UPDATED 14/06/18 - *** Rules for User Made Mods and Edits of PDS games ***

[lukew]

Torrent links are subject to removal.

This rule seems really unfair to me. MEIOU and Taxes has had 723GB of bandwidth usage on our official links (bear in mind our mod is a 178mb .7z file) in the last 24 hours, not counting unofficial mirrors which were in use for 4 hours whilst all our services went down through over use. I purchased Mediafire at 1tb/mo yesterday, which as a poor student is the maximum I can afford, and as you can see we are going to max that out fairly soon (480gb of that 723gb figure is through mediafire, meaning we burned half our monthly usage in under a day). If you're going to ban us from using torrents, and are going to cap Steam workshop at 200mb, could you please allow us to host our files on your servers, since I can't afford to pay for this amount of bandwidth.

oki i didn't there was such limitation on dropbox as well.

Dropbox is capped at 200Gb/day for pro (which I bought yesterday in anticipation of the launch) or 20Gb/day for free. I don't know the exact other limits, but out Google drive link went down in about 5 minutes, and Gigau's personal server overloaded after about half an hour.

Maybe ask some of the guys that have large and popular mods what solutions they have found.

Ouch :'(

 

[tompalmer]

Game of thrones uses Moddb that can cope with 50/60 K downloads each version, we also release a mirror on mediafire.

We cannot control petty websites posting mirrors like strategy informer, but the largest part is Moddb

 

[EOOQE]

Game of thrones uses Moddb that can cope with 50/60 K downloads each version, we also release a mirror on mediafire.

We cannot control petty websites posting mirrors like strategy informer, but the largest part is Moddb

Ya , strategy informer is a pain
But im confused now , BjornB told me that hosting mods on Moddb is not allowed .
I had a long discussion with him about some copyright questions. And if i read the rules correct :

1) The mod may not have an external public forum, they can have one for their internal development use but not disclosed to the general membership here, nor allowing them to join.
2) Mod files should be hosted on a file share site designed for use by the public and or Steam Workshop.

Both rules are against Moddb ! Its not an Share site AND you have an public forum/discussion board for your hosted mod.
I get the strange feeling thats no one knows exact whats allowed and what not ... if i ask 3 different Paradox Reps. , i get three different answers ... so what now ? :huh:

 

[lukew]

Now I'm even more confused! It would be nice to know if Moddb is allowed. It's sadly not ideal and very flash ad-heavy, but if it allows us to host for free then that's great.

 

[tompalmer]

Well We asked someone from paradox to open a crusader kings account on moddb, and when it was done (we had to wait quite some times) we did our part.

Paradox interactive and paradox studio both have a "company page", this means that theorically modders could ask paradox to open a EUIV plateform.

But, I don't feel they would now, maybe it was some guy on an internship who opened the ckII plateform as it is against the rules.
Anyway having a mod in the "top 100" is a good visibility for the game, and maybe it's not an "only file hosting" website, but people use it as is for mods. They don't comment much.

It's sadly not ideal

It's quite ideal, it handles an unlimited amount of Dls and can be used in 99% of countries.

 

[EOOQE]

Well We asked someone from paradox to open a crusader kings account on moddb, and when it was done (we had to wait quite some times) we did our part.

Paradox interactive and paradox studio both have a "company page", this means that theorically modders could ask paradox to open a EUIV plateform.
...

No need for , allready there : http://www.moddb.com/games/europa-universalis-iv
So, Paradox , whats up now ?? Was this also an "internship guy" ?
Im kind of lost here with your Rules now.

 

[gigau]

I don't want to make it an anti-Steam post, far from it, but it would be much simpler if Steam Workshop didn't have those size limits.

Given that, in MEIOU and Taxes, we change graphics and map (and here i won't even take in account the custom-made music we are adding), uncompressed mod folder is 208Mb-large. And we haven't shifted to second gear yet in regards of content addition (although it'll mainly be large txt contents). Limit is 200Mb. Even Skyrim mods moved to the Nexus site, which has Warband pages, but none for Paradox internal games.


Yesterday, in addition to the Dropbox (one or two) and Mediafire (two at least) hosting accounts, we used the hosting server i used for MEIOU and worked well. As cited above, we got overwhelmed by the number of downloads... and ultimately there was some frustration du to very slow downloads. Now, i know that it's not Paradox's responsibility.

But, being, like Luke, already 'some of the guys that have large and popular mods' for EUIII, we still got stumped by some limitations regarding the release of our mod, especially as we try to remain with the rules.


So let's recap :
- Steam Workshop sets a too low size limit
- Dropbox isn't adapted for this task
- Mediafire won't cut it in terms of performance
- ModDB used by some is also said by a Paradox voice-person to be against rules

... what can we do, please ?

 

[Sun_Wu]

I don't want to make it an anti-Steam post, far from it, but it would be much simpler if Steam Workshop didn't have those size limits.

Given that, in MEIOU and Taxes, we change graphics and map (and here i won't even take in account the custom-made music we are adding), uncompressed mod folder is 208Mb-large. And we haven't shifted to second gear yet in regards of content addition (although it'll mainly be large txt contents). Limit is 200Mb. Even Skyrim mods moved to the Nexus site, which has Warband pages, but none for Paradox internal games.


