseball said:
I wonder if the success of torpedo carrying a/c in the Italian campaign will see the RAF with a greater emphasis on land-based torpedo bombers like the Beufort--a wing at Singapore would be v.useful and a great help to an inferior (in numbers) RN fleet.

The fact that there are multiple carriers on station gives the fleet organic air cover, much better than trying to coordinate same from land. Hopefully we'll soon hear what the FAA is getting in terms of fighters--hopefully a competitive single-engined monoplane...
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THat in fact is a very interesting proposition. As it happens, I was wondering the same thing, mainly because I could see especially Coastal Command with a torpedo Beau, as it would give them an better anti-ship capability even against heavier units, especially in the far east.
 
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trekaddict said:
THat in fact is a very interesting proposition. As it happens, I was wondering the same thing, mainly because I could see especially Coastal Command with a torpedo Beau, as it would give them an better anti-ship capability even against heavier units, especially in the far east.
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I wonder how the torpedo Beau will stand up to the Imperial Japanese Air Force.
 
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