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The Butterfly Effect: A British AAR

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TheButterflyComposer - The Air Ministry was capable of acts of ridiculous ambition at times, this and LARYNX are the obvious examples and neither went especially well. But as you say, when you have pretentious of being a leading global power you have to take everything very seriously and at least make an effort in every field

Comparing money is notoriously tricky. £300k directly converts to about £20million if you use inflation only. But as a share of GDP figure it's nearer £120million in today's money. To put it another way, £300k would buy the Air Ministry two full 20-plane squadrons of Spitfire Mk.Is.
 
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El Pip said:
Comparing money is notoriously tricky. £300k directly converts to about £20million if you use inflation only. But as a share of GDP figure it's nearer £120million in today's money. To put it another way, £300k would buy the Air Ministry two full 20-plane squadrons of Spitfire Mk.Is.
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I always find context important with history and monetary comparisons easier if you know what you could 'get' with that money. So £300k now sounds quite a bit more, at least for the air ministry. Still not actually that expensive in terms of governance but for a ministry that was never particularly well funded (military ones never are), seems a little politically difficult. Certainly a gamble.
 
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I think I may have got lost down a ridiculous rabbit hole, a diversion too far even by my own lax standards. I found myself looking at the hows and whys of the formation of Imperial Airways. While this is interesting, it also happened in 1924 and cannot possibly have any influence on the story I was once attempting to tell. I think what I need to do is just skim over why the Empire Air Mail Scheme picked seaplanes and then get down to the tech pron.

So unless anyone has any strong feelings about wanting to know the details of British policy on land planes vs seaplanes I'll do that. Any views?
 
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El Pip said:
I think I may have got lost down a ridiculous rabbit hole, a diversion too far even by my own lax standards. I found myself looking at the hows and whys of the formation of Imperial Airways. While this is interesting, it also happened in 1924 and cannot possibly have any influence on the story I was once attempting to tell. I think what I need to do is just skim over why the Empire Air Mail Scheme picked seaplanes and then get down to the tech pron.

So unless anyone has any strong feelings about wanting to know the details of British policy on land planes vs seaplanes I'll do that. Any views?
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You're asking me? After the large discussion that was had on seaplanes, I think that quite a few aspects of them was covered including some advantages and disadvantages. Unless the British picked them for obscure and entertaining reasons, the discussion that will presumably break out after and before the next post will probably cover the stuff that gets skimmed over in the actual chapter.
To be honest, I want to get onto the bit where they start using those planes in combat. Flying post office vans against the Nazis is something the Internet need some more of.
 
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El Pip said:
I think I may have got lost down a ridiculous rabbit hole, a diversion too far even by my own lax standards. I found myself looking at the hows and whys of the formation of Imperial Airways. While this is interesting, it also happened in 1924 and cannot possibly have any influence on the story I was once attempting to tell. I think what I need to do is just skim over why the Empire Air Mail Scheme picked seaplanes and then get down to the tech pron.

So unless anyone has any strong feelings about wanting to know the details of British policy on land planes vs seaplanes I'll do that. Any views?
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Who are you and what did you do with the real El Pip?

This whole story has been about going into the rabbit hole. ;)

Of course, I'm perfectly fine with more tech pron!
 
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El Pip said:
Any views?
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Any views? From this lot?!? Pfft! Where to start I say... :D

I vote for kicking this can down the road so we can get back to the Socialist victory in Spain... sponsored by Tanks, of course!

Dury.
 
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Duritz said:
Any views? From this lot?!? Pfft! Where to start I say... :D

I vote for kicking this can down the road so we can get back to the Socialist victory in Spain... sponsored by Tanks, of course!

Dury.
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If only there was some way to build an amphibious flying tank-boat, then we'd all be happy!

And could just use tanks for everything.
 
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Perhaps a discussion of the rise of Short Brothers since they were so intimately associated with Imperial Airways, with numerous government contracts to supply long distance aircraft to service the edges of the Empire. You get flying boats, Empire Airways and Ministry machinations in a neat bundle.
 
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TheButterflyComposer - Nothing massively obscure, most of the reasons are the ones you'd pick if you took the time to think about it. I must however disappoint you, there will at some point probably be flying boats hunting Nazis, but it won't be for quite some time.

TheExecuter - That is true, this entire endeavour was prompted by a post about the World Cup. Which is why I feel I have to drag myself back on track and get back to some good, wholesome tech pron.

Nathan Madien - It is a wonderful thing, flying post office vans hunting Nazis. Should be a film made about it really.