Yesterday, in addition to the Dropbox (one or two) and Mediafire (two at least) hosting accounts, we used the hosting server i used for MEIOU and worked well. As cited above, we got overwhelmed by the number of downloads... and ultimately there was some frustration du to very slow downloads. Now, i know that it's not Paradox's responsibility.

But, being, like Luke, already 'some of the guys that have large and popular mods' for EUIII, we still got stumped by some limitations regarding the release of our mod, especially as we try to remain with the rules.


So let's recap :
- Steam Workshop sets a too low size limit
- Dropbox isn't adapted for this task
- Mediafire won't cut it in terms of performance
- ModDB used by some is also said by a Paradox voice-person to be against rules

... what can we do, please ?

We will probably unlock an answer when we beat the Kobayashi Maru.

 

[MiltonS]

I'm gonna hazard a guess *and I really hope I'm right* that based on their silence after opening this thread with a lot of responses that PI is reviewing the 7 pages of issues we've raised and are attempting to come up with an equitable solution that benefits our needs for mods and their need to protect their IP, especially since they opened this thread saying they wanted to get out feedback.

Again, I hope I'm right. Although I think it would be beneficial if they came up with ONE 'mssion statement' that set the goal for what they're trying to achieve, so that they could then weigh every rule/suggestion against it. If it's "Protect IP" or "Absolve liability" or "Reduce Bandwidth Consumption" or "Require free mods" or SOMETHING so we all (PI and players) knew what the point was.

 

[Castellon]

I'm gonna hazard a guess *and I really hope I'm right* that based on their silence after opening this thread with a lot of responses that PI is reviewing the 7 pages of issues we've raised and are attempting to come up with an equitable solution that benefits our needs for mods and their need to protect their IP, especially since they opened this thread saying they wanted to get out feedback.

Again, I hope I'm right. Although I think it would be beneficial if they came up with ONE 'mssion statement' that set the goal for what they're trying to achieve, so that they could then weigh every rule/suggestion against it. If it's "Protect IP" or "Absolve liability" or "Reduce Bandwidth Consumption" or "Require free mods" or SOMETHING so we all (PI and players) knew what the point was.

This is pretty close, Formalizing the rules in one place and put in writing, is an attempt to level the playing field and have a common set of rules for everyone. Pretty sure we looked into those moddb pages and no one here would admit to having opened them, so they should not be considered official. We will look into solutions for you and appreciate the effort you have gone through. An immediate idea just from me, no idea if it is feasible or you have already looked into it. Can you have some of the extra content like music as a separate download, then host the main files (under 200mb) on Steam works with a note and link to download the extras if they are interested in those as well. You could then host the extras as a separate sub mod on Steam works, or as a separate download on your existing sources. This would severely lower the load on those sources. Also: No insult of any kind was intended, with my suggestion to ask mod makers of big project, it was merely a suggestion to "network" with them to see if they had encountered similar issues.

 

[Sotof]

As mentioned above, if you want to include PDS IP from a different game, you would need to get approval from Kallocain, you can PM her. If you do get it be sure to state that you did get permission, in the first post of any thread made about the Mod here.

I think Kallocain may have a full inbox, or I am just unable to send a PM to her.

 

[Sun_Wu]

This is pretty close, Formalizing the rules in one place and put in writing, is an attempt to level the playing field and have a common set of rules for everyone. Pretty sure we looked into those moddb pages and no one here would admit to having opened them, so they should not be considered official. We will look into solutions for you and appreciate the effort you have gone through. An immediate idea just from me, no idea if it is feasible or you have already looked into it. Can you have some of the extra content like music as a separate download, then host the main files (under 200mb) on Steam works with a note and link to download the extras if they are interested in those as well. You could then host the extras as a separate sub mod on Steam works, or as a separate download on your existing sources. This would severely lower the load on those sources. Also: No insult of any kind was intended, with my suggestion to ask mod makers of big project, it was merely a suggestion to "network" with them to see if they had encountered similar issues.

We separated out both the UI and the music, we are still over 200MB and the mod is still growing. Yes we can continue to separate things out in to smaller packs, but it creates a serious issue when in addition to the main mod they also need to download 2+ sub mods. We have dealt with what feels like dozens of players, maybe even a hundred or more coming to us because the mod doesn't work due to them putting it in programming files despite us including a step by step video on how to install it on the main post.

Sorry if we seem a little cross with you, on launch day we dealt with our links constantly going down due to heavy load almost as fast as we could put them up. That caused a lot of stress for us. Being able to have a torrent option would dramatically ease this issue as it is distributed downloading meaning no data caps.

 

[tompalmer]

We separated out both the UI and the music, we are still over 200MB and the mod is still growing. Yes we can continue to separate things out in to smaller packs, but it creates a serious issue when in addition to the main mod they also need to download 2+ sub mods. We have dealt with what feels like dozens of players, maybe even a hundred or more coming to us because the mod doesn't work due to them putting it in programming files despite us including a step by step video on how to install it on the main post.