Duritz - After this I do need to get back to Spain. There will probably be tanks, there will definitely be socialists, I'm also thinking of putting in some Wild Geese.

TheButterflyComposer - That is alarmingly possible. First step is give the Soviet Union a few more heavy bombers, that will give them the aircraft to make the Antonov A-40 concept work (the famed glider tank), which hit the problem of a lack of suitable tow aircraft. At that point just replace the underslung T-60 tank with it's sister the amphibious T-40 and there you go. A flying amphibious tank.

Davout - The Short clan are indeed an interesting bunch, my favourite would be Horace Short who, shortly after visiting Robert Louis Stevenson in Samoa, managed to get captured by cannibals. Being a strong, clever chap he managed to convince them he was a God and after a brief few weeks of worship, made a canoe and escaped. It may well not be true, but I prefer to think it is. After all this is the part of the world were Prince Phillip is still worshipped as a God, with signed photos of him being revered as holy relics.
 
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El Pip said:
That is alarmingly possible. First step is give the Soviet Union a few more heavy bombers, that will give them the aircraft to make the Antonov A-40 concept work (the famed glider tank), which hit the problem of a lack of suitable tow aircraft. At that point just replace the underslung T-60 tank with it's sister the amphibious T-40 and there you go. A flying amphibious tank
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Ah you see then, these communists, they aren't all bad.
 
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Just for the record, these tangents are always informative and delightful. While I am all for returning to Spain, the intrepid quests of the British public delivery system is always welcome XD. Also, since it has been years, isn't Hitler in a poor political spot after the attempt at re-militarizing of the Rhineland was stopped by the French? Also, I continue, as always, to root for poor Landon :p.
 
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TheButterflyComposer - No, they really were all bad.

jeeshadow - It is important to remember this tangent originally started with an alternate location for the 1938 World Cup and we've come a long way since then. Hitler is not in a great political position, as you say the Rhineland is not re-militarised - it's got some paramilitary SA chaps marching around, but that really isn't the same thing at all. President Landon is tying himself in knots about moral neutrality, but is probably, on average, doing OK domestically.

Both will probably crop up in the Spain update as I intend to do start with a wider 'Foreign backers and kit of both sides' type update first on Spain.

Cromwell - When I'm doing tangents to my tangents I think I've goon too far. But rest assured there will be a 'Birth of BOAC' (or whatever it ends up being called) update in the future, so at that point 1920s civil aviation policy will doubtless be dragged kicking and screaming into the light.


I've found this chapter a bit tricky to get written, I had the time and the requisite facts but it just wasn't coming out on the page. However, I've finally managed to get a first paragraph down so hopefully I'm over this writers block. If it continues to play silly buggers I may just abandon it and move onto Spain.
 
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Glad to know you're still writting.
 
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Kurt_Steiner said:
Glad to know you're still writting.
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Definitely writing. Just not writing the correct things. For instance Butterfly Redux is going well, Chapter 10 has been rewritten and has working photos now.

I've got a second paragraph down of the next real update, but it is going slowly even by my standards.
 
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El Pip said:
Il Duce would persist with this mistaken, if understandable, assumption right up until the Royal Navy taught the Regia Marina a comprehensive, but expensive, lesson about the actual state of the British Empire.
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Yes, well we all know the British are a fan of large and expensive lessons. Not that they learn sometimes but...
 
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TheButterflyComposer said:
Yes, well we all know the British are a fan of large and expensive lessons. Not that they learn sometimes but...
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It's true, some British people still vote for the Labour Party despite everything. Personally I blame Gladstone and Asquith for letting the whole mess begin in the first place.
 
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El Pip said:
It's true, some British people still vote for the Labour Party despite everything. Personally I blame Gladstone and Asquith for letting the whole mess begin in the first place.
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Mm. Wasn't New Labour in power when this AAR started? Just to make everyone who's been reading that long feel old.
 
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El Pip said:
These were eventually fudged and the service started a couple of years later, had a horrific Christmas 1938 when it was over loaded by the Xmas cards/presents and was only saved from collapsing entirely in Christmas 1939 by the war breaking out. It is safe to assume that will not happen this time around.
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Clearly, this was why we needed the War on Christmas

EDIT: Rereading the revised early chapters, I realized that I forgot about the DVA. As a resident of the Mid-Atlantic states (well, the South really, but spittin' distance), I'm not sure how that would work, topographically. (No offense meant, obviously).


(Sterling work, as always, Mr. Pip, best to the family and all that),
 
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