It's not hard to do an installer and it compresses the mod A LOT. Only shit thing is that steam workshop won't allow .exe

Anyway if you are interested in the installer formula try to put this into innosetup :

; Script generated by the Inno Setup Script Wizard.
; SEE THE DOCUMENTATION FOR DETAILS ON CREATING INNO SETUP SCRIPT FILES!

#define MyAppName "mod"
#define MyAppVersion "0.4.3"
#define MyAppPublisher "AGOT TEAM"

[Setup]
; NOTE: The value of AppId uniquely identifies this application.
; Do not use the same AppId value in installers for other applications.
; (To generate a new GUID, click Tools | Generate GUID inside the IDE.)
AppId={{7C82709E-75FE-4C3A-976A-8C97908DDD7B}
AppName={#MyAppName}
AppVersion={#MyAppVersion}
;AppVerName={#MyAppName} {#MyAppVersion}
AppPublisher={#MyAppPublisher}
AppPublisherURL={#MyAppURL}
AppSupportURL={#MyAppURL}
AppUpdatesURL={#MyAppURL}
DefaultDirName={userdocs}\Paradox Interactive\Crusader Kings II\mod
DisableDirPage=yes
DefaultGroupName=AGOT
SetupIconFile=C:\Users\SUPINTERNET\Desktop\Dropbox\asoiaf\ck2agoticon.ico
DisableProgramGroupPage=yes
InfoAfterFile=C:\Users\SUPINTERNET\Desktop\Dropbox\asoiaf\AGOT- Manual.txt
OutputBaseFilename=agotsetup
Compression=lzma
SolidCompression=yes

[InstallDelete]
Type: filesandordirs; Name: {userdocs}\Paradox Interactive\Crusader Kings II\mod\A Game of Thrones\*
Type: filesandordirs; Name: {userdocs}\paradox interactive\Crusader Kings II\A Game of Thrones\gfx\*

[Languages]
Name: english; MessagesFile: compiler:Default.isl
Name: french; MessagesFile: compiler:Languages\French.isl
Name: spanish; MessagesFile: compiler:Languages\Spanish.isl

[Files]
Source: C:\Users\SUPINTERNET\Desktop\mod\mod\*; DestDir: {app}; Flags: ignoreversion recursesubdirs createallsubdirs
; NOTE: Don't use "Flags: ignoreversion" on any shared system files
Source: insertlocalfolderwiththefix; DestDir: {userdocs}\Paradox Interactive\Crusader Kings II\mod\A Game of thrones; Components: testfixdesc; Languages: 

[Icons]
Name: {group}\{cm:ProgramOnTheWeb,{#MyAppName}}; Filename: {#MyAppURL}
Name: {group}\{cm:UninstallProgram,{#MyAppName}}; Filename: {uninstallexe}

[Components]
Name: testfix; Description: If your screen definition is above 1200*1080 tick that; Types: custom; Languages:

replace the paths and adapt additional modules.

And note that the installer will decrease the numbers of "where do I put this mod ?" "your mod is wrong" "I'm gonna kill you"

Downside effect is that it only works for windows, you would need a java installer for mac and linux people.

Unauthorised link removed - Seelmeister

 

[lukew]

An immediate idea just from me, no idea if it is feasible or you have already looked into it. Can you have some of the extra content like music as a separate download, then host the main files (under 200mb) on Steam works with a note and link to download the extras if they are interested in those as well. You could then host the extras as a separate sub mod on Steam works, or as a separate download on your existing sources. This would severely lower the load on those sources.

1) Even without the music separated out, we are just over 200mb. Furthermore, the mod has just been made, and we expect to add plenty more content in the future. We'd love to be able to use the workshop, and prevent the many issues people have installing the mod and the issues we have with hosting. Would you consider raising the limit to 300mb - or is that beyond your control?

Also: No insult of any kind was intended, with my suggestion to ask mod makers of big project, it was merely a suggestion to "network" with them to see if they had encountered similar issues.

2) No offence taken, I was only joking (it must be my amazing British humour )

 

[Sun_Wu]

I just checked, we have 44MB of just text.

 

[Don_Quigleone]

Surely there needs to be some limit on the number of threads a single mod can have? Almost a third of the threads on the front page are directly related to M&T, pushing many other mods off the front page.

 

[Sun_Wu]

Surely there needs to be some limit on the number of threads a single mod can have? Almost a third of the threads on the front page are directly related to M&T, pushing many other mods off the front page.

The alternative is M&T getting its own subforum.

 

[Castellon]

Guys a reminder that this thread is about the rules, if posting related stuff, start a new thread, and PM me to look at it if I am needed.

 

[Castellon]

A clarification: as a few questions about using content from one of our IPs in a MOD for another of our IPs have arisen.
A final ruling has been determined from PDS:
No material from one IP(Game or DLC, includes any content in them) may be used in a user mod, unless that mod can assure only people with that other IP installed can use it. If doing that is beyond the technical ability of the particular mod maker or it is impossible then they cannot be used.

I will annotate the rules accordingly.

 

[MiltonS]

Sounds very reasonable. Any update on copyright issues from rule #4?